President Bush has 213
 

...and Senator Kerry has 175 electorial votes...according to a poll taken since the Republican convention. 270 are required to be elected President.

This is why it doesn't matter if everybody in the country votes for kerry if the electoral college votes bush he's in...Fucked up huh?

I always thought the People vote the president


American Democracy is wired

Yes it does matter...as each states electorial votes go to whoever wins that states popular vote.

The electoral system is actually very wired and complicated.

But from what I understand it can happen that they suddenly vote for the second candidate.

The people do vote for the President via the Electorial College as the electorial votes of a state go to the winner of the popular vote within each state.

bush bush. shave shave bush bush shave shave epic cash shave shave epic cash

thats stupid...
:2 cents:

This has never happened...in our history...to the best of my knowledge. It has only happened twice in our history that the winner of the Presidency lost the national popular vote.

Here are a couple definitions for "Democracy"...


1. The common people, considered as the primary source of political power. [

2. Majority Rule.

3. The principles of social equality and respect for the individual within a community.

No...it is not stupid. If it were not for the Electorial College there would basically be only two population centers that would elect the President. The Electorial College provides a little parity to the less populated States.

What country do you live in...because your statements are not applicable to the USA?

well if a second election is lost because of this, I think we can scrap the whole electoral votes system.. Because it clearly didn't work the way it was supposed to last time.. as Gore had the most votes from the people and the electoral college is supposed to reflect what the people want.

But i always wonder if this is theoretically possible, and if there would be any consequences etc....

I remember the chaos connected with the last election and counting votes.....but if suddenly an electoral vote would go to the second candicate ( assumign this is possible ),m there would be even more chaos.

blah :(

yeah .. That was crazy..

heard some jews voted for a anti jewish party because of a stupid system...

even the 3th world countries have a better election system

:glugglug

Why not just count every vote? and don't sum it to states

You are wrong...the Electorial College worked exactly as it was supposed to. The Electorial College only reflects the popular vote within each state...and does not necessarily reflect the national popular vote...but it has only happened twice in our history that the national popular vote did not reflect the Electorial votes.

yea well that's why it's flawed.. it should allways reflect what the majority of the people want. It didn't last time and may not this time.

Because we are a country of United States and as I have stated if not for the Electorial College...basically only two population centers would elect the President...the Eastern Seaboard and the Western Seaboard...but more specifically New York and California...which would leave 48 states a little more than pissed off.

Read post above.

213 like the Snoop Dogg crew ? :D

I agree. The electoral system is fine - if you don't cheat it and defraud the nation.


Gore would have won Florida if they hadn't committed fraud against the black voters.

I'd bet the fraud wasn't limited just to that state either.


So technically once....

So it's not really a democracy?

To me it's the guy with the most votes wins.

But this way it seems someone can carry most of the populated States, yet with all the lesser populated going against him he loses.

Or do I have it wrong?

213 was the number of Jeffrey Dahmer's apartment.

coincidence?




Yup. heheheh

The accusation of fraud has been made but none have proven it...though some may think they have. An allegation is not proof.

More to the point Al Gore...what ever happened...in Florida would not have been a problem if Al Gore could have won in his home state...which he had represented for most of his adult life. Maybe they knew something that the rest of the country did not know.

well... by definitions a democracy is:


1. Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives.
2. A political or social unit that has such a government.
3. The common people, considered as the primary source of political power.
4. Majority rule.
5. The principles of social equality and respect for the individual within a community.


Some people will try to say that our democracy applies to #1 and #2 (since it clearly doesn't apply to numbers 3, 4, or 5)


But what good is #1 if #4 doesn't apply?


And #2... well... I mean any country can DECLARE they have democracy. They can even repeat it over and over and over 1984 times until people start believing it.

I mean... take Iraqs new democracy for example.

The US has never been a "Democracy"...it is a Democratic Republic...and our Electorial College has served the country well for more than 200 years. Buy a fucking clue...clueless.

It seems to me that a Presidential candidate who does not have the interests of the MAJORITY of his electors is going to start playing to minorities.

Like the religious right.

Stupid must be your middle name.

What worked in 1804, 1904, 1954, 1984 does not necessarily work tomorrow.

You go and buy a clue, idiot.

Run down to the mall and cash your food stamps while you still have them.

The whole democracy as we have it today in the Western World isn't necessarly the best system. It could need some fresh elements. But this is not the point of this thread to discuss democracy in the 21st century here - I will do it in my masters thesis though :1orglaugh

The Electorial College still seves us well. We are a country of United States (50 countries if you will). California has a little different culture/values than New York. New York has a little different culture/values than Texas. Texas has a little different culture/values than Hawaii...etc. etc. Because of the Electorial College each State (Country) has some say as to who is elected President...and not just California and New York. Now go fuck your content wife in her ear...your foreign piece of trash.

you are wrong, it worked exactly like it was set up 2 work.

if you are an american, what were you doing in school, eating the books.

I learned how the electoral college worked and why we have it in something like the 5th grade.

I'm if it had been the other way, Gore won we would not hear a peep out of most of you people.

And I can tell you RAT now it ain't going 2 change, we will have the electoral college for another 250 years.

3-4-and 5 are all applicable. Majority rules with the Electorial College...as the electorial votes go to the majority winner within the State. We are a representative democracy and majority rules within the two houses of Congress...which we the people have elected to represent us. Majority rules within City...and County government as well.

yep

speaking of the moron named Bush.. Kerry is owning him on CNN right now in a live speech..

it's possible, consequences they get rid of the person/persons that has electoral vote/votes but it's 2 late then it's been done. they are elected also

Are you currently working on your Masters...one of my brothers will have his at the end of December. He would have had it at the end of last December but he dropped his classes when he opened a business. He has now sold the business.

this has been answered I believe.
theking post above

you are wrong
your way California and New York would elect our Prez.