paycom and the 'store'? - GoFuckYourself.com

p1mpdogg · 04-18-2006, 10:23 PM

wtf is this? they can sell memberships to our sites without our knowledge? behind our back?

what do we do if we no longer have the site? or do no longer stock the product? the pi_code is still active!

paycom wtf is a going on with you lately?

p1mpdogg · 04-18-2006, 10:25 PM

a quote from paysom tech support:

> Trey,
>
> Per MasterCard Regulations, the pi_codes that we have
> in our database must be shown in our Store. This is how
> the customer was able to sign up.
>
> Regards,
>
> John P

mazdaman · 04-18-2006, 10:25 PM

sounds to me like trey rhymes with ghey

p1mpdogg · 04-18-2006, 10:26 PM

a reply from an emplyee of epiccash and its possible impacxts on our business.

"So since we have free trial codes anybody can sign up for free trials as
well which may increase our chargeback ratio.
In fact I'm sure it will as we havnt used some of those product codes in
over 2 years.
So basically paycom is selling a product that epiccash no longer offers.
What if it was a dvd that we were selling that we ran out of stock on? Or
that we closed shop. That looks like more chargebacks and credits that will
not make paycom look bad, it will only hurt epiccash. What about sites that
we no longer have? We cannot give access to those.
Ithahaha8217;s a dumb idea in general reguardless of regulations and I think someone
should call up paycom and bitch at them a lot because I'm sure they are
doing something wrong. If anything, they would know what product codes are
inactive and have not been used and should never ever ever offer those.
Trey if I were you I'd immediately call the top brass and yell at him for
this idiocy of implementation."

p1mpdogg · 04-18-2006, 10:31 PM

what? this doesnt concern anyone? this affects ALL of you using paycom directly or indirectly. use your fucking heads you lazy morons.

p1mpdogg · 04-18-2006, 10:36 PM

bump bump bump

chadglni · 04-18-2006, 10:38 PM

So it's not the store that bothers you it's that they aren't deleting codes that are for stuff you don't have anymore? They sure got some Einsteins working the backend over there.

PR_Dave · 04-18-2006, 10:39 PM

Hasn't this been a regulation of MasterCard for over 2 years?

Check your pay-pages, as soon as you type a 5 in the cc field it has a link to the store.

Not saying it's good or bad, but it's old news.

p1mpdogg · 04-18-2006, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chadglni

So it's not the store that bothers you it's that they aren't deleting codes that are for stuff you don't have anymore? They sure got some Einsteins working the backend over there.

honestly this is the first i have heard of it. I dont know exactly whats going on, and i expect if i rasie enough hell they will either term my acct with them, like ccbill did a few years back for calling kk a c u n t or they will send rand in the knight in shining armor to explain in detail. then when i get cb's that come in because of their bullshut, i can quote rand.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 08:48 AM

bump bump bump

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 09:05 AM

how can noone give a shit about this? is it not sinking into your little pea brain heads whats going on here?

Tapaz · 04-19-2006, 09:11 AM

nice sig , what Will say?

gooddomains · 04-19-2006, 09:12 AM

bumpy bump

seeric · 04-19-2006, 09:17 AM

whats this store url trey, i wanna have a look at extreme paychecks and ragecash info.

i dont see any store links anywhere.

thanks.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A1R3K

whats this store url trey, i wanna have a look at extreme paychecks and ragecash info.

i dont see any store links anywhere.

thanks.

i cant find the links either. thats the problem, if they were not 'hiding' this shit from thier customers (you and i) this might not be such an issue. but after being a customer of paycom for years now, im a little pissed they are doing things without my knowledge and possibly affecting my cb%, my credits, my bottom line my business.

i think its fucking bullshit. and i would like an answer and a way to check this shit out on paycom, seeing what the surfer sees.

seeric · 04-19-2006, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by p1mpdogg

i cant find the links either. thats the problem, if they were not 'hiding' this shit from thier customers (you and i) this might not be such an issue. but after being a customer of paycom for years now, im a little pissed they are doing things without my knowledge and possibly affecting my cb%, my credits, my bottom line my business.

i think its fucking bullshit. and i would like an answer and a way to check this shit out on paycom, seeing what the surfer sees.

ditto.

if someone can buy memberships through somewhere else other than sources of traffic i can control to my account, i definitely want to know.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A1R3K

ditto.

if someone can buy memberships through somewhere else other than sources of traffic i can control to my account, i definitely want to know.

well it certianly appears they can through this paycom 'store'.

email from paycom.

He signed up through the store on the Paycom.net site (Mastercard regulation),
so that could be why you didn't receive the info you'd receive on a normal
transaction. Let us know what info you're looking for and we can provide that
to you.

Also, let us know if you'd like us to deactivate the two-day code.

Regards,
Sean
-ETS Tech Support

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 09:32 AM

does this mean paycom has been adding paswords to our password files without us knowing? is this possible fraud taking place by a 3rd party billier? If paycom would be nice enough to come on in here and explain all this....

media · 04-19-2006, 09:35 AM

Ok...

I've spoken to anthony on this, and he has said that they will be removing inactive or disabled sites from this store soon, they are working on a way to freshen up the database now.

I do however have one question that comes to mind with this since paycom controls passwords with alot of companies....

What happens if paycom decided to keep the $$$ from these "store" sales and still add a password to your system for members to gain access under the radar? That is entirely possible and plausible... What does everyone think of this point of failure in the billing system??

Not saying they do this, but has anyone thought of this scenario?

newbreed · 04-19-2006, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by media

What happens if paycom decided to keep the $$$ from these "store" sales and still add a password to your system for members to gain access under the radar? That is entirely possible and plausible... What does everyone think of this point of failure in the billing system??

Not saying they do this, but has anyone thought of this scenario?

I brought that exact point up in a shaving thread a while ago and was told it was an attempt to start fake drama, because no biller would ever consider doing such a thing. There was another billing company that has the potential to do the same thing, in the same way, it's just never really been explained thuroughly.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 09:48 AM

paycom i think we are entitled to an answer.

GotGauge · 04-19-2006, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newbreed

I brought that exact point up in a shaving thread a while ago and was told it was an attempt to start fake drama, because no biller would ever consider doing such a thing. There was another billing company that has the potential to do the same thing, in the same way, it's just never really been explained thuroughly.

Fake Drama Starter you are!!!! LOL HAHA

This is interesting!!!

chadglni · 04-19-2006, 09:53 AM

I joined some test sites with both CCBill and Paycom this week and did get a link to stores from both I believe. It's as soon as you get confirmation there is a "continue to site" or "shop in the store" link. I didn't think anything of it because I assumed program owners would have known all about it.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 09:57 AM

well epiccash didnt, pk didnt, ragecash didnt. who else has the balls to step up and speak out? very few i am sure.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 10:06 AM

bump for paycom, they should be aware of this thread by now im quite sure

seeric · 04-19-2006, 10:09 AM

i'm gonna do a test signup to see this for myself.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A1R3K

i'm gonna do a test signup to see this for myself.

as soon as you put a '5' in the cc field the whole form refreshes and adds another link on the page. does that not just seem shady alla round? if you were a surfer joining this site, and the page refreshed just cause you put in a single digit, would that not scare you away? and fuck up your joins and ratios and shit all because of this paycom store bull shit?

fuck!

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 10:26 AM

i just asked them to disable about 60 or so pi_codes. ones that we dont offer anymore. this includes 30 min free previews. free trials and sites thata re not even in our system any longer.

you fucked up paycom.

Nad · 04-19-2006, 10:28 AM

no need to get your panties in a bunch!!!

This is a regulation of MasterCard that was imposed when VISA started the registration fee.

mastercard states that if you are using a third party processor you HAVE to give the customer the option to purchase from your entire site base. With this in mind, if someone make a purchase, you still get the money. The processors do NOT get any of the money as a sale to themselves.

I can tell you that the 'store' or whatever you want to call it probably doesn't make more than 5 sales a year.

MasterCard wants certain verbiage on the paypage and Visa wants different verbiage.

This also goes along that MasterCard wants the customer to be able to CHOOSE the option the choose, that is why on CCBill and other paypage you will see a drop down allowing you to select another price, another payment option or something like that.

You have nothing to worry about here... the 'store' is crap and really when a customer comes through, they want in and out.... not to shop for porn...

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nad

no need to get your panties in a bunch!!!

This is a regulation of MasterCard that was imposed when VISA started the registration fee.

mastercard states that if you are using a third party processor you HAVE to give the customer the option to purchase from your entire site base. With this in mind, if someone make a purchase, you still get the money. The processors do NOT get any of the money as a sale to themselves.

I can tell you that the 'store' or whatever you want to call it probably doesn't make more than 5 sales a year.

MasterCard wants certain verbiage on the paypage and Visa wants different verbiage.

This also goes along that MasterCard wants the customer to be able to CHOOSE the option the choose, that is why on CCBill and other paypage you will see a drop down allowing you to select another price, another payment option or something like that.

You have nothing to worry about here... the 'store' is crap and really when a customer comes through, they want in and out.... not to shop for porn...

and paycom just forgot to tell all their clients about it? causing us refunds and cb's? i have sites in that stupid store that are not even live.

dont you think its a little fucked up paycom failed to tell us?

Nad · 04-19-2006, 10:36 AM

for sure! you should have been told about it... and they should have been keeping up with the sites that are active or getting joins..

But I am almost positive that if you track them down they will tell you that they don't make any sales from that...it is pathetic, these guidelines...

seeric · 04-19-2006, 10:59 AM

i just got off the phone with paycom.

here is what happens. i personally do not agree with this logic.

customer john doe buys a membership to one of our rage sites. sale is tracked and posted back and affiliate is paid if applicable( i.e. was affiliate traffic).

after that join is processed and the customer clicks the "process and continue shopping" button, they go to the paycom store.

heres the part i dont believe is right. most will agree.

being that i am the one that sent that customer to that store inside the processors umbrella, i feel entitled to a piece of whatever they buy. this is not the case. they do not payout to anyone for anything that my customer bought in the store. i asked several times and was told "no". also, should the customer buy something else and like it better they may cancel what they originally purchased instead of rebilling off of the trial, etc, etc. you see where i am going with this.

you learn something new everyday.

seeric · 04-19-2006, 11:07 AM

one thing i can say is i don't think anyone over there is buying any ferarris with the sales on this store. there are no graphics, no text, no info at all, only price points in drop down menus. i actually had to search for TEEN to find a list of sites that i could subscribe too. i think that if they were trying to make money on it instead of it being a "have to do" thing, they would enhance it to make it sell. i'd never buy anything off of that store. thats what makes me lean towards the regulation thing they they are talking about. nothing but dropdowns and textlinks.

heres one of the returns for search term MILF

https://wnu.com/secure/jsp/view_pric...&useSiteDesc=Y

if you were a surfer would you buy anything off of this?

i wouldn't.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A1R3K

i just got off the phone with paycom.

here is what happens. i personally do not agree with this logic.

customer john doe buys a membership to one of our rage sites. sale is tracked and posted back and affiliate is paid if applicable( i.e. was affiliate traffic).

after that join is processed and the customer clicks the "process and continue shopping" button, they go to the paycom store.

heres the part i dont believe is right. most will agree.

being that i am the one that sent that customer to that store inside the processors umbrella, i feel entitled to a piece of whatever they buy. this is not the case. they do not payout to anyone for anything that my customer bought in the store. i asked several times and was told "no". also, should the customer buy something else and like it better they may cancel what they originally purchased instead of rebilling off of the trial, etc, etc. you see where i am going with this.

you learn something new everyday.

so not only do we have 0 control over this, we dont even get paid for traffic we are sending to the store?

are you fucking kidding me?

I wonder if thats part of the master card regs?

fuck you paycom.

King Adam · 04-19-2006, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by p1mpdogg

well epiccash didnt, pk didnt, ragecash didnt. who else has the balls to step up and speak out? very few i am sure.

SuperModelCash.com had no idea either. Usually when you're not told about something, it means they are hiding something.

Quote:

Originally Posted by A1R3K

i just got off the phone with paycom.

here is what happens. i personally do not agree with this logic.

customer john doe buys a membership to one of our rage sites. sale is tracked and posted back and affiliate is paid if applicable( i.e. was affiliate traffic).

after that join is processed and the customer clicks the "process and continue shopping" button, they go to the paycom store.

heres the part i dont believe is right. most will agree.

being that i am the one that sent that customer to that store inside the processors umbrella, i feel entitled to a piece of whatever they buy. this is not the case. they do not payout to anyone for anything that my customer bought in the store. i asked several times and was told "no". also, should the customer buy something else and like it better they may cancel what they originally purchased instead of rebilling off of the trial, etc, etc. you see where i am going with this.

you learn something new everyday.

So in short, Paycom is in a way stealing from its clients. Upselling my customers to other deals without me getting a piece of it is stealing. And just like you said, if they like it more they will cancel from one of my sites. This is backstabbing and not right.

Why does it always take Paycom so long to post here and answer industry questions and conerns?

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A1R3K

one thing i can say is i don't think anyone over there is buying any ferarris with the sales on this store. there are no graphics, no text, no info at all, only price points in drop down menus. i actually had to search for TEEN to find a list of sites that i could subscribe too. i think that if they were trying to make money on it instead of it being a "have to do" thing, they would enhance it to make it sell. i'd never buy anything off of that store. thats what makes me lean towards the regulation thing they they are talking about. nothing but dropdowns and textlinks.

heres one of the returns for search term MILF

https://wnu.com/secure/jsp/view_pric...&useSiteDesc=Y

if you were a surfer would you buy anything off of this?

i wouldn't.

well yesterday i had a customer complaint that DID buy through this method. they complained because they couldnt get access to our sites. why? because we manage our own passwords. this is where the system fails. now i get a cb cause paycom is so fucking stupid they cant think ahead enough to know these problems would exist.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Adam

SuperModelCash.com had no idea either. Usually when you're not told about something, it means they are hiding something.

So in short, Paycom is in a way stealing from its clients. Upselling my customers to other deals without me getting a piece of it is stealing. And just like you said, if they like it more they will cancel from one of my sites. This is backstabbing and not right.

Why does it always take Paycom so long to post here and answer industry questions and conerns?

becaus they are in their huge ass office with there fresh out of lawschool morons debating on what to tell us and what not to tell us and how they will be liable for anything shady going on if not disclosed in the proper way.

King Adam · 04-19-2006, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by p1mpdogg

well yesterday i had a customer complaint that DID buy through this method. they complained because they couldnt get access to our sites. why? because we manage our own passwords. this is where the system fails. now i get a cb cause paycom is so fucking stupid they cant think ahead enough to know these problems would exist.

Thats completly insane. How many companies have gotten CBs because of this. It makes no diffenence whether its 1 or 1000 ... this whole thing is just wrong.

For the #1 third party billing company, one would think they would have their shit together. All I have seen lately from Paycom and ePass is a bunch of bullshit and speach's.

Earth to Paycom ... what do you have to say about this?

Rand · 04-19-2006, 11:28 AM

Trey -- I have hardly heard of anyone complaining that they are getting too many sales. And to be quite honest, if you don't know how or why something is the way it is I think it'd be worth your while to ask appropriate questions instead of making outrageous accusations.

The "store" is a Mastercard regulation. Nothing more and nothing less. The surfer gets to that store from your traffic on the join form. That's the way the regulation works and that is true with ANY U.S. IPSP.

Tech ran the numbers today to see how many Mastercard transactions had taken place compared to overall MasterCard transactions. Ready for this? 0.0035 % of all Mastercard transactions were from the "continue shopping" store. Had you tried doing a test transaction from your site's join form using a Mastercard you'd see how this works.

As for a product code that you don't wish to offer anymore, let me say this... We don't make up product options / codes. We create them from your instructions. If you decide to stop offering an option you should have those specific codes deactivated. If not, they are active and could have been cached, bookmarked, or sold from the "store". If you don't tell us to deactivate a particular option, guess what.. we have no way of knowing any different and we will process sales based on the options you asked us to create.

The CEO of Epoch, Joel Hall, would like to speak to you. Please give us a call. 888-627-3888.

media · 04-19-2006, 11:29 AM

Ok...

I just touched on one thing with someone that is of concern to me, so I will air it for the record, just so that maybe out of all of this we will get a plausible solution to minimize crap like this from happening....

Say you have MEMBERX who signs up at $1.00 for 1 day, rebilling at $39.84 per month... after he joins he decides to continue shopping at paycom, he may see another offer for the same site at one month for $19.99 and say "wtf yo!!!" go credit his initial membership (or charge back god forbid) then get another membership that is cheaper per month for him...

This is a plausible scenario that could create chargebacks for the industry.
Why not limit it in the paycom admin for specific site codes that are offered to the consumer in the shop paycom area?? This is a requirement to show OTHER offers to the consumer, but I don't think you have to show ALL offers to the consumer..

I like paycom and I don't like seeing the shit going down the tube lately, so lets all work together to make things better for the entire industry, that's what this is about really, the only way we get things done sometimes it seems is to make a big enough stink about it... And I hope that certain people will only know this meant to do just that, not bash them personally or make their job tougher..

I don't like sitting on the sidelines while our joins get declined, members don't rebill, or our members are charging back for reasons such as this. It's not good for my pocket book...

Our chargeback ratio is sitting around .28% right now which I am perfectly happy with, and prefer to keep it at this.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 11:30 AM

according to paycom

"You had some 30 minute trials which have been deactivated, however, the 0
under trial is just for the monthly codes. If you see any legitimate free
trials let me know and I'll take care of that.

At any rate, in your past 1,000 new signups, only 2 of them came via the
ShoppingCart/Store. If we work through all of the codes you do not want to
process for any more, this shouldn't be a problem for you, going forward.

Regards,
Sean"

that puts me more at ease. HOWEVER. I still think its fucked that learn this the hard way. I guess the processing fees and cb fees and the few hundred k in reserves isnt enough for paycom. they gotta keep us in the dark on this shit too.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rand

Trey -- I have hardly heard of anyone complaining that they are getting too many sales. And to be quite honest, if you don't know how or why something is the way it is I think it'd be worth your while to ask appropriate questions instead of making outrageous accusations.

The "store" is a Mastercard regulation. Nothing more and nothing less. The surfer gets to that store from your traffic on the join form. That's the way the regulation works and that is true with ANY U.S. IPSP.

Tech ran the numbers today to see how many Mastercard transactions had taken place compared to overall MasterCard transactions. Ready for this? 0.0035 % of all Mastercard transactions were from the "continue shopping" store. Had you tried doing a test transaction from your site's join form using a Mastercard you'd see how this works.

As for a product code that you don't wish to offer anymore, let me say this... We don't make up product options / codes. We create them from your instructions. If you decide to stop offering an option you should have those specific codes deactivated. If not, they are active and could have been cached, bookmarked, or sold from the "store". If you don't tell us to deactivate a particular option, guess what.. we have no way of knowing any different and we will process sales based on the options you asked us to create.

The CEO of Epoch, Joel Hall, would like to speak to you. Please give us a call. 888-627-3888.

I am calling him right now ring ring

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rand

Trey -- I have hardly heard of anyone complaining that they are getting too many sales. And to be quite honest, if you don't know how or why something is the way it is I think it'd be worth your while to ask appropriate questions instead of making outrageous accusations.

The "store" is a Mastercard regulation. Nothing more and nothing less. The surfer gets to that store from your traffic on the join form. That's the way the regulation works and that is true with ANY U.S. IPSP.

Tech ran the numbers today to see how many Mastercard transactions had taken place compared to overall MasterCard transactions. Ready for this? 0.0035 % of all Mastercard transactions were from the "continue shopping" store. Had you tried doing a test transaction from your site's join form using a Mastercard you'd see how this works.

As for a product code that you don't wish to offer anymore, let me say this... We don't make up product options / codes. We create them from your instructions. If you decide to stop offering an option you should have those specific codes deactivated. If not, they are active and could have been cached, bookmarked, or sold from the "store". If you don't tell us to deactivate a particular option, guess what.. we have no way of knowing any different and we will process sales based on the options you asked us to create.

The CEO of Epoch, Joel Hall, would like to speak to you. Please give us a call. 888-627-3888.

should i relaly have to test joins on my own fuckign sites to make sure shit is on the up and up
? come on rand.

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 11:49 AM

talked to joel and a few other peeps... apparantly the shopping cart things isnt much of an issue atleast its a very small % of sales like less than 1% like rand says.

I will be happy to admit I may have went off half cocked, but there are some clear issues and points failuer in this model that need to be addressed.

WiredGuy · 04-19-2006, 11:50 AM

If this is the case with paycom, its reasonable to assume ccbill is doing something similiar? If so, does anyone have links to the store feature via ccbill? I'm rather curious to see how this is reflected on other processors as well.
WG

p1mpdogg · 04-19-2006, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WiredGuy

If this is the case with paycom, its reasonable to assume ccbill is doing something similiar? If so, does anyone have links to the store feature via ccbill? I'm rather curious to see how this is reflected on other processors as well.
WG

they are. its a master card requirement for over 2 years now. just happens that ALOT of ppl were not notified apparantly.... but i highly doubt its affecting many sales.

i am a lil concerned about the join page refreshing when you start to put in your cc info.

that may scare some ppl away.. Rand any thoughts on this?

Love Sex · 04-19-2006, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A1R3K

one thing i can say is i don't think anyone over there is buying any ferarris with the sales on this store. there are no graphics, no text, no info at all, only price points in drop down menus. i actually had to search for TEEN to find a list of sites that i could subscribe too. i think that if they were trying to make money on it instead of it being a "have to do" thing, they would enhance it to make it sell. i'd never buy anything off of that store. thats what makes me lean towards the regulation thing they they are talking about. nothing but dropdowns and textlinks.

heres one of the returns for search term MILF

https://wnu.com/secure/jsp/view_pric...&useSiteDesc=Y

if you were a surfer would you buy anything off of this?

i wouldn't.

Your not seeing the checks they get off your traffic either. Why wouldnt a surfer join all they need to know is the name of the site.

Love Sex · 04-19-2006, 12:01 PM

Just when you thought program owner shaving was bad.

Rand · 04-19-2006, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by p1mpdogg

i am a lil concerned about the join page refreshing when you start to put in your cc info.

that may scare some ppl away.. Rand any thoughts on this?

Portfolio wide, the numbers do not support this theory. Trust me, if there was a noticeable difference the method would have been changed a long time ago.

seeric · 04-19-2006, 12:08 PM

49 yooooooooooooooooooooo

04-18-2006, 10:25 PM	#2
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	a quote from paysom tech support: > Trey, > > Per MasterCard Regulations, the pi_codes that we have > in our database must be shown in our Store. This is how > the customer was able to sign up. > > Regards, > > John P __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-18-2006, 10:25 PM	#3
mazdaman My Sig was too Big! :( Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: england - please click my sigs and signup, oh please please please Posts: 435	sounds to me like trey rhymes with ghey __________________ FAGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG GGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG GGGGG

04-18-2006, 10:26 PM	#4
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	a reply from an emplyee of epiccash and its possible impacxts on our business. "So since we have free trial codes anybody can sign up for free trials as well which may increase our chargeback ratio. In fact I'm sure it will as we havnt used some of those product codes in over 2 years. So basically paycom is selling a product that epiccash no longer offers. What if it was a dvd that we were selling that we ran out of stock on? Or that we closed shop. That looks like more chargebacks and credits that will not make paycom look bad, it will only hurt epiccash. What about sites that we no longer have? We cannot give access to those. Ithahaha8217;s a dumb idea in general reguardless of regulations and I think someone should call up paycom and bitch at them a lot because I'm sure they are doing something wrong. If anything, they would know what product codes are inactive and have not been used and should never ever ever offer those. Trey if I were you I'd immediately call the top brass and yell at him for this idiocy of implementation." __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-18-2006, 10:31 PM	#5
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	what? this doesnt concern anyone? this affects ALL of you using paycom directly or indirectly. use your fucking heads you lazy morons. __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-18-2006, 10:36 PM	#6
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	bump bump bump __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-18-2006, 10:23 PM	#1
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	paycom and the 'store'? wtf is this? they can sell memberships to our sites without our knowledge? behind our back? what do we do if we no longer have the site? or do no longer stock the product? the pi_code is still active! paycom wtf is a going on with you lately? __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-18-2006, 10:38 PM	#7
chadglni Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: PEI, Canada Posts: 6,924	So it's not the store that bothers you it's that they aren't deleting codes that are for stuff you don't have anymore? They sure got some Einsteins working the backend over there. __________________ Sign up here - Dating Site affiliate program

04-18-2006, 10:39 PM	#8
PR_Dave Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Italy Posts: 2,792	Hasn't this been a regulation of MasterCard for over 2 years? Check your pay-pages, as soon as you type a 5 in the cc field it has a link to the store. Not saying it's good or bad, but it's old news. __________________ www.PIMPROLL.com

04-19-2006, 08:48 AM	#10
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	bump bump bump __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-19-2006, 09:05 AM	#11
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	how can noone give a shit about this? is it not sinking into your little pea brain heads whats going on here? __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-19-2006, 09:11 AM	#12
Tapaz Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: CamCity Posts: 1,745	nice sig , what Will say?

04-19-2006, 09:12 AM	#13
gooddomains Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Netherlands Posts: 10,127	bumpy bump

04-19-2006, 09:17 AM	#14
seeric .......... Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: .......... Posts: 41,917	whats this store url trey, i wanna have a look at extreme paychecks and ragecash info. i dont see any store links anywhere. thanks.

04-19-2006, 09:32 AM	#18
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	does this mean paycom has been adding paswords to our password files without us knowing? is this possible fraud taking place by a 3rd party billier? If paycom would be nice enough to come on in here and explain all this.... __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-19-2006, 09:35 AM	#19
media Confirmed Moneymaker Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Eugene, OR It's Like Jail, Only with Trees! Posts: 9,852	Ok... I've spoken to anthony on this, and he has said that they will be removing inactive or disabled sites from this store soon, they are working on a way to freshen up the database now. I do however have one question that comes to mind with this since paycom controls passwords with alot of companies.... What happens if paycom decided to keep the $$$ from these "store" sales and still add a password to your system for members to gain access under the radar? That is entirely possible and plausible... What does everyone think of this point of failure in the billing system?? Not saying they do this, but has anyone thought of this scenario? __________________ I'm here for the violence!

04-19-2006, 09:48 AM	#21
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	paycom i think we are entitled to an answer. __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-19-2006, 09:53 AM	#23
chadglni Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: PEI, Canada Posts: 6,924	I joined some test sites with both CCBill and Paycom this week and did get a link to stores from both I believe. It's as soon as you get confirmation there is a "continue to site" or "shop in the store" link. I didn't think anything of it because I assumed program owners would have known all about it. __________________ Sign up here - Dating Site affiliate program

04-19-2006, 09:57 AM	#24
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	well epiccash didnt, pk didnt, ragecash didnt. who else has the balls to step up and speak out? very few i am sure. __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-19-2006, 10:06 AM	#25
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	bump for paycom, they should be aware of this thread by now im quite sure __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-19-2006, 10:09 AM	#26
seeric .......... Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: .......... Posts: 41,917	i'm gonna do a test signup to see this for myself.

04-19-2006, 10:26 AM	#28
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	i just asked them to disable about 60 or so pi_codes. ones that we dont offer anymore. this includes 30 min free previews. free trials and sites thata re not even in our system any longer. you fucked up paycom. __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-19-2006, 10:28 AM	#29
Nad Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 503	no need to get your panties in a bunch!!! This is a regulation of MasterCard that was imposed when VISA started the registration fee. mastercard states that if you are using a third party processor you HAVE to give the customer the option to purchase from your entire site base. With this in mind, if someone make a purchase, you still get the money. The processors do NOT get any of the money as a sale to themselves. I can tell you that the 'store' or whatever you want to call it probably doesn't make more than 5 sales a year. MasterCard wants certain verbiage on the paypage and Visa wants different verbiage. This also goes along that MasterCard wants the customer to be able to CHOOSE the option the choose, that is why on CCBill and other paypage you will see a drop down allowing you to select another price, another payment option or something like that. You have nothing to worry about here... the 'store' is crap and really when a customer comes through, they want in and out.... not to shop for porn... __________________ Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar! A MAN A PLAN A CANAL PANAMA 202740086

04-19-2006, 10:36 AM	#31
Nad Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 503	for sure! you should have been told about it... and they should have been keeping up with the sites that are active or getting joins.. But I am almost positive that if you track them down they will tell you that they don't make any sales from that...it is pathetic, these guidelines... __________________ Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar! A MAN A PLAN A CANAL PANAMA 202740086

04-19-2006, 10:59 AM	#32
seeric .......... Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: .......... Posts: 41,917	i just got off the phone with paycom. here is what happens. i personally do not agree with this logic. customer john doe buys a membership to one of our rage sites. sale is tracked and posted back and affiliate is paid if applicable( i.e. was affiliate traffic). after that join is processed and the customer clicks the "process and continue shopping" button, they go to the paycom store. heres the part i dont believe is right. most will agree. being that i am the one that sent that customer to that store inside the processors umbrella, i feel entitled to a piece of whatever they buy. this is not the case. they do not payout to anyone for anything that my customer bought in the store. i asked several times and was told "no". also, should the customer buy something else and like it better they may cancel what they originally purchased instead of rebilling off of the trial, etc, etc. you see where i am going with this. you learn something new everyday. Last edited by seeric; 04-19-2006 at 11:00 AM..

04-19-2006, 11:07 AM	#33
seeric .......... Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: .......... Posts: 41,917	one thing i can say is i don't think anyone over there is buying any ferarris with the sales on this store. there are no graphics, no text, no info at all, only price points in drop down menus. i actually had to search for TEEN to find a list of sites that i could subscribe too. i think that if they were trying to make money on it instead of it being a "have to do" thing, they would enhance it to make it sell. i'd never buy anything off of that store. thats what makes me lean towards the regulation thing they they are talking about. nothing but dropdowns and textlinks. heres one of the returns for search term MILF https://wnu.com/secure/jsp/view_pric...&useSiteDesc=Y if you were a surfer would you buy anything off of this? i wouldn't.

04-19-2006, 11:28 AM	#39
Rand Industry Vet Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Santa Monica, CA Posts: 2,663	Trey -- I have hardly heard of anyone complaining that they are getting too many sales. And to be quite honest, if you don't know how or why something is the way it is I think it'd be worth your while to ask appropriate questions instead of making outrageous accusations. The "store" is a Mastercard regulation. Nothing more and nothing less. The surfer gets to that store from your traffic on the join form. That's the way the regulation works and that is true with ANY U.S. IPSP. Tech ran the numbers today to see how many Mastercard transactions had taken place compared to overall MasterCard transactions. Ready for this? 0.0035 % of all Mastercard transactions were from the "continue shopping" store. Had you tried doing a test transaction from your site's join form using a Mastercard you'd see how this works. As for a product code that you don't wish to offer anymore, let me say this... We don't make up product options / codes. We create them from your instructions. If you decide to stop offering an option you should have those specific codes deactivated. If not, they are active and could have been cached, bookmarked, or sold from the "store". If you don't tell us to deactivate a particular option, guess what.. we have no way of knowing any different and we will process sales based on the options you asked us to create. The CEO of Epoch, Joel Hall, would like to speak to you. Please give us a call. 888-627-3888. __________________ -- Rand Payment Industry - Communications - Quality Assurance

04-19-2006, 11:29 AM	#40
media Confirmed Moneymaker Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Eugene, OR It's Like Jail, Only with Trees! Posts: 9,852	Ok... I just touched on one thing with someone that is of concern to me, so I will air it for the record, just so that maybe out of all of this we will get a plausible solution to minimize crap like this from happening.... Say you have MEMBERX who signs up at $1.00 for 1 day, rebilling at $39.84 per month... after he joins he decides to continue shopping at paycom, he may see another offer for the same site at one month for $19.99 and say "wtf yo!!!" go credit his initial membership (or charge back god forbid) then get another membership that is cheaper per month for him... This is a plausible scenario that could create chargebacks for the industry. Why not limit it in the paycom admin for specific site codes that are offered to the consumer in the shop paycom area?? This is a requirement to show OTHER offers to the consumer, but I don't think you have to show ALL offers to the consumer.. I like paycom and I don't like seeing the shit going down the tube lately, so lets all work together to make things better for the entire industry, that's what this is about really, the only way we get things done sometimes it seems is to make a big enough stink about it... And I hope that certain people will only know this meant to do just that, not bash them personally or make their job tougher.. I don't like sitting on the sidelines while our joins get declined, members don't rebill, or our members are charging back for reasons such as this. It's not good for my pocket book... Our chargeback ratio is sitting around .28% right now which I am perfectly happy with, and prefer to keep it at this. __________________ I'm here for the violence!

04-19-2006, 11:30 AM	#41
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	according to paycom "You had some 30 minute trials which have been deactivated, however, the 0 under trial is just for the monthly codes. If you see any legitimate free trials let me know and I'll take care of that. At any rate, in your past 1,000 new signups, only 2 of them came via the ShoppingCart/Store. If we work through all of the codes you do not want to process for any more, this shouldn't be a problem for you, going forward. Regards, Sean" that puts me more at ease. HOWEVER. I still think its fucked that learn this the hard way. I guess the processing fees and cb fees and the few hundred k in reserves isnt enough for paycom. they gotta keep us in the dark on this shit too. __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-19-2006, 11:49 AM	#44
p1mpdogg Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 16,714	talked to joel and a few other peeps... apparantly the shopping cart things isnt much of an issue atleast its a very small % of sales like less than 1% like rand says. I will be happy to admit I may have went off half cocked, but there are some clear issues and points failuer in this model that need to be addressed. __________________ A fast fortune is easy to earn! Just go with a winner!

04-19-2006, 11:50 AM	#45
WiredGuy Pounding Googlebot Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 34,487	If this is the case with paycom, its reasonable to assume ccbill is doing something similiar? If so, does anyone have links to the store feature via ccbill? I'm rather curious to see how this is reflected on other processors as well. WG __________________ I play with Google.

04-19-2006, 12:01 PM	#48
Love Sex Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,905	Just when you thought program owner shaving was bad.

04-19-2006, 12:08 PM	#50
seeric .......... Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: .......... Posts: 41,917	49 yooooooooooooooooooooo