Why I am so disappointed in the way this industry moved.. - Page 3 - GoFuckYourself.com

papill0n · 04-09-2012, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B.Barnato

Good morning Paul.

Paul Markham · 04-09-2012, 11:27 PM

You see there problem?

papill0n · 04-09-2012, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

You see there problem?

Paul Markham · 04-10-2012, 01:20 AM

The real problem for porn with online porn is the ease of entry to online porn.

At the lowest level of entry is the affiliate model. There's not much required to being an affiliate and never was. This led to saturation of this level and they ended up competing with each other, largely on who could give away the most free porn. Yes some later went on to buying adwords and blogs/SEO. Still the growth in free porn is evidence in itself to the saturation of this level.

Then paysites. Putting up a paysite isn't hard. It costs a bit and this was a barrier for some. The major cost was content, in the beginning sites were opening with as little as 20 scenes and not adding a lot of content. Some bought non exclusive and stopped buying, then after a few years found their members area was full of "saturated content".

The cull was always the profit margin, could someone make enough to give up the day job? As doing it part time as a hobby was possible to most.

Well that depends what the "day job" paid. US, judging by the intelligence of some here their ceiling would be around $30,000 a year $600 a week. Nothing difficult about that. Take out the travel costs to work, other costs of working for a wage, tax deductions and $30,000 matching the wage of being employed and it's a better paying job.

Reading many of the posts you realise few of these people have earned or worked in a higher grade.

We ended up with a very weak herd and the biggest problem was everything the lowest needed to survive was laid out on the table for them. Their overheads were minimal to nothing. And we took giant steps on the road to 2012.

Today there's probably less money taken in porn than for the last 15 or 20 years. Offline which was a big industry is all but gone. DVD, sales and rental, Cable as a money tree, phone lines, magazines, hotels, etc. Even porn shops are feeling the pinch. Very little money left in any of those. What we do know is the money that was spent there, isn't being spent online. If it was this industry would be booming.

And it's clearly not. Manwin might be the biggest company in online porn. Still no one knows for sure how big they are. Fabian told us he had a 9 figure sum by Wall Street bankers or investors to invest. 4 + months after announcing it has anyone seen him spending it? Manwin must be keeping very quiet or the investors are patient.

Still we have papill0n, B.Barnato, ottopottomouse, Cherry7, DamianJ, TheSquealer, to tell us how much they know and how little I know. as they post without giving a clue what they really know. Guys on $30,000 a year. Banging a keyboard from their spare room?

who knows.

Go on guys waste more time replying to me. I'm going to work in the garden.

SIK · 04-10-2012, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

From: [email protected]
To:
Subject: Re: Asian glamour
Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2012 08:08:00 +0200

Hi JD, it all comes down to what you will pay for it.

give me your rates.

I always find this "sales method" retarded as hell, same as "whats your budget" question. That is just WRONG.

I'm asking for a quote because:
a) I obviously can't do/make it myself
b) Am not familiar with the subject

That kinda implies I do not know the expenses for it nor what should the expected profit margin be for it, and then again as a customer - I always want to pay less.

So to shorten this shit up..
Why the fuck didn't you just tell the guy its xyz$ per photo set, xyz$ per video, THEN proceed with bartering and option explaining if that is even needed?

DamianJ · 04-10-2012, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIK

So to shorten this shit up..
Why the fuck didn't you just tell the guy its xyz$ per photo set, xyz$ per video, THEN proceed with bartering and option explaining if that is even needed?

Because he has no idea at all about even the most basic of sales techniques.

Paul Markham · 04-10-2012, 02:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIK

I always find this "sales method" retarded as hell, same as "whats your budget" question. That is just WRONG.

I'm asking for a quote because:
a) I obviously can't do/make it myself
b) Am not familiar with the subject

That kinda implies I do not know the expenses for it nor what should the expected profit margin be for it, and then again as a customer - I always want to pay less.

So to shorten this shit up..
Why the fuck didn't you just tell the guy its xyz$ per photo set, xyz$ per video, THEN proceed with bartering and option explaining if that is even needed?

I don't shoot any more.
I didn't shoot custom much unless it's for a decent price.
I don't have Asian girls and if I did I would ask for top dollar.

I was just seeing what this guy thought this content was worth or what he was willing to pay.

SIK Only in this business would a person reply with a post stating he was going into something he doesn't know the price of, hasn't thought it through properly, doesn't know what's involved or cost to create the product, doesn't have a budget, doesn't know the profit margin, starts talking about cutting costs before establishing the quality of the product and always wants to pay less.

Met Art are who they are because they do not run their business like that.

In this business, no one questions your mistakes. I do.

papill0n · 04-10-2012, 03:02 AM

discuss please

Paul Markham · 04-10-2012, 03:08 AM

SIK and others.

This is the way it works in most businesses. If a company works in one field of an industry and wants to move into another. It does a lot of research, creates a business plan, sets out a strategy to obtain the product, market and sell the product, then launches the whole thing.

It doesn't send random emails to people they have no clue can create the product and ask for a price without setting out a lot more criteria.

I'm sure you know what it takes to create voyeur content, what the profit margin is between great voyeur and mediocre voyeur content. If you want to go into the Asian Met Art level. Do some research first.

Freaky_Akula · 04-10-2012, 03:12 AM

Jakez · 04-10-2012, 03:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrashyContent

Did someone say content thread...

Yeah every one plays the "how much you want, how much you want to pay" game... why say how much you want to pay when the guy might do it cheaper... To me it's the content buyers responsibility to spec the job and come up with "THE PRICE"

Where does "What your willing to pay for it" come from ? Your the one playing the GAME Paul... he's told you what he wants, tell him how much it will cost, no ? You hoping he's going to say more than you want (UNLIKELY) all you've achieved by not telling him, is giving yourself the chance to come on here to moan your ass off about it... and bore the fuck out of everyone else !

Winning hey Paul ? You really are CHarlie Sheen !

The whole 'depends on what you will pay for it' thing is some complete bullshit. It sounds like he wanted some content that has already been shot anyway, and wants a price for it. It seems like other content producers in this thread agree with the buyers prices never coming close to their production costs, fine. But what do you expect when you ask them to come up with the price? You expect them to be generous?

Anyway, you mentioned something about "egotistical thinking". LOL of the century. Paul you need to look at every post you make and think to yourself "am I being a hypocrite?". I honestly guarantee 95% of your posts would never happen were you to do this.

papill0n · 04-10-2012, 03:31 AM

in conclusion

Freaky_Akula · 04-10-2012, 03:41 AM

DWB · 04-10-2012, 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cherry7

I would not see the problem as models. As with the Paul Markham shoot, the Model took only a few hundred dollars and PM took $2500. What value did he add to the shoot compared to the model?

Models are the most important element and yet have the least power and wealth.

If a photographer wants to get paid good money he should show the ability to add value in making good unique different exciting pictures.

Sorry about the model's luck. They should demand more money.

But that is how exploitation works. The people who do not know their worth or can not do anything about it, works for much cheaper than they should while the producer and the owner of the material making all the profits. That applies to porn just as much as it does to shoes and furniture.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilentKnight

Yes, you are correct.

The world is filled with talentless hacks who can "take pictures."

Not everyone can create images others are willing to break out their wallet for.

That is correct. Too many people can take photos.

However, amateur content is hot for a reason. They don't want "pros" taking photos. And there are more of them than there are pros. And it sells just as well.

There is a nut for every bolt.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roald

I never understood why one would post that you have someone on ignore. Isnt the whole idea of the ignore function to actually ignore people?

Carry on ;)

It's to show the person on ignore they are wasting their time with you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

The real problem for porn with online porn is the ease of entry to online porn.

This is the truth. But as much as that is bad for professionals, it is great for the amateur market.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

We ended up with a very weak herd and the biggest problem was everything the lowest needed to survive was laid out on the table for them. Their overheads were minimal to nothing. And we took giant steps on the road to 2012.

We do have a weak herd and it has been thinning and will continue to do so.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Today there's probably less money taken in porn than for the last 15 or 20 years.

I don't have the figures to back it up, but I'm not sure I'd agree with that. I think the money has just been redirected. Cams being one example. Lots of money there. There is still a LOT of money in the business, it's all just changed hands. Porn as you grew to know it has changed, that money is gone. Now it's somewhere new. And that is a hard pill to swallow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Offline which was a big industry is all but gone. DVD, sales and rental, Cable as a money tree, phone lines, magazines, hotels, etc. Even porn shops are feeling the pinch. Very little money left in any of those. What we do know is the money that was spent there, isn't being spent online. If it was this industry would be booming.

Video killed the radio star.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

And it's clearly not. Manwin might be the biggest company in online porn. Still no one knows for sure how big they are. Fabian told us he had a 9 figure sum by Wall Street bankers or investors to invest. 4 + months after announcing it has anyone seen him spending it? Manwin must be keeping very quiet or the investors are patient.

I think everyone knows the money didn't really come from wall street.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIK

I always find this "sales method" retarded as hell, same as "whats your budget" question. That is just WRONG.

I'm asking for a quote because:
a) I obviously can't do/make it myself
b) Am not familiar with the subject

It depends on how they asked the question.

"Can you shoot Asian teens" is a loaded question.

How do you want me to shoot them? Solo or hardcore? How much video, how many pics? How many outfit changes? What kind of location? Do you want smoking hot girls or average looking amateurs? Do we need the best hair and make up or can the girl do it herself. ALL of these things can add a lot of money to the cost.

My answer would have been, show me an example of what you want it to look like, and I'll give you a price. And even then, I'd bet anything he would want the most expensive option and want to pay peanuts for it. That is 99% of the people who ask for content these days. Most companies/people these days don't want to spend much on content.

DamianJ · 04-10-2012, 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

You see there problem?

Is it that they don't understand the difference between their and there?

B.Barnato · 04-10-2012, 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

The real problem for porn with online porn is the ease of entry to online porn.

At the lowest level of entry is the affiliate model. There's not much required to being an affiliate and never was. This led to saturation of this level and they ended up competing with each other, largely on who could give away the most free porn. Yes some later went on to buying adwords and blogs/SEO. Still the growth in free porn is evidence in itself to the saturation of this level.

Then paysites. Putting up a paysite isn't hard. It costs a bit and this was a barrier for some. The major cost was content, in the beginning sites were opening with as little as 20 scenes and not adding a lot of content. Some bought non exclusive and stopped buying, then after a few years found their members area was full of "saturated content".

The cull was always the profit margin, could someone make enough to give up the day job? As doing it part time as a hobby was possible to most.

Well that depends what the "day job" paid. US, judging by the intelligence of some here their ceiling would be around $30,000 a year $600 a week. Nothing difficult about that. Take out the travel costs to work, other costs of working for a wage, tax deductions and $30,000 matching the wage of being employed and it's a better paying job.

Reading many of the posts you realise few of these people have earned or worked in a higher grade.

We ended up with a very weak herd and the biggest problem was everything the lowest needed to survive was laid out on the table for them. Their overheads were minimal to nothing. And we took giant steps on the road to 2012.

Today there's probably less money taken in porn than for the last 15 or 20 years. Offline which was a big industry is all but gone. DVD, sales and rental, Cable as a money tree, phone lines, magazines, hotels, etc. Even porn shops are feeling the pinch. Very little money left in any of those. What we do know is the money that was spent there, isn't being spent online. If it was this industry would be booming.

And it's clearly not. Manwin might be the biggest company in online porn. Still no one knows for sure how big they are. Fabian told us he had a 9 figure sum by Wall Street bankers or investors to invest. 4 + months after announcing it has anyone seen him spending it? Manwin must be keeping very quiet or the investors are patient.

Still we have papill0n, B.Barnato, ottopottomouse, Cherry7, DamianJ, TheSquealer, to tell us how much they know and how little I know. as they post without giving a clue what they really know. Guys on $30,000 a year. Banging a keyboard from their spare room?

who knows.

Go on guys waste more time replying to me. I'm going to work in the garden.

Please add some depth to your arguments and cite sources.

DamianJ · 04-10-2012, 05:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Still we have papill0n, B.Barnato, ottopottomouse, Cherry7, DamianJ, TheSquealer, to tell us how much they know and how little I know.

I don't do that. I take your posts where you demonstrate how little you know (like when you got AIDA and FAB statements horribly wrong) and I explain why you are wrong.

I always use your own posts to demonstrate your lack of knowledge.

SIK · 04-10-2012, 06:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DWB

"Can you shoot Asian teens" is a loaded question.

How do you want me to shoot them? Solo or hardcore? How much video, how many pics? How many outfit changes? What kind of location? Do you want smoking hot girls or average looking amateurs? Do we need the best hair and make up or can the girl do it herself. ALL of these things can add a lot of money to the cost.

My answer would have been, show me an example of what you want it to look like, and I'll give you a price. And even then, I'd bet anything he would want the most expensive option and want to pay peanuts for it. That is 99% of the people who ask for content these days. Most companies/people these days don't want to spend much on content.

Trust me, I know the drill. I even tend to ask how are models acting skills are and how much do they like to smile. The guy from Paul's email is a "clumsy negotiator" (at best).

But STILL I find it very wrong from a provider to ask "how much are you willing to pay?".
You also can't exclude the potential language barrier - perhaps I simply don't know how to ask you the detailed questions?

Indeed IT IS easier if the person ordering content knows exactly what they want, but if not - you gotta be the one guiding them through the process, and even suggesting a better idea based on your experience and even upsell skills.

Once again, I really find it unprofessional (in ANY business) to ask "how much would you care to pay for it?". For fucks sake, where would that lead - you order a steak and waiter asks how much are you willing to pay for it so he can tell chef to wash his hands or not?

Paul Markham · 04-10-2012, 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DWB

Sorry about the model's luck. They should demand more money.

But that is how exploitation works. The people who do not know their worth or can not do anything about it, works for much cheaper than they should while the producer and the owner of the material making all the profits. That applies to porn just as much as it does to shoes and furniture.

Cherry is a fool. his added value isn't anything of value, except in his head. Still spot on with the analogy of a worker getting less than a boss. Cherry has extreme socialists of even communists thinking, so he thinks we should all earn the same. That's how he justifies his low wage.

Quote:

That is correct. Too many people can take photos.

However, amateur content is hot for a reason. They don't want "pros" taking photos. And there are more of them than there are pros. And it sells just as well.

There is a nut for every bolt.

Porn has rarely been about camera skills. The model is the equipment that has to be mastered. How do you get a girl who's not an actress to convince the audience she's not bored. Cherry will filll us in on that. he read the book.

Quote:

This is the truth. But as much as that is bad for professionals, it is great for the amateur market.

Is this the amateur photographer or amateur model market?

Quote:

We do have a weak herd and it has been thinning and will continue to do so.

Quote:

I don't have the figures to back it up, but I'm not sure I'd agree with that. I think the money has just been redirected. Cams being one example. Lots of money there. There is still a LOT of money in the business, it's all just changed hands. Porn as you grew to know it has changed, that money is gone. Now it's somewhere new. And that is a hard pill to swallow.

As you don't have figures on what all the cam sites make, that's a guess.

Using logic, is it logical all those buying per-recorded porn moved over to web cams?

Quote:

Video killed the radio star.

Free killed the porn business, well not yet but it gave it one very bad cold.

Quote:

I think everyone knows the money didn't really come from wall street.

The only people it could of come from are venture capitalists. They don't gamble. Where ever it came from I expected some big news of where it had started to go. By now.

Quote:

It depends on how they asked the question.

"Can you shoot Asian teens" is a loaded question.

How do you want me to shoot them? Solo or hardcore? How much video, how many pics? How many outfit changes? What kind of location? Do you want smoking hot girls or average looking amateurs? Do we need the best hair and make up or can the girl do it herself. ALL of these things can add a lot of money to the cost.

My answer would have been, show me an example of what you want it to look like, and I'll give you a price. And even then, I'd bet anything he would want the most expensive option and want to pay peanuts for it. That is 99% of the people who ask for content these days. Most companies/people these days don't want to spend much on content.

Most people never spent much on the product. That's why the top shooters offline rarely shot for anyone online. They would of, if people would of paid them to. Even the "glam" sites were using people who could never compete with the Steve Hicks, Viv Thomas level of the offline porn world.

If you're on my end of the business, you would be amazed at the dick heads who walk up to you with the notion that we work for peanuts. Czech girls model for $50 a day, I shoot for $50 a day, etc. In fact people here on GFY find it amazing or even unbelievable that a guy who is basically a shooter of no outstanding talent if compared with the whole business, DVTimes to Suze Randall. Can actually make a decent living and retire with no financial worries without driving traffic, opening a paysite, shooting custom. That's why they jump on Damian and Squealers lies as if they are the truth.

Squealer is the clown. He actually visited our studio with all the scenes and equipment, saw the office with the office only staff, met the studio staff, saw I wasn't kissing his butt for business and he judges my success on the car I choose to drive models around in and our 3 bedroom detached house in the countryside. Didn't know diddly squat and thought 8 years ago I was broke. Yet people believe him today when clearly I wasn't going broke 8 years ago.

His stupidity clearly matched by others?

TheSquealer · 04-10-2012, 06:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Squealer is the clown. He actually visited our studio with all the scenes and equipment, saw the office with the office only staff, met the studio staff, saw I wasn't kissing his butt for business and he judges my success on the car I choose to drive models around in and our 3 bedroom detached house in the countryside. Didn't know diddly squat and thought 8 years ago I was broke. Yet people believe him today when clearly I wasn't going broke 8 years ago.

His stupidity clearly matched by others?

I saw you were a broke loser with zero social etiquette, sense of courtesy, professionalism or even what could be described as an appropriate sense of self awareness.

I saw someone who was obviously grossly exaggerating their success online (as you continue to do today).

I saw you were in panic as you tried to copy the "content blowout" model, launch paysites and tgps (all failed miserably as could easily be predicted). Remember when you used to argue that "cheap content" would ruin this industry? Fucking retard.

I saw you were desperate and had insane plans to lease your "studio" for $1000's per day even though it was an absolute shithole.

I saw you begging on this board for money.

I saw you announcing your wife had to get a job because you were destitute.

I also saw that you were irretrievably stupid and though i agreed to work with your wife and assistant, it wasn't even worth it to know you were within a 100 KM radius.

And yeah...

You clearly were going broke Paul. You created the threads here yourself to beg for money. You admitted that Eva, who was actually the one shooting all your content leading up to that point had to get a job to support both of you.

The only one who believes Paul Markham is his oldest and only friend... Paul Markham.

Paul Markham · 04-10-2012, 08:37 AM

TheSquealer
This message is hidden because TheSquealer is on your ignore list.

porno jew · 04-10-2012, 08:40 AM

TheRealityPrinciple
This message is hidden because TheRealityPrinciple is on your ignore list.

B.Barnato · 04-10-2012, 08:46 AM

Paul Markham
This message is hidden because Paul Markham is Paul Markham.

Cherry7 · 04-10-2012, 08:54 AM

I do think that Models should be respected and be paid a fair wage. I would also like to see them organize and have more power in the industry.

If a shoot requires little resources to produce, the cost is low and the product will have low value.

If we add value to the product to make it more attractive, more sexy, unique and exclusive, we make it more valuable and sought after.

So we

Select Models
Script Productions
use
Professional Lighting
Professional Cameras
Professional Sound
use
professional crew (like wot works in TV and film proper )
Buy Clothing and Sets
Edit Film
Add sound effects
Compose Music to Picture
Mix sound tracks to Stereo or 5,1 sound

Paul Markham does not have the understanding, knowledge or ability to add value to his product, and this is why it has little value. The value back in the day was that he had access to naked pretty girls and others didn't.

Paul Markham · 04-10-2012, 10:00 AM

porno jew
This message is hidden because porno jew is on your ignore list.

B.Barnato
This message is hidden because B.Barnato is on your ignore list.

Cherry7
This message is hidden because Cherry7 is on your ignore list.

porno jew · 04-10-2012, 10:01 AM

you are such a knob.

DamianJ · 04-10-2012, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

porno jew
This message is hidden because porno jew is on your ignore list.

B.Barnato
This message is hidden because B.Barnato is on your ignore list.

Cherry7
This message is hidden because Cherry7 is on your ignore list.

I am starting a book that you will reply to one of the three people, proving your fictious ignore list is just one of your many and varied lies.

24 hours
36 hours
48 hours
1 week

Any takers?

CaptainHowdy · 04-10-2012, 10:10 AM

Paul gets the "views", you gotta give him that ...

B.Barnato · 04-10-2012, 10:15 AM

DamianJ · 04-10-2012, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainHowdy

Paul gets the "views", you gotta give him that ...

I think any mental, broke, retard trying to do something difficult they have no experience in doing whilst claiming they are amazingly rich and experts in that area would get views.

MrBottomTooth · 04-10-2012, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainHowdy

Paul gets the "views", you gotta give him that ...

So did guys like sexeducation.

Paul Markham · 04-10-2012, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainHowdy

Paul gets the "views", you gotta give him that ...

No you have to thank all my stalkers telling me how useless I am.

Damian works from home and masquerades as a marketing man.

Cherry7, his models will tell you why they look so bored on his shoots. He's just spent 30 minutes trying to impress them with how clever he is. He doesn't realise the girls he's trying to impress have been shot by real photographers. And know he's a dumb ass amateur.

Porno Jew, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

Squealer, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

papill0n, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

Freaky_Akula, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

B.Barnato, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

So many people on here fall into the, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is? Category.

Without them my threads would be a lot smaller. so I love them. Having them on ignore makes it sweet as well.

B.Barnato · 04-10-2012, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

B.Barnato, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

B.Barnato
VP of Mergers and Acquisitions
Paul Markham Content Store

ottopottomouse · 04-10-2012, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B.Barnato

Paul Markham
This message is hidden because Paul Markham is Paul Markham.

DamianJ · 04-10-2012, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Damian works from home and masquerades as a marketing man.

Rather that then be a broke, bitter liar stealing money from two governments whilst sending his wife out to work as a secretary to pay the bills.

Anyway, was it just another lie when you said you wouldn't be coming back here because you weren't bothered and everyone here was an idiot?

lolsome.

Cherry7 · 04-10-2012, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Cherry7, his models will tell you why they look so bored on his shoots. He's just spent 30 minutes trying to impress them with how clever he is. He doesn't realise the girls he's trying to impress have been shot by real photographers. And know he's a dumb ass amateur.

"Oh I hate these dumb ass amateurs, I wish Paul Markham had not retired"

Jakez · 04-10-2012, 01:25 PM

Stalkers lol. Don't act like you don't love the attention. And I'm not talking about thread bumps.

Paul Markham · 04-10-2012, 09:25 PM

My stalkers are busy

Porno Jew, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

Squealer, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

papill0n, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

Freaky_Akula, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

B.Barnato, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

Add

ottopottomouse, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

Jakez, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is?

This lists keeps growing.

BettingHandle · 04-11-2012, 01:36 AM

bump for Paul

Roald · 04-11-2012, 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DWB

It's to show the person on ignore they are wasting their time with you.

Sounds like a waste of time to me

papill0n · 04-11-2012, 01:53 AM

im on my own ignore list

CurrentlySober · 04-11-2012, 01:59 AM

I usually stay out of these threads, but I feel today, I have something relevant to say...

I'm going to an event near Brighton this weekend - Back in January, I was given the numbers of 3 Hotels, that were nearby, and recommended by the event organiser.

I called them up and asked how much a night for 3 nights on these dates?

Hotel A said £55 a night
Hotel B said £110 a night
Hotel C said £170 a night

I booked at Hotel B, cause I didn't want to try and stay at the cheapest, and poss have a shitty room, and nor did I want to stay at the most expensive, and throw extra money away on people calling me sir, with phoney airs and graces...

The point I'm making, is that I had NO IDEA of price, so I asked and I was told. Then I was able to make an informed decision...

NOT ONE OF THE HOTELS ASKED ME HOW MUCH I COULD AFFORD TO SPEND, OR WHAT MY BUDGET WAS...

.

CurrentlySober · 04-11-2012, 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

I usually stay out of these threads, but I feel today, I have something relevant to say...

I'm going to an event near Brighton this weekend - Back in January, I was given the numbers of 3 Hotels, that were nearby, and recommended by the event organiser, who had NO IDEA of my budget...

I called them up and asked how much a night for 3 nights on these dates?

Hotel A said £55 a night
Hotel B said £110 a night
Hotel C said £170 a night

I booked at Hotel B, cause I didn't want to try and stay at the cheapest, and poss have a shitty room, and nor did I want to stay at the most expensive, and throw extra money away on people calling me sir, with phoney airs and graces...

The point I'm making, is that I had NO IDEA of price, so I asked and I was told. Then I was able to make an informed decision...

NOT ONE OF THE HOTELS ASKED ME HOW MUCH I COULD AFFORD TO SPEND, OR WHAT MY BUDGET WAS...

.

Paul - As you normally say - Comments please?

Paul Markham · 04-11-2012, 02:31 AM

It's easy for a person who was in porn prior to online taking it over, to be disappointed.

1995 given what the Internet had to offer, the future should of been great.

With world wide access, direct to peoples homes, places of work, 24/7/365. The prospect for smaller producers to go direct to customers at a low price, the ease of publishing porn. With new technologies and speed of the Internet stepping up all the time.

What could possibly go wrong?

We now know. It was too easy and the entry level was dropped to a level where a "marketing man". displays on his site, why not to do business with him.

Or a person masquerading as an "erotic film maker" is clearly not.

And 1,000s think they sell and market porn because they can get 1,000s to millions on their site and send a tiny % to a website where an even smaller % spend money. Al the time giving away the biggest deterrent to actually spending money on porn.

Who thought in 1995 we would be mostly using recorded porn to sell ad space?

Disappointing? Yes given what we could of achieved.

Paul Markham · 04-11-2012, 02:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

Paul - As you normally say - Comments please?

The person you were speaking to wasn't selling the hotel room. He was taking an order.

he was basically an order taker, filling in a form. someone who was "selling" the hotel would ask questions that related to what he had to offer without revealing the price. something like this.

We have a beautiful Presidential suite that has a bedroom, lounge with a dining table and chairs for 4, leather sofa with two armchairs and a jacuzzi with a sauna. Plus bath, shower and separate toilet. It's excellent for entertaining people and also offers superb views of the sea.

A bit over the top, still it shows what a salesman does and an order taker does. Obviously the speech can be shortened and for other rooms it would go down in scale.

A salesman doesn't ask for budget before selling his product/services.

The above is basic selling and marketing.

So way over Damian's head.

Still for £170 a night I'm sure you're not staying at the Savoy.

CurrentlySober · 04-11-2012, 03:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

The person you were speaking to wasn't selling the hotel room. He was taking an order.

he was basically an order taker, filling in a form. someone who was "selling" the hotel would ask questions that related to what he had to offer without revealing the price. something like this.

We have a beautiful Presidential suite that has a bedroom, lounge with a dining table and chairs for 4, leather sofa with two armchairs and a jacuzzi with a sauna. Plus bath, shower and separate toilet. It's excellent for entertaining people and also offers superb views of the sea.

A bit over the top, still it shows what a salesman does and an order taker does. Obviously the speech can be shortened and for other rooms it would go down in scale.

A salesman doesn't ask for budget before selling his product/services.

The above is basic selling and marketing.

So way over Damian's head.

Still for £170 a night I'm sure you're not staying at the Savoy.

Well, OK... I guess I'll give you that.

DamianJ · 04-11-2012, 03:10 AM

How many times do you think anyone in a hotel would ever say to anyone "how much do you want to spend"?

Paul Markham · 04-11-2012, 03:16 AM

There are other ways of selling. Asking the prospective customer what he needs the product for. This can be done many ways depending on what you're selling.

Asking an open question, which is one that can't be answered with a yes or no.

For instance a hotel clerk might ask what you need the room for, with a convention in town that's an obvious question.

Often in this business asking someone his budget will tell you whether the guy is an idiot or has a clue. Especially the guy the OP was about.

Now to online porn.

The most important thing about selling a repeat sale product, where the loyalty of the buyer to the brand and mode of purchase is paramount. Is customer satisfaction. It's not traffic even though getting a customer is important, it does not pip keeping him buying.

Therefore once he hits the affiliates site, he needs to see something that is different, outstanding and fills him with the desire to see more. I'm assuming he's hit the niche/style he likes.

Then when he hits the site the expectations need to be met and surpassed by the content on the tour, not the design, layout, join buttons or text. He's buying porn and the most important thing is the product, then the design, layout, join buttons and text.

If he sees something he's seen a 1,000 times before, he's likely to move on. If on the other hand he sees something different or new or better, etc. Than he's seen before, he's more likely to buy.

Once he has bought if he's inside a site that surpasses others he's joined. The site has a far better chance of retaining him or coming back in a few month for more.

This you will see form your buying habits, in the malls that you go to, shops, supermarkets you buy from and the products that are always your favorite.

There's absolutely nothing that's rocket science here.

Online porn thought they could break these rules and give away tones of free porn to send people to sites that converted badly and retained worse. Yet they called it great, so selling to 1-100s and keeping them a few months became great.

Now it's 1-1,000 and retention is dropping and you see what the customers think of it. but we still think all is fine, so not to worry. All we need is more traffic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

Well, OK... I guess I'll give you that.

Thank you.

I see our very own marketing man is in here with his sage advice. The guy who's blog open with a reason not to do business with him.

Quote:

Sorry if you are getting comment spam with this URL in.

It?s not me doing it. I imagine it is a man called Marion who pretends to be girls on forums whom I outed and got banned from GFY recently. He is clearly trying to get my sites blacklisted for spamming. However, it doesn?t impact me at all as I get very little type in traffic. It?s all direct links.

So, just let akismet do it?s thing, and we can all move on!

= I have a stalker and he does't like me. And I can't put up a blog.

I've told him that this is wrong, but he clearly knows better.

CurrentlySober · 04-11-2012, 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

A salesman doesn't ask for budget before selling his product/services.

Wait ! (I have just re-read your post a few times...)

But... Isn't that exactly what you did, though???

CurrentlySober · 04-11-2012, 03:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

A salesman doesn't ask for budget before selling his product/services.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

Wait ! (I have just re-read your post a few times...)

But... Isn't that exactly what you did, though???

Next Page?

JFK RESPECT!

04-09-2012, 11:27 PM	#102
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	You see there problem? __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

04-10-2012, 01:20 AM	#104
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	The real problem for porn with online porn is the ease of entry to online porn. At the lowest level of entry is the affiliate model. There's not much required to being an affiliate and never was. This led to saturation of this level and they ended up competing with each other, largely on who could give away the most free porn. Yes some later went on to buying adwords and blogs/SEO. Still the growth in free porn is evidence in itself to the saturation of this level. Then paysites. Putting up a paysite isn't hard. It costs a bit and this was a barrier for some. The major cost was content, in the beginning sites were opening with as little as 20 scenes and not adding a lot of content. Some bought non exclusive and stopped buying, then after a few years found their members area was full of "saturated content". The cull was always the profit margin, could someone make enough to give up the day job? As doing it part time as a hobby was possible to most. Well that depends what the "day job" paid. US, judging by the intelligence of some here their ceiling would be around $30,000 a year $600 a week. Nothing difficult about that. Take out the travel costs to work, other costs of working for a wage, tax deductions and $30,000 matching the wage of being employed and it's a better paying job. Reading many of the posts you realise few of these people have earned or worked in a higher grade. We ended up with a very weak herd and the biggest problem was everything the lowest needed to survive was laid out on the table for them. Their overheads were minimal to nothing. And we took giant steps on the road to 2012. Today there's probably less money taken in porn than for the last 15 or 20 years. Offline which was a big industry is all but gone. DVD, sales and rental, Cable as a money tree, phone lines, magazines, hotels, etc. Even porn shops are feeling the pinch. Very little money left in any of those. What we do know is the money that was spent there, isn't being spent online. If it was this industry would be booming. And it's clearly not. Manwin might be the biggest company in online porn. Still no one knows for sure how big they are. Fabian told us he had a 9 figure sum by Wall Street bankers or investors to invest. 4 + months after announcing it has anyone seen him spending it? Manwin must be keeping very quiet or the investors are patient. Still we have papill0n, B.Barnato, ottopottomouse, Cherry7, DamianJ, TheSquealer, to tell us how much they know and how little I know. as they post without giving a clue what they really know. Guys on $30,000 a year. Banging a keyboard from their spare room? who knows. Go on guys waste more time replying to me. I'm going to work in the garden. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

04-10-2012, 03:08 AM	#109
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	SIK and others. This is the way it works in most businesses. If a company works in one field of an industry and wants to move into another. It does a lot of research, creates a business plan, sets out a strategy to obtain the product, market and sell the product, then launches the whole thing. It doesn't send random emails to people they have no clue can create the product and ask for a price without setting out a lot more criteria. I'm sure you know what it takes to create voyeur content, what the profit margin is between great voyeur and mediocre voyeur content. If you want to go into the Asian Met Art level. Do some research first. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

04-10-2012, 03:12 AM	#110
Freaky_Akula Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 3,670	__________________

04-10-2012, 03:41 AM	#113
Freaky_Akula Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 3,670	__________________

04-10-2012, 03:02 AM	#108
papill0n Unregistered Abuser Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 15,547	discuss please

04-10-2012, 03:31 AM	#112
papill0n Unregistered Abuser Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 15,547	in conclusion

04-10-2012, 08:37 AM	#121
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	TheSquealer This message is hidden because TheSquealer is on your ignore list. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

04-10-2012, 08:40 AM	#122
porno jew Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 10,166	TheRealityPrinciple This message is hidden because TheRealityPrinciple is on your ignore list.

04-10-2012, 08:46 AM	#123
B.Barnato So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 3,618	Paul Markham This message is hidden because Paul Markham is Paul Markham.

04-10-2012, 08:54 AM	#124
Cherry7 Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: UK Posts: 3,564	I do think that Models should be respected and be paid a fair wage. I would also like to see them organize and have more power in the industry. If a shoot requires little resources to produce, the cost is low and the product will have low value. If we add value to the product to make it more attractive, more sexy, unique and exclusive, we make it more valuable and sought after. So we Select Models Script Productions use Professional Lighting Professional Cameras Professional Sound use professional crew (like wot works in TV and film proper ) Buy Clothing and Sets Edit Film Add sound effects Compose Music to Picture Mix sound tracks to Stereo or 5,1 sound Paul Markham does not have the understanding, knowledge or ability to add value to his product, and this is why it has little value. The value back in the day was that he had access to naked pretty girls and others didn't. __________________ My Neighbour Butterfly PORN-The Musical The Long Goodbye Cinema Erotique

04-10-2012, 10:00 AM	#125
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	porno jew This message is hidden because porno jew is on your ignore list. B.Barnato This message is hidden because B.Barnato is on your ignore list. Cherry7 This message is hidden because Cherry7 is on your ignore list. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

04-10-2012, 10:01 AM	#126
porno jew Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 10,166	you are such a knob.

04-10-2012, 10:10 AM	#128
CaptainHowdy Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Happy in the dark. Posts: 93,178	Paul gets the "views", you gotta give him that ... __________________ FLASH SALE INSANITY! deal with a 100% Trusted Seller Buy Traffic Spots on a High-Quality Network 1 Year or Lifetime — That’s Right, Until the Internet Explodes!

04-10-2012, 10:15 AM	#129
B.Barnato So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 3,618

04-10-2012, 01:25 PM	#137
Jakez Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: oddfuturewolfgangkillthemall!!!!!!! Posts: 5,656	Stalkers lol. Don't act like you don't love the attention. And I'm not talking about thread bumps. __________________ [email protected] - jakezdumb - 573689400 Killuminati Last edited by Jakez; 04-10-2012 at 01:26 PM..

04-10-2012, 09:25 PM	#138
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	My stalkers are busy Porno Jew, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is? Squealer, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is? papill0n, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is? Freaky_Akula, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is? B.Barnato, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is? Add ottopottomouse, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is? Jakez, does anyone have a clue what he does or who he is? This lists keeps growing. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

04-11-2012, 01:36 AM	#139
BettingHandle Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 1,832	bump for Paul __________________

04-11-2012, 01:53 AM	#141
papill0n Unregistered Abuser Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 15,547	im on my own ignore list

04-11-2012, 01:59 AM	#142
CurrentlySober Too lazy to wipe my ass Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: A Public Bathroom Posts: 38,551	I usually stay out of these threads, but I feel today, I have something relevant to say... I'm going to an event near Brighton this weekend - Back in January, I was given the numbers of 3 Hotels, that were nearby, and recommended by the event organiser. I called them up and asked how much a night for 3 nights on these dates? Hotel A said £55 a night Hotel B said £110 a night Hotel C said £170 a night I booked at Hotel B, cause I didn't want to try and stay at the cheapest, and poss have a shitty room, and nor did I want to stay at the most expensive, and throw extra money away on people calling me sir, with phoney airs and graces... The point I'm making, is that I had NO IDEA of price, so I asked and I was told. Then I was able to make an informed decision... NOT ONE OF THE HOTELS ASKED ME HOW MUCH I COULD AFFORD TO SPEND, OR WHAT MY BUDGET WAS... . __________________ My AI Handywork... My Dream Gal... XXX 👁️ 👍️ 💩

04-11-2012, 02:31 AM	#144
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	It's easy for a person who was in porn prior to online taking it over, to be disappointed. 1995 given what the Internet had to offer, the future should of been great. With world wide access, direct to peoples homes, places of work, 24/7/365. The prospect for smaller producers to go direct to customers at a low price, the ease of publishing porn. With new technologies and speed of the Internet stepping up all the time. What could possibly go wrong? We now know. It was too easy and the entry level was dropped to a level where a "marketing man". displays on his site, why not to do business with him. Or a person masquerading as an "erotic film maker" is clearly not. And 1,000s think they sell and market porn because they can get 1,000s to millions on their site and send a tiny % to a website where an even smaller % spend money. Al the time giving away the biggest deterrent to actually spending money on porn. Who thought in 1995 we would be mostly using recorded porn to sell ad space? Disappointing? Yes given what we could of achieved. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

04-11-2012, 03:10 AM	#147
DamianJ Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: A magical land Posts: 15,808	How many times do you think anyone in a hotel would ever say to anyone "how much do you want to spend"?