How tube sites make money and why they suck!

[RogerV]

Ok lets be real tubes only make money from promoting GetRichInPorn, Dating sites and Cam sites.

they dont help paysites using there content at all.

give us the Pros and Cons about tubes sites with long clips and stolen content. lets see how they stack up against eachother

[fris]

tube traffic has always converted better than any other type of traffic

[Bored]

give people what they want and you will be rewarded

[RogerV]

Originally Posted by fris

tube traffic has always converted better than any other type of traffic

Why is it every single person I talk to about porn ask me how I make money since its all free online. These people arnt even in our business and they get it.

[WiredGuy]

Originally Posted by RogerV

Ok lets be real tubes only make money from promoting GetRichInPorn, Dating sites and Cam sites.

they dont help paysites using there content at all.

give us the Pros and Cons about tubes sites with long clips and stolen content. lets see how they stack up against eachother

Which tube sites promote GRIP? I've only seen cams and dating.
WG

[RogerV]

Originally Posted by Bored

give people what they want and you will be rewarded

Ok what are the sites that convert well off free porn tubes? Let me guess its a secret

[RogerV]

Originally Posted by WiredGuy

Which tube sites promote GRIP? I've only seen cams and dating.
WG

I can show you on ICQ also we have a huge deal going down very soon on mainstream side

[omygosh]

Like everything else on the internet its all about the eye balls, you get people to your site and you have traffic then you have a license to print money. You can try to convert the good traffic, sell the shit traffic, sell links to people hoping for traffic, sell top spots. I imagine theres a lot of money to be had if you have the traffic. On the flip side there are costs, bandwidth, content if you actually own any, dealing with people trying to take your site down or trying to sue you etc etc.

If done right I think its a good business, I do think its making things tougher for everyone but.. business is about making money for yourself.

[mmcfadden]

I don't know how it stacks up but the reality IMO is...

The industry will evolve. If you have a pay site offering vids and pics and tubes give it for free... your site won't convert that well

My thinking now is cams on a paysite is a must. Surfers will get more free porn then anyone could ever possibly think of stopping... that's a fact.

Technology and virtual internet is right there in front of us and that's how I think the next four years will evolve...

[edgeprod]

Originally Posted by WiredGuy

Which tube sites promote GRIP? I've only seen cams and dating.
WG

I just filed it under "guerrilla marketing slash self-promotion slash wishful thinking" and moved on.



Still, I love the GRIP design, and always have.

[WiredGuy]

Originally Posted by RogerV

I can show you on ICQ also we have a huge deal going down very soon on mainstream side

You know, I bet GRIP would do well on CPA side of mainstream, its not too taboo and money making opps do well in general there.
WG

[Zorgman]

If you build it, they will come.

[necoeds]

Roger man, i wish there was a way to just fucking zap all the tube sites...

[SomeCreep]

Owning a tube site is a license to steal! Grooooooooovy!!!!!!!

Originally Posted by RogerV

Ok lets be real tubes only make money from promoting GetRichInPorn, Dating sites and Cam sites.

they dont help paysites using there content at all.

give us the Pros and Cons about tubes sites with long clips and stolen content. lets see how they stack up against eachother

Yeah, give away full length porn to the cheap bastards, but let's also show them how to get into the biz too!

[RogerV]

Originally Posted by omygosh

Like everything else on the internet its all about the eye balls, you get people to your site and you have traffic then you have a license to print money. You can try to convert the good traffic, sell the shit traffic, sell links to people hoping for traffic, sell top spots. I imagine theres a lot of money to be had if you have the traffic. On the flip side there are costs, bandwidth, content if you actually own any, dealing with people trying to take your site down or trying to sue you etc etc.

If done right I think its a good business, I do think its making things tougher for everyone but.. business is about making money for yourself.

I totally agree.

[RogerV]

Originally Posted by edgeprod

I just filed it under "guerrilla marketing slash self-promotion slash wishful thinking" and moved on.



Still, I love the GRIP design, and always have.

LOL so Very TRUE We do have many tube sites promoting us just not the Pornhubs and redtubes etc. I think they have there own agenda

[RogerV]

Originally Posted by WiredGuy

You know, I bet GRIP would do well on CPA side of mainstream, its not too taboo and money making opps do well in general there.
WG

thats what we are working on now with some publishers etc. I'm just worried about the mail traffic on the maintream side

[RogerV]

Originally Posted by Killswitch

Yeah, give away full length porn to the cheap bastards, but let's also show them how to get into the biz too!

I dont think what i'm doing effects anyone at all in the biz, just making them more money. the only ones making money are the real webmasters and it will always be that way. If I help someone learn and get involved then thats a plus

[RogerV]

Originally Posted by mmcfadden

I don't know how it stacks up but the reality IMO is...

The industry will evolve. If you have a pay site offering vids and pics and tubes give it for free... your site won't convert that well

My thinking now is cams on a paysite is a must. Surfers will get more free porn then anyone could ever possibly think of stopping... that's a fact.

Technology and virtual internet is right there in front of us and that's how I think the next four years will evolve...

I can see the huge porn tubes going the route of megavideos. 10min free then have to wait 30min to get it free again unless they pay. at least thats what I think they should all be like

[Paolo]

[QUOTE]Owning a tube site is a license to steal! Grooooooooovy!!!!!!!/QUOTE]

There is no licence thats why they all hide like scared little bitches

[AdultSoftwareSolutions]

Originally Posted by Bored

give people what they want and you will be rewarded

True. How do you compete with free content, near unlimited amount, and no signup or credit card hassle though? If you can figure out how to do that, you are in business.

[TheDoc]

Upgraded/Premium Memberships to DVD Sites that pre-Pay for the spot or to self members area. Dating & Cam White Labels, Mobile, Web TV - all white labels. Video Spots like TGP's do but these are perm listings, Blog listings, Link spots, Chatrooms and Forums with more ads, hosted gals, etc - and then depending on who own the Tube, all the branding, links, urls, etc for your own sites, content, girls names and so on - so more type in traffic, more se traffic.

That's the short list.

[bo$$]

Not true

I just let go a very popular tube (for one, the server was fucking expensive, two, I was afraid of legal issues)

and I promoted nothing but one or two paysites

referred lots and lots of sales

[tiger]

Quality over quantity for me any day.

[hypedough]

Originally Posted by fris

tube traffic has always converted better than any other type of traffic

That's gotta be sarcasm.

[edgeprod]

Originally Posted by RogerV

LOL so Very TRUE We do have many tube sites promoting us just not the Pornhubs and redtubes etc. I think they have there own agenda

Hehe, well, I still have to chuckle and applaud the original post.

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by RogerV

Why is it every single person I talk to about porn ask me how I make money since its all free online. These people arnt even in our business and they get it.

Good point.

I've been wanting to chime in for a while on the increasing ratios most are seeing. But it's all been said. I don't know what the fuck. Is it the tubes? Sure it is. It's a lot of shit. I got some ideas but I wouldn't be saying anything new.

Heres a point I havnt heard much. PPC traffic searches are down and porn searches in general are down. I know, I did PPC since 2004.

Which means interest is down. At least in terms of the old gaurd paysites. Not good for this time in porn. The old sites are yawners and not enough new stuff.

I'm starting to think maybe it's a good time for a vacation. I own sites. I own domains. I have ideas. I will always get some income. Why not put things on auto pilot which many suspect (not me) some paysites are. (not updating, shave on, whatever) Personally I don't think that is true of the winners (sellers). It may be true of many losers though. If the shits sinking and will be sink, why pay Joe affiliate.

It is real easy to work now days for the wrong reason, at the wrong thing, with the wrong sponsor, and not really be worth it.

So I said fuck it. I'm getting old and tired of HTML. I been at this shit as an affil since 1997. I'm not used to working hard. I'm gonna hang out on GFY. Post a bit. Just let my recurrs come in. Take some free time before the ship sinks! If it's going down why fight it?

But damned if the ideas don't keep coming and I stay in the html.

I do enjoy your firey posts Roger and agree most times. Stay on em.

[mx8829]

Traffic is money , if you know how to convert them then props to you. I've bought traffic from tube sites, they convert for dating site, but not regular paysites. Even for dating sites, the convertion is really poor.

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by RogerV

Ok lets be real tubes only make money from promoting GetRichInPorn

Stoip lying you dumb fuck. Your constant spam is already way annoying but your constant bs is just too much. Fucking moron.

For those who don't know him. This is just "creative" spam. Nobody promotes his pos program.

[Dirty F]

MoronV, what exactly do you hope to achieve with your constant bs? Why is it that people like always have to lie and talk crap? Do you realize there is a honest way to get affiliates?

You, Dirtydanza and Simon Synister are all the same. You idiots have so much in common. Besides all 3 being dumb fucking rednecks all you do is spam and bullshit. It's so fucking pathetic.

I always wonder why hicks you like just NEED to bullshit day in day out. It's like compulsive behaviour. You can do things the right way but instead you just need to lie and talk out of your ass. Sad.

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by fris

tube traffic has always converted better than any other type of traffic

If that is true then it should be no problem to finally move to easy street. I hope you're right.

But I doubt you are.

[fris]

Originally Posted by hypedough

That's gotta be sarcasm.

nope not at all

[who]

I love tubes. Especially straws.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by omygosh

Like everything else on the internet its all about the eye balls, you get people to your site and you have traffic then you have a license to print money. You can try to convert the good traffic, sell the shit traffic, sell links to people hoping for traffic, sell top spots. I imagine theres a lot of money to be had if you have the traffic. On the flip side there are costs, bandwidth, content if you actually own any, dealing with people trying to take your site down or trying to sue you etc etc.

If done right I think its a good business, I do think its making things tougher for everyone but.. business is about making money for yourself.

Let me guess what you sell????

Your post is pure bull shit. Traffic does not bring money into the industry and that governs the success of an industry.

The problem is you can't own people and they are traffic, they decide to buy or not. The more who decide not to buy, because we listen to people moving them around and spend too much money moving them around, means the less money we all make.

AFTER 8 YEARS OF LISTENING TO THESE FOOLS AND TRAFFIC IS KING ANSWER ME THESE TWO QUESTIONS.

DO WE HAVE MORE TRAFFIC?

DO WE MAKE MORE OR LESS MONEY?

The answer is yes we have more traffic and we all make less money.

Yet some will never get it.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by mmcfadden

I don't know how it stacks up but the reality IMO is...

The industry will evolve. If you have a pay site offering vids and pics and tubes give it for free... your site won't convert that well

My thinking now is cams on a paysite is a must. Surfers will get more free porn then anyone could ever possibly think of stopping... that's a fact.

Technology and virtual internet is right there in front of us and that's how I think the next four years will evolve...

We've had a free live cam show on the site for a month now and it makes a difference. The problem is few others will do it.

The problem with many is they will not evolve, they want to go back in time. Which is sad for a new industry.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Let me guess what you sell????

Your post is pure bull shit. Traffic does not bring money into the industry and that governs the success of an industry.

The problem is you can't own people and they are traffic, they decide to buy or not. The more who decide not to buy, because we listen to people moving them around and spend too much money moving them around, means the less money we all make.

AFTER 8 YEARS OF LISTENING TO THESE FOOLS AND TRAFFIC IS KING ANSWER ME THESE TWO QUESTIONS.

DO WE HAVE MORE TRAFFIC?

DO WE MAKE MORE OR LESS MONEY?

The answer is yes we have more traffic and we all make less money.

Yet some will never get it.

Content is King - Traffic is God

We have far less porn traffic today than we ever have. Is the traffic still on the Internet? Yes! But since we have way less Webmasters today, we have way less global traffic being created, thus way less exchanges, way less exits going on - which has created less sales.


However traffic is god - and more traffic will produce you more sales. It's very simple to figure out, if someone else does more sales than you do - which 100% does happen - then you, don't have enough traffic - and that is a fact.

[Rebel D]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Content is King - Traffic is God

We have far less porn traffic today than we ever have. Is the traffic still on the Internet? Yes! But since we have way less Webmasters today, we have way less global traffic being created, thus way less exchanges, way less exits going on - which has created less sales.


However traffic is god - and more traffic will produce you more sales. It's very simple to figure out, if someone else does more sales than you do - which 100% does happen - then you, don't have enough traffic - and that is a fact.

I Agree with this. It definetly is a double edged sword. You can Have the ultimate content Stuck on a Page. But with No traffic who can buy it. on the same side if you have alot of traffic and No where to send it who does it help?? No one. Traffic that Doesn;t work for 1 content isn;t nessesarily bad traffic. just no the traffic for you.

Just trial and error it.

Tubes may have a volume of traffic. May not be the traffic for your content. but Have you tried it?
You may be surprised

[omygosh]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Let me guess what you sell????

Your post is pure bull shit. Traffic does not bring money into the industry and that governs the success of an industry.

The problem is you can't own people and they are traffic, they decide to buy or not. The more who decide not to buy, because we listen to people moving them around and spend too much money moving them around, means the less money we all make.

AFTER 8 YEARS OF LISTENING TO THESE FOOLS AND TRAFFIC IS KING ANSWER ME THESE TWO QUESTIONS.

DO WE HAVE MORE TRAFFIC?

DO WE MAKE MORE OR LESS MONEY?

The answer is yes we have more traffic and we all make less money.

Yet some will never get it.

Theres no doubt you make more money that I do online, which I dont really care about, so lets not turn this into a pissing match to try to prove some unrelated point.

Let me guess what you sit around and complain about... things you cant control. Example being; what other people are doing that are causing issues for you... (tubes taking our traffic, or TGPs giving free porn etc)

I apologize if I take a different approach and I work on the the things I can control. Those things such as traffic, content, and the ability to creatively match the two in order to generate revenue.

If you are saying its harder to make the same amount of money today as it was 5 years ago with the same traffic numbers, you are probably right. However im sure some people are making more. But with that said, whats the point of whining about it?

Evolution can be summed up quickly: you move, you adapt or you die. Its our own choice.

Originally Posted by omygosh

Evolution can be summed up quickly: you move, you adapt or you die. Its our own choice.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by RogerV

I can see the huge porn tubes going the route of megavideos. 10min free then have to wait 30min to get it free again unless they pay. at least thats what I think they should all be like

The funniest this will be if Tube sites evolve to fit the times and paysites don't.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by Devin-GTS

Tubes may have a volume of traffic. May not be the traffic for your content. but Have you tried it? You may be surprised

I quit playing with the Tubes when the big ones at the time quit allowing user submits and it wasn't very easy seed them, lots of work for the return. But, through previous experience, I already knew how to draw that traffic in from videos and piracy.

So I only had to figure out how to convert it. Which I'm going to be does better today since they now have so much search engine power.



It's not a secret, title & niche.. It works on the smallest tubes, which I do own and it's all SE traffic, and it does make money.. to the biggest tubes.




The problem with Tubes - why every ones balls are in a bind. Is they don't share the traffic. So the traffic flow in the Industry is being massed into sites that don't share/trade it out with the rest of the Industry. Like the biggest tgps/mgps and all adult has always done - and now, a major part doesn't.


Oddly enough, I think all these people removing content from tubes is now hurting you more than it helps you. Global exposure to your brand/name, etc - at the 'mass level ' the god like traffic level' it will produce more sales.... but not if the eyeballs can't see it.

[Voodoo]

There are ways to profit from tubes.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Content is King - Traffic is God

We have far less porn traffic today than we ever have. Is the traffic still on the Internet? Yes! But since we have way less Webmasters today, we have way less global traffic being created, thus way less exchanges, way less exits going on - which has created less sales.

However traffic is god - and more traffic will produce you more sales. It's very simple to figure out, if someone else does more sales than you do - which 100% does happen - then you, don't have enough traffic - and that is a fact.

This is a fact.

We have more people looking at porn today than we have ever had. And we have less people buying it. You've had 8 years to prove traffic is King or God and look where it has got us.

More traffic does not produce more sales and if you ignore the customer he will show you whose right. HE IS.

omygosh no worries about who makes the most money because some of the biggest money makers in this business are the ones who sold us up the river to make themselves rich.

Your point about controlling traffic is wrong, you can't. You can't control traffic because it's people and they have a habit of learning fast. If we could control traffic we would not have to keep heaping more of it into our sites to get ever decreasing returns.

You know I'm right and said it.

"If you are saying its harder to make the same amount of money today as it was 5 years ago with the same traffic numbers, you are probably right. However im sure some people are making more. But with that said, whats the point of whining about it?"

The problem is the some people making more today are the ones who weren't making anything 5 years ago. I'm sure you have noticed many who have been here 5 years are getting out.

Why whine about it? That's a good point because after years of telling people not to go this route they have gone it and some still say heaping more traffic onto a site is the answer. While their traffic falls and their conversion ratios worsen. Why is simple. YOU CAN'T CONTROL TRAFFIC.

If we were all making more money today than yesterday I would give up telling you your wrong.. But while our earnings are falling I have a right to tell you why I think they're falling.

Originally Posted by Voodoo

There are ways to profit from tubes.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Devin-GTS

I Agree with this. It definetly is a double edged sword. You can Have the ultimate content Stuck on a Page. But with No traffic who can buy it. on the same side if you have alot of traffic and No where to send it who does it help?? No one. Traffic that Doesn;t work for 1 content isn;t nessesarily bad traffic. just no the traffic for you.

Just trial and error it.

Tubes may have a volume of traffic. May not be the traffic for your content. but Have you tried it?
You may be surprised

Yes you need traffic and content to make a site work, without either the other will not work. It's the balance we got wrong. Because people believed the solution was to send more traffic. We got it wrong.

Tubes prove we got it wrong. Because Tubes spend very little on traffic they can survive. Giving away free content and getting traffic to come by many means, except the expensive ones, results in traffic sticking. Which they can then sell. Which is great for the Tube site owners, if they were not making more money before.

But for the rest of us it has meant less traffic coming to paysites and even less buying something. For a few Tube site owners it's good. For all the affiliates, paysite owners, content producers, designers, billing, programmers, affiliate managers and other people who work in the business it sucks.

Originally Posted by Voodoo

There are ways to profit from tubes.

Definitely. So long as the Dating sites remain. Otherwise paying the BW bills on selling traffic, paysite joins and web cams might be a lot tougher than you imagine.

And is there more profit for the industry or do you need to half the profit of many to make a meager one for a few?

[omygosh]

I think we agree on a lot, things were easier before, tubes are overall hurting conversion rates etc.. and really the part we are hung up on is the word "control"

We can "control" how much traffic we get, buy traffic, SEO, link trades etc. What we put into it effort wise has an effect on the resulting overall traffic. Thus we are in control of the amount of traffic we get for the most part.

Your point of we cant "control" the users meaning they are free to do what they want and we cant drag them to a join page and make them click. Thats obvious however you can definitely persuade their decisions again by matching up the best quality content for the designated niches, by playing to their emotions or curiosity. Etc etc

With all the thread we have on gfy about how bad tubes are (daily) and how bad tgps were.. the time spent posting and bitching about it could have go towards trying to generate more traffic to throw into your "sales funnel" or "filter' as well as time spent trying to understand how to better convert the traffic you have. As well as time spent trying to find better ways to recycle the shit traffic that you filter out.

Its like panning for gold, you put yourself in the right spot, you have the right equipment, you are setup to sell the non gold materials for small money to recoup some of your investment, then you start panning... the more panning you can do the better your odds are at finding more gold. If you find no gold there, you move to a different niche and continue.

---

If your filter and funnel are setup well, and your destination point / product is solid (and you are able to evolve them on the fly) then the more traffic you dump into it the better your results period. I dont see a way to argue that.



"More traffic does not produce more sales and if you ignore the customer he will show you whose right. HE IS."

More traffic produces more opportunities to make sales, if you dont or cant capitalize on that, then its not the customer who is right, its you who is wrong. Stop thinking that this is a you vs the customer battle and think of it as a you and the customer battle vs boredom and horniness lol. Go get em big guy!

(Back later need to go submit CCBill crap, trying to start a paysite hahaha)

[Voodoo]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Content is King - Traffic is God

We have far less porn traffic today than we ever have. Is the traffic still on the Internet? Yes! But since we have way less Webmasters today, we have way less global traffic being created, thus way less exchanges, way less exits going on - which has created less sales.


However traffic is god - and more traffic will produce you more sales. It's very simple to figure out, if someone else does more sales than you do - which 100% does happen - then you, don't have enough traffic - and that is a fact.

Ahhh... the age old battle of absolutely nothing.

Content is content. Traffic is traffic. If you want to sum it all up. But it's a lot more complicated to really sum it up in a 5 syllable or less statement.

Content has many degrees, as does traffic. They multiply each other.

GOOD CONTENT * BAD TRAFFIC | 1*0=0
BAD CONTENT * GOOD TRAFFIC | 0*1=0
BAD CONTENT * BAD TRAFFIC | 0*0=0
GOOD CONTENT * GOOD TRAFFIC | 1*1=1

I always like to say "Quality Joins are God", because without them, Content AND Traffic are both pointless.

There are many other levels and varying degrees of content and traffic, but for simplicity... I'm just illustrating that not all content and traffic is created equal, and this seemingly neverending battle of what is better Content or Traffic is entirely trumped by Quality Joins. Which after all... is the point of it all, isn't it?

2c

[Paul Markham]

I think we agree on a lot, things were easier before, tubes are overall hurting conversion rates etc.. and really the part we are hung up on is the word "control"

We can "control" how much traffic we get, buy traffic, SEO, link trades etc. What we put into it effort wise has an effect on the resulting overall traffic. Thus we are in control of the amount of traffic we get for the most part.

Agreed we can control how much traffic we get. I was thinking beyond the feeding it in point.

The problem is the return on our investment of time and money. And you make it here.

Your point of we cant "control" the users meaning they are free to do what they want and we cant drag them to a join page and make them click. Thats obvious however you can definitely persuade their decisions again by matching up the best quality content for the designated niches, by playing to their emotions or curiosity. Etc etc

The problem comes when you over spend (time, money, etc.) on traffic and cut the budgets on the members areas. And this is the main problem.

As RogerV says Tubes will develop if they are to survive. We need to as well. We need to develop our members areas to the point where they are worth signing up to. The problem is you can't always afford to develop the members area if you're spending more on traffic. Balance is the key.

With all the thread we have on gfy about how bad tubes are (daily) and how bad tgps were.. the time spent posting and bitching about it could have go towards trying to generate more traffic to throw into your "sales funnel" or "filter' as well as time spent trying to understand how to better convert the traffic you have. As well as time spent trying to find better ways to recycle the shit traffic that you filter out.

Some will only post on boards and bitch. We added more content, opened the site to the surfer (they only see thumbs) and gave them a free live show every night. It works, we improved our ratios at a time when most are worsening. Why? We spent more on the members area. (Content of the site.)

It was cheaper than throwing more traffic at the site and far more productive. If they all did it would all their ratios improve?

I hope they don't.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by Voodoo

Ahhh... the age old battle of absolutely nothing.

Content is content. Traffic is traffic. If you want to sum it all up. But it's a lot more complicated to really sum it up in a 5 syllable or less statement.

Content has many degrees, as does traffic. They multiply each other.

GOOD CONTENT * BAD TRAFFIC | 1*0=0
BAD CONTENT * GOOD TRAFFIC | 0*1=0
BAD CONTENT * BAD TRAFFIC | 0*0=0
GOOD CONTENT * GOOD TRAFFIC | 1*1=1

I always like to say "Quality Joins are God", because without them, Content AND Traffic are both pointless.

There are many other levels and varying degrees of content and traffic, but for simplicity... I'm just illustrating that not all content and traffic is created equal, and this seemingly neverending battle of what is better Content or Traffic is entirely trumped by Quality Joins. Which after all... is the point of it all, isn't it?

2c

I think you guys are looking at this the wrong way...

See, I don't think you can 'build' traffic of massive volume, and it not be of quality. Just the mixture of sources it takes to build traffic of that volume, will have to create quality traffic that is filtered coming in, and can easily be filtered going out.

Don't think of it so much as, get millions of it, dump at x location.. shit never converted shit, even 12 years ago.


For me though, the traffic is god thing is more broken down like this... If I do lets say 100 sales a day to my own affiliate program. We both know lots of people are doing over 100 sales a day, 500-1000 is still going on, and at the super levels - above that is still being produced.

Assume through my group of paysites, I convert 1:800 - if that ratio slips to 1:1000 - my sales drop. Let me show you..

10,000 hits / 800 = 12.5
10,000 hits / 1000 = 10 or 2.5 less sales

So to do the same numbers I need 2.5k more traffic. This assumes traffic already held - but you can tell from people traffic has dropped and ratios slipped. If ratio slipped and traffic went up, you would still make more sales...

To end this... My idea of traffic is god has to do with someone is bigger than you. If your sales are down, traffic is down, net profit is down, whatever it is - and you have something that converts, its yours... then your problem is traffic.

That doesn't mean go buy shit traffic, it means you need to build more, and you can do that through direct traffic, banding, mass exposure, lots of ways.. that's why the group of 'mass' traffic being built at volume has quality.