Brujah

Would another president have done differently?

Before laying all the blame at Mr. Bush's door, consider this little slice of history.
In 1998, after years of evasion and deception, Mr. Hussein had stopped co-operating with United Nations weapons inspectors. The U.S. president at the time called Iraq an "outlaw nation," and urged the international community to take strong action.
If "we fail to act, or we take some ambiguous third route which gives him yet more opportunities to develop his weapons of mass destruction ... he will conclude that the international community has lost its will." The result, he said, would be disastrous. "Some day, some way, I guarantee you, he'll use the arsenal."

The name of the president? Bill Clinton.

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dig420

yeah except Clinton was actually capable enough to get the support of other countries for his actions.

rooster

yea so capable he bypassed the un when he bombed yogoslavia because he knew he wouldnt have got the votes.

Thats what bush should have done, but powell was stabbed in the back by the french.

Sly_RJ

Holy shit, we actually agree.

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dig420

Clinton was always an expert at bringing together disparate opinions

directfiesta

It's called "standard procedure".

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I know that Asspimple is stoopid ... As he says, it is a FACT !

But I can't figure out how he can breathe or type , at the same time ....

Sly_RJ

Clinton was great at lying to get his way. Bush isn't.

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hottoddy

Like what, getting his dick sucked (well he was on the phone with Arafat) ?

ChrisH

Facts... Facts.... What do you expect these posters to care about facts?



To busy yealling about oil.

Just like the Muslim countries that try to say it's a war on Islam. They neglect to look at the action in Bosnia where muslims were being killed by the thousands.

dig420

Bullshit. All politicians are expert liars. The question is what are they gonna lie ABOUT. I'll take lies over blowjobs compared to Bush's lies about everything anyday.

rooster

dig, you are a perfect example of why the democrat party has gone to hell and is very divided.

Sly_RJ

You're joking, right?

You think Bush is a good liar? He tricks you into believing lies?

Either you're <i>really</i> gullible or you're just arguing to defend Clinton.

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TheJimmy

you know I wasn't a total Clinton fan, but he definitely had some strong suits, and THAT was one of them for sure!

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jas1552

Yeah we all know except for lying about blowjobs Clinton was a pillar of honesty.

BTW if your own family can't trust you why should anyone else?

jas1552

Refresh my memory. When did Clinton rally UN support for taking action?

JeremySF

I admire Clinton simply for the fact that he got his dick sucked in the Oral Office.

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ThunderBalls

No, Bush is a terrible liar. Which proves to me how stupid people like you really are to believe his bullshit.

sweetcuties

I miss Clinton

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Sly_RJ

You're a sharp one, aren't you?

I just stated Bush is a terrible liar. Meaning you can see when he's talking out of his ass and when he's adamant about something.

But thanks for the "stupid" compliment. Have anything else up your sleeve?

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ThunderBalls

Yes I am, thanks for noticing.

Uh, no, you didnt state he is a terrible liar. Your exact words were You think Bush is a good liar?
And since he is ALWAYS talking out of his ass you are dumber than I originally thought.

Sly_RJ

Try reading the context.

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jas1552

What would Clinton do? Nothing. He had plenty of opportunity when Saddam kicked out inspectors. He bombed for a few days and then let Saddam get away with it.

Gutterboy

Clinton would have continued his policy of containment and sanctions.. with occasional bombings of military infrastructure & weapons plants when Saddam got uppity.

I like how some people try to blame this conflict on Clinton. What a crock. Lets get it right, George Bush and only George Bush is the reason we are at war.

Not Clinton, not Clinton's policies.

There is no more evidence that Saddam is a threat to the US now than there was at the beginning of W's term. He didn't want to bomb Saddam then, in fact he showed no indications of doing anything other than continuing Clinton's policies until 9/11. Those are the facts. The 'war on terror' is just a convenient cover for him to take out Saddam.

And as for Bush's lies... Bush and his senior administration have been lying repeatedly and profusely for the last year, both to the American public, the UN and many other nations, about Saddam being a threat to the U.S.

jas1552

Look at North Korea and judge for yourself how well containment and sanctions work. The people are starving and the government is building nukes.

If Clinton hadn't been weak and put real pressure on Saddam right after he kicked out inspectors we probably wouldn't be where we are today.

dig420

conservatives have been trying to blame Clinton for everything including the weather because they're terrified he's going to go down in history as a great president. that's the entire reason for Kenneth Starr and all that other bullshit.

they not only play hardball, they're fanatics.

Gutterboy

lol. Lets try this again... be sure to read it slowly so it sinks in..

Saddam is no worse a threat to the US today than he was when he was ejected from Kuwait in 1991.

Nothing has gotten worse.

This "crisis" was entirely manufactured by the Bush administration.

We are in this situation because W. decided he wanted to use the war on terror as an excuse to play out a personal vendetta against Hussein. No other reason.

jas1552

Read the first post in this thread. Specifically Clintons quote. Clinton sure seemed to think Saddam was a big threat. Clinton could talk a good game but he was all talk and no action. Bush actually turned Clinton's rhetoric into action.

Gutterboy

Two words: North Korea

What is Bush doing about that? Nothing. No action, just promises they'll be a "dipomatic solution"

Gee, sounds a bit like Clinton? Wonder why?

Did North Korea build nukes, reactivate its reactors and begin saber rattling under Clinton? No. They did it specifically to make Bush's posturing about "premption" foolish.. and they succeeded.

Bush is only a "man of action" when it comes to non-threatening dictators of barely above 3rd world status, starving nations.

To do something useful, you have to deal effectively with real threats. Saddam never was a threat.

When Bush does something useful for the US, its economy, and the real threats it faces.. something besides pretending his is a cowboy and blowing up starving ragheads.. I'll take notice.

Maybe he could start with catching Bin Ladin?

jas1552

Actually yes they were building nukes when Clinton was president. We only found out about it later and when we called them on it I guess they got embarrassed and started their sabre rattling.

Are you calling Clinton a liar?

Gutterboy

Henry Hyde once said that "Lying is part and parcel of the game of politics."

Of course Clinton is a liar. All politicians are liars to one degree or another. As a previous poster said, the only thing you need to be concerned about is what the policitican in question is lying about.

With Clinton he lied about getting a blowjob to hide it from his wife.

With Bush he lied about Saddam being an imminent threat to hide the general faliure of his war on terror and take out a personal vendetta on Saddam.

He also lied about his preemption doctrine, because it is obvious now.. in light of Kim Jong Il making Bush look like a bitch.. that it was just an arbitrary, once off thing to justify invading Iraq.

In other words, we STILL don't have a coherent foreign policy, nor much of a domestic one either.

Remember how it used to be about a guy named Osama? Probably not, which is the precisely the point.

jas1552

I'll rephrase the question. Is Clinton a liar for saying the following.
"Some day, some way, I guarantee you, he'll use the arsenal."

rooster

Daschle said the same things about Sadaam in 98 like Clinton did. And now he think Sadaam is a great guy and no threat.


It furthur illustrates how the lefts objections to this has mainly to do with partisan politics.

I give credit to guys like Liberman who arent playing those games.

jimmyf

This is sooooooooooooo true, I don't think you know how true. I know they don't have a clue. I like, same with talk radio, they don't get it why so many people listen, don't have a fucking clue.
just watch what they post now

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Gutterboy

Saddam is a threat to Israel, maybe the Kurds, Iran etc. So Clinton was probably right.

When I said Saddam is not a threat, I meant a threat in the only sense that should IMHO be used to justify war.. an imminent threat to the United States.

Despite the fact that Bush and his adminsitration have lied and spun relentlessly over the past year, Saddam is not, and never has been, a threat to the United States.

The breadth of Bush's campaign of deception is easy to see. A recent Gallup poll showed that close to 1/2 of those surveyed believed Saddam had some role in 9/11. Why do they believe that? Hard evidence? There is none. Circumstantial evidence.. hmm.. none of that either. Because they've been fed a steady diet of Bush adminsitration lies and half truths? 'Fraid so.

Don't get me wrong, this war will probably be good for the Iraqi people.. assuming they welcome us "liberating" them.. but its being fought for the wrong reasons.

nuclei

Ummm actually he was saying bush IS a shitty liar. read the context.

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dig420

I am so proud I could bust to belong to the party that educated people prefer. The party that prefers an open court system, seperation of religion and state and believes in an individual's right to privacy.

I am proud that I'm not so gullible that I can be convinced to vote for the party that repeatedly says it wants to put me in jail for what I do, the party that counts David Duke and Pat Robertson and G. Gordon Liddy and Oliver North among it's most prominent members. The party that tells women they can't decide for themselves whether they can have an abortion, the party that is campaigning for secret courts and the 'Patriot' act, the party that wants to be tough on crime and put pot smokers in prison.

The same party where secret degenerates like John Ashhahahahaha wrap themselves in the flag and drape a cloak over Lady Liberty's breast, where they believe in confiscating your car if they find a joint in it because 'the car is guilty of a crime'. The party that wants the right to hold suspects without benefit of representation indefinitely and that wants the right to phone and wiretap everyone without having to ask permission from a Judge and then present the evidence in a secret court. The party of the 'morally upright and holy' who wants to force every kid to stand in lockstep and recite the pledge of allegiance when they're damn well told to. The party that wants to force me to live in a police state based on biblical principles, brought to you by the Moral Majority and the Republicans.

Keep voting for them you Repubs and conservatives, hope you enjoy the confiscated property and cozy little jail cell you'll get for your troubles.

ThunderBalls

Very well said.

FlyingIguana

if he would have said lets go into baghdad and take saddam out of power he would have met the same opposition.

DaDee

The same party where secret degenerates like John Ashhahahahaha wrap themselves in the flag and drape a cloak over Lady Liberty's breast, where they believe in confiscating your car if they find a joint in it because 'the car is guilty of a crime'.

TurboTrucker

I am so proud I could bust to belong to the party that educated people prefer. The party that prefers an open court system, seperation of religion and state and believes in an individual's right to privacy.

- The party that poor people prefer
- The party that thinks people should be able to sue McDonalds because they're fat
- Should individuals have the right to plot attacks against us if they're plotting in privacy?

I am proud that I'm not so gullible that I can be convinced to vote for the party that repeatedly says it wants to put me in jail for what I do, the party that counts David Duke and Pat Robertson and G. Gordon Liddy and Oliver North among it's most prominent members. The party that tells women they can't decide for themselves whether they can have an abortion, the party that is campaigning for secret courts and the 'Patriot' act, the party that wants to be tough on crime and put pot smokers in prison.

- Jail for porn, like that will happen - for one thing it's way too big of a legitimate business
- Jesse Jackson is on your side
- You think women should have the right to murder other individuals - as long as they created them. I do to, it prevents the spread of their moronic genes.


The same party where secret degenerates like John Ashhahahahaha wrap themselves in the flag and drape a cloak over Lady Liberty's breast, where they believe in confiscating your car if they find a joint in it because 'the car is guilty of a crime'. The party that wants the right to hold suspects without benefit of representation indefinitely and that wants the right to phone and wiretap everyone without having to ask permission from a Judge and then present the evidence in a secret court. The party of the 'morally upright and holy' who wants to force every kid to stand in lockstep and recite the pledge of allegiance when they're damn well told to. The party that wants to force me to live in a police state based on biblical principles, brought to you by the Moral Majority and the Republicans.

- I'm all for the legalization of Cannabis
- Nobody is forced to pledge allegance to our country, however if you're not willing to you should get the fuck out of here.

Keep voting for them you Repubs and conservatives, hope you enjoy the confiscated property and cozy little jail cell you'll get for your troubles.

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