to Rand

Please make my business account details public (i mean member id Noganka, partnership Damcash). I am not against any way of understanding the situation particularly!

Motos, what was the primary reason that made you change your address? Common sense tells me that even if it's legit, it will create questions at that point of time.

Epassporte should protect those receiving money. I understand reversing such payment and closing accounts after multiple cases of receiving fraud money, but I fail to see the logic after that. Any account holder can receive such payment and a single event is not enough to judge someone.

Suppose an account is frozen after such event, does the balance becomes available (minus the fraud transaction) after some time or is kept by epassporte?

Is it true that E-Passporte uses SKNANB.com , St.Kitts National Bank for operations?
The same bank Glo-bill was relying on?

Good to know that our funds are always "safe".
And good to know that Russia is in Your black list. Funny to mention though, that St.Kitts itself (and unlike Russia) is in international banking black lists worldwide.

My address was changed because of a mistake of my secretary .in the agreement he wrote address where the company was registered but not the factual address of the company!

P.S. how can you accuse Damcash in fraud if we even dont require in receving bank transfers from you. we only deal with intersystem operations made by epass.

No, it hasn't. It has become avoided. Several people raised the issue before I started persuing an answer and while KimmyKim was already here and answering questions. She never bothered to answer this, and to me this is a serious issue of customer neglect. Not that epassporte has the best reputation when it comes to customer support, but then again I've never needed support either. However, NOW I want a fucking answer, and I think that, as a loyal customer, I'm entitled to it.

Thanks, appreciate it. :thumbsup

Hey. You just named us cheaters. How the person can be a cheater while making ZERO transactions.
I'm very sorry to tell this, but in the current situation - epassporte is a cheater. Epassporte is playing very strange game.

BTW now I understand why my account was closed. I've opened it through DAMCASH. BUT TELL ME WHY!!!!! EPASSPORTE TEAM CAN'T TELL ME THE REASONE why my account was closed. WHY should I read postings on GFY to get the full picture?

PS.
And once more Kimmykim personally promised to check my problem and write back. But I still don't have a reply.

blH.

Just as a side note...I know that PayPal close accounts with little reason and at the drop of a hat etc etc and they seem to have the same support in this situation as epassporte i.e. more or less none, however...

I have to use PayPal on a couple of non-adult projects I'm involved in simply because it would lose business not to. Obviously I take a risk just by using paypal but am prepared to accept that and keep no significant funds in the account 'just in case'. To the point - I recently received my first 'fraudulent transaction' via PayPal. PayPal DIDN'T close my account. Instead I received a nice, professionally written e-mail explaining that they'd had to reverse the fraudulent transaction and advising me not to ship any goods to that person. They also asked for a little more info on the account which I happily provided and received a prompt, hand-written (ie no bot mail) response thanking me for my help.

Now...if even PayPal can do this (and let's face it for the most part paypal really do suck) why does it seem to be impossible for epassporte to do too?

I've been toying with the idea on an epassporte account for ages but never bothered as in the past the direct join approach would never work for UK accounts (ie the small test load never shows as it's never truly debited). However, the inability to answer simple questions is very worrying so I don't think I'll bother just yet.

Worth asking again in the vain hope somebody is professional enough to actually answer a very simple and very important question that's now been repeated by many people....

If an account closed for receiving money from a previously unkown fraudulent account (or in this case it seems it's actually for being created by an account that received money from a fraudulent account - so is even further removed) what the hell happens to any 'non-fraudulent' funds in that account. Are they returned to the ACCOUNT HOLDER and if so when?

Even PayPal usually eventually return frozen funds if the funds are not fraudulent, sometimes fairly quickly too if you pressure them enough.

I dont wanna take DamCash side, however there are some strange facts going on :

Sponsor accounts (Business accounts) cand only be funded by wire transfers, this meaning the the funds are available on epassporte bank account, before they enter the system and can not be fraudulent.

Also, a Sponsor account (Business Account) can also receive transfers from another Business Account (B2B). However sice all Business Accounts can only be funded by wire transfers, i dont see how fraud cand take place....

Note that a Business Account CAN NOT receive funds from personal/associate accounts ! (p2b)

Do not make situation any worse for you.

There have been enough people who stood up for your cause in this thread; questions have been perfectly phrased and addressed to EP support stuff. Now just wait for them to anwser.

If they'll be answered in a manner everyone expect them to you and your affiliates will get your money back except for the funds transferred from a fraudulent account(s).

But posting private info you're not supposed to know on a public board could be a reason of itself for blocking account (I'm sure there is a clause in their TOS to support that).

So for now just shut up and wait till Monday. They WILL HAVE to answer one way or the other if they do not want their reputation damaged beyond repair; too many people who're interested to listen for what they have to say on that one.

Their rep said p2b is possible: "p2b requires the use of the ePpurchase interface to process, but if you are using that there is no problem with the transaction."

You're right dude. How i can belive in fraud if it cant be by terms? :BangBang:

ePpurchase , witch takes a 18% comission it's smth like a shopping cart/credit card processing solution, and if fraud occurs, it will result in chargebacks and not in a closed business account and all affiliates accounts, witch are actualy standalone accounts, paid by affiliates..the sponsors only create this accouns for and in the name of the affiliates, at affiliates instructions...as they have to pay for it and also the affiliate account is in his own name, where is is fully responsable for his actions only, and not for the actions of the people that send him money..this is epassporte business to prevent fraudulent money to enter the system.

However, i am 99% sure that DamCash was not selling website memberships via epassporte.....


P.S. SKNAB Bank is not PRIVATE information...the name of the bank is written on the back of the card , as per Visa regulations.....
The fact that GloBill used SKNAB to process transactions is not private information either, as it was public from Globill and become ever more popular when Globill went down...

OK, really, the last post, but a simple and fair question that deserves an answer (although I thought it had been answered).

Spacemonk: The answer in your example is ?Yes? and in a few days, not 180 DamageX.

Your account may not be closed as a result of getting a payment from one fraud transaction, in your narrow example, just suspended. In that case the $50 is returned to the CC up the chain, no matter how far we have to go back; the $1000 is either left for your reactivated account or it is wired back to you or a check is mailed or UPS'd, depending on what you want.

If anyone here wants any money back that is on his or her account, let us know ? you have access at all times. We do not keep any funds anyway under any circumstance. We do not keep cardholder funds in any bank account we control in any way, nor do we spend, or count as ours, any funds that are seized. Those funds are returned to the rightful owner. The problem in this thread is that some people are trying to get information to continue or amend their scam by creating the false appearance that we are stealing funds or acting irresponsibly.

To help you all understand, here is a short version of our business model: We make money when funds are loaded, or sent in a P2P transaction. Therefore, we are fully driven towards use and functionality for you, our cardholder. We do not charge a monthly fee or a Use Fee, like many other cards. We do not make money on float (funds held in accounts), ePassporte funds that are loaded on to your account are not within our control; rather a trust bank holds them waiting for a call from Visa Interchange or the cardholder at an ATM or you asking for a wire, then the cash is moved to cover that transaction.

Spacemonk asked a simple question and maybe others have as well and if we were not answering this question I am sorry for the prior confusion.

From an industry point of view I think that we are lucky to have ePassporte; its success has been in large part due to the Adult Webmaster community accepting the product and using it. Sure we make money, however the investment in the technology and the time it takes and took to work with banks, etc was very costly. We expect to make a profit, just like anyone else. Neither ePassporte nor EPOCH will abandon this market, as did Pay Pal and others. However, we run the risk as an industry of hurting ourselves from within by constantly having these public discussions where accusations of theft or fraud are relentless, even after an answer is given and a solution, such as "write to me" is offered. Let?s just be aware that we have a great product run by honest people and just like everything else, a few idiots will screw it up for the rest of us. Believe me: There is fraud in every product like ePassporte - Visa or otherwise. When we catch it we are going to be as aggressive as possible, to protect our brand and to ensure our ability to continue offering alternative payment methods and vehicles to this industry.

To those of you (4 so far) that wrote to me, I have replied to each of you that I will have details to you tomorrow.

C

PS: St. Kitts Nevis Anguilla National Bank is an excellent bank and it is not on ANY list as some idiot posted.

The whole thing looks even more misterious to me now... What fraud have they commited then, if they weren't even phisycally able to?

Hope EP can get it all cleared.

Hmm your avoiding every question posted here again almost..


Dont you have "RULES" to follow. What is " a few days" ? we know its not 180 days , but how many days is it. ?? And if this is the case , then mail the money to the people in this thread that have had money stolen by you.

How come you dont tell your customers this information when they call you. It seems several peple in this thread have had sezied funds for no reason and customer support never mentioned UPS'ing the money back to the owner who's account you suspended...

Again like your other employees instead of simply answering the question , you choose to muddy the water , by making blanket ACCUSATIONS of people who have legitimate questions about your service in this thread. Calling them fraudsters looking to gleam info from you. Instead of WAKING UP AND REALIZING ITS YOUR CUSTOMERS ASKING THE QUESTIONS, AND FOR GOOD REASON, Your employees are on a seize spree and it means CUSTOMERS cant get answers to questions.

Again you use 2 paragraphs to tell us things we already know and dont need an answer to, and ignore every other question..



SIMPLE QUESTION IT DOESN'T NEED A FUCKING PARAGRAPH TO ANSWER..


I sell domains , I have 50k in my account, What protection as an epassporte user can i take to prevent someone from using 1 fraud epass account to purchase a domain and have my 50k seized.

GET IT ?? THEN FUCKING ANSWER THE QUESTION

Sigh. I'm going to correct the errors in this reasoning and then I'm not posting in this thread again.
Lanoy, you need to email me kimmy @ epassporte .com so that I have somewhere to answer your questions when risk management gives me the answers tomorrow. I will not be posting them on a message board since they will be account specific.

Now on to the rest...


Business accounts are initially funded and reloaded via wire transfer. We do not allow direct funding of business accounts with anything else. However, using the ePpurchase interface money does move from personal accounts, which are credit card loaded, into business accounts, creating a co-mingled funds situation.

I hope this clarifies the situation as far as your questions regarding how funds can be transferred.

ummm
Dont you charge a fee for both cards ?

KimmyKim, I wrote a big letter to you, where I described situation very detaily. Please give me normal answer. I still waiting for normal answer. All i got is

"We can't take you business anymore"
"We will not tell you the reasons you was blocked"
"We can't tell you anthing, sorry".

I wait for ONE normal answer. Please, can you do it? I really need it.

Ouch ... I have some russian friends that might like to meet you and discuss this.

that sounds kinda scary.. what's happening with epassporte?

Sure it does not sound like all participants of the drama were offered polite detailed explanations of what happened and FedExed checks with what remained of their money.

Lip Service so far..

i think epassporte users deserve an answer to the question about how users are supposed to protect themselves from a fraud user or sponsor sending them money.. and thus losing all funds accumulated until that point..

As a merchant account holder if my merchant told me someone came into my store and used a stolen credit card and so my merchant was going to reverse the charges PLUS seize all funds in my merchant account and disable the account so no further sales could takes place with no explanation i would go apeshit.

Generally in a case like this the charge is reversed and the police are notified, my merchant abilities are not disrupted and business goes on as usual.

If a high occurance of fraud was to take place the merchant might suspend an account , but they certainly cant seize the funds the merchant account has in it. If following a police investigation the merchant account themselves were found to be involved in the stolen credit cards then the money would be seized and charges filed..

How does an EPASSPORTE user verify if the money he spends / recieves was at one point involved in a crime ??

Like EXAMPLE..

If i sell a domain to someone , how do i verify if his account is fraud or not and what steps can i take to insure if he had fraud money that all my money wont be seized with no way of me recuperating my loss ... ?

bumpolisious...
me smell some Genuine
http://nnk.art.pl/endorfun/bullshit.jpg

Did the Russians get an explanation yet?

Interesting how You managed to solve the problem banks wordwide are trying to solve for AGES which is the very reason for "know Your client" idea used worldwide.

How can You track 50$ up to the chain? Lets say I got legitimate 50K on my account and I get 50$ from someone I dont even know. Then in 1 minute I send 50$ to a friend of mine for lets say 5 porn pics and You block my account. How on earth can You prove that I've sent the SAME 50$ which were stolen?

You cant. And no-one can.

That is why in the offline cash world police does the same stuff worldwide - they mark the actual dollar bills (ever seen that in the movies?) or copy their numbers.

And in non cash transactions that is not possible and is the sole reason for the "know Your client" banking policy, because banks can not be sure of the source of the funds and thus have to verify the client.


It would be illegal for Your company to earn money on "float" because Your company does not seem to have an actual banking license nor financial license.

"ePassporte funds that are loaded on to your account are not within our control; rather a trust bank holds them", this I beleive is illegal as well since You operate without a banking license. In fact Netherlands Antilles (Curacao where E-Passporte is registered) law is in general very similar to a certain extent to the Dutch law.

By dutch law if it would happen in Netherlands Your operations when You freezed the funds would qualify as a violation of article 82 of the Act on the Supervision of the Credit System 1992 ('ASCS 1992') .Pursuant to article 82 it is prohibited for any natural person or legal entity to invite, receive or have, in the course of his or its occupation or business, repayable funds on demand or subject to notice being given from the public. In this respect it is also prohibited to act as an intermediary for the purpose of inviting or receiving from the public such repayable funds on demand or subject to notice being given.

Which essentially means that You can not really freeze the funds on their way when You pass them because than they will be considered "repayable".

Your agent bank can do that, providing that there is visible legal relationship in between Your client and the bank or You can send all of them back to their respective senders, but by dutch law You can not keep them longer than 5 working days.

But as for Netherlands Antilles law to be honest I dont know but because these two jurisdictions are quite similar I would expect the same or similar legal restrictions.

You might want to have a legal opinion of Your lawyers into that before doing such stuff as freezing accounts because Damcash theoretically as well as all other account holders may really as You said Yourself actually go to court and claim damages (Ironically just as Your own company Paycom-Epoch is suing FDC with the sole exception that FDC IS a bank unlike E-passporte).


As for St.Kitts Bank I beleive Motos did not mean the bank itself but rather the whole region which has been removed from the official FATF black list of non-cooperative regions and countries only in 2002 with a notice that it will be watched on "closely".

FATF stands for Financial Action Task Force which is the main guide for banks wordwide in relation to whom to work with.

Russia is still there though. :D
On the other hand 140 Million population of our country with even our own Forbes edition (main editor shot dead unfortunately though :D) is a bit more than a tiny island in Carribean.

Which in essence reminds me of a joke in "Mean Girls" when a Japanese school girl in an American school being mad on her Chineese girlfriend says "YOU NIGGA!!!".
:D

glad to hear.

I have a non-adult webiste and when a fraudolent payment is made my procesing company just takes the amount out of my account and returns it to the rightful owner, certainly they do not freeze my account as that will cause me huge losses. For sure after reading this post I will not get an epassporte account. I like to comment on the threats that they have made on this board to sue their critics (rather then answer their questions) and I would like to remind them that recently paypal has had to pay a large fine for freezing accounts without justifiable cause and that legal recourse might not be entirely in their interest.

regards
Marco

I've read this thread a few times and still have questions.

I have an ePassporte account and have had it well over a year now.

Let's say a sponsor deposits something in my account, a sponsor I think is legit as they've been around forever, are USA-based, etc. ePassporte determines the monies paid to webmasters during this pay period were acquired fraudulently. You'd then remove those funds from my account.

Fine and dandy.

BUT - then - what determines if you close my account, freeze my account or suspend the account?

People here claim that due to a single transaction, their accounts were closed.

I can certainly understand if you froze the account while investigating, but to permanently close based on a single transaction seems excessive and harsh.

HairToStay, as I understand Epassport will close affilate program's account not yours

Kimmy, please print this and hang it in your office
http://www.terra.es/personal7/kalahero/ww1647-41.jpg

I know the guys at damcash and they are solid !

But on the other hand, Paycom/Epoch or whatever name they use now still owe me 17grand in reserves from back in the day and refuse to answer me. I am baffled at the # of people that still do business with them.

to Rand,Kimmy Kim and others from Epassporte

We still didnt hear any answer from your side about the reasons of closing the account . Everybody on the board is waiting for it.....

Read this thread again, several people here say their accounts were closed because of receiving money from DamCash.

Someone should make a collective thread showing the multitude of threads made on this very subject by different people so everybody can see these are NOT isolated cases.

Thanks, I read everything 3 times and was sure of that ....

I could understand freezing it while investigating, but closure?

Still has no answer from Chris.

the same for me..
still no answer from Chris

This is what happens when a financial company is ran without any licenses to transfer money... just on an agreement from a bank :)

for some reason I always hated ePassporte and always knew that they would freeze the accounts.

You cannot start issuing ATM cards without having serious heat for money laundering etc....


well, good luck to all of ya.

Bump?
:Graucho