Huh?

:helpme

A good time to cancel that Internext trip

Hehe I knew someone would tag me on this, but that's why I said "Quick calculation". :Graucho

What are the actual percentages of people who forget to cancel? What are the actual percentages of people who retain memberships at most of these sites? Come on, we've all visited some of these paysites at one time or another and taken a quick peek inside their members area. Most of them blow chunks and I can't imagine that many people sticking around.

I was going to go into details on how the salesman I paid $50.00 to would get me customers that I could upsell to, etc. but in the long run the percentages just wouldn't ever work out high enough in my favor. That's why shaving goes on.

If you're going to tag me and say my logic is flawed, and that the companies actually do make money from retaining memberships, upselling, etc. then you're going to also state that shving doesn't happen. Otherwise the execution of my logic might have been screwy, but the end result is the same. You can't make an honest profit by paying out 10 times more than what you take in.

Jak

I was always under the impression that you would get paid for everything and if a webmaster had an abnormally bad conversion ratio that you would lock the account, investigate and withold payment if necessary.

Not just shave 59% of all sales. THAT seems like a very high percentage of traffic that is coming in from "bounced emails, non matching ip-addresses and bad countries.

Adding up to what??? $14,000 just the few days of this week alone!!

Yeah, hand caught in the cookie jar comes to mind :)

Sammy

double post

Liar liar pants on fire!
:321GFY

Now you are wrong. I mean the dat fields are stated that way yes. But when you would press the submit button you will se that this week only 350 dollars is charged.

The 14000 bucks is over whole 2002 so far....So they don't sell much at all..

Andre

I'm sure John Asshahahahaha at the US Justice Department would love to take a look at the books of all porn site operators.

Anyone want to give him a call?

Actually I do...I'd love for them to go in and shut some of these big motherfuckers down.

RICO act on them like a mother fucker...seize their cars...their houses...anything and everything they "earned," or purchased with their illgotten gains.

This sure will keep some of the smaller guys from trying the same kinda bullshit.

:2 cents:

that's crazy shit... was searching around for sponsors guess I can 'shave' them off my list... thanks guys :(



http://www.wetwords.com
We take your wettest dreams and put them into words.

Ummm, I've ran paysites for many years and I know that most $40 signups have fucking terrible rebill rates. I'd say most big paysites with mainly plugin content would have rebill rates of 1.5 months per customer, which an't great.

Sammy

What a load of crap :mad:

Why all the fuzz?? We all know that they shave right?? I want to know who shaves the most!!

That's got to be the biggest crock of shit I've seen yet.

I mean its not bad considering the amount of time you had to make some shit up, but its still a crock of shit.

Translation:

'Guilty'

Then why is the page called the 'Dollars4All PROFIT Calculator' and not the 'Dollars4All Real Customer Sale Checker'.

Besides looking through the emails associated with shaved sales doesn't seem to reveal any corelation at all. Nor is there any data associated with IP addresses logged in the script and a large percentage of the shaved sales recur, some for as long as a year.

If you're gonna lie to webmasters, at least think up something clever. Not only are they offended that you stole their money, they are even more offended that you think they are so fucking dumb that they'd believe that bullshit line.

It's threads like this that make it all worth it.

I love to see cheating scum (yes, that's you dbarry and dollars4all) - get caught redhanded.

Now let's get the hackers on busting the rest of them. ;>

Cheers,
Backov

1) Ibill's Webmasters don't receive bouncing confirmation emails because from line of confirmation emails is @ibill.com

2) Bad countries?? What are they? Ibill scrubs all cards from all "bad" countries. You can't have customers from those countries.

3) Non-matching IP's? What other IP are you comparing your customer's IP to?

4) Let's suppose what I wrote above is not correct... But you've shaved 53%, so this must be your refund&CB ratio as to your saying. How on earth Ibill still keeps you?

GREED.

Webmasters that sign up for 80% revshare or $50. trial payouts are just asking to be screwed. But from their own greedyness they ignore the obvious signs of shaving and fraud.

Don't like it? Start promoting sponsors that are paying out a reasonable amount that makes logical sense. Go with the sponsor that's paying an honest 50-60% that actually retains members and treats their sites like a true business.

Then there are those that say, "who cares if they shave, as long as I get my money". Bullshit. It's fraud, nothing less. If your sponsor is willing to shave your sales just to be able to offer you 80% revshare or whatever, what else are they doing you don't know about? If they're defrauding you, they're probably screwing their members too.

These aren't businessmen, they're simply greedy crooks running adult sites.

chances are they're shaving because their site sucks. if you have a solid members area paying per sign up can make you more money in the long run.

I would assume the hacking is a felony, too. Get the popcorn ready!

This may be a stupid question, but how do they shave if it goes via a third party biller? Do they route the clicks through dollars4all.com, and sometimes 'forget' (cough) the refid passed to ibill?

i'm sure prosecutors would rather go after the shaving affiliate for the thousands of dollars they've defrauded than go after a guy who got a login and password off of ICQ. :)

then again, thousands of dollars isn't very much money.

From what I've heard, using a third party biller does not necessarily prevent shaving.

With 3rd party billers the code runs through the Processors site, has nothing to do is Dollars4All 'shaving' or not.

How is it done?

good question.

It's very easy to do if the hit doesn't go straight to the 3rd party biller and instead passes through a script somewhere. Why would it be difficult?

Wow, this is amazing...

There are several ways, but you people are confusing third party 'stats' with a third party 'processor' you can process sales anyway you want and then pass on the billing information to your processor of choice.

In this case iBill was billing the credit cards, but the sales and affiliate ceredits were processed in house. This is pretty common, Lightspeed for instance has their own in house affiliate tracking but still process sales through CCBill.

This is not to imply that Lightspeed operates in any way like these scumbags. I think anybody would agree that Lightspeed sets the benchmark for honesty in porn.

I'd like to take this opportunity to annouce my new companies with a new marketing strategy.
TOTAL HONESTY

dollars4half.com
Shitty payouts, shitty conversions, PLUS we shave over 50% of your signups.....but at least we tell the truth about it.


likedown.com
Our all new hosting company. When you want websites that go down more than a $2 whore, likedown.com is the host for you.
(Coming soon, a first in the adult industry, a 10GIG network.....it won't matter because that will be constantly down too, but hey, its BIG)


i-cant-bill.com
Is your website getting too many new members? Tired of seeing that recurring money add up month after month? Then i-cant-bill.com is the processor for you. Not only do we scrub the skin right off of your potential customers with our patented loofah software, but we lose rebills from the database all the time.
For customer service see our sister site irefund.com......no questions asked :thumbsup


Coming Soon - Free hosted galleries designed by Donovan Phillips, and free bannerless virtual hosting courtesy of Cologroup.

Fucking Funny Lenny.:1orglaugh

it depends on how webmasters send them traffic
there are two ways:
1) send surfers through ibill's cookie placer url
2) send surfers straight to Dollars4All script (in this case)

#2 is almost always true for per signup programs, and in #2 shaving is very possible.

I don't see why people are supprised at all. I mean it's hilarious that they got busted so hardcore, this is worse that how CEN got busted.

Every sponsor who pays $30 or more per signup is shaving you. I doubt this is even an extreme case, someone hack Nasty Dollars' stats system, you'll really be supprised when you see 80% of your sales being shaved.

Get your heads out of your asses and find a good, HONEST recurring program.

holy shit. for some reason, though... this kind of feels/seems like a red herring... dunno why... just something nagging at the back of my mind...

This is awesome. I love it that these dumb fucks got busted .....LMAO......:1orglaugh

pretty funny stuff :thumbsup

nasty dollars is one of my best converting sponsors. damn, if i started my own paysite i'd prolly make a killing if they actually shave that much.

Yes, it's safe to say if you had the content and layouts Nasty Dollars has, and set up your own paysite, you'd be making a killing.

Remember that guy who stole the content from one of thier sites and started processing with ibill? Ask him how well the site really sells. :Graucho

It's possible (and easy) to shave both ways. But talking about it is damn dumb - do you really want your next sponsor to have heard on gfy "Oh ya, you can shave with CCBill/IBill THIS way"

Trust me, it can be done.

Cheers,
Backov

ND has the shave turned up HARD this week. I would love to see someone out them. I am pulling them, its a shame, so good at times.