What would a good Family dog be? - GoFuckYourself.com

KMR Stitch · 06-08-2004, 04:08 PM

As we all know I have a son. 1 year 4 months old. He is now walking. I was thinking about getting him a puppy.

We already have a Germanshepard (sp) That is sooo tame he wouldn't hurt a fly.

He is dying due to Heart worms and the Surgery is 6,000.00.

I know my girlfriend wants a pug.

Any suggestions?

I don't really want something BIG. Even though a Golden Retreiver would be great

twistyneck · 06-08-2004, 04:09 PM

Maybe you can find a nice mutt at the dogpound. An older dog that is used to kids might be a good way to go.

Elli · 06-08-2004, 04:17 PM

I wouldn't recommend a pound dog with a young child. Dogs in the pound usually have some problems that require training out, like being improperly socialized.

With a child around, get a dog that the kid can't hurt if he falls on it or pulls its ears. A little yapper might not be so patient with a child.

Dalmatians have the brains of a rock and are extremely energetic.

Maybe a nice black lab? Not too large a dog, but just big enough.

banderas · 06-08-2004, 04:17 PM

for me it is better to have a cat.......

cosis · 06-08-2004, 04:18 PM

golden retriever

strobi · 06-08-2004, 04:19 PM

labrador

Jaden · 06-08-2004, 04:20 PM

I would definitely say not a dog from the pound with a little one. Like was said before you just never ever know. The absolute best dogs I can think of to have with kids are Border Collies and Labs. Both are amazing breeds

RP Fade · 06-08-2004, 04:20 PM

lab or golden retriever if you want to go that route. But i've rescued dogs from the shelter/pound before and they've been some of the most obedient, loving and loyal dogs i've owned.

wvuatl · 06-08-2004, 04:22 PM

golden retrievers are great.. had one for 8 years now.

most of my friends will take my dog for the day b/c she's so cool... they need lots of playing though.

twistyneck · 06-08-2004, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Elli
I wouldn't recommend a pound dog with a young child. Dogs in the pound usually have some problems that require training out, like being improperly socialized.

Some but not all. Many pound dogs are just fine. In fact, the best dogs I've ever had have been pound/shelter dogs. The hard part is looking and waiting for just the right one.

An older dog is out of the puppy stage so you don't have to put up with all that irritating puppy stuff. They are probably (hopefully) also housebroken so no worries there. And if it is already used to kids, it won't mind getting its tail pulled or its eyes poked.

But like I said, the hard part is finding the time and energy to look around for a good one. Just a thought, I realize these kinds of dogs aren't for everyone.

silent moan · 06-08-2004, 04:28 PM

"bulldog" is great for me, they look so sweet and adorable

Elli · 06-08-2004, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by twistyneck
Some but not all. Many pound dogs are just fine. In fact, the best dogs I've ever had have been pound/shelter dogs. The hard part is looking and waiting for just the right one.

An older dog is out of the puppy stage so you don't have to put up with all that irritating puppy stuff. They are probably (hopefully) also housebroken so no worries there. And if it is already used to kids, it won't mind getting its tail pulled or its eyes poked.

But like I said, the hard part is finding the time and energy to look around for a good one. Just a thought, I realize these kinds of dogs aren't for everyone.

Yes, I know. My friend got a black lab from the pound that was 2 years old and she was a total sweetie. She finally died a few years ago, a happy old dog. My mother got a retriever from the pound (another two year old) and Purdy is now 9 and finally settling down.

They are great dogs, but I still would not bring an older dog with unknown behaviours into a house with such a young child.

KMR Stitch · 06-08-2004, 06:09 PM

inthestars · 06-08-2004, 06:53 PM

a golden for sure.. someone on this board has the cutest golden puppy I've ever seen!

Semi-Retired-Dave · 06-08-2004, 06:57 PM

The most loyal thing in the world. So I got rid of the girlfriend and got another one.

http://www.cyberagedave.com/Dogslife.wmv

scottie0779 · 06-08-2004, 06:59 PM

You people and big dogs... what's up with big dogs?!? I have this conversation with my wife all the time...

For the family, get a cocker spaniel

Ours is a little over a year old, VERY SMART. Learned all sorts of stuff in like less than 5 tries. Of course, we got him when he was a pup, so we got to raise him as we wanted. he knows OUR commands. Sure, the standard Sit, Down, Shake but he also knows "SHUT THE FUCK UP" and he can answer questions when you ask him

Knows the difference between "Do you want to go outside?" and "Are you hungry?" and "Are you ready for bed?"

Get a cocker!!!

Fletch XXX · 06-08-2004, 07:00 PM

an abused pit bull?

Semi-Retired-Dave · 06-08-2004, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by scottie0779
You people and big dogs... what's up with big dogs?!? I have this conversation with my wife all the time...

For the family, get a cocker spaniel

Sure, the standard Sit, Down, Shake but he also knows "SHUT THE FUCK UP"

Babagirls · 06-08-2004, 07:01 PM

Akita

big ass dogs, but very friendly and protective. great kids and babys (bro-in law has had one for like 14 yrs now.)

Elli · 06-08-2004, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by scottie0779
You people and big dogs... what's up with big dogs?!? I have this conversation with my wife all the time...

For the family, get a cocker spaniel

Ours is a little over a year old, VERY SMART. Learned all sorts of stuff in like less than 5 tries. Of course, we got him when he was a pup, so we got to raise him as we wanted. he knows OUR commands. Sure, the standard Sit, Down, Shake but he also knows "SHUT THE FUCK UP" and he can answer questions when you ask him Knows the difference between "Do you want to go outside?" and "Are you hungry?" and "Are you ready for bed?"

Get a cocker!!!

My mom's cocker spaniel was the meanest bitch on the block. She'd sleep on my bed, then bite me if I moved my foot in my sleep.

Mutt · 06-08-2004, 07:02 PM

golden retriever. gentle as can be. just don't get any of the small nervous breeds. my parents got me a half fox terrier/half chihuahua for my 4th birthday, dog spent the next 16 years biting me. i was too young for a nervous dog like that, i'd try to play with her and she'd just tear my face off.

Abbie Bueller · 06-08-2004, 07:05 PM

Basset hound. They're really short and kid-friendly.

sheldonjuan · 06-08-2004, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by KMR Stitch
As we all know I have a son. 1 year 4 months old. He is now walking. I was thinking about getting him a puppy.

We already have a Germanshepard (sp) That is sooo tame he wouldn't hurt a fly.

He is dying due to Heart worms and the Surgery is 6,000.00.

I know my girlfriend wants a pug.

Any suggestions?

I don't really want something BIG. Even though a Golden Retreiver would be great

are you looking for donations?

robfantasy · 06-08-2004, 07:07 PM

a collie

scottie0779 · 06-08-2004, 07:11 PM

I LOVE BASSETS!!!

Nice pic abbie!

Semi-Retired-Dave · 06-08-2004, 07:12 PM

Abbie Bueller · 06-08-2004, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by scottie0779
I LOVE BASSETS!!!

Nice pic abbie!

Awww.... I just did a google search. Here's a cute one of some puppies:

Semi-Retired-Dave · 06-08-2004, 07:16 PM

scottie0779 · 06-08-2004, 07:21 PM

Dave - your dog is SO ADORABLE!!! It's name is Ginger? (file name hacking...) My wife wants to know what kind of dog that is...? (I told her she's not gettin another dog)

Jaden · 06-08-2004, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by twistyneck
Some but not all. Many pound dogs are just fine. In fact, the best dogs I've ever had have been pound/shelter dogs. The hard part is looking and waiting for just the right one.

An older dog is out of the puppy stage so you don't have to put up with all that irritating puppy stuff. They are probably (hopefully) also housebroken so no worries there. And if it is already used to kids, it won't mind getting its tail pulled or its eyes poked.

But like I said, the hard part is finding the time and energy to look around for a good one. Just a thought, I realize these kinds of dogs aren't for everyone.

True, but I would have to say definitely NOT worth the risk with a kid. My best friend as well as I had always gotten dogs from the pound, but the last time she did, she ended with a dog who ended up literally scalping her 7 year old son. After seeing that, I decided to save the dogs from the pound until my wee ones are a bit older, and stick with dogs I could raise and bring into the family from their start.

Semi-Retired-Dave · 06-08-2004, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by scottie0779
Dave - your dog is SO ADORABLE!!! It's name is Ginger? (file name hacking...) My wife wants to know what kind of dog that is...? (I told her she's not gettin another dog)

Thanks, they are so loyal as well. Love showers, love playing, lots of personality.

They are long hair dachshunds

That little bitch gave birth about a two months ago. They are quick nowadays.

clickhappy · 06-08-2004, 07:41 PM

german shepherd. they'll do anything to make you happy and they'd die to protect you and your family. One of the most loyal dogs there is. If I was in the market for a new dog that's what Id get.

scottie0779 · 06-08-2004, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CyberAge-Dave
Thanks, they are so loyal as well. Love showers, love playing, lots of personality.

They are long hair dachshunds

That little bitch gave birth about a two months ago. They are quick nowadays.

SHIT!! FATAL ERROR. i just showed her that pic. now she wants one of the pups! lol

cosis · 06-08-2004, 07:45 PM

Semi-Retired-Dave · 06-08-2004, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by cosis

That is just way too hot.

Semi-Retired-Dave · 06-08-2004, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by scottie0779
SHIT!! FATAL ERROR. i just showed her that pic. now she wants one of the pups! lol

Two sorrys there, one. You have to get another dog.
and Two, they are all already gone.

But you can find breaders around. Make sure the mom and the dad are both pure breeds.

cosis · 06-08-2004, 07:50 PM

this is my sisters puppy - she is now about 4-5 months old, I get to watch her next weekend

synapse · 06-08-2004, 08:52 PM

We have a Chocolate Labrador, he's very sweet and great with our 6yo daughter, the only down side is when their young they eat *everything* including my sound system etc ... but love him and wouldn't trade him for anything

Cloner · 06-08-2004, 09:15 PM

I used to raise Cocker Spaniels, they are really sweet if you raise them right.

jhauser · 06-08-2004, 10:00 PM

I have a border collie and hes the bomb.

Sama · 06-08-2004, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Many pound dogs are just fine. In fact, the best dogs I've ever had have been pound/shelter dogs.

I agree. I've been that route twice and the best 2 dogs I've ever owned and did excellent with small kids. The first one was a 5 year old mixed hound type and the 2nd was a 7 year old cocker.

Quote:

I wouldn't recommend a pound dog with a young child. Dogs in the pound usually have some problems that require training out, like being improperly socialized.

That is WAY too broad a statement. Just don't rush into the adoption until you have viisted the dog a few times, had some 1 on 1 time, etc...

Good luck

Tuna · 06-08-2004, 10:29 PM

go with the pug. if not jack russells are great dogs

pimpin · 06-08-2004, 10:35 PM

my pug is almost 1 and he is wound like a top at times and a big time licker but overall he's a damn good dog and pretty obedient for a pug (there often bullheaded).

You might want to consider a pound dog , maybe one that's out of the lick and bite puppy stage already. Yeah puppies are cute but around a young child you should play it safe.

I just had my neice over who is 4 months old and the dog couldnt stop nosing around her and licking her all over the place. She didnt mind but he would not stop. Even though he is small he also likes to jump up on my friends 2 year old as well. Standing on his hind legs he's almost their height and can pretty much knock them over if they aren't surefooted. We have to just hold him when the kids are over.

A medium size dog that won't jump up on the kid might be a good idea. The dog would already be the kids height ya know so it wouldnt need to jump up on them.

reynold · 06-08-2004, 10:40 PM

A basset hound puppy seems just fine!

pimpin · 06-08-2004, 10:41 PM

oh yeah and here's mine as a pup and current pic

The lady dogs like the tongue

Tam · 06-08-2004, 10:42 PM

I know you don't want a big dog....... but we have 2 full blooded boxers and a full blooded black lab, and there isn't one of them that wouldn't kill for any one of my kids. They are all aweosme and extremely protective of my kids.

Shephards are also great, I Had one when I was a kid and I thought I'd never own another dog, but I love the ones I have now.

I have pics of them somewhere....... the boxers LOOK mean as all hell, but they are sweethearts with my family. Let anyone come near any one of us though and they are all after them. lol

Disco_Stu · 06-08-2004, 10:47 PM

I breed dobermans, Fawn color mostly, I never have a problem with my kids riding around on them like their horses.
Upper left is fawn

PiTaAnGeL · 06-08-2004, 10:47 PM

I did a little bit of research on this when my mom wanted to get a dog. She has a day care at home so she needed a dog that would be good with kids. We ended up getting a Basset hound and they are very sweet. They are a little harder to train but they are definately more passive that most other dogs. We have never had problems with her.
Now that I moved out, I got an American Eskimo named Tatum. We adopted her and she is the coolest dog that I have ever had. She is sweet, playful, harmless and very loyal.

pimplink · 06-08-2004, 10:48 PM

Can't go wrong with a Labrador...or a G. Retriever for that matter.

believe me, we had both...They were both dead now though.

PiTaAnGeL · 06-08-2004, 10:50 PM

Tatum is not too big and not too small. She's only weighs 20 lbs. and she stands like a foot and a half tall and is like 3 feet long. She is a miniature American Eskimo.

06-08-2004, 04:08 PM	#1
KMR Stitch I am cool Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 14,494	What would a good Family dog be? As we all know I have a son. 1 year 4 months old. He is now walking. I was thinking about getting him a puppy. We already have a Germanshepard (sp) That is sooo tame he wouldn't hurt a fly. He is dying due to Heart worms and the Surgery is 6,000.00. I know my girlfriend wants a pug. Any suggestions? I don't really want something BIG. Even though a Golden Retreiver would be great

06-08-2004, 04:17 PM	#3
Elli Reach for those stars! Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 17,991	I wouldn't recommend a pound dog with a young child. Dogs in the pound usually have some problems that require training out, like being improperly socialized. With a child around, get a dog that the kid can't hurt if he falls on it or pulls its ears. A little yapper might not be so patient with a child. Dalmatians have the brains of a rock and are extremely energetic. Maybe a nice black lab? Not too large a dog, but just big enough. __________________ email: [email protected]

06-08-2004, 04:20 PM	#8
RP Fade Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 3,343	lab or golden retriever if you want to go that route. But i've rescued dogs from the shelter/pound before and they've been some of the most obedient, loving and loyal dogs i've owned. __________________ HomemadeCash.com - Homemade & GF sites powered by NScash.com HomemadeVideoPass.com - The only all homemade mega site OurHomemadePorno.com - Real couples fucking on camera Contact ICQ: 400-786-531 Email: fade AT nscash.com

06-08-2004, 04:22 PM	#9
wvuatl Confirmed User Join Date: May 2004 Location: New Jersey Posts: 604	golden retrievers are great.. had one for 8 years now. most of my friends will take my dog for the day b/c she's so cool... they need lots of playing though. __________________ Get you some vibrators for women now!

06-08-2004, 06:57 PM	#15
Semi-Retired-Dave Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: LA Posts: 11,190	The most loyal thing in the world. So I got rid of the girlfriend and got another one. http://www.cyberagedave.com/Dogslife.wmv __________________ Support a Good Cause

06-08-2004, 04:09 PM	#2
twistyneck So Fucking Banned Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Hanging by the neck until dead. Posts: 4,660	Maybe you can find a nice mutt at the dogpound. An older dog that is used to kids might be a good way to go.

06-08-2004, 04:17 PM	#4
banderas Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Bruxelles Posts: 1,086	for me it is better to have a cat.......

06-08-2004, 04:18 PM	#5
cosis Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Beach Posts: 5,281	golden retriever

06-08-2004, 04:19 PM	#6
strobi Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 7,383	labrador

06-08-2004, 04:20 PM	#7
Jaden Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: CO Posts: 151	I would definitely say not a dog from the pound with a little one. Like was said before you just never ever know. The absolute best dogs I can think of to have with kids are Border Collies and Labs. Both are amazing breeds

06-08-2004, 04:28 PM	#11
silent moan Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 1,908	"bulldog" is great for me, they look so sweet and adorable

06-08-2004, 06:09 PM	#13
KMR Stitch I am cool Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 14,494

06-08-2004, 06:53 PM	#14
inthestars Registered User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: California Posts: 2,021	a golden for sure.. someone on this board has the cutest golden puppy I've ever seen!

06-08-2004, 06:59 PM	#16
scottie0779 Confirmed User Join Date: May 2004 Location: IL US Posts: 287	You people and big dogs... what's up with big dogs?!? I have this conversation with my wife all the time... For the family, get a cocker spaniel Ours is a little over a year old, VERY SMART. Learned all sorts of stuff in like less than 5 tries. Of course, we got him when he was a pup, so we got to raise him as we wanted. he knows OUR commands. Sure, the standard Sit, Down, Shake but he also knows "SHUT THE FUCK UP" and he can answer questions when you ask him Knows the difference between "Do you want to go outside?" and "Are you hungry?" and "Are you ready for bed?" Get a cocker!!! __________________ Scottie ICQ 213 164 680

06-08-2004, 07:00 PM	#17
Fletch XXX GFY HALL OF FAME DAMMIT!!! Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: that 504 Posts: 60,840	an abused pit bull? __________________ Want an Android App for your tube, membership, or free site? Need banners or promo material? Hit us up (ICQ Fletch: 148841377) or email me fletchxxx at gmail.com - recent work - About me

06-08-2004, 07:01 PM	#19
Babagirls Text Writer Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 18,812	Akita big ass dogs, but very friendly and protective. great kids and babys (bro-in law has had one for like 14 yrs now.) __________________ Need a Text Writer? Blogs\|Reviews\|Descriptions\|Paysites\|TGP's\|Stories ICQ: 397892500

06-08-2004, 07:02 PM	#21
Mutt Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 34,431	golden retriever. gentle as can be. just don't get any of the small nervous breeds. my parents got me a half fox terrier/half chihuahua for my 4th birthday, dog spent the next 16 years biting me. i was too young for a nervous dog like that, i'd try to play with her and she'd just tear my face off. __________________ I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!

06-08-2004, 07:05 PM	#22
Abbie Bueller Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Texas Posts: 160	Basset hound. They're really short and kid-friendly.

06-08-2004, 07:07 PM	#24
robfantasy Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Medellin, Colombia Posts: 6,445	a collie __________________ Looking to speak w/ high volume nutra CPA affiliates or networks... msg me

06-08-2004, 07:11 PM	#25
scottie0779 Confirmed User Join Date: May 2004 Location: IL US Posts: 287	I LOVE BASSETS!!! Nice pic abbie! __________________ Scottie ICQ 213 164 680

06-08-2004, 07:12 PM	#26
Semi-Retired-Dave Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: LA Posts: 11,190	__________________ Support a Good Cause

06-08-2004, 07:16 PM	#28
Semi-Retired-Dave Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: LA Posts: 11,190	__________________ Support a Good Cause

06-08-2004, 07:21 PM	#29
scottie0779 Confirmed User Join Date: May 2004 Location: IL US Posts: 287	Dave - your dog is SO ADORABLE!!! It's name is Ginger? (file name hacking...) My wife wants to know what kind of dog that is...? (I told her she's not gettin another dog) __________________ Scottie ICQ 213 164 680

06-08-2004, 07:41 PM	#32
clickhappy Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 4,027	german shepherd. they'll do anything to make you happy and they'd die to protect you and your family. One of the most loyal dogs there is. If I was in the market for a new dog that's what Id get.

06-08-2004, 07:45 PM	#34
cosis Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Beach Posts: 5,281

06-08-2004, 07:50 PM	#37
cosis Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Beach Posts: 5,281	this is my sisters puppy - she is now about 4-5 months old, I get to watch her next weekend

06-08-2004, 08:52 PM	#38
synapse NameNetwork.com Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: South Carolina Posts: 1,175	We have a Chocolate Labrador, he's very sweet and great with our 6yo daughter, the only down side is when their young they eat everything including my sound system etc ... but love him and wouldn't trade him for anything

06-08-2004, 09:15 PM	#39
Cloner Confirmed User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Heredia, Costa Rica Posts: 157	I used to raise Cocker Spaniels, they are really sweet if you raise them right. __________________ Chief Information Officer Day Group Services The Costa Rica News - Editor in Chief Jatropha World - Chief Science Consultant on Biofuel Production United Biofuels of America - Science and Information Director

06-08-2004, 10:00 PM	#40
jhauser Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 2,924	I have a border collie and hes the bomb. __________________ TopBucks.com\| PlugInFeeds.com\| PinkVisual.com I am not one of those girls that go Mobi ing around my mobile solution is for you and you only. icq 175789972

06-08-2004, 10:29 PM	#42
Tuna Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Steeler Country Posts: 1,307	go with the pug. if not jack russells are great dogs __________________ $30 PER SIGNUP PLUS 25% RECURRING FREE HOSTED PIC AND MOVIE GALLERIES Submit Your Free Sites, Pic and Movie Galleries Here ICQ : 20034024

06-08-2004, 10:35 PM	#43
pimpin Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 565	my pug is almost 1 and he is wound like a top at times and a big time licker but overall he's a damn good dog and pretty obedient for a pug (there often bullheaded). You might want to consider a pound dog , maybe one that's out of the lick and bite puppy stage already. Yeah puppies are cute but around a young child you should play it safe. I just had my neice over who is 4 months old and the dog couldnt stop nosing around her and licking her all over the place. She didnt mind but he would not stop. Even though he is small he also likes to jump up on my friends 2 year old as well. Standing on his hind legs he's almost their height and can pretty much knock them over if they aren't surefooted. We have to just hold him when the kids are over. A medium size dog that won't jump up on the kid might be a good idea. The dog would already be the kids height ya know so it wouldnt need to jump up on them. __________________ ---------------------------------

06-08-2004, 10:40 PM	#44
reynold Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Global Traveler Posts: 51,271	A basset hound puppy seems just fine!

06-08-2004, 10:41 PM	#45
pimpin Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 565	oh yeah and here's mine as a pup and current pic The lady dogs like the tongue __________________ ---------------------------------

06-08-2004, 10:42 PM	#46
Tam Rude Bitch Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: In your face Posts: 8,489	I know you don't want a big dog....... but we have 2 full blooded boxers and a full blooded black lab, and there isn't one of them that wouldn't kill for any one of my kids. They are all aweosme and extremely protective of my kids. Shephards are also great, I Had one when I was a kid and I thought I'd never own another dog, but I love the ones I have now. I have pics of them somewhere....... the boxers LOOK mean as all hell, but they are sweethearts with my family. Let anyone come near any one of us though and they are all after them. lol __________________ Get in Touch on Telegram if you need a hardworker - (since 1999)

06-08-2004, 10:47 PM	#47
Disco_Stu So Fucking Banned Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 757	I breed dobermans, Fawn color mostly, I never have a problem with my kids riding around on them like their horses. Upper left is fawn