Ukraine is bitch smacking the Russian Separatists

[Rochard]

Seems like the Ukrainian military has the upper hand and beating the Russian backed separatists badly......

Ukraine's military has pounded the main pro-Russian rebel stronghold of Donetsk with artillery fire, damaging buildings but few casualties are reported.

A military spokesman said the rebels were in "panic and chaos" and had begun to desert en masse.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-28732180

[femdomdestiny]

Donetsk is surrounded as far as I understand, which means they are practically finished. But there is something new: http://rt.com/news/179496-lavrov-hum...rridor-agreed/

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by femdomdestiny

Donetsk is surrounded as far as I understand, which means they are practically finished. But there is something new: http://rt.com/news/179496-lavrov-hum...rridor-agreed/

If they are sending in the Red Cross then it shouldn't be an issue.

[femdomdestiny]

yeah but it is a ceasefire if I understand good.

[aka123]

Originally Posted by Rochard

If they are sending in the Red Cross then it shouldn't be an issue.

Well, NATO just informed that Russian military intervention in the name of "humanitarian mission" is likely. So, maybe they put some red crosses on their tanks.

[aka123]

Originally Posted by femdomdestiny

Donetsk is surrounded as far as I understand, which means they are practically finished. But there is something new: http://rt.com/news/179496-lavrov-hum...rridor-agreed/

According to other news Ukraine government definitely doesn't want any "humanitarian missions" from Russia.

Maybe Russia Today has a bit...hmm... Russian view to this?

[femdomdestiny]

Originally Posted by aka123

According to other news Ukraine government definitely doesn't want any "humanitarian missions" from Russia.

Maybe Russia Today has a bit...hmm... Russian view to this?

Russians showed they are weak with this and showed it to whole world so I doubt they will do anything. They let thousands of people to die, and hundred thousands of refugees to come to Russia and while nazis were burning people alive or shelling civilians. That is pure weakness and there is no excuse for that.

[MrDeiz]

yeah. ruski weren't prepared for that kind of suppression
just for the record ruskie army is weak, but has a big mind about itself. everyone in rusia tries to look big, while it's not. rusia likes to pretend, while it barely delivers.

it's a war of Ukrainian army against professional ruski militaries. Ukraine wins so far.

[aka123]

Originally Posted by femdomdestiny

Russians showed they are weak with this and showed it to whole world so I doubt they will do anything. They let thousands of people to die, and hundred thousands of refugees to come to Russia and while nazis were burning people alive or shelling civilians. That is pure weakness and there is no excuse for that.

Don't you think that stopping the help to the rebels would help to stop the fights?

Russia has plenty of border patrols, troops, etc. If they would want to, they could easily take their border into control. Not to mention to stop the supply of weapons and material, that they do themselves.

Or do you think that Russia has no control who walks on their land, or in or out of their borders? In normal country there would be countless polices and army troops if unofficial armed troops would walk on the streets (no matter the troops nationality). I don't think Russia is that out of normal, so it intentionally lets the rebel troops to walk freely on their land.

Russia has significant military presence at the Ukraine border, and yet they claim to have no control over it. LOL. Russia having tens of thousands troops at the border, the rebel troops are literally walking amongst Russian troops.

[CAHEK]

Originally Posted by MrDeiz

yeah. ruski weren't prepared for that kind of suppression
just for the record ruskie army is weak, but has a big mind about itself. everyone in rusia tries to look big, while it's not. rusia likes to pretend, while it barely delivers.

it's a war of Ukrainian army against professional ruski militaries. Ukraine wins so far.

Collapse of the Ukraine nation's currency is coming so you should better buy rubles.

[femdomdestiny]

Originally Posted by aka123

Don't you think that stopping the help to the rebels would help to stop the fights?

Russia has plenty of border patrols, troops, etc. If they would want to, they could easily take their border into control. Not to mention to stop the supply of weapons and material, that they do themselves.

Or do you think that Russia has no control who walks on their land, or in or out of their borders? In normal country there would be countless polices and army troops if unofficial armed troops would walk on the streets (no matter the troops nationality). I don't think Russia is that out of normal, so it intentionally lets the rebel troops to walk freely on their land.

Russia has significant military presence at the Ukraine border, and yet they claim to have no control over it. LOL. Russia having tens of thousands troops at the border, the rebel troops are literally walking amongst Russian troops.

Of course that Russia is helping rebels, just like US is helping rebels against Asad (and Russians helped Asad) or that US helped muslims on Kosovo, and dozen another examples (and they will always deny involvement). Nothing new. There were no war until violent happenings in Kiev.Country was peaceful until that moment. What I am saying is that Russians acted weak. There was no reason to play it small , but play big, which means same what they did in Crimea. That would save lives, Ukrainian military (nazis and mercenaries) would simply run away but infrastructure and lives would be saved. Unfortunately Ukrainian lives are not important to NATO or Russia and ordinary people are paying the price.

Main looser there is Ukraine. They will feel it in incoming months but signs of that are available all over, from currency going down up to armed and masked people running around Kiev. Not to mention dead people, devastated families and ruined economy. Ukraine don't have any chance for normal life from now. Getting in any kind of fight with powerful neighbour will result is total economic disaster. Which means more dead people with lack of heating,medicaments,money.etc...

[Barry-xlovecam]

Ukraine crisis: the neo-Nazi brigade fighting pro-Russian separatists

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...paratists.html

Nationalism is an ever growing problem ...

Russia, caused the migration of Russian nationals to Ukraine maybe they should repatriate their nationals, and let Ukrainians be Ukrainians (whatever that is ).

[aka123]

Originally Posted by femdomdestiny

Of course that Russia is helping rebels, just like US is helping rebels against Asad (and Russians helped Asad) or that US helped muslims on Kosovo, and dozen another examples (and they will always deny involvement). Nothing new. There were no war until violent happenings in Kiev.Country was peaceful until that moment. What I am saying is that Russians acted weak. There was no reason to play it small , but play big, which means same what they did in Crimea. That would save lives, Ukrainian military (nazis and mercenaries) would simply run away but infrastructure and lives would be saved. Unfortunately Ukrainian lives are not important to NATO or Russia and ordinary people are paying the price.

Main looser there is Ukraine. They will feel it in incoming months but signs of that are available all over, from currency going down up to armed and masked people running around Kiev. Not to mention dead people, devastated families and ruined economy. Ukraine don't have any chance for normal life from now. Getting in any kind of fight with powerful neighbour will result is total economic disaster. Which means more dead people with lack of heating,medicaments,money.etc...

Well, Russia denies it's help to rebels. Why you see Russia's help as a positive thing or Russias intervention as a positive thing? You say you don't want humanitarian disaster, but still you want military actions? Why? There is no fighting without those rebels, or Russia's attack.

About the Kiev, as far as I know the Russian led puppet president had problems going on for years, and peace was far from that.

You talk about nazis, but nazis are gone, and the few neo-nazis are not that big issue. If rebels would stop fighting against Ukrainian government, what do you think would happen? If Ukrainian government would stop fighting, Russia would annex eastern Ukraine, or at least make it as a puppet country.

[Rochard]

Why does Russia want to send in "humanitarian aid"? They created the problem by destabilizing Ukraine and continue to meddle. If they cut off aid to the so called rebels this problem would go away quickly.

[femdomdestiny]

Originally Posted by aka123

Well, Russia denies it's help to rebels. Why you see Russia's help as a positive thing or Russias intervention as a positive thing?

Because nazis and mercenaries (regular army is deserting to Russia as we all saw so many times ) is killing people without pardon.Nothing will stop this except bigger force. Force so big that it will stop any resistance. Just like when someone is attacking you on the street and you pull out gun. He will run away.

Not best principle but it was used so many times by US and no one said a word. In previous months we saw hundreds of killed civilians (it is always problem to post videos and documents about this here and I was watching 45 min long video few days ago with terrible footage and ordinary people blown around that none of western medias simply won't show) , many hundreds of dead attackers (Ukrainians if we can call them like that since people on the south are also Ukrainians) and there is a big threat that chemical factory will be hit and new catastrophe can easily happen.

It worked with Crimea, no violence, no death,no crimes, no suffering. Precisely same principle since Kiev government showed it will kill own people. Someone has to stop it, if human lives are most important (but from what we see, they are definitely not, for any side in this mess)

Originally Posted by aka123

You say you don't want humanitarian disaster, but still you want military actions? Why? There is no fighting without those rebels, or Russia's attack.

And who is making humanitarian disaster? Are pro russians bombing cities in Ukraine,or Kiev junta is only one that refused any talk and started bombing, airplane attacks and missiles attacks? Tons of footage online,easy to find. From what I see you are suggesting (or I am wrong?) that goal is to kill and clean all people from there and ethnically clean so from that moment there will be no further problems ?. You just need to explain people there to stay calm and wait nazis to do what they did 70 years ago. I know,it worked pretty good once in Croatia and second time in Kosovo, but this time those people are not completely alone and left to NATO supported butchers. (actually it seems Russia will leave them be killed and betray them after giving them help and hope)

Originally Posted by aka123

About the Kiev, as far as I know the Russian led puppet president had problems going on for years, and peace was far from that.

He was legally elected president. Even let protesters to act like savages for months but it was described as problem. But it is not problem when new "government" is using army against onw people? that is fine, right?

Originally Posted by aka123

You talk about nazis, but nazis are gone, and the few neo-nazis are not that big issue.

Nazis are gone ? where? to drink milk before sleep?http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...paratists.html

Originally Posted by aka123

If rebels would stop fighting against Ukrainian government, what do you think would happen?

Same what happened where US and NATO is advising and that is mass ethnic cleansing and brutal violence. I've gave you two historical facts above, do a research. Burning people alive in Odessa is not telling you what will happen? As someone who lived in country devastated by civil war, I have a pretty good idea what will happen .

Originally Posted by aka123

If Ukrainian government would stop fighting, Russia would annex eastern Ukraine, or at least make it as a puppet country.

Much better then to have all those people suffering? Don't you think so?

Do you really think that bunch of Nazis and mercenaries are reason why Russians are not stepping in?

Once again, as someone who live in country that had a brutal civil war (much worse then this one in Ukraine), I will say this: There is no bigger stupidity then to make war with people around you. Everything will calm down at some point and people will continue to do business, make love or party and make new friendships. I remember when older and smarter people were telling that, but it sound stupid at that point. Decade later, it was just like that. Only ones fucked are people who lost their parts of body, people driven away from their homeland and that lost their closest relatives.

[sandman!]

the civil war in Syria would have ended years ago if the usa and europe did not fund the rebels also.

so whats your point ?

our government has destabilized more countries then the Russians have.

Originally Posted by Rochard

Why does Russia want to send in "humanitarian aid"? They created the problem by destabilizing Ukraine and continue to meddle. If they cut off aid to the so called rebels this problem would go away quickly.

[femdomdestiny]

Originally Posted by sandman!

the civil war in Syria would have ended years ago if the usa and europe did not fund the rebels also.

so whats your point ?

our government has destabilized more countries then the Russians have.

He missed how everything started and that Kiev "government" (bunch of nazis, boxers and oligarchs) showed how will treat Russians in Ukraine by tooking their right to use own language. Beautiful and promising start,really..

[aka123]

Originally Posted by femdomdestiny

Because nazis and mercenaries (regular army is deserting to Russia as we all saw so many times ) is killing people without pardon.Nothing will stop this except bigger force. Force so big that it will stop any resistance. Just like when someone is attacking you on the street and you pull out gun. He will run away.

Not best principle but it was used so many times by US and no one said a word. In previous months we saw hundreds of killed civilians (it is always problem to post videos and documents about this here and I was watching 45 min long video few days ago with terrible footage and ordinary people blown around that none of western medias simply won't show) , many hundreds of dead attackers (Ukrainians if we can call them like that since people on the south are also Ukrainians) and there is a big threat that chemical factory will be hit and new catastrophe can easily happen.

It worked with Crimea, no violence, no death,no crimes, no suffering. Precisely same principle since Kiev government showed it will kill own people. Someone has to stop it, if human lives are most important (but from what we see, they are definitely not, for any side in this mess)

And who is making humanitarian disaster? Are pro russians bombing cities in Ukraine,or Kiev junta is only one that refused any talk and started bombing, airplane attacks and missiles attacks? Tons of footage online,easy to find. From what I see you are suggesting (or I am wrong?) that goal is to kill and clean all people from there and ethnically clean so from that moment there will be no further problems ?. You just need to explain people there to stay calm and wait nazis to do what they did 70 years ago. I know,it worked pretty good once in Croatia and second time in Kosovo, but this time those people are not completely alone and left to NATO supported butchers. (actually it seems Russia will leave them be killed and betray them after giving them help and hope)

He was legally elected president. Even let protesters to act like savages for months but it was described as problem. But it is not problem when new "government" is using army against onw people? that is fine, right?

Nazis are gone ? where? to drink milk before sleep?http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...paratists.html

Same what happened where US and NATO is advising and that is mass ethnic cleansing and brutal violence. I've gave you two historical facts above, do a research. Burning people alive in Odessa is not telling you what will happen? As someone who lived in country devastated by civil war, I have a pretty good idea what will happen .

Much better then to have all those people suffering? Don't you think so?

Do you really think that bunch of Nazis and mercenaries are reason why Russians are not stepping in?

In Crimea there wasn't actual battles involved and thus no casualties, excluding murder or two, as pro-Russians did some "clearing" of the wrong minded.

Pro-Russian rebels started the whole civil war by taking arms and making easter Ukraine cities as battlefields. They chose to fight in the midst of civilians. The people's suffering will end when they give up their arms. You just hope Russian invervention, because it suits for your ideology. Whatever you are, you are definitely Pro-Russian, you have no objective view to this matter, no whatsoever.

Nazis lost WWII, and it made them gone from being any major player. Some small bunches of old or new nazis wont make difference. You are just acting like real Russian blaming people nazis. Nazi this, nazi that. The whole Soviet Union was not any better than Nazis. And today's Russia is heading for the same direction with good pace.

There were no nazis in Balkans, there were muslims and cristians and other ethnical shit. And western troops were sent to stop the ethnical killing. You are just so brainwashed that you blame western troops, those came after the "cleaning" had started. And objective figures estimate that in Ukraine the separatists have made much more war crimes than Ukrainian troops.

Russia is not yet stepping in (besides Crimea, as it did that already), because it has even somewhat sense. Conquering other countries or part of those have some serious political consequenses as we have already seen.

Originally Posted by femdomdestiny

Once again, as someone who live in country that had a brutal civil war (much worse then this one in Ukraine), I will say this: There is no bigger stupidity then to make war with people around you.

So why the rebels took arms, and in the cities in the first place? Why they make war?

[brassmonkey]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Why does Russia want to send in "humanitarian aid"? They created the problem by destabilizing Ukraine and continue to meddle. If they cut off aid to the so called rebels this problem would go away quickly.

oh man syria lebanon south korea vietnam oh wait they said hell no to splitting the country in half

[femdomdestiny]

Originally Posted by aka123

In Crimea there wasn't actual battles involved and thus no casualties, excluding murder or two, as pro-Russians did some "clearing" of the wrong minded.

So you really believe that population so large can be held under occupation against their will? I've thought you learner lesson from Iraq for example.

Originally Posted by aka123

Pro-Russian rebels started the whole civil war by taking arms and making easter Ukraine cities as battlefields. They chose to fight in the midst of civilians.

As stated in previous posts, one of the first things they did was to deny Russian language. Is that normal,smart, democratic, or whatever? once Nazi lovers took power by force,people there organized. Are they stupid to follow guys like this and be on their mercy? Nazi that already killed Russians in Checenya and that told that he is there to kill All Ruskies and Jews. You msised episodes like that somehow, right?



Or Timoshenko that told it is time to grab guns and kill all Russians? Small reminder for you and simillar people ignoring how it all started

Originally Posted by aka123

The people's suffering will end when they give up their arms.

Once again people burned alive in Odessa were not armed. This is precisely what will happen if they lay down arms. Leaders calling to kill all russians, and burning people alive. It is fine as long as it is in US interest, in a same way as it was ok to arm and help muslim terrorists in Kosovo or help civil war against Assad in Syria. No one normal or with a little brain will just stand down and wait to be executed.

Originally Posted by aka123

You just hope Russian invervention, because it suits for your ideology. Whatever you are, you are definitely Pro-Russian, you have no objective view to this matter, no whatsoever.

And what is my ideology,tell me since I don't know. You are russophobic what is putting you in even worse situation compared to me (as you described me).

Originally Posted by aka123

Nazis lost WWII, and it made them gone from being any major player. Some small bunches of old or new nazis wont make difference.

Maybe to you since they are type of people you like but we are all different.

Originally Posted by aka123

You are just acting like real Russian blaming people nazis. Nazi this, nazi that. The whole Soviet Union was not any better than Nazis. And today's Russia is heading for the same direction with good pace.

Soviet Union saved world from nazis and their practice of putting people in concentration camps . I can write you a book about what Nazis did in my country and what sick stuff was done, but there is no need to because you are going to justify it because it suits your ideology.

Originally Posted by aka123

There were no nazis in Croatia, there were muslims and cristians and other ethnical shit. And western troops were sent to stop the ethnical killing. You are just so brainwashed that you blame western troops, those came after the "cleaning" had started.

No nazis in Croatia? Ever heard about Ustase? ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usta%C5%A1e) ...but that is irrelevant now. Such amount of missed historical facts made me check who you are and I've figured you are the same guy that couldn't manage to answer all those questions which is a good explanation why you are again talking lies. I am not saying you are lying but lack of knowledge is making you look like that. As Cyber SEO advised,it is stupid from me to even try to talk with someone with such level of education. You just added new avatar so I didn't recognize you immediately , until I've read incredible amount of ignorance in few sentences.

My bad

[just a punk]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Ukraine is bitch smacking the Russian Separatists

The real president of the Ukraine will fix it all:

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by brassmonkey

oh man syria lebanon south korea vietnam oh wait they said hell no to splitting the country in half

And your point?

The United States has been involved in Syria, Lebanon, South Korea, and Vietnam. And your point is what? In Vietnam and Korea, it was a direct military confrontation - no hiding anything. With Syria, we've been arming the rebels or at least supporting them with other means... We aren't trying to hide anything.

With Russia.... They are trying to covertly send arms and most likely men to fight a war that Russia itself mostly created. If they want to send in the Red Cross, great. But no military.

[brassmonkey]

Originally Posted by Rochard

And your point?

The United States has been involved in Syria, Lebanon, South Korea, and Vietnam. And your point is what? In Vietnam and Korea, it was a direct military confrontation - no hiding anything. With Syria, we've been arming the rebels or at least supporting them with other means... We aren't trying to hide anything.

With Russia.... They are trying to covertly send arms and most likely men to fight a war that Russia itself mostly created. If they want to send in the Red Cross, great. But no military.

its proxy war in syria and Ukraine the united states need to stay out.

[aka123]

Originally Posted by femdomdestiny

So you really believe that population so large can be held under occupation against their will? I've thought you learner lesson from Iraq for example.

Try answering in one fucking piece, not cut down to huge number of sections. And yes, even large populations can be held under occupation. Russia does so, Soviet Union did so, nazis did so, USA (and other Europeans) did so, and countless and countless countries have done so.

Have you forget Chechnya. There was and still is rebels. "Peaceful" Russia bombed the shit out of them during second war around there and there were countless of civilian casualties. So why is it now problem in Ukraine? It isn't even Russia. Were you crying for Russian civil war (Chechnya)?

In general this conversation is pointless. You think that it is good if Russia invades Ukraine (again). Fine, you think so, I don't. Continuing this conversation is pointless.

[MrDeiz]

Originally Posted by CyberSEO

The real president of the Ukraine will fix it all:

nice to see your meltdown is over. while hysterical you look like a broke bitch

[Rochard]

So now Russia is sending in aid but the local Red Cross there knows nothing about it? And the Ukrainian military is threatening to stop it at the border?