I don't know who you are, and with only 22 posts, I probably never will, but you know your shit. That is all. :thumbsup:thumbsup

He re-posted and corrected his initial post

OMG... This is fucking stupid and you people are ass kissing sheep too.

First, if you have an issue with Cross Sales. How about this - Stop promoting programs with hidden/double checked xsales. Be part of the solution, not some bullshit idea that means nothing.

Outside of hidden, it's your opinion that surfers care about xsales - and that's the real problem with this. Your Opinion could be effecting the amount of sales/money I get.

This is what kills me, you are the affiliate, you put a flag up or a color I don't like, I email you and tell you to change it, and you do or don't get paid. Really that simple.


So, in reality you will still push double hidden xsales, you will rate sites on xsales but not care that the member areas of 90% of those solo girls you push are total trash.

Really, this is nothing more than to make ass suckers feel happy that a large traffic site that they have nothing to with is, is acting like they care, and forcing bs moral values onto site owners that are trying to make money?



Sounds like we have another case of run away big headed affiliate or lots of crack, one of the two.

Hey that's a great idea. Please hit me up on icq when you can! Thanks :)

Very nice guys

Dear halfwit, please find a post where I advocate hidden cross sales of any kind.

You should have a clue about the subject you speak about before you open your idiot mouth.:thumbsup

quoted for truth.

Everyone talks the talk but they line right up to take the money of the hidden cross sale guys.

We can't let such a hypocritical post die.. Come on, bump bump bump.

Maybe I should support this. Rate xsales, rate bad xsales, get praise, yeah weee, people love me.. But I'm still going to promote dirty cross sales! So fuck you people.. hahahaha!

Bump.

:2 cents:

agreed, the best method of all is to DROP all of the links to sponsors that do that shit

there are plenty of sponsors out there that are console free and xsale free that you never need to worry about running out of links to promote

Good idea,but it should be maybe more exposed since average joe probaly wont noticed.Some people suggested stoping sending traffic to such sponsors,but freeones cant do that beacuse of site concept.

That?s not an entirely fair assessment of this idea / concept. Here?s the point, first off they have an established traffic source for these sponsors, they have submitted galleries in place, freeones isn?t just a traffic source with hosted galleries, they have submitted galleries from webmasters that they have to contend with and a database of galleries that they can?t just delete from the system.

It?s a matter of throwing the baby out with the bathwater. A number of sites, say even a year ago, didn?t have these pre-checked cross sales below the join button?however, with certain companies being bought out, new systems being put into place, you?re stuck with a quandary of how to handle the situation.

Let?s say you had a blog dedicated to Mr. Blue (I'm hot as hell), you have 300 handwritten posts, you have decent serps for Mr. Blue plus a number of long tail keywords, and you?re generating a fair amount of money from it. What do you do when that site gets bought (Dee make me an offer) and pre-checked cross sales below the join happens?

You really have three options:
1. Pull all the links because you have amazing morals
2. Ask the sponsor to give you the option to have no pre-checked x-sells
3. Put a warning on your site so the surfers know that when they go to buy, to uncheck those boxes.

Basically, 1 isn?t really an option. Pichunter chose the second option. Freeones chose the 3rd option (possibly the 2nd option as well on their fhgs but I?m not privy to that info)

There?s really no perfect solution, but at least some effort is being made. Also, informing the surfer that these issues may exist certainly couldn?t hurt.

Traffic to a website isn?t like driving a car with screaming kids in the backseat where you can turn around and yell, ?I?ll turn this car right around if you don?t stop!??it?s more out of control like a dingy going down a river with swift currents?the best you can do is try to guide your traffic and navigate the ebbs and flows.

If this were 1 crooked sponsor, I?d completely agree with you?but because of the size and scope of this problem one has to address the issue in a measured manner. So, I don't really think Freeones is hypocritical and I think your assessment is a little needlessly harsh.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see someone just say, all these sites are banned, fuck off. It's really not practical though when you're dealing with the sheer numbers involved.

Here my comments:

- We will change the icon colors a bit, so that the green color, which is associated in normal life as good, will be changed
- In the coming weeks all honest sponsors will get a Thumbs Up icon behind the links

The reason why we did not simply remove all links is because some sponsors with cross-sale do also have official sites listed. FreeOnes visitors often would like to visit the official site of a babe. By simple removing the link they will use a search engine to find it. The same thing happens with FHG's. People will try to find more galleries and won't get the information about cross-sales thru those pages. At Freeones they get all those information at least. A part of the sponsor programs offer "fair" cross sales. If you simply uncheck the boxes you don't get screwed etc. And don't forget, all those shitty programs don't get promo and banner spots anywhere on our site anymore!

Now I have done several test signups in the last 2 months. And I can tell you it's 1 fucking shady world with tens of different companies. Some cross-sales are even rebilling after cancellations. I have read complaints for people who had to get a new card because of this. And it seems like I have this problem on my card too. More news about that when I know it for 100% sure because I only like to write facts.

But I can tell you that this cross-sales business is at least a 100 million business on yearly basis if not bigger. Some people (thieves) are becoming very rich which this at the moment. Just by doing this they are screwing the whole market. If it continues like this without taking any action you should not be surprised that CC companies don't process for porn sites at all anymore soon. I know many people just think short term and are only in the porn bizz to try to make money fast. However FreeOnes is not and will do anything we can to stop this shit.

Solution: Stop ACTING like you care, and actually help correct the problem.

If you really think cross-sales are going to kill our business, then remove the 200ish programs that do double-hidden pre-checks. Just stop, it's that simple - fucking stop.

Don't put a marker up, don't act like you care, don't pretend to fool the sheep on GFY... Just stop pushing them, remove the links, 301 redirect them, and stop bullshitting people.

Great post, Maurice. I can certainly understand educating the surfer with such a massive traffic base.

"and stop bullshitting people"

better tell that to some other people in this business.....

You are the one posting here acting like you are doing something to help. Stop bullshitting the people here and actually help.

You try to spin this shit like, we are educating the surfer. Please, it's not education when you are still allowing them to be ripped off.

Are you putting warning labels on advertisers as well?

Niether do we!!! And today we are changing our prices to NO TRIALS EITHER!!!

EXACTLY!!! Just good, clean, honest porn! And at it for a long time! Why is everyone so desperate and gouging? Must be the non-exclusivity or the lacking of quality of the product.

Right on freeones! (not a sheep either) but i am pulling links off my site!

The problem with you, is the attitude of your writing. We just implemented this system and will make improvements to it like how we do with everything. Nothing is perefect and everything can be done better. However with your kind of writing you make people think that I'm an idiot and ripping off people. If you would said: " well good move, but not good enough, I would suggest you do this and that" then it would sounds totally different. Dont you think so?

I know this is GFY, but still... But after x comments like these I simply ignore the posts so what's you gain?

Oh and to let you know, we probably will move those links into a special shady on the page or whatsoever.




What do you mean?

You can ignore me if you like, the people reading my posts don't ignore me. So your choice if you want to add some fuel to the fire for me.

And no no, you aren't the idiot, you are playing people for idiots. By saying you are going to rate xsales, and saying you care in general, blah blah blah - says you are stepping up to do something about it.

When the truth is, you aren't doing anything. And I'm calling your card on it.


If you did something grand, I would say it - like pulling the sponsors doing it, then I would say, damn freeones is kick ass, great example, blah blah blah. Otherwise, it's total bullshit, 100% bullshit. You can put lipstick on a pig but the bitch is still a pig. Haha.

That a good idea. I'm sure there will be more like this. :thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup

The doc has a point.

Logic 101: Class 1

A surfer hits a join page, with a precheck or without, hidden xsales or above the button, he joins and gets an xsale.

Free site A, gets mad - and tells surfer A about the bad sites.

Now the logic: If surferA can't read about the xsales, above or below the button, prechecked or not, directly on the join form, clearly written on 99.9% of the join forms.

And yet, we expect them to read a tiny icon, in the mix of other icons, in the mix of tons of free porn. But yet, they can't read the billing page, that is charging them?

</logic101>

very Interesting addition..
nice work.

I have a feeling that not many sponsors are going to jump out and start making demands to one of the largest adult sites on the web.

I don't really see why this would create any controversy. Freeones has decided to show surfers which sites it believes are honest and which it believes are dishonest. That's a business decision that they have made for their own company.

My review sites already show "Checked" "PreChecked" or "None" on each review and WebmasterScore.com is already compiling this information which is available to affiliate webmasters via the sponsor search feature of the site or to review sites (including Freeones) via the Review Site Submitter as well.

If a company believes prechecked xsells are good business, none of this stops them from continuing to use them. The only people a decision like this hurts are the ones who are willing to admit they are really seeking to cheat consumers by hiding additional costs from them... or to cheat affiliates by hiding revenue from them.

As long as everyone is informed, each can easily make their own decisions. :2 cents:

Google does this too somewhat if I remember, warning about a potential site using an interstitial type page?

:thumbsup

The blood is not in the surfer brain when he signs up for a site -- it is usually in his cock (the reason he wants to join in the first place). An impulse purchase where lack of attention and a fixation of seeing the content very quickly can be exploited by hidden xsells.

Will a surfer without the full compliment of blood in his brain notice a tiny icon warning him that the porn he is about to view may bad for his wallet work....?

No, they do it to sites that are Dangerous, that can harm your computer. Prechecks or xsales in general, are not dangerous, they do not harm your computer, and they do not mass piss people off.

If they don't mass piss people off then why are most of the programs built on cross sales using all kinds of merchants?

I get your point though, it is just that we want to do it differently and it is not as easy as 1 2 3

Just because you have cross sales, two pre-checked, does not mean you are rolling merchant accounts. Xsales have been around for about 8 years now, they are legal and allowed by VISA.

What you are referring to is pre-checks under the submit button or hidden terms of the xsale membership. Both of which Epoch and CCBill programs can not do. And just because they don't use Epoch and CCBill doesn't mean they are doing xsales at all and/or doing hidden ones.

Example: DukeDollars uses Netbilling with no xsales.

See it would be different if you only flagged only dirty xsale programs (hidden/under the button) then it would be like Google. However, even Google will de-list sites that don't clean up.

Which is what you should be doing. If the surfer can't read the join page, that has dirty xsales - then they aren't going to see or use your little notice. So the only real way to stop the surfer from being screwed over is to stop pushing programs with dirty xsales and/or get the lower paying option without the xsale.

great more warnings about adult business. lets just tell them to never buy porn again instead of let them think in their heads. they don't understand this game, or cross sales or anything else, all you're doing is scaring them and fucking with your ratios.

I don't say every program not using ccbill/epoch is a cheat, I think you perfectly understand what I am trying to say but like I said we seem to have a different view on things.

We don't say the idea is perfect, it is a start of what we see is a step to clean up (at least a bit) the mess.

I understand.. but let me help. If YOU want to make more money, remove the 200 programs doing shady cross sales. Then tell your surfers that they won't find sponsors with hidden billing practices on your site.

Now that, is helping the people out, helping the webmaster, and helping yourself.

Everything else is an image - trying to play nice but still worried about your bottom line over actually helping the surfer.

At the end of the day, you are still promoting programs known to be scamming the surfer and those same programs screw you over at the same time.

Why not just pull the dirty sponsors? I did, it took one afternoon and I have as many Sponsors to go through as you do.

The reason for not doing so is stated already.

Special link codes are an option though!

In the case of FreeOnes, that would be a seriously stupid thing for an affiliate program to do.

Money. We are all in this to make money. Freeones doesn't want to lose a LOT of money, that's why they aren't gonna pull the "shady programs. And that's why there will be a love fest in Amsterdam with the sites in question. I have no problem with that. You're right though about the hypocrisy of GFY. Lot of people acting morally righteous. Bottom line is I work my ass off to take care of me and my family. We all do. But I'm with you Doc...other businesses (car dealerships, retail stores, etc.) don't go out of their way to reveal how much money they make and the hidden and misleading charges they throw at you. Yet...the majority opinion on GFY seems to be that we in adult should. I respectfully disagree with doing that.

And if I were a tube or torrent site owner I would be laughing my ass off at this whole controversy. While they are busy ripping everybodies members areas and giving them away for free while cashing their pre-paid dating site checks...We are here attacking one another and trying to further reduce profit margin. All over something that has been in place for at least 8 years. But now suddenly it's an issue. :(