KRL

The TSA's new system called SecureFlight is being implemented. Airlines have to turn over their customer data now to the Feds.

The amount of data in passenger name records varies by airline, but it typically includes name, flight origin, flight destination, flight time, duration of flight and form of payment. It can also include credit card numbers, address, telephone number and meal requests, which can indicate a person's ethnicity.

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fris

owned x 10

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pornJester

Bush / Cheney in '04 -- watch your freedom and privacy go down the toilet.

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David!

I personally do not mind

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WarChild

Seeing as I have nothing at all to hide, I'm all for the TSA finding out everything they can about passengers. If it takes me 2 hours to board a plane and I have to give finger prints and take a lie detector, I'd be for it as long as it makes me and my loved ones flying safer.

The real question, in my mind, is does it make me safer? That remains to be seen, I suppose.

KRL

Then vote for Bush and his intrusive policies again.

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WarChild

What makes you think Kerry would be any different?

The Truth Hurts

wheres the intrusion here?

KRL

It has nothing to do with hiding. Its invasion of your privacy. Who wants the Federal Govertment to know your every move. That's the direction we are heading and that my friend takes us closer towards a police state and further from a democracy.

People don't get it at all. Its amazing. Don't you see inch by inch they keep taking more and more control over every aspect of our lives. Where does it end? It doesn't.

Idiots.

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KRL

OMG everytime I see someone in porn promoting the Republican agenda I just cringe.

WTF? What are you folks thinking here supporting the people that want to destroy this industry.

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David!

Actually I will not vote for either one. But this intrusion was put upon us after 9/11. In all fairness, prior to 9/11 we did not have to go through all this bullshit. And I believe that if an American Government had some balls, they would start checking those who brought this mess upon us and stop checking those of us who have nothing to do with this.

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chupacabra

ditto, it boggles the mind... sure their not surfers or trolls..?

BradM

Oh I see it. From limiting media to policing sex toys to .... god Ill stop RIGHT NOW so I save my fingers.

It's happening but no one seems to care.

WarChild

I'm willing to have my "privacy" invaded for my safety. I don't buy that this is just a ploy to get a list of where people fly, how they pay for it and what they eat on the plane. What's the invasion here? They're not trying to find out what I eat in my home, where I buy that food and how I cook it.

I get where you're coming from, I just don't agree with you. What are they taking control of from me? They're not trying to stop me from eating chicken on the plane.

A police officer can pull you over and demand to see your license. Is this an invasion of your privacy, too?

Must you call all people that disagree with your assessment of the situation idiots? I almost expected better of you.

Rich

The Truth Hurts

I promoted no agenda.

I asked what the intrusion was.

The Airlines kept this data already.

The Government could already get access to it pretty much any time it wanted.

Rich

So were Germans.

TheJimmy

you mean watch it go down further...


got to admit, they're pretty good at selling fear, paranoia and death...

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The Truth Hurts

and you think this started and will end with the Bush admin?

TheJimmy

thank you for beating me to that reply...


some people just don't get it :/

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Serge Litehead

how exactly do they take control of our lives by implementing SecureFlight? what does "control" means to you, is it someone knowing all your moves, being able to predict your next move; or is it making you do something with or against your will?

what are the pros and cons of this system? dont just go by the first impression.

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WarChild

That's a pretty silly comparassion.

We live in a violent world today. People blow up, hijack and crash airplanes. Mostly Muslim people, actually.

I don't want to be on a plane that is destroyed for some whacked out ideals. I'm all for the Federal Goverment doing everything they can to make air travel safe.

WarChild

I absolutely get it. I just don't agree. So from my persepective, it's you that doesn't get it.

Rich

Yes during the days of Hitler the world was very different, not violent at all in fact. Terrorism was invented by Osama Bin Laden in 2001, did you know that?

It also was a very non violent world when the founding fathers started America. You're probably right, if they would have known that one day people would kill each other they would have never considered all those silly rights they wrote into the constitution.

robfantasy

wow osama bin laden is winning the war on terror

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KRL

The United "Police" States of America.

If you don't see the writing on the wall, you're either blind or in extreme denial.

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Peaches

Not everyone thinks possibly saving the porn industry is the most important reason to vote for a president of the country.

KRL

LOL this is true apparently Peaches.

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WarChild

I still don't say how you can possibly compare the two.

What part of the constitution guarantees that the goverment won't look at already collected data for statistical analysis?

What liberty is being taken from you? You don't have to fly if you don't want to. I don't remember an ammendment guaranteeing you the right to airline travel in absolute privacy. The information has been collected by the airlines for years already. You weren't crying about it then.

Manowar

Serge Litehead

i may agree with you, but i dont see what can a goverment do by having complete info on their citizents.
lets say they know where i live, how much i make, how much i spent, where i spend, where i go, who i fuck etc etc etc...
lets say they have this info for everyone in the country.
how valuable this info for them? how would they use it against us?

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David!

You must have forgotten your Xoloft

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Peaches

Yet people think nothing of signing up for the grocery card that DOES show most of that.

The information is ALREADY OUT THERE! The government has always had access to it.

If you don't want your information given away, stop using credit cards or checks, cancel all your frequent buyer cards, Sam's/Costco/Etc., cancel your insurance, don't go visit a doctor and on and on and on.

There are open public sites out there right now that list credit card numbers along with names, address and phone numbers of the card holders. I can pay $29 and get mounds of information about someone including every where they've lived and the future and former addresss of people they lived with, where they worked, their unlisted phone number, where they have credit cards, how much in debt they are and more. Where's the outrage against all that?

VirtuMike

Warchild, being CANADIAN you just don't understand. And let me be the first to tell you that once they figure out that you make porn, you'll never be allowed into America.

Does that make you feel safe? Because they are keeping America safe by keeping you out. Add to that your vocal opinions of how America should work, and you are now on a list of international dissenters, which oddly enough is probably the same list as the terror list... And you'll get locked up for six hours in Seattle before getting sent walking home with a box full of car parts.

It doesn't matter if YOU feel safe, it's how AMERICA feels.

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Shoehorn!

Good. I am glad that they are doing this. It's not really information that's too personal, but it will help make flights safer and speed up security checks.

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WarChild

That's funny, I was at my American Mother's house in Seattle two weeks ago. I told the customs agent exactly what I did for a living. No problem getting in.

When I go to Vegas I always tell them I'm going to a convention. They as which one and I tell them. Haven't been denied access to Vegas yet.

I have more troubles entering Canada, as a porn webmaster, than I ever had entering the United States.

You're just making stuff up. Either that or I'm a magical Canadian that these "policies" don't apply to.
Please stick to the facts. On at least 3 ocassions that I can specifically remember (I am sure there is more) I have been allowed in to the United States without having to hide what I do for a living. I don't believe in lying to Custom Officers and so I don't. Nobody is keeping me out of America. I've never one time been denied entrance to your country. Not once.

I fly in the States all the time. So I'm sorry, but it does affect me. Your whole theory is bogus anyways, as none of it is true.

Peaches

The vast majority of American citizens wouldn't feel any less safe if all porn was abolished tomorrow.

KRL

Just out of curiousity, and not trying to be funny, but how old are you?

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Rich

and how many books have you read in your life?

holograph, not KRL

Rich

OMFG

WarChild

What Liberty is being stolen from you?

The goverment already knows where you live, what you do, how much money you make, who lives in your house with you, what kind of car you drive, who you're married to, who your parents are, etc etc.

Now they can find out what airline you fly and what you ate on that airline. Oh the horror of it all! Now whispering to the flight attendant what you'd like to eat and covering it up with your body while you eat it is no longer a viable option. God forbid!

The TSA isn't ordering the airlines to start collecting this information, it's already being collected!

Shoehorn!

My thoughts exactly.

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gornyhuy

This is why Bush will win.

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WarChild

I think whoever is elected President will be by the will of the American People and not so much what a Canadian posted on a message board.

Shoehorn!

More specifically the members of the Electoral College.

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CheeseFrog

Like they need all that to tell what ethnicity you are. If your first name is "Mohammed" and your last name isn't "Ali", you're gonna get hassled.

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erehwon

A DAMN good read!

http://www.mises.org/fullstory.aspx?Id=1619

[...]

Submission and compliance: that is what is meant by the term security in the state's lexicon. It is an interesting choice of words. Its use in public life dates at least to the advent of Social Security, a tax scheme that promises to put you on welfare in your old age in exchange for paying 14 percent of your income to support current retirees who constitute the wealthiest demographic slice of the American population. Even in this case, the term security meant compliance, as shown by the tendency of recipients to back ever more redistribution.

Now we have the Department of Homeland Security, a gargantuan agency that administers foreign and domestic spying, sends hither swarms of agents to harass us at airports, conduct drills in the event that the government decides that martial law is the only option, and generally suppress any and all signs of insurrection wherever they might appear. Here too the term security means submission, control, compliance, obedience, and stability for the state.

Who is this security trying to secure? We are told it is for our own benefit. It is government that makes us secure from terrible threats. And yet, if we look closely, we can see that the main beneficiary of security is the state itself.

We all understand this intuitively. Let's say you know that someone is after you?an ex-spouse, for example?and threatens your very life. Would you call the Department of Homeland Security and expect a response? No, the DHS is there to protect the state, as evidenced by the comparatively energetic response that a threat to the president's life would elicit.

[...]

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