Good thread and valid points raised in support of legit tubes.

Sure stolen content is a problem much as it was a problem with tgps and mgps and remains to be, but legit tube sites that make efforts to block stolen content are a good thing. Adult seems hell bent on giving more content away from free and it has been getting worse since 96, so its not surprising tubes sprang up as the next stage of giving more away for free to get your traffic.

Well, it isn't like the surfer knows Tube sites have stolen content. Just like they don't know which galleries on TGP/MPG sites use stolen content.

Yeah, TGPs and MGP's link to galleries that have stolen content, all of them. TGP's know this, they aren't stupid, hell. But that's different I guess??? Or like Wizzo has said, you allow Google to send you traffic, yet they are packed with stolen content.

What Shap is doing is exactly what everyone is already doing. He is just doing it something new that you people don't like, yet.

"But to come here and act like they are doing some great thing by getting a site like redtube to "filter" the page that their content is on, while at the same time allowing them to continue to steal and fuck everyone else is another thing.":error

So it would be better for Twisty's to be a super hero and regulate tube sites for everyone else? How is that supposed to be his business?

From another side of this argument one can say other content providers are not taking part in enforcing there own content. Tube sites would have to follow rules if like I said many months ago took active measures on an individualised effort.

Why you people expect others to wipe your own asses all the time I do not know...

Honestly again Shap should have never made this thread unless he maybe just wants to see how many other tube sites will contact him that are willing to follow the rules step forward and become legit affilaites for promoting his sites.

Just hope its worth it to em...
Probably is most of you guys aint got fuck all for traffic anyways.

I hate it when AlienQ has good points. ;)

These are indeed pretty sad times when I am right...

Fine. You know what, I'm really getting to the point that I just don't care anymore. It truly is becoming a no win, everyones a crook.

You know, I build Extremehole, by myself in 1999. No experience, no help. hell, i didn't even know how to create an html page. I've tried to run it in a manner I thought was right. I didn't have to scam, mail, cheat. I didn't have to fuck over people. Everyone I have worked with over the years I still respect and I believe that the same would hold true in reverse. Nobody comes to my defense when there is a situation Just because I'm a BRO and they need to get their ass kissing in for the day... no.. people come in to my defense because they like me, and know I'm right. (there are examples of that all ready on GFY where a BRO company used my content to promote their affiliate program) and then tried to claim it was theirs... even though I was the one IN the fucking video with my wife... ya, they came out looking like idiots. But the Bro team jumped right in to their defense as usual. While at the same time people I actually know and have worked with jumped in for mine.

Point is, I have always thought you could run an upstanding adult business. Just like you can run any business. Sure, there are always temptations, "easy" money trying to persuade you otherwise, but I have tried to avoid them to the best of my ability. Has this been a factor in my site remaining a smaller site... probably. I sleep fine with it. I can proudly point to it at anytime and feel good about what I have been able to achieve with it. And can say I have never knowingly fucked over, or helped someone fuck over somebody else in the process.

All the little google comments in an effort to try to make this look any better are not going to change the facts as I see them.

Redtube : 4555 videos

Puretna.com : Torrents : 47,098
empornium.us : Torrents : 42,838

torrents ain't a big deal - they are still too technical for the typical surfer who joins paysites. the guys who download torrents are the same guys who have drives filled with warez, the type who never buys anything and is proud of it.

tube sites are where the traffic's going - for a reason - it's an all you can eat buffet of porn movies and the biggest moron on the planet can click a 'Play' button.

I have worked for Shap for 5 years and I think this is funny as hell. I am 6' 3" and I would not fuck with him. He is built like a brick shit house and used to play Junior hockey. If you want to go after Shap, you better bring a bat. If I am there you better bring two bats.

Damn those morons

I have been here since day1 of this board, but never once saw myself as a "Bro" but just as you I always standup for what I believe in. I will support others that in my eyes are stand up as well. Shap is one person in my eyes, that has always tried to do the right thing and I totally understand the situation that He, You, Myself, and any other content producers are in and its time to adapt is the whole point and don't think he's doing this out of greed, but out of business reasoning.

For Example, you are willing to give affiliates content to promote your site on TGPs, MGPs, and etc which are also full of stolen content, but I would never accuse you of trying to sabotage someone else's business. However, Shap has made the choice to at least do what he can to protect his business/content and suddenly he's the bad guy? I just think that's a little one sided.

Fuck... sometimes I'm amazed that people can be so thick. How about telling sites like this to fuck off. Not allowing them to become an affiliate and then have you pay them to stay up. You can not be this fucking stupid. See, it's not a matter of them becoming a super hero for anyone... it's a matter of saying "Your entire site is a bunch of stolen content... clean it up and we might work with you, till then please remove all of our content from your site."

But, in the real world that's not going to happen. Rebtubes etc will find people like this that will pay them. And as your have again clearly pointed out, Twisty's is one of those people.

I never said he was a "bad" guy. I just find a flaw with his approach in this matter.

Wizzo isn't a bro. :)

Looks like it's time to retire this
http://www.amateurcleavage.com/gfy/shap.jpg

Reminds me of the old days with TGPs. People will change their minds, adapt and will continue to make money. Others will just fade away...


I am an adult webmaster 4 life.

ha Lenny sucks at Photoshop. use the distort tool.

This thread is filled with bullshit.

Bottom line is that Twistys has made a business decision to support content theft and the thieves behind it.

Their decision is both unethical and damaging to both the industry and themselves. By supporting and FUNDING illegal sites like redtube, they allow illegal tubes to easily profit from the exploitation of others.

Obviously Twistys is not looking long term with their decision and one can only assume they are fattening up for a program sale. :2 cents:

Talk about a brick wall. You don't understand the difference between legal and illegal tube sites. No one here doubts the use of "tube"technology.

How is that different than programs that support TGPs, MGPs, and Search Engine traffic? They all have stolen content like tubes, and yet its OK to accept their traffic.

Wizzo you got a great program but your trying waaaay too hard.

what TGP and MGP's have all stolen content? hasn't been that way in years - there are so many programs with high quality exclusive content that stealing content for galleries isn't done very much.

Search engines don't host adult content.

If you are using 1 programs content to promote another that's stolen content and happens ALL the time...

But they do profit from it... :pimp

can someone please show me all this stolen content on my site, or please fuck off...thank you

Really? Cause I know for a fact I have seen my content used on galleries, that do not have promote my sites, being pushed from every major TGP on the market.

Some of the biggest tgp's and tgp traffic brokers deal almost exclusively in stolen content on self hosted galleries, since most the times the ads rotate out.



Maybe I see this because I own content?

show me Doc ?

Good for you Shemp:thumbsup

Umm... Hosted galleries, you link to them and you have no way to prove who the owner of the content is when they strip off the stamps.

fucking off.... but only for you Shemp! :winkwink:


Have a great night all... :pimp

What the tube sites are doing has been going on since the beginning of the Internet. The only thing that has changed is that they have found a way to aggregate all of the stolen content into larger and easier to access "pools", and at an accelerated pace. The catalyst for this was allowing surfers to upload content. The fuel on the fire is the widespread increase of broadband access.

You also have to be careful how you use the word stolen. If a guy joins your site and downloads a video then uploads it to a tube site, who do you go after? Sounds a lot like the mp3 problem from a while back, and the RIAA is still fighting a losing battle there.

If you put content on the Internet, it is going to get stolen, guaranteed. You have to do your best to protect it without pissing of your paying customers, but anything you do is just delaying the inevitable. Once it gets out there you have to pick and choose your battles and monetize it when you can. If anyone thinks we are going to sue the "bad" tube sites into oblivion, then I think you are overestimating the power of this industry to do anything constructive as a group.

i've changed my stance a little in the sense that for years i have put my own balls and reputation on the line trying to get people to unite on things like 2257, .XXX, Piracy, and i've just grown a little weary of trying to unite a bunch of renegades that are in it for themselves. being around some of the people that i was at the xbiz show, and paying attention to the vibe i was getting from many of the people there, i got the sense that its still very much a Me Me Me thing. No one is uniting on anything. The piracy seminar was a very small fraction of the people at the show. I walked into the hallway during the seminar and to the pool, only to see the hallway and pool area SLAMMED with people chilling and laughing. That piracy seminar should have been standing room only. The one we organized here at the Sheraton in L.A. was more populated. You would think with all the bitching and moaning and "I'm gonna sue you" shit going on, that more people would have cared enough to attend. With the amount of producers in SoCal, that room should have been jammed to the rafters. Its despicable. Sad. Unnerving even.

So, with that said, I've lost my "lets get em team" attitude and am now focused on ME and those who put money in my ban accounts and their interests. I do not believe that this industry can unite. With that said, I am damn sure gonna make well that I will be ok when the shit goes down. I will make decisions to protect myself and the people who put money in my bank accounts. For everyone else, good luck. I talked, the majority of the industry cared not. This is not my battle to fight. I believe that the failure of this industry to unite will one day be it's downfall. In other industries, even thought the companies hate each other, they all unite to stand strong in the face of adversities. We cannot do that. Too many egos.

I wish everyone luck though and i support those that will take an active stance in protecting their intellectual property. I don't walk on water, but I'm giving up carrying the torch for an industry that can't focus on a core issue for longer than it takes to type a post and hit submit in a fit of rage. No one will see me flagrantly posting anymore about things outside the realm of BROness anymore, I will deal with those other ways and actually do more damage by not posting about them. If I've disappointed anyone with my decision to not give a fuck anymore, my apologies. I've got money to make and this thing has taken enough of my valuable time. I've got the PAK Group thing started and thats enough for me.

I am available for consulting at a rate of 1,000,000 USD per hour though. :1orglaugh

I currently can't find any Tubes or Torrents with my movies on them. Just like I can't find galleries with my stolen content.


But yet, both have happened..

sure, but please dont generalize like that...i go to a lot of extra work to know my submitters and get a lot of personal info on them...stolen content is not acceptable on my site....and i would delete the content and the submitter in a heartbeat...thanks :)

Xnxxx also owns Xvideos.com, another huge tube site.

http://www.xvideos.com/?k=raven+riley+

And most Tubes will remove a video once they know it's stolen. Not all, but Red Tube does. Just like you.

You have been in the game a long time, you will have rules, you will have a trust factor with submitters. But newer TGP's don't have that, and neither do tubes.

Just because you keep your shit clean doesn't mean your trades do. Part of this argument is getting "any" traffic from sources that have stolen material, or benefit from it in any way. After all, not all tube content is stolen.

BTW, I can show you a "paysite tour" stealing my big dick content. I would bet you have listed his galleries.

You are a hopeless romantic, but its cute.

But all I am saying really is people need to police thier own shit and work where it is possible to generate income. It is irresponsible of other companies to just let thier content go stolen and do nothing at all. Blame them.

Its part of the new environment and when you see this from the new perspective maybe you will realise you are cussing out the wrong guy.

Chimpanzee's on roller blades?

I seriously hope you are joking - you can not possibly be this clueless.

Last night I found a gallery on a tgp that had ripped all 16 of its images from one of my fhgs and then pointed to a different site. The thief neglected to remove my watermarks and even USED MY IMAGE FOR THE THUMBNAIL!!! The worst part is that the gallery was a free hosted gallery from the sponsor. YES, THE SPONSOR MADE THE GALLERY AND THEN MADE IT AVAILABLE TO ANY AFFILIATES. I can not prove the tgp owner who approved it knew it was stolen content - but they would have to be pretty dense not to when my galleries are and have been listed on their tgp for years.

There are few people in this industry with any ethics - it is a fact. Adult is a get rich, renagade industry. The problem is when real business people try to prosper they quickly come to the realization that adult is the most ass-backwards industry on the face of the earth.

Theft is theft and supporting it should be considered treason, punishable by death in the adult industry.

Hmm. Not many lines to read between there. You sounded a little resigned in this thread, which is why I asked.

I understand what you're saying and totally understand and respect it Airek.

The bottom line of this is that the adult industry is keep sticking to the mentality of offering more and more for free making the product it sells less and less attractive. I doesn't have to do with ppl that can adapt and those that can't anymore. It has exceeded these borders and it's hurting itself for long time now. Oh well.... nothing new.