Smart people...HELP. Intelletual property suit - GoFuckYourself.com

blackmonsters · 06-14-2005, 10:28 PM

This could be big or it could be nothing. Please give your opinions on this scenario. I've heard of celebrities winning these cases but what about a plain old nobody?

This is realy happening but facts are modified to protect the case:

-A guy takes a lowly job at a brand new restaurant.
-He is given tips by the managment based on the total money made that day.
-The tips are basically a percentage of the take even though quite low.
-The biz is struggling to survive so tips suck.
-He then realizes a layout flaw in the biz that prevents more customers from comming in and buying.
-This flaw is quite easy to fix and requires no investment and can be undone in seconds.
-He makes the suggestion to the owner but no dice.
-He makes the suggestion to the manager and is told "Hell no".
-He then makes the suggestion to the owner again and finally it gets done.
-First day it's done the biz has record sales. 50% more profit.
-Profits continue to rise but lowly guy finds another job and leaves.

Issue: Since management and owner squashed the initial suggestion for months, despite it taking only a few seconds to do, it was clear they did not have the intellectual insight to make this move without him.
Therefore can he claim intellectual rights to this new biz layout no matter that it is very simple?
And if so then what amount of money could he claim. For example: can he claim he's still entitled to the tip money as it was increased by his suggestion or can he claim it's bigger than that since the biz is noew grossing 500% more than before he was employed.

This is a good one!! Maybe it's a stretch. What do you think?

DamageX · 06-14-2005, 10:31 PM

It's his word against the manager's and the owner's. I'd say there's no case.

DateDoc · 06-14-2005, 10:32 PM

No, he was an employee when he made the suggestion. By making the suggestion it may of helped the business but they in no way have a fiduciary responsibilty to him. If he had stayed and it was my company I would have given him better pay and a promotion.

mynetporn · 06-14-2005, 10:38 PM

I am not a lawyer but here is my

.
If one of my employees comes up with an idea while I am paying them then the idea is property of my company.
If the employee only came up with the idea based on inside knowledge of my business then that idea also belongs to my company.
Not sure about all businesses but in the contracts my employees sign this is very well stated.
I treat my employees very well and offer bonuses for good suggestion but the suggestions still belong to my company.
I have had a few employees quit and then try to come back as contractors with these great ideas of improving our products. I then ask them how they gained the information about our products and they normally state that they thought of it while they worked for me. I then ask them to reread their current and previous contracts and ask them if they wish to take things to court. I have not had one that wanted to really push it that far.

If you did not have any agreement then you would be wise to seek counsel. If you can not find a lawyer to take the case then you should just chalk it up.

blackmonsters · 06-14-2005, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BusterPorn

No, he was an employee when he made the suggestion. By making the suggestion it may of helped the business but they in no way have a fiduciary responsibilty to him. If he had stayed and it was my company I would have given him better pay and a promotion.

Well he did actually get better pay since his tips went up.
I see your point about him being an employee but wasn't that the case in other cases that were won? (ie. is David Letterman(TV) an employee?)

blackmonsters · 06-14-2005, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mynetporn

I am not a lawyer but here is my

.
If one of my employees comes up with an idea while I am paying them then the idea is property of my company.
If the employee only came up with the idea based on inside knowledge of my business then that idea also belongs to my company.
Not sure about all businesses but in the contracts my employees sign this is very well stated.
I treat my employees very well and offer bonuses for good suggestion but the suggestions still belong to my company.
I have had a few employees quit and then try to come back as contractors with these great ideas of improving our products. I then ask them how they gained the information about our products and they normally state that they thought of it while they worked for me. I then ask them to reread their current and previous contracts and ask them if they wish to take things to court. I have not had one that wanted to really push it that far.

If you did not have any agreement then you would be wise to seek counsel. If you can not find a lawyer to take the case then you should just chalk it up.

Great points!
He did not have any contract besides a general application with personal information on it so there is no agreement to pay or not to pay for any intellectual input. For these reason I think he may have a case even if not a very good one.

This would be a closed case if this were the music biz because of clearly defines roles in recording, producing and writing in the copyright laws. But I think employers would not back up his idea that he is owed something but a jury of average folks might.

l

Matt 26z · 06-14-2005, 10:51 PM

Employees own nothing they come up with on company time. There are so many inventors out there who can't lay claim to what they conceived since they did it on company time and now the company owns the patents.

Bill Gates is a similar example to you. The only difference is that he was laughed at and then got permission to take his idea off on his own, and you didn't.

blackmonsters · 06-14-2005, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt 26z

Employees own nothing they come up with on company time. There are so many inventors out there who can't lay claim to what they conceived since they did it on company time and now the company owns the patents.

Bill Gates is a similar example to you. The only difference is that he was laughed at and then got permission to take his idea off on his own, and you didn't.

Hmmmmm....you caught my eye with "on company time".
These suggestions were not actually made while the employee was on the clock. They were made over drinks after work.

Getting more interesting.

Tony Montana · 06-14-2005, 11:19 PM

The guy who made Tethlon (spelling) at Dupont made it by mixing up some shit at work.They down the road found a use for it(and a damn big one).
He didn't get shit. You won't either.

blackmonsters · 06-14-2005, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony Montana

The guy who made Tethlon (spelling) at Dupont made it by mixing up some shit at work.They down the road found a use for it(and a damn big one).
He didn't get shit. You won't either.

Just for the record I'm not the one suing.
I am very close to the situation though.

But Dupont has employee contracts like stated above. Not really a relavent case. What you are saying is common knowledge and no offense but I don't need to post to know this stuff.

I'm interested in comments that can dig deeper than where you're comming from because the fact is that people have won these cases. I asking how did they win...not interested in obvious cases that will lose.

06-14-2005, 10:28 PM	#1
blackmonsters Making PHP work Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: 🌎🌅🌈🌇 Posts: 20,588	Smart people...HELP. Intelletual property suit This could be big or it could be nothing. Please give your opinions on this scenario. I've heard of celebrities winning these cases but what about a plain old nobody? This is realy happening but facts are modified to protect the case: -A guy takes a lowly job at a brand new restaurant. -He is given tips by the managment based on the total money made that day. -The tips are basically a percentage of the take even though quite low. -The biz is struggling to survive so tips suck. -He then realizes a layout flaw in the biz that prevents more customers from comming in and buying. -This flaw is quite easy to fix and requires no investment and can be undone in seconds. -He makes the suggestion to the owner but no dice. -He makes the suggestion to the manager and is told "Hell no". -He then makes the suggestion to the owner again and finally it gets done. -First day it's done the biz has record sales. 50% more profit. -Profits continue to rise but lowly guy finds another job and leaves. Issue: Since management and owner squashed the initial suggestion for months, despite it taking only a few seconds to do, it was clear they did not have the intellectual insight to make this move without him. Therefore can he claim intellectual rights to this new biz layout no matter that it is very simple? And if so then what amount of money could he claim. For example: can he claim he's still entitled to the tip money as it was increased by his suggestion or can he claim it's bigger than that since the biz is noew grossing 500% more than before he was employed. This is a good one!! Maybe it's a stretch. What do you think? __________________ Get paid, get tools, get going with Camsoda Join Chaturbate get your cut of the pie

06-14-2005, 10:31 PM	#2
DamageX Marketing & Strategy Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Former nomad Posts: 14,293	It's his word against the manager's and the owner's. I'd say there's no case. __________________ Whitehat is for chumps If you don't do it, somebody else will - true story!

06-14-2005, 10:32 PM	#3
DateDoc Outside looking in. Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: To Hell You Ride Posts: 14,243	No, he was an employee when he made the suggestion. By making the suggestion it may of helped the business but they in no way have a fiduciary responsibilty to him. If he had stayed and it was my company I would have given him better pay and a promotion. __________________

06-14-2005, 11:19 PM	#9
Tony Montana Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 794	The guy who made Tethlon (spelling) at Dupont made it by mixing up some shit at work.They down the road found a use for it(and a damn big one). He didn't get shit. You won't either. __________________ I am a marketing Genius.

06-14-2005, 10:38 PM	#4
mynetporn Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: FL Posts: 1,154	I am not a lawyer but here is my . If one of my employees comes up with an idea while I am paying them then the idea is property of my company. If the employee only came up with the idea based on inside knowledge of my business then that idea also belongs to my company. Not sure about all businesses but in the contracts my employees sign this is very well stated. I treat my employees very well and offer bonuses for good suggestion but the suggestions still belong to my company. I have had a few employees quit and then try to come back as contractors with these great ideas of improving our products. I then ask them how they gained the information about our products and they normally state that they thought of it while they worked for me. I then ask them to reread their current and previous contracts and ask them if they wish to take things to court. I have not had one that wanted to really push it that far. If you did not have any agreement then you would be wise to seek counsel. If you can not find a lawyer to take the case then you should just chalk it up.

06-14-2005, 10:51 PM	#7
Matt 26z So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: ¤ª"˜¨๑۩۞۩๑¨˜"ª¤ Posts: 18,481	Employees own nothing they come up with on company time. There are so many inventors out there who can't lay claim to what they conceived since they did it on company time and now the company owns the patents. Bill Gates is a similar example to you. The only difference is that he was laughed at and then got permission to take his idea off on his own, and you didn't.