question for the anti-religious crowd. - Page 7 - GoFuckYourself.com

themadwriter · 02-25-2010, 05:07 PM

more murders and massacres have happened in the name of religion than all the wars man has had to date!

Something to think about!

CosmicTang · 02-25-2010, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by themadwriter

more murders and massacres have happened in the name of religion than all the wars man has had to date!

Something to think about!

Popular propaganda. Not that there haven't been more than enough though.

12clicks · 02-25-2010, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CosmicTang

Popular propaganda. Not that there haven't been more than enough though.

+1

Do they still reward you for longest thread of the week?
I'll have to ask captain save a ho

TheDoc · 02-25-2010, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDSmith

I'll say this much for the scientists and athiests, at least you don't come down my street in pairs twice a year knocking on my door trying to recruit me into your religion. I'm thankful for that because I'm running out of places in my yard to bury the bodies.

I keep all the scientists in my evil basement lab, that's why they never make it to you.

With what you said... I have faith that something(s) created everything, I can see life around me. In the simplest of ideas, I don't have to know my parents to know they created me. With that, the father doesn't always know he created children.

So faith to me isn't just the idea of a creator/giver of life - even without science I can see it.. but a higher power pulling all the strings, watching, waiting for us to screw up or not, to judge us, basically the ideas of Christianity.

onwebcam · 02-26-2010, 02:58 AM

Let's make this simple for everyone. Around 2000 years ago we had a group of people that got together to make a story of how we all got here (for control purposes). There were certain people within that group that said "Hey lets make up a story which makes us look good" so what you get is the bible and eventually other modern day religions. "Fairy tales" which for the most part are all made up and passed down generation through generation for at least 6500 years is what we have now. When the reality is it's similar but much different.

onwebcam · 02-26-2010, 03:20 AM

FYI I'm not going to pretend that I "know" how we all got here but I will say for a FACT that damn near "everyone" who is preaching "any" sort of modern day religion knows they are a "fraud". Including but not limited to Al Gore.

NoComments · 02-26-2010, 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onwebcam

Let's make this simple for everyone. Around 2000 years ago we had a group of people that got together to make a story of how we all got here (for control purposes). There were certain people within that group that said "Hey lets make up a story which makes us look good" so what you get is the bible and eventually other modern day religions. "Fairy tales" which for the most part are all made up and passed down generation through generation for at least 6500 years is what we have now. When the reality is it's similar but much different.

The New testament was written in 300 AD, and Old Testament about 1400 BC,
just a small correction.

wig · 02-26-2010, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDSmith

Yes. But I also see the commonalities of the two. Don't you?

No, I don't.

Quote:

Yes, and as I said those hypothesis' are either believed in or not. As in taken on faith. Really, if you don't have faith in your hypothesis what's the point?

Yes, which is why the two words, hypothesis and theory, have different meanings.

Quote:

There's plenty beliefs on the scientific side of the argument that offer nothing physically testable or provable either. Go back in time far enough in the evolution of the world and the universe and at some point it all becomes speculation.

And these would be hypotheses, no?

Quote:

You're focused on the differences, while I am merely pointing out the what the two sides have in common. Both sides rely on a modicum of faith to complete the puzzle, not just one. In fact some people put so much faith in science and all it's theories that it becomes as much of a religion as religion is.

I'll agree that religious people can do good science, if you want to call that commonality. But at the core, the methods for acquiring knowledge are quite different.

wig · 02-26-2010, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDSmith

Oh, was my use of the word "theory" incorrect? Maybe I should have used the word "opinion" instead? "The opinion of nothingness" it is then. Happier?

The next time someone says "It is my theory that when you die, that's it, you're gone into nothingness" I will speak up and correct them on their grave error.

Thank you thank you thank you.

I wasn't trying to offend you.

Yes, you were using the word theory here in the colloquial sense and that is not how it is used in scientific circles. I was curious if there was any data that you were aware of to support the "theory". It looks more like it is not actually a theory.

wig · 02-26-2010, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDSmith

Aside from all the oh so sound reasoned arguments that always go on in these types of threads the thing I always find the most amusing is how both sides try to convince the other that theirs is the correct way, the ONLY way, to think. Non-believers and the science crowd tend to throw a lot of ridicule at the creationist/Christian or otherwise religious crowd, and the "religionists" love to talk about how immoral and faithless the other side is, all the while wondering why they can't see the evidence of God's work which they believe is in plain view all around us.

Members of both sides take to the boards and aggressively try to argue their case and won't hear of how they may have anything in common with their counterparts, and vehemently deny the possibility even exists. Fact is whether your beliefs are athiest, Christian, science/athiest, Muslim with an interest in gene-splicing, Islamic but you majored in genetic engineering, or whatever ---- if your faith in your belief is unshakeable and you are secure in your mindset and confident you are on the right path in life, that really should be good enough for you. Shouldn't it? It always amuses me how so many feel the driving need to convince others that their way is right and everyone else's beliefs are wrong. It really does smack of insecurity no matter who is doing it.

I'll say this much for the scientists and athiests, at least you don't come down my street in pairs twice a year knocking on my door trying to recruit me into your religion. I'm thankful for that because I'm running out of places in my yard to bury the bodies.

Well, I personally find that religious people on the one hand are more as you describe (ie; unshakeable and secure in a mindset and confident they are on the right path) while non-religious people are more open minded and willing to change their mind and follow the evidence where it leads.

wig · 02-26-2010, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by themadwriter

more murders and massacres have happened in the name of religion than all the wars man has had to date!

Something to think about!

False. Even if it were true, what's the relevance?

wig · 02-26-2010, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onwebcam

Let's make this simple for everyone. Around 2000 years ago we had a group of people that got together to make a story of how we all got here (for control purposes). There were certain people within that group that said "Hey lets make up a story which makes us look good" so what you get is the bible and eventually other modern day religions. "Fairy tales" which for the most part are all made up and passed down generation through generation for at least 6500 years is what we have now. When the reality is it's similar but much different.

Depending on what you really mean, I don't know if "for control purposes" is the right way to look at it.

It appears to me that religion was our first attempt at organizing society, before we had institutions of law, government, etc.

It may have been evolutionarily advantageous, like our sweet tooth. Perhaps more beneficial in the past than the present.

12clicks · 02-26-2010, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onwebcam

Let's make this simple for everyone. Around 2000 years ago we had a group of people that got together to make a story............................................w hich for the most part are all made up and passed down generation through generation for at least 6500 years

oh, thats pretty simple alright.

NoComments · 02-26-2010, 12:23 PM

chopstick · 02-26-2010, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12clicks

man can create test tube babies, clone animals, split atoms, alter genes. Science understands so much yet we can't create life out of the bare elements in the way that science believes it happened. Nor do we have a clue how to do it.
The spark of life is beyond our grasp.
something to think about.

Read Richard Dawkins "The Greatest Show on Earth"
He addresses this exact idea and explains that we are not able to do it at the moment, but that does not automatically preclude us from ever doing it.

Occam's argument:
When competing hypotheses are equal in other respects, the principle recommends selection of the hypothesis that introduces the fewest assumptions and postulates the fewest entities while still sufficiently answering the question. It is in this sense that Occam's razor is usually understood.

Just because one argument is not proven, it does not automatically entitle, or prove, the opposing argument.

In other words, if we cannot do it now, does not mean it cannot be done, or didn't happen.

chopstick · 02-26-2010, 12:51 PM

Another good book is "God is Not Great" by Christopher Hitchens. Dawkins doens't go about bashing God - he just sticks to evolution, which is fascinating if you read his books. Hitchens goes to war with ALL religions, and he has studied them so it's a very interesting read.

wig · 02-26-2010, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chopstick

Dawkins doens't go about bashing God - he just sticks to evolution, which is fascinating if you read his books.

I don't know... The God Delusion may be an exception.

12clicks · 02-26-2010, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chopstick

Just because one argument is not proven, it does not automatically entitle, or prove, the opposing argument.

In other words, if we cannot do it now, does not mean it cannot be done, or didn't happen.

in other words?

how about in other meanings?

chopstick · 02-26-2010, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12clicks

in other words?

how about in other meanings?

hahaha, I don't even know what THIS means!

papill0n · 02-26-2010, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12clicks

in other words?

how about in other meanings?

how about fucking clueless???

onwebcam · 02-26-2010, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoComments

The New testament was written in 300 AD, and Old Testament about 1400 BC,
just a small correction.

And there's a similar yet different story on separate continents told thousands of years before

12clicks · 02-26-2010, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by papill0n

how about fucking clueless???

welcome home from the day job, little fella!
time to play webmaster for the weekend, eh?

shwsrvcs · 02-26-2010, 04:09 PM

onwebcam · 02-26-2010, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wig

Depending on what you really mean, I don't know if "for control purposes" is the right way to look at it.

It appears to me that religion was our first attempt at organizing society, before we had institutions of law, government, etc.

It may have been evolutionarily advantageous, like our sweet tooth. Perhaps more beneficial in the past than the present.

What if it were still in practice today?

The Levitical Priesthood of Tennessee
http://mlf1070.wordpress.com/2007/08...-of-tennessee/

wig · 02-26-2010, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onwebcam

What if it were still in practice today?

The Levitical Priesthood of Tennessee
http://mlf1070.wordpress.com/2007/08...-of-tennessee/

What if what was still in practice?

onwebcam · 02-26-2010, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wig

What if what was still in practice?

What if you don't follow that religion should you still be bound to the beliefs of those who "choose" to follow it?

wig · 02-26-2010, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onwebcam

What if you don't follow that religion should you still be bound to the beliefs of those who "choose" to follow it?

Of course not.

onwebcam · 02-26-2010, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wig

Of course not.

Do you realize what you just agreed to? Go back and read the link given if you haven't already (assuming you didn't)

theking · 02-26-2010, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onwebcam

Do you realize what you just agreed to? Go back and read the link given if you haven't already (assuming you didn't)

You think you are playing him...but if he returns to this thread...he will educate you about who has been played.

wig · 02-26-2010, 09:38 PM

i didn't read it. Didn't think I had to in order to answer your question.

I'm off for the night so I'll read it tomorrow.

Sausage · 02-26-2010, 10:26 PM

Some of us are religious because of an experience. In my mind there is no question that there is some form of existance after we die, whether its a god, heaven or whatever it is I have no idea but i know there is something. Unfortunately there are a lot of religious nutjobs out there who use religion as an excuse for being a nutjob.. and unfortunately we all seem to get painted with the same brush.

onwebcam · 02-27-2010, 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

You think you are playing him...but if he returns to this thread...he will educate you about who has been played.

I don't play. I'm painting a bigger picture for him and whoever else cares to see.. As you can see he didn't read the link I posted and wasn't aware of what he agreed to. But even though he didn't know, he's right.

dig420 · 02-27-2010, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12clicks

oh, thats pretty simple alright.

It's pretty accurate. Nearly all the biblical stories have antecedents from previous religions. The flood, Jonah and the Whale, on and on and on, nearly identical stories appropriated by the christian religion for it's own use. The bible was also 'created' by Pope Damascus by choosing which of the hundreds of texts purporting to Christian theology were divinely inspired. Last but not least, Christ was far from the only 'savior' floating around during his lifetime, there were hundreds of them, some more successful than others. He's just the one who won the lottery by having the very effective Paul as a disciple. Paul is far more responsible than any other figure for Xtianity having the position it has today.

SmokeyTheBear · 02-27-2010, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dig420

It's pretty accurate. Nearly all the biblical stories have antecedents from previous religions. The flood, Jonah and the Whale, on and on and on, nearly identical stories appropriated by the christian religion for it's own use. The bible was also 'created' by Pope Damascus by choosing which of the hundreds of texts purporting to Christian theology were divinely inspired. Last but not least, Christ was far from the only 'savior' floating around during his lifetime, there were hundreds of them, some more successful than others. He's just the one who won the lottery by having the very effective Paul as a disciple. Paul is far more responsible than any other figure for Xtianity having the position it has today.

You are arguing facts with someone who thinks theres a man floating on the clouds watching everything we do. Saving aids infected drug addicts whilst watching babies starve to death. You are arguing with a man who thinks dinosaurs never existed and there were no cavemen.

cykoe6 · 02-27-2010, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onwebcam

What if it were still in practice today?

The Levitical Priesthood of Tennessee
http://mlf1070.wordpress.com/2007/08...-of-tennessee/

I should have known you would spreading you unique brand of lunacy on this thread.

Naechy · 02-27-2010, 01:11 PM

yes etc..... yes

12clicks · 02-27-2010, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dig420

It's pretty accurate. Nearly all the biblical stories have antecedents from previous religions. The flood..........

which works FOR there being a grain of truth behind them. Not against.
Zealots of any stripe seem ridiculous to everyone else.
Think about that before your next dopey rant.

mikesinner · 02-27-2010, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shwsrvcs

oh man, "I did not spend my life not raping and killing so I couldn't go up in the sky and have sky cake"

This video perfectly describes religious belief.

TehKinkyHotness · 02-27-2010, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12clicks

Yeast:
any of various small, single-celled fungi of the phylum Ascomycota that reproduce by fission or budding, the daughter cells often remaining attached, and that are capable of fermenting carbohydrates into alcohol and carbon dioxide.

if you START with life, you'll get life.

my point is that as we sit here, we can not recreate the origin of our being.if we know there was a time on earth where there was no life, something, as of yet, unexplained created us

I would rather take a guess based on what we do know rather than assume life came from a man in the sky with a magic wand.

dig420 · 02-27-2010, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12clicks

which works FOR there being a grain of truth behind them. Not against.
Zealots of any stripe seem ridiculous to everyone else.
Think about that before your next dopey rant.

I'll type more slowly this time: These stories existed BEFORE Christianity, and BEFORE Judaism. Do you understand that very simple statement now?

onwebcam · 02-27-2010, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cykoe6

I should have known you would spreading you unique brand of lunacy on this thread.

As the old saying goes. The truth is stranger than fiction.

SmokeyTheBear · 02-27-2010, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dig420

I'll type more slowly this time: These stories existed BEFORE Christianity, and BEFORE Judaism. Do you understand that very simple statement now?

god has a time machine silly , he planted those like the dinosaur bones to test your faith.

wig · 02-28-2010, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onwebcam

I don't play. I'm painting a bigger picture for him and whoever else cares to see.. As you can see he didn't read the link I posted and wasn't aware of what he agreed to. But even though he didn't know, he's right.

You are conflating religion with government using a weak analogy and then ask me a misleading question by only using the word religion. As best I can tell, I think your point is a non-sequitur.

This is not to say that there should not be any dissent and clearly we (USA) have dissent, including those who break the law as a form. We also have processes for this and it is ingrained in our founding documents.

Maybe you would like to expand on your big picture.

Sabby · 02-28-2010, 11:02 AM

I have a hair appointment... tata boys..

Shall I do the redhead thing again??

kissses..

onwebcam · 02-28-2010, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wig

You are conflating religion with government using a weak analogy and then ask me a misleading question by only using the word religion. As best I can tell, I think your point is a non-sequitur.

This is not to say that there should not be any dissent and clearly we (USA) have dissent, including those who break the law as a form. We also have processes for this and it is ingrained in our founding documents.

Maybe you would like to expand on your big picture.

You might think it's weak but it's strong enough to fool most amd it's very real. As far as the founding documents you mentioned

"But, indeed, no private person has a right to complain, by suit in court, on the ground of a breach of the Constitution, the Constitution, it is true, is a compact but he is not a party to it."

Padelford, Fay & Co. vs. The Mayor and Aldermen of the City of Savannah

Hmm so the Constituution isn't for us? Then who or what is it for? I know, do you? Just another part of the con.

Best-In-BC · 02-28-2010, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12clicks

man can create test tube babies, clone animals, split atoms, alter genes. Science understands so much yet we can't create life out of the bare elements in the way that science believes it happened. Nor do we have a clue how to do it.
The spark of life is beyond our grasp.
something to think about.

ROFL, what the fuck is that suppose to mean ?
You serious think and magical being created life, something that some guy create 1000 years ago. Religions and gods are a dime and dozen. The clear answer is that its complete crap!

If you dont beleave in Santa clause or the easter bunny I don't see why you would beleave in god!

wig · 02-28-2010, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onwebcam

You might think it's weak but it's strong enough to fool most amd it's very real. As far as the founding documents you mentioned

"But, indeed, no private person has a right to complain, by suit in court, on the ground of a breach of the Constitution, the Constitution, it is true, is a compact but he is not a party to it."

Padelford, Fay & Co. vs. The Mayor and Aldermen of the City of Savannah

Hmm so the Constituution isn't for us? Then who or what is it for? I know, do you? Just another part of the con.

Perhaps, it's strong enough to fool you rather than the other way around. But, I'm open to argument. Enlighten me.

just a punk · 02-28-2010, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12clicks

man can create test tube babies, clone animals, split atoms, alter genes. Science understands so much yet we can't create life out of the bare elements in the way that science believes it happened. Nor do we have a clue how to do it.
The spark of life is beyond our grasp.
something to think about.

Hallelujah!

wig · 02-28-2010, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Best-In-BC

ROFL, what the fuck is that suppose to mean ?
You serious think and magical being created life, something that some guy create 1000 years ago. Religions and gods are a dime and dozen. The clear answer is that its complete crap!

If you dont beleave in Santa clause or the easter bunny I don't see why you would beleave in god!

I'm not defending any of the arguments I'll list below, but it's a bit more complex than you lead on. Great minds have wrestled with the concept/ necessity of god for millennia.

ontological argument
cosmological argument
moral argument
arguments from consciousness

onwebcam · 02-28-2010, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wig

Perhaps, it's strong enough to fool you rather than the other way around. But, I'm open to argument. Enlighten me.

What do you want enlightenment on? The fact that our judicial system is a scam? The fact that you and I aren't a party to the constitution? What? You said yourself and what started our little debate that before we had what is known as our government and judicial system we had forms of "control" your term "organized society" such as the Old Testament. Well I provided 1 clue as to where and how how judicial system came to be. Which is basicly what you said in the first place. So technically there really is no argument to be had. Only I see it as a religion because it very much is. There are other sources from which our judicial system was developed but as a whole it's not what the general population perceives it to be. It is a monumental fraud.

Besides even if you and I were a party to the Constitution it doesn't really even matter and hasn't since at least 1933. Why? Because Roosevelt signed the War Powers Act of 1933 where the US fell under military rule and all the people were declared enemies of the STATE.

02-25-2010, 05:07 PM	#301
themadwriter Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Experienced SEO Copywriter at your service! Posts: 1,427	more murders and massacres have happened in the name of religion than all the wars man has had to date! Something to think about! __________________ icq : 591247121 xxxcopywriters.com

02-26-2010, 02:58 AM	#305
onwebcam Fake Nick 1.0 Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Rent free, your head Posts: 27,679	Let's make this simple for everyone. Around 2000 years ago we had a group of people that got together to make a story of how we all got here (for control purposes). There were certain people within that group that said "Hey lets make up a story which makes us look good" so what you get is the bible and eventually other modern day religions. "Fairy tales" which for the most part are all made up and passed down generation through generation for at least 6500 years is what we have now. When the reality is it's similar but much different. __________________ PLEASE WAIT WHILE BIDEN ADMIN UNINSTALLS ITSELF..... ██████████████████▒ 99.5% complete. Last edited by onwebcam; 02-26-2010 at 03:13 AM..

02-26-2010, 03:20 AM	#306
onwebcam Fake Nick 1.0 Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Rent free, your head Posts: 27,679	FYI I'm not going to pretend that I "know" how we all got here but I will say for a FACT that damn near "everyone" who is preaching "any" sort of modern day religion knows they are a "fraud". Including but not limited to Al Gore. __________________ PLEASE WAIT WHILE BIDEN ADMIN UNINSTALLS ITSELF..... ██████████████████▒ 99.5% complete. Last edited by onwebcam; 02-26-2010 at 03:31 AM..

02-26-2010, 12:23 PM	#314
NoComments Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 4,957	__________________ ************************************* Give me the offer I can't refuse**

02-26-2010, 04:09 PM	#323
shwsrvcs Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 600	__________________ MUTTCASH! Start Earning today! www.muttcash.com

02-26-2010, 12:51 PM	#316
chopstick Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada Posts: 188	Another good book is "God is Not Great" by Christopher Hitchens. Dawkins doens't go about bashing God - he just sticks to evolution, which is fascinating if you read his books. Hitchens goes to war with ALL religions, and he has studied them so it's a very interesting read.

02-26-2010, 09:38 PM	#330
wig Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Panama Posts: 708	i didn't read it. Didn't think I had to in order to answer your question. I'm off for the night so I'll read it tomorrow. __________________ Credit Card and ACH Processing

02-26-2010, 10:26 PM	#331
Sausage Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 3,012	Some of us are religious because of an experience. In my mind there is no question that there is some form of existance after we die, whether its a god, heaven or whatever it is I have no idea but i know there is something. Unfortunately there are a lot of religious nutjobs out there who use religion as an excuse for being a nutjob.. and unfortunately we all seem to get painted with the same brush.

02-27-2010, 01:11 PM	#336
Naechy Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 6,497	yes etc..... yes __________________ Adult SEO Labs * Buying Links * SEO 666-874

02-28-2010, 11:02 AM	#344
Sabby Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 2,888	I have a hair appointment... tata boys.. Shall I do the redhead thing again?? kissses.. __________________ Fuck off