I did not mean to attack you, however you seem focused on saying who ELSE appears to be guilty, as opposed to the issue at hand.

I'll take your response as a denial that you are Norman's prettyboy, and that you are not being paid to post.

NOTE: I mistyped above, meant to say NOT norman's pretty boy, but I did mistype and my logic is fucked, so I'm taking a time out.

Fair enough.

I deeply agree with you that this problem goes far deeper that Matrix Content's alleged actions.

I think People should help support the defense group of 11, and I think people should not patronize those collaborationists who have settled with Acacia.

Please accept my apology for hurting your feelings.

I'll try to live up to the standards of GFY professionalism in the future.

Squirtit - you are my new best friend, and I'm sorry for being unkind.

Again.. it doesn't begin and end with Matrix my friend. Many people have come forward in other threads that have said they've never bought from matrix and gotten affiliate addressed packets.

Ok.. so we have all the info in this thread on Matrix.... now what?
What about the others? Let all the companies that sold info go free?

:thumbsup :1orglaugh smartass

Like I've said in other posts, you're a fool in business if you think anyone is going to take care of your interests before they take care of theirs.

The industry now is every man for himself.

We must all hang together or assuredly we will all hang seperately.
Benjamin Franklin

You, sir, are a fool, if you think you can survive without allies.

Well I see it differently. I see people on GFY, and other boards, coming together to find a solution. The little guy has a lot more spunk and drive then we're given credit for. We can move faster then a big company, dig farther then patent researchers, and hit harder then a big law firm. Why? Because we personally have more at stake then a big corporation or lawfirm.

We feed ouselves and our families on what we do and will fight tooth and nail to protect that. Those who challenge us and sell us out are just beginning to see what we as a community can do.

QUESTION...Assuming that Matrix or any other company has a database of clients...is it not their database to do with as they choose. Is there any criminal or civil liabilty for giving and/or selling the database to whom ever you choose?

Companies have been fined big money by the government for sharing customer data without the consent of the customers.

If they are in California, it could be even worse!

Here's how I think about this question.

#1 I wonder WHAT POLICY does NLB and Matrix CONTENT have for disclosing their list? And why won't he tell us?

I think this may not be a legal issue, but it sure as skittles is at issue in the court of GFY and customer opinion.

#2 I think that unless an entity has posted a privacy policy and specifically violated that privacy policy, there is no breach of contract.

HOWEVER::::

I think that the entity that disclosed information MAY WELL be liable for any damages that occur as a result of that.

If Bertha loans me her wallet, and I show her driver's license to BUBBA and he rapes her, juries might find me liable.

That's what I think.

But I also use chuck taylors to catch fish in the reflection pool.

I guess that would depend upon the customer agreement, if any.

It's been said that a lot of the big guys swap their lists. Lists are a valuable thing worth big money.

How many webmasters have swapped customers lists as part of a deal?

Have to research it, but in healthcare its nice and nasty.

2. Civil Sanctions

The U.S. HHS may impose civil fines of up to $100 per violation not to exceed a total of $25,000 per person per year for a negligent violation of a single standard.

UnderCalifornia law, any patient may bring a civil action against a person or entity who negligently releases confidential information in violation of the Confidentiality of Medical Information Act. In addition, the person or entity may be assessed an administrative fine or civil penalty not to exceed:

a. $2,500 per negligent violation;

b. $25,000 per willful or knowing violation; and

c. $250,000 per willful or knowing violations if the information was used for financial gain.

3. Criminal Sanctions

HHS may make a criminal referral to the U.S. Department of Justice to prosecute a person who knowingly violated a requirement set forth in the Privacy Rule. The potential criminal penalties are as follows:

a. If the person is convicted of violating a requirement set forth in the Privacy Rule with the intent to sell, transfer, or use Individually Identifiable Health Information for commercial advantage, personal gain or malicious harm, a court may impose a criminal penalty of fines of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to ten years.

b. If the person is convicted of violating a requirement set forth in the Privacy Rule under false pretenses, a court may impose a criminal penalty of fines of up to $100,000 and/or imprisonment for up to five years; and

c. If the person knowingly commits and is convicted of a violation of the Privacy Rule (other than under the specific circumstances in paragraphs a and b above), the person may be fined up to $50,000 and/or imprisoned for up to one year.

Instead of this speculating.. TAKE ACTION people!

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showth...hreadid=191252

Get some answers in writing from the people involved. Read more at the post above.

Also, Matrix says they did not give Acacia permission to use the list.

So, if it is true that Acacia is using it, and if what Matrix says is true, wouldn't it seem that they are using it illegally?

You guys should keep in mind that aside from this Matrix issue, i'm sure that Acacia has their OWN guys doing research to find companies to mail out their packets to as well. I highly doubt that they would take 'someones' database, use that, and call it a day.

Just because someone received a packet that wasn't from the Matrix database, doesn't mean anything...and it doesn't mean someone else 'sold them out.' Is it possible though? Sure. But it's also possible that one of Acacia's employees who's assigned to find companies to mail packets to, happened to find you.

Ofcourse I believe it's always good to question the possibilities of where Acacia may have got/received your information from. But again, keep in mind that you know they have their own people searching for you as well. Some leads are going to be untraceable, while some are probably from a simple whois lookup. Other ways? Well...who knows.

The question here is the Matrix issue. Or is this still in question? It's truly scary the of the amount of people that received packets that can only have come from the Matrix database; per those peoples claims.

Is there a straight answer yet on the Matrix database?

Are you saying that it is a State criminal offense and/or a Federal criminal offense?

If so what do you base your info upon?

http://oryza.com/asia/hongkong/index.shtml

California Civil Code § 1798.82 ? New Duties to Disclose A "Security Breach"

California has revised its business laws to require notification of customers if a "security breach" leads to the disclosure of customers' personal data. The new law is codified as an amendment to California Civil Code § 1798.82 and takes effect on July 1, 2003. It applies to any person or business that conducts business in California if the entity possesses "computerized ... personal information." If a "breach of the security system" occurs, defined as any unauthorized acquisition of personal data, the business must inform affected persons "immediately" unless law enforcement requests a delay. Consumers have a private right of action under the law for injunctive and civil damages relief, but no specific monetary penalties are suggested.

Based on the information provided I'd make my own decision. ASSUMING the Matrix data did reach Acacia.. HOW it got there is crutial to what action should be taken. Without more information... I would take no action.. not until the HomeGrown VS Acacia suit is done. It's to early... WAY to early.. a court date hasn't been set yet and much more shocking information will come out. This is just the beginning. Save judgement until a later date, keep notes and stay informed. I say that regarding Matrix and the other people that haven't used Matrix and got packets. It's more then one company.

I suppose a simple phone call to the local DA office will inform one if it is a criminal act to give or sell a clients personal information to another entity.

If it is a criminal violation then those with "100% proof" can file criminal charges with the DA.

If it is a civil violation and subject to civil fines and or a punitivive damage award...or real damage award then those with "100% proof" can have their attorney file a civil case.

A call to a DA and/or a call to your attorney can provide the answer.

Or is it just more fun to mouth off on a BB?

Can I get the Cliffs Notes for this thread? :)

I did receive the letter with identical info as I'm registered for Matrix with btw.

So how are we dealing with this?

norman, are you saying that jaYMan also changed his info as you say lil2rich did? and as upset as you are - and who wouldn't be? - are you certain lil2rich did? do you have a way to check the date the info was last changed? we have heard from a fair amount of people who feel that the info matrix has is unique to matrix. mine wasn't unique, but only a couple places have it that way, and matrix is one of them.

all problems between you aside, this is important. if your database was stolen in some way, it might be a lot more important than these other issues. if you could find that lil2rich and jaYMan did NOT change their info, you have a case and can stop that info being used. plus you should report that theft to the law and to the fbi immediately.

good luck with the fires - the valley is sure getting more than its share of smoke, but plenty is still making it here to hollywood.

btw, has anyone contacted Acacia and asked where they received their name/address from?

Nope. I take all other staments seriously. Those people should call me and help get to the bottom of this.

To the people saying 'email your sponsors and ask them this' do you really think they're going to tell you 'oh yeah we sold them our database'

And about Matrix, why would so many people who buy matrix content just all wake up the same day and decide lets all slander matrix?

Theres enough proof in this thread and others to lead me to believe that the matrix database was used... BUT

Norm is saying it wasn't stolen, and they didn't give it away

So what the fuck is the deal here?

I agree I should report it, but I have no proof. If I could get at least 25 matches to our database I would. I would love nothing more. Trust me I have my suspicions, but I need proof of the thief first. I sat in my office Monday till the sheriff kicked me out of our office because of the fire waiting for the calls. To think I was worried my phone system would be overloaded. I think if anyone who feels their information came from our data it would be worth a call.

After reading this long thread, any one can see the frustration
from both sides.
But now is the time to lay down your anger and those that have proof to call MC so he can do something about it.

Just coming here and saying you have proof is not good enough, to many people get caught up in threads like this and post bull shit... The man has asked you to call him and prove your match to the data base. hell im sure if you ICQed him and gave him your no# he would call you.

The way i see it now is if you are not calling or ICQing him you dont have proof or you altered it.
This is a fight against acacia, not webmasters against webmasters.. calm down and look at this objectively and help him get them. After all every notch in our belt against acacia is a plus.
and no i dont know any one from MC. just think things thru and remember united we stand and divided we fall.
Give him the benefit of doubt that you would want for yourselfs.

Norman, there is no mistake whose database it came from here. Jaime has never used that name anywhere. You are the FIRST place and that is her first adult site. and the only reason was to get a few sets for her brand new dating site design.

Its so pathetic how obvious it is. :glugglug

Does Matrix make its custom list available to third parties in any form - i.e. sell their list to partners?

Is it possible that Acacia was able to obtain customer information using methods other than theft or settlement?

If so, it is possible that a partner company who licensed this information rolled?

I have received all of the ACACIA packets and have never bought any content from Matrix and have never registered or even looked at their web site before.

BV

So you weren't available yesterday because of the fire, but you were available for phone calls. Which is it? Where you available or were you not?

Your digging yourself a very deep hole here. You've had all weekend (plus Monday) to come up with some response on this board and all you have is that your going to sue your customers.

This is kind of what I was saying before... And lynching Matrix isn't going to make the fact go away that Acacia is using ALL KINDS of databases from ALL KINDS of sources to pin people. No matter what happened here, Matrix isn't the only signee, but they are one of the only ones who came forward... That should stand in their favor, I would think. Norm is taking a fuck of a lot of heat here that he wouldn't feel the need to take if he was out and out lying.

It's easy to see why people are doing it, and the sense of betrayal is huge, I can understand that. But until anyone has DEFINITIVE PROOF that Matrix is not a victim like everyone else in this, cursing at them, threatening their business, etc isn't going to make the situation go away. There's two options here. People can work together, or they can run around screaming and pointing fingers at each other.

If Acacia is doing this to our industry, tearing it apart from the inside, causing mistrust, contention and the chaos we're seeing now, their battle is already 3/4 won for them. I have to agree with Squirtit here... It's extremely important to see the BIG picture.

Cel phones? What century are you from? :P It's one thing taking a cel phone with you evacuating from a fire.. taking a pc with you isn't always easy?

And this is where it's at. I hope you can get your matches, Norm.. It would be very vindicating for you to be able to press charges against these extortionists, and perhaps gain back some of the trust they are stripping away from our industry like the peel off a banana. I will send some people your way who are sure about it and hopefully that will help you on the way.

NLB, I'm giving you the benefit of doubt here.

Here are my facts, now I will admit they would not hold up in a court of law on their own. But as part of a group I'm sure it would help.

I allways use my correct personal info when signing up for something to do with my new business venture in Adult. This means my contact info is all the same, Name, address, e-mail and so on.

But the 1 very major diffrence in my contact info at Matix is the use of a single domain name. I have around 50 domain names, I have never used this 1 name anywhere but matrix content. It is the only name I ever listed at Matrix content, because I've never bought a thing from you, so I never updated my info at your store. I used this name to view your online store and that's all it never has been a website sense I've owned the name.

I called Acacia up on Mon to see what sites I own that are in violation of their claimed patents. The only domain they have on me is this single domain, and therefore this 1 single name was the reason I recived a letter from Acacia. Not because Acacia did reseach and found sites that I own, because if they did , they would not have that url being it's a dead one a 404.

Out of 50 names many I've used countless places how come this is the only name they have? Honestly if I belived for one second that My info didn't come from your contact list I'd would have never spent this much time typing. Now you can threatn to sue me or anyone else for what ever you want, you can even stick your head in a hole and pretend not to hear.

But the simple fact is I personally know 100% fact in my mind that Acacia got their information on me from your contact list. Now I want to know what you plan to do about it?

There are laptops to. He can take that cell phone and laptop and hook up to the internet or take that laptop to where ever he went and hooked up to the internet. He said he was waiting by the phone until the sheriff threw him out.
So apparently he wasn't using his cell phone.

What is happening here should teach people to think before signing with Acacia. Matrix signed and now their trust is at issue here. Their trust went down once they signed. This stuff about the database doesn't help him any further. If you want to stick up for him after he signed up with Acacia and then all this evedince that more in likely his database was used for Acacia to go after more adult companies. That's all great and good. But in war, anybody caught running away from a battle (like against Acacia) can and usually would get shot.

I did.

The canned response from the operator was that the 'Research Dept.' had gathered my information.

let them connect you to the "'Research Dept." then and ask again?
i know, chances to get infos are like zero, but atleast you can try..

you need 25 matches?

search GFY

I believe atleast 25 are here.

Exactly:thumbsup