You didn't make me an offer... I made you the offer. The offer has been stated many times, it's very simple. I do my part, you do yours. I don't do your part and you don't do mine, processors pay us, we split it all. Very simple.... zero reason for you to twist it.

And 100 joins a day is worth a more than $150k a month. At 30% you're taking a loss of member growth month over month, the average is 50% which is a sustained growth, anything above that is $300k+ a month.

You have said shit about lawyers, legal crap, and changed and twisted this in almost every post from the day I made the offer. The offer still stands, it's not anything anyone on here is confused about - my contact info is below.

They did allow downloads, that's true. Perhaps that means that it falls under the umbrella of counterfeit legally. But they weren't selling the movies to users as far as I can see.

Sorry, you are wrong. Just because your use of a song in a porn video doesn't damage someone economically doesn't mean you can just use it. Plus, there is no way to know exact damages. If I used a Jonas Brothers song in a porn movie, it may not hurt their sales that day, but it could hurt their reputation and cost them endorsements or other things down the road.

Copyright isn't all about protecting lost sales, it is also about protecting the right of the holder to control the use and distribution of it.





Okay, let me end this stupid argument because, honestly, I don't even really know what the fuck you are talking about.

Yes. If you show a company some magic formula and they decide that this gives them the right to now take my traffic and not pay me for yes, they can have it. Yes, I will give them that right. Yes, they can do whatever the fuck they want with it. And I will take my traffic and move on to a different site, one of their competitors and not miss a beat. I grant them any power they want.

Is this ever going to happen? No. Why? It has nothing to do with fair use and everything to do with the market. If a company is able to change their tour and better convert my traffic we both win because we both make more money. They know if they just start taking it and not paying me they will lose 100% of it. So they aren't going to do that and if they do, I move on.

I have seen companies go from thriving to collapsing and closing their doors in a matter of days just because they did something stupid and that action got made public and people pulled their links from them. A company starts taking traffic from its affiliates, fair use or not, they better be ready to go it alone because the affiliates will leave very quickly.






I believe you teach 30 people per week how to use your formula and net 5K per year per student like I believe I have 19 inch cock and walk it on the leash like a dog.

We both know this isn't true.

Just handle it this way. Hire a guy at 60K per year to run all the grunt work for Doc's site. You then only have to teach him how it is done and sometimes check in on him and you still make at least 660K per year. And you get that money for doing nothing but what you already claim you are doing. Show them, watch over them and guide them, cash huge checks. But I think we both know the answer you will give.

You remind me of one of those people who always has a get rich quick plan. You have an idea and you visualize it as this huge thing, but you never get it off the ground because it either doesn't really work how you envision it or you never get past all the details to actually take the first step and make it happen.

the simple response to that is..... then if it wasn't being used as the end result and wasn't a big part of the process then why did they go through the trouble of making sure it was there and using it. Surely if they added the music to the clips they must have thought it would increase their sales or add some value to it. It's not like, opps we caught some back ground music in the video right? it was purposely put there? correct ?

I'm going to end my posting with this. Best of luck RK, honestly... I hope you pull the magic rabbit out of the hat. If you can set some legal standard, this could benefit us as an Industry through the ability to attract a greater market share.

:thumbsup:thumbsup

Sales/revenues are far from 'kicking ass'...I don't know where you got that info from.

All of you may want to read this article about Fair Use from Standford....

http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyrigh...pter9/9-b.html

These are the four elements that RK will be trying to prove, if they let this case go to trial.... It is really their only defense...

The four factors judges consider are:

1.the purpose and character of your use
2.the nature of the copyrighted work
3.the amount and substantiality of the portion taken, and
4.the effect of the use upon the potential market.

This analysis is not an easy one and requires actually knowing case law. Its not intuitive.

You can always use the Vanilla Ice Defense:

“...See, our’s is ding-ding-ding-duh-duh-ding-ding…”

Michael, what does any of that have to do with gideongallery, vcrs on a time machine, and Snow White/Disney? :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

You guys done time shifting yet?

From the statistics... in 2000 they cut the inventory of produced music in half, at it's peak.

Logically it's impossible to sustain growth if you produce half the amount to be sold. The "drop" they calculate is "inventory" sales, it's not total earnings of the Music Industry. Overall the Industry has grown... cd sales have dropped through the floor though - thank god they use don't the tape or 8 track to calculate lots sales, they would be out of business by the books.

As a global Industry, single downloads, mp3 and unique medium purchases are growing at a faster rate than inventory sales are dropping. The "income" difference is the cost of hard goods, such as cd, printing, shipping, store needs. Even for a DJ, the costs are lower now. So overall the "gross income" drops, however the net income per artist has increased.

We have the highest paid singers/groups ever in history right now.... more music being sold ever in history, tons of bands have said they're making more, music artists selling every before in history, more exposure to more music ever before in history.

Saying the Music Industry is hurting means you're only looking at the cd/store sales - which is quickly becoming obsolete.

0%

Its not as big a deal as everyone in this thread thinks

All the people who scream about pirated music. Now someone in the porn industry is getting hit for pirating music. Ironic.

i agreed to teach you what to do and then walk away

you said that was ok as long as what i taught you would produce 100 sales per day.

that was the offer and what was accepted

your exact

we talked about creating a paysite designed to operate within the context of the torrents and the tubes and succeed when the content is shared.

are you going to do all the stuff that would normally get you 100 sales a day. All the tgp submission, all the tube site submission etc

if you were planning to do all that work anyway, i would have to do a thing since you would already have the 100 sales a day yourself.

You want me to replace the sales generated from that with my techniques

common sense says the time that would go to all that stuff should go towards the maintainance of all these new techniques.

But your changing the definition now, so that it is nothing but a standard affiliate agreement

what really stupid is considering that at 100 sales a day level i would earn way more then just 50%.


you trying to change it from a deal i agreed to , to a deal you know makes no sense whatsoever for me to agree to.

I have to ask Why

Ask yourself why you would lie when we can simply post the thread and prove you wrong?

1) It was very clear that I did not and would not be told what you do.
2) I do not need you to teach me how to do a 100 sales a day.
3) I wasn't planning on doing that work, I was planning on doing what I specialize in and that's making programs money.
4) I don't drive traffic through site submissions, nothing was ever talked about me sending any traffic.
5) My job was to create content, build/maintain the site, support, and make it grow so it could support a 100+ sales a day.
6) I only want you to produce sales, the website alone will require me to dedicate help on it. It's not a one man job and it's 7 days a week, 24 hours a day... unlike your end is.

I haven't changed anything, as Robbie and Kane have already pointed out and I'm sure others would as well. The deal was so simple that a child could follow it....

You do your part, I do my part... we split the money, I provide the content and backend. Anyone on this forum can understand that formula, the risk is without question on my side.

This has now reached comical with you..

About as much as One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.

Why what? Why would you lie, why would you twist stupid shit? Here... let me pawn you.

This is the Org offer from me:
http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=212

"Gideon, if you can really produce the sales, I can get us content...

Think you can pump 100 sales a day? I will split 50% of the profits with you and go get us any content you think will rock the house. It will be like putting your current money on 100 lbs of crack.. so let me know.

No affiliates, I have the content connections... it's like 2 million in each of our pockets the first year."


A bit down the page, the deal is very simple to understand and follow... but a note

"I have no need to use whatever it is your doing other than on this Project. I don't actually care what you're doing, not going to ask what you're doing... if you suggest a change, we will put it in, outside of that I have other shit to worry about.

If you need an NDA/No Compete agreement, one can be drafted up for it."



In order of the deal going down:
http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=214
http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=215
http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=217
http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=218
http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=219
http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=220
http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=221

To be clear:
http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=224
"I have no idea what you're talking about... hoopla confuses me.

I will handle all the normal operations as requested, create the site/member areas, hookup the billing, support, maintaining it, etc.. I will supply the content, as stated. Processors are going to make sure we're taken care of and do all that dirty work for us. Sounds like the same shit I deal with every day now.

Your job is provide the traffic/sales, and you asked about suggesting some changes, and a domain, plus 15% of the gross off the top. If you need to change the content for your promotions that's fine.

This isn't really anything new, lots of various people do this in the Industry. We have what each other needs, so to me this is like slap head stupid to not do."

.......

Later we brought it up to 50% split... and I agreed.






Any questions?

post the thread i am not lying i quoted your statements directly from that thread



first off what you are saying make no sense

your saying that the sites you build just magically get traffic with no traffic generation

you build sites to 100 sales a day without doing anything to generate traffic.

second

if i tell you to add a private tracker to the site offering

i show you how to setup it up properly

alll the stuff to get that working/intergrated with your existing systems would clearly be backend stuff (and therefore your responsiblity)

if i teach you how to change your content (post and pre production) that would fall under content (again therefore your responsiblity)


doing the basic seo on the site/ submitting it to review sites, building gallery etc all backend stuff.


that the point of this arguement

your now trying to push that work on me.

interesting how you deliberately buried the important part


Quote:
Originally Posted by gideongallery
You would need to produce 100ish sales a day, if you feel you can change a few things and walk away, then sweet...

how exactly can i show you and walk away which you agreed to if backend opperations like maintaining the private tracker, etc are now my responsiblity.

When you read what he wrote in its original context it is pretty simple to understand. What he means is that if you can set up a system that works on autopilot and can still send 100 joins per day you can walk away from it and let it run.

There was never any indication on Doc's part that he wanted you to teach him anything. He has always maintained that he wanted to set the site up and handle the day to day operation of the site and your job would be to use your magic techniques to deliver the traffic.

You are like a con man or something?

You forgot the rest of "your" quote...


It's if the issues you listed above are taken care of... One of which is "you would have to handle all the normal opperations etc " - It was made very clear I wouldn't need or care to know anything you're doing.. http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=218


Btw... I wrote this part, not you... Meaning "You, Gideon" will have to produce the 100 sales a day.

No place does it say "I" will produce 100 sales a day.... and it was made very clear above "from you" that I would: "you would have to handle all the normal opperations etc "

Source: http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=214
Source Reply: http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=215

Notice, I don't need to know what you're doing is down the page as we planned it all out
Source: http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=218 <-- post count

That's absolutely not true. That's only what it SEEMS...

GideonGallery....everyone that read those threads KNOWS what you said you could do.

And now when someone offers it to you on a platter...you suddenly CAN NOT.

It's obvious that the reality is...YOU ARE FULL OF SHIT AND CAN'T DO IT.

You have been called out and PROVEN to be a liar. Your ridiculous twisting and turning of words has made you a joke. :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

But of course, everyone of us on GFY already knew that ahead of time.

WE are the experts at selling things online. YOU are the guy who has NEVER sold anything.

LMAO...the Vanilla Defense...too fuckin' funny (I laughed back then as well, that's why this is so fuckin' funny)!

I laughed at this too. I will never forget the interview with Vanilla Ice watching him try to justify that the music was not copied. It was priceless.

all five of the things i said would solve the problem were operational things

1. doing water marks correctly (post production editing)
2. doing branding bugs (post production editing)
3. setting up a private tracker (day to day operations)
4. product placement (pre production)
5. live interaction done properly (day to day operation)


you said you would handle ALL normal operations period.


the new system once implemented will generate the 100 sales a day, that my commitment

but you would still have to do the opperational maintance on that system.

Your now trying to change the rules to make me responsible for opperational aspects you explictly agreed to handle.

planning out a nash equilibrium is not easy, it is a perfectly balancing of all the actions of every party (customers, competitors, free loaders, "pirates", fair use advocates, guys who just want it free, etc) to create a situation where you can naturally profit from the system itself.

the nice thing is once the planning is done, as long as you follow the plan, market itself creates the success, and every competitive advanatage the other parties has, turns into your competitive advantage (either because your move turn it into a disadvantage, or you get to exploit it for free too).

exactly, and now your trying to misrepresent what i said

everything i have ever talked about is systematic changes

how many times have i pointed out that movie studioes didn't get revenue from vcr sales, or tape cassette sales

they made the money by changing their opperation to sell their shit on the tape cassettes.

The operational change, and all the operational maintance for that new market, created more revenue than all the other revenue streams combined.

same thing here


that like saying we should go in the soda pop selling business, you sell them the coke syrup by spoon, they eat it , and then they can buy the carbinated water from me.

that business won't work, admitting it won't work doesn't mean that it is impossible to go into the soda selling business if it was done properly.


i still stand 100% what i agreed to do

i will show doc exactly the systematic changes necessary (the put your shit on the cassettes and sell it solution) he maintains it (handles all the day to day operations). I commit to show him all the building blocks until a system that generates 100 sales a day is created, we split the money 50/50.

Why do you try to quote things or write things that weren't 'ever' said? It was very simple, I would supply the content, build the sites, maintain the program, which would include processing the content 'for a website'. We already do water marks correctly and it's not possible to have a branding bug when it's only a site.

You will be supplying sales... a private tracker wont help me produce anything, but it will help you produce sales. That's content you will manipulate, not us.

If you want to supply people that will pay for product placement, then sure that will be added in with a 50% split to me. I won't be adding a sales staff for this being that it couldn't pay for one. At that, nobody said we would shoot new/exclusive content - why would you need that when nobody on the torrent has seen the other stuff - I clearly said get us content, but I guess I can pull this rabbit out of my hat if really needed.

If you want to supply models for live interaction, and manage them, pay them, manage the live network and equip and all that, then I agree with you that we should do it.

All your posts are, are excuses that allow you to back of the deal - anything for you to back out. That's what it boils down to, that's all everyone sees... we all know you're a fake - you can stop pretending now.

what the hell are you talking about every single time i ever talked about solution to the problem i listed those five things

1. doing watermarks correctly
2. doing branding bugs
3. doing live interaction
4. setting up a private tracker properly
5. product placement.

i have never talked about another thing as a solution to the problem.


your doing watermarking like 1970 television which is most certainly wrong.

setting up a private tracker PROPERLY takes a hell of a lot more then just slapping the script up on the internet.

some of the things you need to do REQUIRE copyright control. (in a blind case like you want to setup where no training is provided, that means copyright ownership)

sort of hard to do product placement if you can't control how the products are placed in the video.


wording is a little unclear
it seems like your trying to say that you want to pay me less then i would get as a normal affiliate (100/day would get a good whale bonus) and you want me to cover the cost of doing live chat that is pretty much standard in every single paysite on the market today out of that commission.

WTF.


your the one trying to re-write the deal.

hell look at your statement for live interaction, how the fuck would you ever believe that making me pay for and manage a component that exist in virtually every single pay site on the market when you agreed to manage all the opperations not represent a complete re-write of the deal.

gideongallery, first off you are lying through your teeth. All anybody has to do is read those threads.

Second...the quote above just shows that you don't have ANY idea how the adult business works.

Let me "train" you, and this won't even cost you $5,000 plus 10% of your LIFETIME revenue.

THE ONLY PAY SITES THAT HAVE LIVE INTERACTION ARE SOLO GIRL SITES. YOU DUMBASS.

Fuck, does that guy gideongallery ever shut up? He's like half this thread. I skip over all his posts.

http://tour.naughtyamerica.com/live_...NTkuMC4wLjAuMA

you were saying

That is ONE site who hires those same girls over and over and over. They are trying there best to do anything to make sales. But unfortunately it isn't working.

You know damn well what I'm saying about paysites. 99.9% of them are sites that shoot girls, pay the girls, and move on. You normally can't get those girls to do live cam chat for the site. Naughty America is paying those girls in the hopes of getting more sales.

But as a long time affiliate (I've been with them since they were "SoCal Cash") I can tell you that ever since their scenes started being pirated a couple of years ago I've watched sales to their sites drop to nothing.

And that's a goddamn shame because they are one of the best companies out there and are shooting some of the best content in the world.

I used to make sales with them like breathing the air. Now I can't. Why? Because within an HOUR of them releasing new updates in their members areas...it is all over pornbb where to go download them.

Anyway, gideongallery...YOUR statement was that: "virtually every single pay site on the market" had live interaction. You found ONE. And there may be a couple of more. But that's it. Other than solo girl sites where the girl has some reason to do the live cam shows...it doesn't happen.

So you're now saying that your "training" would be useless for sites like Twistys, or any of the Nasty Dollars or Brazzers or pretty much EVERY site in the world because it won't have one of your 5 things?

I wonder if gideongallery has told those poor suckers....er, I mean BANDS... that he CLAIMS to have stolen...er, I mean charged...$5,000 plus a percentage of their lifetime earnings that he would have no problem with paysites using their music without their permission AND not paying for it either.

Gee, I wonder how those bands would feel about that? (if they existed anywhere other than gideongalleries delusional mind)

welivetogether has had a chat with the girls who were just shot, since i started posting here

twistys had chats inside

fuckafan

and so on and so on

it not just one it a growing trend, they are almost doing it right.

just like your almost doing it right with cm.

problem is almost doesn't count.

this case has nothing to do with payment

the complaint specifically says they would not licience it to a porn site at all

this is only about permission.

that being said, when you licience your content in a fair use friendly way, without permission is impossible.

Idiot. lol

What do you mean twisty had "chats inside"?

Twisty hires photogs to shoot all their content. They don't even go to a porn shoot much less have the girls hanging out to stream them.
fuckafan...We been doing that on Claudia-Marie.Com since we opened the doors.

And you're right it is a "growing trend" But NOT for sites that don't have the girls there to do live interaction.

You are so ignorant of everything in this world. And I'm your worst nightmare come true.

I protect our content...and we DO live interaction and have been for a long time. And guess what gideongallery...Claudia-Marie.Com is bigger and better than ever while others are falling.

I'm doing the exact OPPOSITE of what you are trying to convince others to do. And it's working beautifully.

Meanwhile your bullshit can't even get off the ground because YOU WON'T EVEN EMAIL THEDOC TO GET IT STARTED! :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh :1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Fucking loser.

WTF????

You really ARE retarded aren't you?

Tick tock gideongallery. Your time is up.

i did email doc, he "claimed" he never recieved

which makes sense given how he has changed the deal. (trying to turn it into a really bad affiliate deal)

your a big time affiliate player, how many programs that you send 100 sales a day only pay you 50%.