200........,

Your right fuck over all our affiliates too. Sorry I wont do that.

Excellent would you like me to maybe copy to a hard disk and mail it to you as well incase you get a computer virus and lose the bookmark?? Or I can print it out for you as well and send it to you. Im here to help Donavans Cause.

If Kim Nielsen, Louis Bajjali, or the select few others I sell to stalk a model I'll be happy to turn myself in and help prosecute myself.

Dude, you are WAY smarter then that. Arnt you guys in AZ? You guys need a lesson from Lightspeed again. Drive over to Glendale and sit down with a company that has figured out a way to keep their models safe and their affiliates happy. It will be worth your time and Im know he will be happy to share.

You want to play dirty little games I'll make sure that if one of your models (god forbid) is hurt, I'll do the same. Or did you forget that you also photograph girls and distribute their I.D.'s?

You really are showing everyone what a classes person you really are. It's one thing to have a different opinion, it's another to make ridiculous statements.

I think ExtremeJohn and FTV are forgetting that there's a lot of nasty people out there and that affiliates are people, so some are nasty (how's that for logic, LOL).

OK so now you've got an affiliate that youve built a relationship of trust with over a few months, and then there's a dispute, lets say about conversions or such. Now imagine a conversation like this:

ExtremeJohn: OK affiliate Joe you're out, I dont want to have anything more to do with you. And by the way I am also forfeiting your $2431.72 that I still owe you.

Affiliate Joe: Oh no you don't. I have the goods on Jane Model and ... and Zoey Model. Unless you pay up by tomorrow, their info is free for all on the net. And not only that, I want 75% payout from now on.

OK, do you guys really want to expose yourself to that possibility? I'd say FHG is the only way to go, or free 2257-exempt content for everyone, whether affiliate by signup or not.

Yes there is always "other possibilities".

:thumbsup

FleshJoe2005- I have seen you ask this question a few times. I don't know if anyone has answered you clearly.

Crop a thumb from a softcore thumb ( does not require you to have ID's) send to the roughest , most explicit FHG you want.

Crop a Hardcore image into a softcore thumb-you need Id and releases.

This is how my people have explained this to me.

and of course I suggest your consult YOUR legal counsel for confirmation.

Yup as in everything else, your missing the point. As much as you want to think so anything can happen, not to mention you put their names on here, OMG what if someone stalked and killed them, you would be in trouble....

whoa no full name using, wtf

You won't think these are ridiculous statements if you become responsible for rape, injury or death with you idiotic stance on model IDs. I've been in this business for 8 years. Models are to be protected as much as possible at all times.

I clearly understand your point (althouugh I will say we have never killed an affiliate EVER for bad conversions, nor have we forfieted anyone's earning EVER).

And again I do clearly understand that, again we made a Business decision it could turn out the be the "New Coke" that everyone hated or the Adult Industry will go on business as usual.

Everyone already knows these names.

Since your all over knowing all and assuming that this will surely happen.

Let me pose 2 questions to you (1 of which I posed before that you ofcourse ignoed).

1) Do you think Extreme will be the only company to make this decision?

2) Do you think that every model we have ever filmed has only worked for us therefore we would automatically be the one's to blame?

Have you considered either of those two things?

There are more scenarios like this than can be possibly covered tonight. Short term thinking is keeping them from finding the right solution.

And no one knows any models full name right?? Because it's completley immposible to find any of that info out right?

donovan, if i took down all my thumbs and galleries tonight and went all text links, am i exempt from the new regulations?

am i not still responsible for documentation for every pic i have posted since i started doing TGP?

1. I will speak out like this against ANY company that makes such a stupid decision.

2. "But Mr. Police office, OJ killed his wife and got away with it. Why can't I?"

1. You would then be compliant.

2. Ask an attorney.

Your exactly right based on your opinion, which is just that an opinion.

When will you understand and respect the fact that regardless of your "PERSONAL" opinion that this is a business decision made by a Company that has worked closely with their affiliates for 6 years? Nothing more, stop assuming and guessinf at what might happen and letting your wild imagination about what "MIGHT" happen lead you around like a dog on a leash. You voiced your opinion more than once (probably 50x by now), your "OPINION" is clear, and guess what there's others that will share that "OPINION" and others that wont share that "OPINION" in the end we/I will personally live with that decision.

Your wrong on your first answer... DEAD WRONG.

You shouldnt have answered if you didnt know and should have just answered with #2 to begin with.

Speaking out is one thing, you managed to make a complete ass of yourself tonight. So if that was your goal, let me be the first to say good job.

Your "high and mighty" stance on this subject really doesn't mean squat since you've been passing on model info. to secondary producers for years. You've been doing exactly what your crying about right here.

So basically you avoided both questions, 1 of them by stating youll slap your "OPINION" tag on anything. and the other by refrencing something completley different from the wuestion I asked you.

So in short you did exactly what I thought you would do, thanks for showing your true colors there Genius.

My clients aren't secondary producers, by the way. :) That's a whole other story.

As for making an ass out of themselves, Extreme did just fine in that department. You'll realize that in the next few days.

Extreme, with your list of sites there is no doubt whatsoever that model harassment is going to become a very real part of your future. In one way or another, handing out the IDs of the models who appear on your very extreme sites is going to get you into trouble. No fucking doubt. Most likely they'll first hear from Jesus freaks.

I give you 2 months after you start handing out those IDs. Maximum. Wanna stick $100 on that?

Donavan you're reaching....get over yourself.

My view is you don't give a shit about the models, you care about your own ass and your own business. You're worried that it will be harder to find girls to shoot in the future and that will affect your income. Let's at least get off the soapbox and be honest here.

Also...if I REALLY wanted to stalk someone, why wouldn't I just hack the servers of the company that hosts the content of the person I want to stalk?
It's alot easier to do than you think......so now what are you going to do? Only sell content to people who have banking class or CIA level security systems on their servers?

What about the guy who wants to follow the stripper home from work at 3am and stalk her? Does the strip club have to provide secret service protection for her at all times in order to live up to your "moral standards"?

People everywhere in every walk of life put themselves in danger everyday, I really don't think this is as big of a deal as you're making it out to be, and I don't think the models will be in any more real danger than they have been in the past.

:2 cents:

Yeah based on Your Opinion your right Extreme did just that..

As for the people you shoot content for and based on your answer to someone else's question it's VERY clear to me your commenting on a law you dont know a fucking thing about. Instead of wasting your time in here Mr. Content Producer I suggest reading up on the law or contacting a lawyer (unless ofcourse you dont care about your Models and they dont know that your sending that content off to "Secondary Producers".

Aren't you one of those so called "Jesus freaks," you are the son of a pastor correct? Does your job make daddy happy?

i brought this up before it's going to be impossible to control what somone uploads, and people who don't like you will just use it as a way to mess with you

Lenny your points are way too Proffesional, well thought and honestly out of Donny's league.

But oh so true.

Crossed the street l8ly Donny?

oh boy :1orglaugh

Exactly, people will do what they want when they want and how they want, having a solid relationship with those you host or keeping the domain registered under THIER name is the only safe bet for a program in this day and age.

OK John

I'm not gonna call you names and neither the FTV fellow. I just think its not in your best business interests to release the model names. If gallery makers become obsolete by this new regulations, I'm sure they'll find something new to do, they're smart people too :) I just think it exposes you to so much liability it's not worth it especially that there are solutions that work w/o risking the liability.

You asked what DonnovanPhilips can do to assure you his model IDs don't become public info, because he's been providing them for years to his clients (I didn't know that the old 2257 regs required him to do that, that's news to me). Anyways the answer is he can't do squat about it, once he released the info -- if he did -- its out of his control.

But having said that, it doesn't make it -- IMHO again, just a private opinion -- a smart long term decision to release the info to affiliates who will then HAVE to release it to TGPs and so on. In fact, its quite a different scale entirely of information propagation we're talking about here. Donnovan released his info to maybe 10, 15 customers, we're talking about 100s or 1000s of new people who will have SOME information about the models. Quite a different ball game entirely.

Good to see you guys taking control of the situation and helping all of us out. The models know that with this job comes a certian level of danger as with many jobs. We all have done all we can to protect the models, dont blame extreme paychecks, blame George W Bush and the morons who voted for and elected him. And if someone wanted a models info bad enough they could get it, even before now.

Extreme John,

WOW, and HOLY SHIT!!! I know that there are a lot of program owners taking the easy way out over this, saying ?just use our soft-core? or ?just use our hosted? or ?we?re leaving, best of luck?. But YOU have stepped up to the plate and BIG-TIME for the affiliates.

My hat is off to you, sir. In the past I had put your program on the back burner because of some things that happened out of your control. I?m going to put that all aside, and start building some serious promotional things once again for EP. You?ve shown you have the balls, AND the spine to stand up for affiliates.

I am sorry that I let things slide to the background on EP promos. It was certainly NOT your fault, and I?ll do my best to support the program a hell of a lot more in the future. THANK YOU for not taking the easy way out. THANK YOU for setting the bar and raising the standards which more programs should follow!!!

Sincerely,
Mark R. Moore (TexasDreams)

:thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup

i dont think you're understanding something here. if you have EVER posted a pic on your website or gallery, and you don't have the documentation from the sponsor - you are in violation and can be charged with a felony. it doesn't matter if you take everything down before the 23rd.

Hey are any of you Extreme Paychecks guys on ICQ? I'd like to chat with you for a few.

78465690 :)

Message sent.

Sorry, illegal. You cant make a softcore image from a hardcore one.

LOL...

WTF??????

It's not illegal to make a softcore image from a hardcore one.

Sorry, had to take a phone call from someone who wanted to call me to vent. Some people can't/won't speak out on this board but believe me, there are some big people watching who agree with me.


First of all, learn to spell my name. It's right there for you to look at. It's not that freakin' hard to do.

Secondly, you're wrong about my losing business over Extreme's actions. In all likelihood I'll gain business because of them? Why? Let a group of LA models start talking about how their IDs are being given out by ___ company or ___ producer. When companies don't have as much content to choose from in areas that don't have models willing to pose anymore, where do you think they'll turn?

I honestly am simply outraged at the stupid greed I see in this thread.


This assumes someone is stupid enough to put these IDs on a publicly accessible computer.


The difference here is:

The stripper put herself into that position. That's bad. But it's worse when a company like Extreme puts a model into that same position. Expect legal ownage to shortly follow. Don't you think this is what the DOJ has in mind? A model's person data is discovered, a jury is shown how an Extreme porn company could have prevented the situation.

The result: model owns company.

I've received counsel from two attorneys who specialize in adult. I highly suggest you do the same. Specialize is the key word in that paragraph above.

Kinda puts me on the inside as to how the Jesus freaks will act about this, dontcha think?

I'm sure that's EXACTLY how the courts will see it when a model who has been brutalized decides to sue Extreme for releasing her info. :winkwink:

Because they needed the money for food or something else and signed w/o thinking it thru, or because they just turned 18 and dont have a fucking clue -- I know what I'm talking about here -- and someone showed them a fistful of green... Happens, you know?

"Yes, your honor, I signed it. I didn't completely understand what it said but I signed it 'cause if I didn't I wouldn't have been paid."

"Has the jury reached a decision yet?"

"Yes, your honor..."



^^^ that situation is scary, and it's more likely to happen if a model's info is released by a big porn company... I can almost hear the saliva dripping from attorney's mouths... it's only a matter of time.

Probably correct but it makes you a slightly harder target than the ones that are simply doing the ostrich thing after June 23 :)