B2B cross sells via 3rd Party IPSP not allowed? - GoFuckYourself.com

PR_Dave · 05-03-2010, 06:06 PM

B2B cross sells via 3rd Party IPSP not allowed?

That is the rumor of the day.

Anyone want to confirm or deny this?

Shoplifter · 05-03-2010, 06:16 PM

Makes sense as the sales would have a different descriptor even at the same IPSP.

WiredGuy · 05-03-2010, 06:18 PM

I thought within the same IPSP you were allowed?
WG

Shap · 05-03-2010, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shoplifter

Makes sense as the sales would have a different descriptor even at the same IPSP.

The big difference is no information is being passed along. CCBill charges client A for site #1 and site #2. Site 1 and 2 never get the CC information. The descriptor isn't the problem that bugs visa as much as the information being passed around (from my understanding).

Shap · 05-03-2010, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WiredGuy

I thought within the same IPSP you were allowed?
WG

What Dave is saying is that he heard that is coming to an end.

Dave how good of a source did you get this from?

PR_Dave · 05-03-2010, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shap

Dave how good of a source did you get this from?

Is this a good enough source?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Netbilling

Actually - the rule change effects IPSPs I was told by Visa as the card number is supposed to now be re-entered for the Xsell because 2 sponsored merchants are considered 2 separate entities even though they are under the same merchant account.

Shap · 05-03-2010, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PR_Dave

Is this a good enough source?

Interesting. If I'm understanding it correctly does that mean if you want to xsell to yourself they have to enter in the info twice?

dropped9 · 05-03-2010, 06:43 PM

This is going to get interesting thats for sure... Can we say goodbye to high payouts?

kristin · 05-03-2010, 06:44 PM

I started bringing xsales in-house, including 3rd party.

If this has any merit, I'm ready.

kristin · 05-03-2010, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shap

Interesting. If I'm understanding it correctly does that mean if you want to xsell to yourself they have to enter in the info twice?

According to what Mitch said, no because it would be one entity.

DimeCash · 05-03-2010, 07:05 PM

Time for more consolidation to solve this problem

PR_Dave · 05-03-2010, 08:20 PM

Any 3rd party processors willing to address this rumor?

GTS Mark · 05-03-2010, 08:53 PM

https://youtube.com/watch?v=slPAiGyX61s

NETbilling · 05-04-2010, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shap

Interesting. If I'm understanding it correctly does that mean if you want to xsell to yourself they have to enter in the info twice?

Xselling to yourself is the same entity so it does not fall into the same rule.

I was told straight from Visa about the new rule, which effects IPSPs and individual merchants alike. Enforcement may be something else. I am just going by what I was told directly.

WiredGuy · 05-04-2010, 12:10 AM

If you're x-selling to yourself, will you be required to re-enter the credit card info or is that only when x-selling to other merchants on the same IPSP?
WG

FrozenJag · 05-04-2010, 01:36 AM

The way I understand it is you can cross to yourself but you cannot cross to another company even if you are both using the same third party processor like ccbill, epoch, etc.

Which is different then we were thinking was going to be the case last week. A possible solution was to go back to third party processing from your own merchant accounts so that it would all be under 1 roof per say even though the program owners may be different. The addition to this rule would shoot that all to hell though.

You truly only could cross to yourself then unless doing the reentering of cc data.

Interesting. When does this go into affect?

SweetT · 05-04-2010, 06:33 AM

How long do you think it is going to take before Sponsor A and Sponsor B get together and form a corporation in which each owns 50%. Sponsor A brings 5 totally built out sites and content to the partnership, while Sponsor B does the same. The new entity gets its own Merchant Account to process transactions and the new entity xsells between the 10 sites and Sponsor A and Sponsor B split the revenues from the company 50/50.

Seems easy enough to me.

--T

seeandsee · 05-04-2010, 06:36 AM

they will find a way

quantum-x · 05-04-2010, 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SweetT

How long do you think it is going to take before Sponsor A and Sponsor B get together and form a corporation in which each owns 50%. Sponsor A brings 5 totally built out sites and content to the partnership, while Sponsor B does the same. The new entity gets its own Merchant Account to process transactions and the new entity xsells between the 10 sites and Sponsor A and Sponsor B split the revenues from the company 50/50.

Seems easy enough to me.

--T

Perhaps you've not plunged into these murky waters before...

Wizzo · 05-04-2010, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quantum-x

Perhaps you've not plunged into these murky waters before...

...Sweet T knows these waters better than most...

TheGrapevine · 05-04-2010, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SweetT

How long do you think it is going to take before Sponsor A and Sponsor B get together and form a corporation in which each owns 50%. Sponsor A brings 5 totally built out sites and content to the partnership, while Sponsor B does the same. The new entity gets its own Merchant Account to process transactions and the new entity xsells between the 10 sites and Sponsor A and Sponsor B split the revenues from the company 50/50.

Seems easy enough to me.

--T

Like herding cats!

SweetT · 05-04-2010, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quantum-x

Perhaps you've not plunged into these murky waters before...

It was just an observation...I have not ever sold or bought one single cross sale.

--T

SweetT · 05-04-2010, 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGrapevine

Like herding cats!

Wow....7 posts in 5+ years and I get the honor of being the one for 2010...and based on your post you know me so this is cool on multiple levels ;)

--T

Phoenix · 05-04-2010, 06:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SweetT

How long do you think it is going to take before Sponsor A and Sponsor B get together and form a corporation in which each owns 50%. Sponsor A brings 5 totally built out sites and content to the partnership, while Sponsor B does the same. The new entity gets its own Merchant Account to process transactions and the new entity xsells between the 10 sites and Sponsor A and Sponsor B split the revenues from the company 50/50.

Seems easy enough to me.

--T

i think they can do the same thing..but they dont need to share with anyone else.

just make separate members areas....full complete members areas...that you would actually want to belong to...and wham..you have multiple viable products to sell and cross sell..and rebill with

having one massive members area always seemed like a waste to me

have 4 massive member areas

troncarver · 05-04-2010, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wizzo

...Sweet T knows these waters better than most...

Quote:

Originally Posted by SweetT

It was just an observation...I have not ever sold or bought one single cross sale.

--T

obv not lol

SweetT · 05-04-2010, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by troncarver

obv not lol

The only "obv" thing here is that you have no idea what you are talking about. LOL!

--T

Shap · 05-04-2010, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SweetT

How long do you think it is going to take before Sponsor A and Sponsor B get together and form a corporation in which each owns 50%. Sponsor A brings 5 totally built out sites and content to the partnership, while Sponsor B does the same. The new entity gets its own Merchant Account to process transactions and the new entity xsells between the 10 sites and Sponsor A and Sponsor B split the revenues from the company 50/50.

Seems easy enough to me.

--T

People started something along these lines a year or 2 ago. It's a decent work around.

NETbilling · 05-04-2010, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WiredGuy

If you're x-selling to yourself, will you be required to re-enter the credit card info or is that only when x-selling to other merchants on the same IPSP?
WG

If you are cross-selling to yourself, the customer does not have to re-enter the card info.

NinjaSteve · 05-04-2010, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NetBilling

If you are cross-selling to yourself, the customer does not have to re-enter the card info.

That's good to know.

As for "Sponsor A and Sponsor B get together and form a corporation" - To me it sounds like Sponsor A could just cross sell to itself and use another members area without the hassle of forming a partnership with Sponsor B.

Phoenix · 05-04-2010, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NetBilling

If you are cross-selling to yourself, the customer does not have to re-enter the card info.

party on wayne

party on garth

NinjaSteve · 05-04-2010, 09:14 AM

Xbiz says "It said that 35 million consumers have paid $1.4 billion for such marketing offers. "

I wonder if this will affect Visa in a positive way or reduce profits from the processing and other fees like chargebacks.

SCORE Ralph · 05-04-2010, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kristin

I started bringing xsales in-house, including 3rd party.

If this has any merit, I'm ready.

We're on the same brain wave.

kristin · 05-04-2010, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shap

People started something along these lines a year or 2 ago. It's a decent work around.

My thought was that one would be able to do xsales with other companies by using a whitelabel and masked domain.

kristin · 05-04-2010, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NinjaSteve

That's good to know.

As for "Sponsor A and Sponsor B get together and form a corporation" - To me it sounds like Sponsor A could just cross sell to itself and use another members area without the hassle of forming a partnership with Sponsor B.

You have to be careful with credits/chargebacks if you put all xsales coming to you ... that's why many send off to other companies.

MrDeiz · 05-04-2010, 10:14 AM

i've asked it over here
http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showpo...8&postcount=16

Quote:

Originally Posted by daizzzy

was 1 of those variants i thought about and hi five for being ironic

then how you maintain cb ratio w/o rotating very big # of merchants on those x-sells? or that's some trick sobv gateway does for you and it works in terms of profitability on a huge scale only? does it mean any program can run the same x-sells by using your platform?

just checked a few of others aggressive x-sellers and they have dropped that thing. you kinda the last warrior with that. congrats i guess

gleem · 05-04-2010, 10:18 AM

of course it's gonna be you have to have the same descriptor to do any x-sell or upgrades with no card re-entry, this is their goal, I spoke to Visa CFO today, and he told me so.

Rand · 05-04-2010, 12:34 PM

The Visa rule applies to those who transfer data from one merchant to another. IF an IPSP were to do this, then yes, IPSPs are not immune to the rule and they would be in violation.

If you have any questions about your account with Epoch and how you may or may not be affected, please contact your sales representative or write to [email protected].

.

iSpyCams · 05-04-2010, 01:04 PM

So basically this affects operations that offer all the fliexibility like Netbilling because they are basically a gateway for your private merchant account but not Epoch, Segpay or CCBill, because they use their own merchant account and let you charge memberships on it?

05-03-2010, 06:18 PM	#3
WiredGuy Pounding Googlebot Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 34,469	I thought within the same IPSP you were allowed? WG __________________ I play with Google.

05-03-2010, 06:44 PM	#9
kristin GOO! Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Back Home : ) Posts: 9,768	I started bringing xsales in-house, including 3rd party. If this has any merit, I'm ready. __________________ Vacares rules. "Usually only fat guys have the kind of knowledge and ability that Kristin has."

05-03-2010, 07:05 PM	#11
DimeCash Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Costa Rica Posts: 118	Time for more consolidation to solve this problem __________________ [email protected]

05-03-2010, 08:20 PM	#12
PR_Dave Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Italy Posts: 2,792	Any 3rd party processors willing to address this rumor? __________________ www.PIMPROLL.com

05-04-2010, 12:10 AM	#15
WiredGuy Pounding Googlebot Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 34,469	If you're x-selling to yourself, will you be required to re-enter the credit card info or is that only when x-selling to other merchants on the same IPSP? WG __________________ I play with Google.

05-03-2010, 06:06 PM	#1
PR_Dave Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Italy Posts: 2,792	B2B cross sells via 3rd Party IPSP not allowed? B2B cross sells via 3rd Party IPSP not allowed? That is the rumor of the day. Anyone want to confirm or deny this? __________________ www.PIMPROLL.com

05-03-2010, 06:16 PM	#2
Shoplifter Richest man in Babylon Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Posts: 10,002 Posts: 5,704	Makes sense as the sales would have a different descriptor even at the same IPSP.

05-03-2010, 06:43 PM	#8
dropped9 Registered User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Your moms box Posts: 26,727	This is going to get interesting thats for sure... Can we say goodbye to high payouts?

05-03-2010, 08:53 PM	#13
GTS Mark Vrume Mark Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 20,912	https://youtube.com/watch?v=slPAiGyX61s

05-04-2010, 01:36 AM	#16
FrozenJag Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 1,763	The way I understand it is you can cross to yourself but you cannot cross to another company even if you are both using the same third party processor like ccbill, epoch, etc. Which is different then we were thinking was going to be the case last week. A possible solution was to go back to third party processing from your own merchant accounts so that it would all be under 1 roof per say even though the program owners may be different. The addition to this rule would shoot that all to hell though. You truly only could cross to yourself then unless doing the reentering of cc data. Interesting. When does this go into affect? Last edited by FrozenJag; 05-04-2010 at 01:39 AM..

05-04-2010, 06:33 AM	#17
SweetT Shank-A-Potamus Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Atlanta, Georgia USA Posts: 1,756	How long do you think it is going to take before Sponsor A and Sponsor B get together and form a corporation in which each owns 50%. Sponsor A brings 5 totally built out sites and content to the partnership, while Sponsor B does the same. The new entity gets its own Merchant Account to process transactions and the new entity xsells between the 10 sites and Sponsor A and Sponsor B split the revenues from the company 50/50. Seems easy enough to me. --T

05-04-2010, 06:36 AM	#18
seeandsee Check SIG! Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Europe (Skype: gojkoas) Posts: 50,945	they will find a way __________________ BUY MY SIG - 50$/Year Contact here

05-04-2010, 09:14 AM	#31
NinjaSteve Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 11,089	Xbiz says "It said that 35 million consumers have paid $1.4 billion for such marketing offers. " I wonder if this will affect Visa in a positive way or reduce profits from the processing and other fees like chargebacks. __________________ ...

05-04-2010, 10:18 AM	#36
gleem Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Sunny Land Posts: 5,593	of course it's gonna be you have to have the same descriptor to do any x-sell or upgrades with no card re-entry, this is their goal, I spoke to Visa CFO today, and he told me so. __________________ Contact me: \\// E: webmaster /at/ unprofessional.com

05-04-2010, 12:34 PM	#37
Rand Industry Vet Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Santa Monica, CA Posts: 2,663	The Visa rule applies to those who transfer data from one merchant to another. IF an IPSP were to do this, then yes, IPSPs are not immune to the rule and they would be in violation. If you have any questions about your account with Epoch and how you may or may not be affected, please contact your sales representative or write to [email protected]. . __________________ -- Rand Payment Industry - Communications - Quality Assurance Last edited by Rand; 05-04-2010 at 12:41 PM..

05-04-2010, 01:04 PM	#38
iSpyCams Amateur Gynecologist Industry Role: Join Date: May 2009 Location: Medellin Posts: 4,436	So basically this affects operations that offer all the fliexibility like Netbilling because they are basically a gateway for your private merchant account but not Epoch, Segpay or CCBill, because they use their own merchant account and let you charge memberships on it?