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Someone fucked up when they entered the new markets, how can a piece of software cost MORE here than in US if the purchasing power is say 3 - 5 times lower? That's a million dollar question that costs those headquarters idiots BILLIONS a year on unrecoverable losses! You folks would probably be surprised, practically only government and big corporations even pay for software or ANYTHING here! The households - I would expect the piracy to be at around 97 pct. I'm talking about software, music, movies - anything that you can pirate - well movies that changed during the last year, and here is why: Now they bought cheap dvd licenses for the region and are popping dvd's for 3 bucks a piece - they immediately sell 10 000 - 50 000 units per title (for popular movies) on a 10 mil. market! Well it took them only 20 years to figure out, that you can't sell in a shit country, where everyone is poor and a smart ass for the same price as in a real country! |
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The question is - what do we want? More control over the internet? Less control over the internet? There are a few now, that are benefiting from the chaos and fucking anyone who's playing "by the rules" in the ass and many are then "hurting" and screaming for regulation. But the flip side of the coin is, what will happen if there will be more regulation? Do we want to get to the same state as in Germany? Where even if you play by their "rules" if they (be it whoever, state, government, someone who knows them) decide to shut you down, they'll almost certainly be able to shut you down? My solution, in principle, would be to organize a crusade and push hard on anyone who's offering services to those motherfuckers. But then again? Who has the balls, who has the morals, who has the dedication to do this? Who will not want to burn the bridges if he would want to join the dark side someday? |
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I'll actually do it once I'll have all the promos up, why should I fucking care? |
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What everyone has been saying for years is the affiliate model was going to go away, no one knew exactly when or how but we all knew it would eventually go away.
Welcome to that day, the affiliate model is dying a quick painful death. Programs have built up their traffic networks to a point they just dont need affiliates anymore. Im so glad i saw this coming and got diversified and more heavily into the mainstream and social media. It was a great run, but if you make your living just being an adult affiliate your going ot have to rethink your strategy. |
Been in the adult industry since 1982 and the business has evolved continually from magazines to VHS to DVD to web. The problem is that it got to the web and stopped to evolve for a lot of people and now those people are starting to suffer.
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Also, try to buy a free site these days, what will be the price? One third of what it would be one year ago? And what guarantee you'll actually have that the trend that the traffic is lowering will not continue for years to come? What now? You want to put out your whole members area on your own tube site to upsell a couple bucks to dating? Cause that's the only way you can do if you compete with full length bullshit and say you market the GENERAL stuff. Is this the evolution? I call this devolution and an epochal fail, Idiots used to make money, good money Unfortunately, technology enabled those idiots to steal from other idiots in more volume than ever, and to kick their own asses by completely devaluating the traffic pool. And that's what happens now. Some might still keep their eyes closed, some might be doing good money if they are niche targeted and diversified etc. But I doubt anyone can deny this general trend. |
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Well, wasn't the whole past evolution actually all kinds of various distribution models based on the model of "tease and get them to pay"? Who are we teasing now? |
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But it's bullshit, you can't do 5 dollar porn, they don't give a fuck if they can fuck you for 5 dollars or 30 dollars, they just don't give a fuck unless it's not something they won't find for free or something they want, which, and I don't want to cause you any more health problems, but your teenie content is cool and professional and nice models and everything, but it's definitely not unique. You also have your fixed bandwith costs etc., someone has to update this, someone has to keep an eye about every aspect, you have to keep an eye on billers if they don't fuck you over, you need to SOMEHOW get traffic (and I would be interested what would be your plan for 5 bucks sites). ... You want to do some profit margins, you don't want to devaluate your business or even your other assets. Since you talk about your stuff, allow me [B]to talk about my business, and yes it's MINE business, because I spent YEARS of my life, from the first day since I applied for the job to the investor, since I went through all the promotions and get rid of all the people that stood in the way to make this work, I spend YEARS to make this something that doesn't have a direct competition worldwide (I sure hope I'll make a dime while everything is finally tested and proven and I'll do a huge one man marketing offensive soon). BUT, LET'S GET BACK TO THE POINT: I know I COULDN'T get below 39.95 USD with bigsisterlive.com, cause I'm offering VALUE for the MONEY! Do the simple maths, we're paying every single week: - livecam girls to chat with the members, a fixed cost - the club, the waitress, security, the pool cleaning, the fucking bathtub, an administrative fat ass who cares so the drinks for the bar are in place, the cleaning service,the electriciity so a couple idiots from Italy or anywhere else can get free sex in front of the cams and fail in a live broadcast - the club, the waitress, security, the pool cleaning, the cleaning service, the fucking bathtub, an administrative fat ass, who cares so the drinks for the bar are in place, the electriciity so a couple horny couples can get drunk and a buffet for free and fuck each other each Saturday in a live broadcast - security, the pool cleaning, the cleaning service, the fucking bathtub, an administrative fat ass, who cares so the drinks for the bar are in place, the electricity so a couple horny couples can shoot their own sex DVD and fuck each other each Sunday in a live broadcast - we're building a new studio now where we will be able to syndicate hardcore real people shows with cam providers - the whole start up investition into the real estate, location, straemintg setup, hardware, proprietary cam control soltion in 2004 was 5M EUR (I was not with the company, and I'm also not saying, that, with the experience I have now that it wouldn'e be possible to notably cut it) - the result is over 9000 exclusive videos so far for the members (ok say 1 500 of it is exceptional and the rest is just archived voyeur stuff with real pople for the fans of particular girls or etc,) - a minimum of 32 hours of exclusive live hardcore content with real people INCLUDED in the membership, we have at least 15 - 20 couples in the house over each day of the weekend - on top of that we DO update weekly 4 exclusive updates of never before seen fun, swingers, real couples stuff, shit that's NOT on the web because no one ever invested so much to do something this risky plue a couple recorded live streams from each day of live broadcast so they can watch something if they missed it - Renting also additional feeds next week - If I'm gonna update 5 more video updates every week, I'll have enough additional updates for 120 weeks to come, if you want a referal I'll give you the company name - Renting also additional live feeds next week - an access to additional hardcore shows, especially for the US members and their timezone, those are the single most growing group among the members, loyal and without a hassle (as opposed to Germans that will ALWAYS bitch) - plus two actual real support people who are on webcam over the broadcast time to talk with the members and do news and announcements etc. I know I'll most probably get rid one of them as she's fuckin up a lot lately and every not timely or silly response fucks with the members confidence and you're on a way for them to cancel We're paying FOR ALL OF THIS to get the PRODUCT - and that's what I do - I offer a VALUE and I want THEIR MONEY! What should be wrong with that? I want them to realize all the great things they get, and I want them to fill in that fucking join form, I want them to pull out the damn credit card and to hit the submit button! Sorry, I'm not EVER going to lower the price of the membership. |
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The affiliate model will not die, it will evolve though. More and more sponsors will realise the present business model and payments can not work in the future. The pot is getting smaller whether affiliates like it or not. Money can be spent on them sending traffic to sites with falling ratios, but the end of that line can be bankruptcy. What I think will happen is affiliates will need to become more independent and look after themselves. The days of having a team supporting them are not over, not for every site, but it's getting close. This is I'm sure general and what many sponsors have said to me. The guys that need the least support, hear from the least and are the least trouble. SEND THE MOST JOINS. Today a sponsor can spend money on the traffic or the site. One leads to more traffic, the other should lead to more sign ups. Where would people here spend the money? |
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We all think we offer great value for money. Problem is it's what the customers think that matters. $5 for 1-2 days might appeal to a lot more and if the site is as good as you say they will upgrade if they want 30 days. You have to believe and agree with that. Or are you scared these guys won't upgrade? I run trials and not worried about them upgrading. With all what you're offering I'm sure they would upgrade as well. Only reason not to is they don't need the other 28 days because they won't be able to view or they don't think it's worth viewing. In todays market the guys who buy trials don't buy anything else, sites that don't offer them don't get their business. There are enough sites that do. Even though yours is a unique product. The $5 porn site idea was something my CMS could not handle, it was built to run the content stores and adapted to run one paysite. Your question about how would I of got traffic at $5 a join is interesting. Are you saying affiliates demand we charge $39.95 or just that the cost of getting the traffic means you have to charge $39.95? What ever you say is right it says more than you know and shows how Tubes operate and able to give away content. They don't have those costs. Maybe so long as we do have those costs we will always be competition to us. |
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Once I will know exactly what every customer wants. They have there a trial - a 7 day trial so they can see the whole program before deciding if to cancel or not - and it works so far. Quote:
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So if you would pay me $ 2,50 net per each sign up I would need to make 8 sign ups at an average ratio of 1:125. Can be done? Sure, but I would pull the links once the ratio would decline. How much would YOU make? Would you also leave the money from rebills on the table? Talk about the opportunity cost. Quote:
For the rest cares the DMCA. And they have sponsors, who wire them money on their account every month, so they can steal traffic to send to them. Traffic, that was also probably marketed in a legit way before, it's yours traffic, it's my traffic, it's our traffic, it's traffic we owned, but it's gone now. It's practically financing a a third perty to do a theft for you, I don't see how was no one ever able to put one and one together yet. Maybe lawyers are too expensive? May be.. |
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Evolution should mean more advancement, more effectiveness, more advanced technology, better know how, making more with less. Who evolves? The surfer - SURE - he gets more porn for less than ever The marketers - NO WAY - they get less money for more porn offered than ever They devolve, they fucked up the traffic pool forever, it's not tease and pay anymore, it's make them tired of jerking off and hope you sell them something during their 50th visit, when they already burned $10 bucks worth of your bandwith. Again, I'm talking about the general niche here. You can always make bank if you target the right audience with the right product without an overload of free substitute around. But the general niche has no direction available to evolve anymore. |
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No you are offering them 7 days for $12 so you are offering them an option and after testing it you found this one works the best. I stopped reading pass there because you seem to agree with me about giving the surfers options. |
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No ... No and .... No !! I look at the previews to all these new sites and cringe. What should I expect my surfers to do? I know my income would triple if I just had some good stuff to promote and there is VERY little out there. I know because I scour the net everyday looking for a new gem. Haven't found one in over 18 months. :) |
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I am not one of those Paul Markham haters but I don't really understand some of his usual points.
Today it doesn't matter that much if the price is $5 or $30. First of all, 99% of porn surfers can be satisfied with the content freely availably on tubes. Second, those remaining 1% might be scared to join pornsites because of things like: * hidden cross sales * afraid of being rebilled or having difficulty to cancel * not finding inside the members area what it promisses... or one of the old reasons -*wife reading the CC statement.... or.. * being afraid to be spammed to death (lots of people use one main e-mail address, don't have 5 different ones, and don't feel like creating one just for joining a pornsite) etc... lack of innovation in porn (reality sites are played out since a long time) and bad economy obviously have an effect as well, but the effect of economy is not that big as some people would hope it is..... |
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And here's the only GOOD point about the illegal tube sites. Well, these people can't pay, so - practically, the whole free porn explosion is the new age sexual revolution in the third world! We've brought porn to the third world countries! How does sex look like outside of the orthodox school books or National Geographic? Now everyone can watch how people fuck in Los Angeles and how Donny Long handles a hermaphrodite, stone cold and with glance and style! Jerking off became the universal language of the new millenium! :winkwink: |
Guerilla Traffic's overall business has increased over the past two years. We have already surpassed last years numbers and it isn't even April yet. I think the 4 million unemployed people and the huge influx of new affiliates on the market have helped our business. There's more people on the internet every day, therefore this is more traffic. You just need to know how to get it.
Now conversation rates are a different story....... Battle Me |
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In other words, with this strategy - it's more and more traffic attracted and retained at places, where you can't really exploit its entire potential anymore. |
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Again, someone is banking on something he doesn't (or does?) have rights to bank on It's like someone could steal your purse in a certain part of the city and unless you would notify him with what exactly he stole in a written letter, he shouldn't get it back to you, and he can use all what he stole to you, it wouldn't matter who's the owner and how many people he robs Is this the legislation that should be taken seriously? |
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How people search for porn has changed. it's now all social networking & u tube type sites that attract the surfers. They bookmark these sites because they give away so much for free. After a while though these same surfers do test out the links to the paysites however no where near as much as they used to.
With mgp everything was free however you only got a small poor quality sample and 8 of the 10 times you would click on a link you would get traded to another mpg or free site so they surfer go upset and joined a paysite because the quality was better and they did not get jerked around.. |
Because a lot of us are geeks, we don't realize how big of a deal a tube site is. Torrents have more stuff etc but most people can't and won't use them but a tube is easy. Your 50 year old American with a wallet full of CC's no longer needs to pay and that is what is hurting us.
I do like the idea of policing the content. If tubes got stale it would help a lot. |
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The sad fact seems to be that the indusrty is totally unable to regulate itself, since it's not really one industry. It's just a bunch of people trying to get the maximum for themselves regardless of how much they ruin the business for all others. Ironically, their piece of the cake gets smaller, too, since the cake itself is becoming smaller every day.
So, yes, it looks like we need government regulation like in other countries. More irony, it looks like those who hate and fight adult could be the ones saving us from the total meltdown. |
nice thread sofar!!
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one significant thing...
i'm not complaining, i'm just saying... we have checked signbucksdaily.com outgoing ips with some programs and found that most of webmasters (80-90% and of course big fish) drop our ref id (in many ways, i can only guess, though it's not hard to find out)... so what we can expect from all in business if even 'legit' webmasters have no ethics... |
When you see sites like Redtube, Pornhub, PornBB, PlanetSuzy, and massive media sharing torrent sites pulling into the millions of daily viewers, I think it's pretty obvious where that traffic is going, don't you? These sites have massive authority with the search engines, and dedicated user followings. Searching almost any adult term will turn one or more of these sites up with very high rankings in the SERPs. On top of that there are thousands and thousands of freehosted surfer ran sharing blogs, smaller forums, yahoo groups, etc etc.
Nobody wants to pay for this shit anymore. It's common knowledge you can find most digital content for free somewhere. Why pay for it? If I had a giant field of fresh fruit and veggies growing right out my backdoor, I wouldn't be going to the grocery store to buy produce. It's a changing landscape, and if someone wants to survive, well maybe they should look at finding a way to profit from that giant crop of readily available veggies. What I see is content owners beginning to use this to their advantage. Starting their own tubes regaining their lost traffic and finding new ways to capitalize on it.. Take PornHub and their "Premium" memberships for example. I think the the tubesite model being merged with the paysite model is the wave of the future. Those who are cultivating this field right now, are the ones who are going to survive. What this is doing bringing the traffic back in house for the content owners and networks. It's cutting out the middle man in order to maintain a profit margin, and while everyone in the industry is taking a loss, in the end it is going to be the average affiliate who dies out. Unless you've harnessed a massive traffic flow, you're not going to make it, and I can see the top dog affiliates doing the smart thing and buying their content to keep all their profits in house too. The average surfer has been conditioned to not trust the paysite model by all sorts of shady practices like cross sales, difficult canceling of recurring memberships and so on. They have grown to trust the tube model, and I'm sure will grow to trust even it's paid options more so than shelling over $30/month for a membership site... It's my opinion that the adult affiliate is going to become a thing of the past more and more so over the next few years. What I see for the future is more mega tube-styled sites with their own licensed content, maintaining their own user bases and capitalizing on their own premium memberships. In order to maintain profitability the networks are going to have to work the middleman affiliate out of the equation, and I believe that they are making it happen now. Smart business by those who are leading the pack at the moment... |
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Sites need to offer things that are NOT available on tubes. Unique new content and fresh niche ideas, interesting games and alternative entertainment, interactivity....
I've reviewed more than 3,000 different paysites (some more than a few times - for several different review sites). Of those 3,000+ I'd say less than 500 offered anything truly unique or different from the rest. If you are interested in seeing what I am talking about, contact me on ICQ# 266942896. I have an exclusive high quality affiliate program with truly unique and different sites. The affiliate program is by invite only... to keep it less saturated. I'll also be at phoenix forum for anyone who wants to discuss this further... :2 cents: |
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