smack

http://www.aclu.org/SafeandFree/Safe...ID=12126&c=207

rather vote for someone with the courage to change their mind, than a man who feels the patriot act was a good idea.

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JSA Matt

Wait until they start going door-to-door collecting guns...

Wiggles

I'm amazed by how many still support him even after all the shit that has occured.

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no sig

Downtime

The patriot act was a good idea. I can't wait until George wins again on november 2nd.

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#27024067

smack

won't happen.

the phrase

"From my cold dead fingers."

is very real to alot of americas. even more liberal ones like me.

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Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

JSA Matt

smack

it's a good idea if you're a nazi and enjoy the government having it's way with you and your civil liberties.

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Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

devilspost

5, all he needs

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MattO

DX

So tell me...

How has the Patriot Act personally effected you, or anyone you know?

smack

It has personally effected me by effectively removing my 4th amendment protection from illegal search and seizure.

this is something that effects us all. any threat to our constitutional liberties is a threat to the sovreignty of the people of this nation.

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Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

smack

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Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

Nismo

How can he win again if he never won in the first place?

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jacked

GW is a flaming deutcshe in my opinion he has done nothing but destroy the moral and ruin the economy

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EviLSuperstaR

But...Bush did so much good the past 4 years!

He ruined the economy, isolated the country, send over a 1000 soldiers to die in the wrong country, killed 15000 civilians, wasted valuable resources and money to fight terrorism, allowed al-qaeda to grow stronger, let the biggest terrorist attack in history happen on US soil despite clear warnings, pulled out of the Kyoto treaty now that global warming will cause each year heavier hurricanes in Florida, handed over an entire country to islam terrorism, managed to read My Pet Goat while the country was on fire, made 100000s of jobs disappear etc etc etc

DX

This coming from the same group who's been trying to dismantle the Second Amendment for as long as I can remember.

trouserrat

Don't worry, the terrorists like Spain. You've redeemed yourself.

smack

not dismantle. regulate.

it will never go through though. but unfortunately bush has already began crushing our civil liberties. and guns won't be much help when the SS can kick your down at their leisure and take you away.

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germ

thats my biggest fear. i personally think none of this matters. im of the opinion that theyve figured out how to fix the election.

it worked flawlessly once, and odds are...it will work again.

just wait until electronic voting starts being implemented in all the states. the same people that make the voting machines give boatloads of money to the bush camp, and republicans in general.

also, it will be a federal felony for ANYONE (even government officials) to open and inspect the machines. sound kinda fishy to anyone else?

nofx

the Patriot Act was the worst thing to ever happen. fuck gwb.

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DX

H.R. 3162, CQ Vote #313: Passed 98-1: R 49-0; D 48-1; I 1-0, 10/25/01, Kerry Voted Yea


Fuck Kerry too?

smack

everyone in congress voted for it. GWB used the fear from 9/11 to pass something that he didn't even give them time to read.

the difference is Kerry realized that mistake. while bush still thinks he is "making the world safer" by taking away our rights.

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Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

BradM

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"No wonder why they have no problem comparing a man of pure evil, Adolf Hitler, to a man(President Bush) that is trying to protect America from today's modern day Hitler."

http://hundredpercenter.blogspot.com...e-up-bush.html


Check that out.

smack

interesting read. now i don't know about all that. but bush's policies sure are reminiscent of the political uprisings of many totalitarian regimes.

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EviLSuperstaR

I guess you copy-pasted in the wrong thread but since you're at it, this is not a blog:

How Hitler helped the Bush family get rich

http://www.guardian.co.uk/internatio...312484,00.html

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Also, Kerry voted for the Patriot Act - http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...ecurity27.html

Now he wants to change it, how can you believe and trust a president that dosen't believe in himself and cannot stand up on a position.

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and neither is this http://hundredpercenter.blogspot.com...e-up-bush.html


Looks like both articles came out the same day, every opinion has its other side.

EviLSuperstaR

Yours is not an article, it's only someone's webblog...

smack

i already responded to this statement from someone else.

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Yeah it was only found on news.google.com

EviLSuperstaR

Interesting article:
"There is no evidence to suggest that Saddam Hussein's Iraq had become a serious staging ground in Osama bin Laden's arsenal of terror, and there is no evidence that Saddam's regime helped bin Laden plan or carry out the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks. In fact, most of the terrorists who have flocked to the war-torn nation seem to have arrived after the United States invaded. "

How can you trust a president that lies to his own people and makes the wrong decisions?

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and your solution is Kerry?

If so, read this:


"Kerry's flip- flops on our war to defend our survival of freedom is dangerous and deadly. One moment Kerry is looking to support our war on terror and in the next blink Kerry wants to pull out our troops, leaving a catastrophic vacuum of death and chaos. Kerry and his leftover 1960's ideologists will continue to relive Vietnam and try to paint a picture that this is where we are today."


http://www.insightmag.com/news/2004/...t-732322.shtml

SuckOnThis

Totally agree. And the biggest thing to worry about at this point is this; There's going to be another terrorist attack on US soil, doesnt matter if Kerry is in there or Bush, its going to happen. If Bush is in charge you can expect further deterioration of the constitution possibly up to the point of a modern day Nazi regime.

smack

besides, at the time i don't think anyone in america would have voted against something called "patriot act".

using fear to goad the congressional body into actions against our civil liberites.

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smack

my solution is ANYONE BUT BUSH.

and right now, the person with the best chance is Kerry.

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Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

Furious_Male

If something isn't working right or it is headed the wrong direction why not change it. It has nothing to do with believing or standing up for yourself. If something is wrong fix it regardless of what your earlier assumptions about the issue may have been.

Every day during the course of business and our lives we change our minds or "flip flop". If we didn't we wouldn't improve and go further in life.

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smack

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mardigras

Other than the US, only Philippines, Nigeria and Poland are right. The rest of the world is wrong because they favor Kerry over Bush. So if Kerry wins, I guess all the true patriots will be moving to Philippines, Nigeria and Poland
---------------
Just one of many world wide polls:
http://betavote.com/
Currently
Bush 13 % Kerry 86 %

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Your opinion has been digested, but I disagree because a leader that "flip flops" as you put it, derails from it's hand at task, therefore; no progress is accomplished. It also shows weakness as a leader should always know what he/she should do.

I've always been taught if you don't stick with something you will never accomplish anything.

Good debate guys.

EviLSuperstaR

Google news does blogs now, sure....

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Great quote, by the way he was Republican.

germ

sorry, but "flip-flopping" is what INTELLIGENT people do.

going into the whole patriot act thing, he probably thought it was a good idea...hell, everyone did.

after he realized it was not a good idea, he changed his mind.

i dunno about you, but that seems like an ability that a president would need to have. the ability to assess something and form a decision on it, based on the current facts. bush seems to just make a decision and stand by it no matter the outcome.

sure, it makes him SEEM like a strong leader. in reality, it only proves to me how weak he really is.

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Subject closed.

Furious_Male

Kerry Marsala is so fucking biased. Its not unlike her to come up with something like that. Dangerous and Deadly.

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smack

so you would rather have a man triumphantly adhere to an incontovertible wrong, than to use his reason to discover a new and more sensible course of action?

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Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

SuckOnThis

You keep repeating 'flip flop' like you're some kind of Limbaugh monkey. Once again Bush's flip flops:

# Bush is against campaign finance reform; then he's for it.
# Bush is against a Homeland Security Department; then he's for it.
# Bush is against a 9/11 commission; then he's for it.
# Bush is against an Iraq WMD investigation; then he's for it.
# Bush is against nation building; then he's for it.
# Bush is against deficits; then he's for them.
# Bush is for free trade; then he's for tariffs on steel; then he's against them again.
# Bush is against the U.S. taking a role in the Israeli Palestinian conflict; then he pushes for a "road map" and a Palestinian State.
# Bush is for states right to decide on gay marriage, then he is for changing the constitution.
# Bush first says he'll provide money for first responders (fire, police, emergency), then he doesn't.
# Bush first says that 'help is on the way' to the military ... then he cuts benefits
# Bush-"The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. Bush-"I don't know where he is. I have no idea and I really don't care.
# Bush claims to be in favor of the environment and then secretly starts drilling on Padre Island.
# Bush talks about helping education and increases mandates while cutting funding.
# Bush first says the U.S. won't negotiate with North Korea. Now he will
# Bush goes to Bob Jones University. Then say's he shouldn't have.
# Bush said he would demand a U.N. Security Council vote on whether to sanction military action against Iraq. Later Bush announced he would not call for a vote
# Bush said the "mission accomplished" banner was put up by the sailors. Bush later admits it was his advance team.
# Bush was for fingerprinting and photographing Mexicans who enter the US. Bush after meeting with Pres. Fox, he's against it.

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Of course not, I just like supporting my President and country, but I will say this, we will see how the debate between John Kerry and GWB goes this week.

I'll be honest if Kerry looks like a better leader I will vote for him, I just consider myself a Republican.

smack

He was a republican only by the modern definition of the term. however he was a champion for the rights and civil liberties of the people.


here's another one of his quotes i strongly believe in.

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smack

i'm a fucking dork. i'm actually really excited to see these debates.

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Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.