gusgug

A lot of webmaster don t realize that we are killing the industry, promoting Tube sites, free porn!! All paysites it will get to a point that won't worth to produce porn, since everybody is pushing free porn out there and regular customer are getting more and more easy access to all free porn!! pushed by us!!

Think about it!! we can not leave just of the traffic, if there is no conversion!!

Just a comment!

V_RocKs

ur rite!.

gandalfuy

i hope not

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IllTestYourGirls

Adapt or die. Nothing stays the same for ever.

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bobby666

i can only agree

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Mutt

another bottom feeder parroting the ridiculous 'adapt or die' crap

tell me how YOU are adapting - show off your smarts here

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slapass

But if you don't move to tubes and your competitors do, you are closing up so what is the solution? Get used to pushing huge traffic for less sales and push cams.

Jack Sparrow

Another one of these threads.
And another day that nothing changes..

Karupted Charles

He can say that cause he does not produce content and his type of sites still convert on all the stolen traffic sites and tubes. People will not pay for porn but lucky for him he can adapt and just keep charging for people to talk to fake profiles.

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Kristian

The spread of free content wont be stopped because demand for a zero-priced good is infinite. The solution is to offer what cannot be given away for free. If anything, this means paysite-owners have to lift their game, think outside the box and integrate web 2.0, among other things.

tranza

Yes, just like the software industry died because of warez sites.

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IllTestYourGirls

seriously you think you can keep promoting the same way, offering the same thing and expect nothing to change in 5 years, or even the next year? I am a bottom feeder, I am no player, but I do know that you can not keep the same business model for years and expect to make money.

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MrVids

Let's add a little salt to the wound, sure you have the free porn out there and its only gaining popularity. several sites in the top 100 on alexa now....

On top of that, let's look at a couple of the sponsors out there that are fisting surfers when they join their sites. Hidden "cross sales" on the join forms and blind joins in the members area, etc. People join a site for $2.95 and end up getting charged $80+ then make it near impossible to cancel.

You think those people are going to join another paysite in their liftetime? nope.... and now why should they? There is a grip of free porn out there for the taking.

Sadly, i have to agree with the "adapt or die" comment because well.... we have no other choice. the guys who are piloting these sites that rip people off and/or give away all that free porn have DEEP DEEP pockets that honest webmasters will never be able to match. So its time we put our thinking caps on and figure out how to flank them.....

tony286

That's so easy to say. lol

gusgug

I think that all producer want to adapt and of course improve the industry but, how they will do that when there is industry going down!!

And i know for fact that is a bunch of paysites creating tube sites to get more traffic those moves are even worse!!

We will get to a point that paysites will charge a dollar for all the content and recrecruring 1.99 so people will rather pay that little money for the paysites than watch free porn.. untill tube sites dye!!

faxxaff

Those cross sales are the worst thing for the business!
Why sell a surfer 564984651214 sites for a 1.99$ trial that rebills for 12321321654.88 $ (with an affiliate just getting 35 to 200$) if you can sell him 20 sites for 30 $ where you make 60% revshare (=360$ + rebills).
Unless stupid affiliates start to learn some math that they actually loose money by promoting those 200PPS programs. But I guess most affiliates live in cages and think 200 bucks once in awhile is better than a bigger check at the end of the month.

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gusgug

I think we all wants to improve!! get the best but to do that cost money and if there is no convertion there is no money so!! we will end up on the same crappy of the free porn!

faxxaff

sure .... specially, our English language :-)

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TheDoc

Free porn and piracy isn't killing our industry, it's one small factor out of 100's of others that are far worse for our business. Plenty of companies are still growing, the numbers may not be as large as previous years, but they are still growing.

Adapting is about using the tools of the Internet for our Industry, some people call it web2.0, when it's just really the Internet. You can look around the adult net and 99% of the sites that are 3-10+ years old have not adapted to any new technologies and/or expanded-changed based on surfer trends.

Are you sales hurting, traffic down? Are you doing the same exact thing today that you did 1, 3, 5+ years ago? Opening a new tgp, paysite, blog or some new niche, it's all still the same thing. Just reading the post about people still wanting rss feeds for wordpress tells you how behind our industry is.

Every day the net gets even more advanced, each time it takes a huge step forward it pushes a huge amount of people out. If you think in 10 years that you will be building webpages that people visit vs xml/rss type systems that people request, from email to websites - then you haven't even started to adapt to what changes have already happened.

That's what adapt or die is all about.

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gusgug

Off course things changes!! that's why we all need to change, but change on the SMART way, not giving people free things!! who lives out of giving things??

You can see the industry has been improved a lot high def, more promo , more competition!! wich makes everything more intresting!! I m just saying if you are good promoting freetubes it s fine but you should start get used to only promote that!!

I guarantee that the industry it will change and all the tube sites it will die!!

MetaMan

adult is dying, are you people going to wait until the scraps turn into ones that cant feed everyone?

tony286

I have two words for you craig's list

gusgug

I will take that as a complement!!!

topnotch, standup guy

I have an "idiot list" to which all these "adapt or die" morons get added to

WarChild

I'm making more money now than ever. The Adult Industry, overall, makes more money each year too.

So what's really dying? Maybe just your portion. Honestly, I couldn't care less what happens to you.

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gusgug

You most be one of those Barra jiu jitsu!!!

TheDoc

Craigs list is a great example, that's why I said it's not web2.0 - it's just the Internet. They came in at a perfect time, when a demand needed to be met, and adapted to it in a simple, quick, and cheap while still making some money - and the people love it.

I wouldn't think the backend technology they run today is the same as it was when they started, it doesn't have to be a visual adaption but anything that fills the need of the surfer.

Like getting your soft porn onto social networks to help drive in type-ins and/or filter traffic down to other sites that create bookmarks for you. You aren't adding 2.0 to you site but you are using it to help drive in more traffic.

It's not just one way street.

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xmas13

I registered my first tube domain.

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IllTestYourGirls

I really can not believe that to adapt or not to adapt is a question and being debated.

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timoxxl2

didnt we discuss that about thousand times?

but i think our content will never be affected by that ;-)

FabianC

Well stated Doc

TheDoc

Craigslist RSS Feed, provided by Craigslist. Already a great example of email being out and xml/rss being in.

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Why

as a personal opinion i think the programs that are doing fucked up shit with merchant accounts are hurting this industry more then tube sites, both in the short and long terms.

dont care to argue about it... if you have to move merchant accounts more then once a year.. as many of these programs are doing(some as often as weekly).. your doing something fucked up and breaking rules, PERIOD. these practices will catch up with them and many of us that didnt ride the bus with them will suffer consequences along side.

Barefootsies

Reading some of these threads is like a Scarlett letter for those who will be dead soon.

It's time to face the facts that in the "good old days" you never learned how to sell in the first place. You could get by just throwing traffic and free shit and people would convert.

Now, there is so much supply of the vanilla porn that you can't get people to pay because you gave that shit away for free for years. So people who can get off to that shit are in heaven. Especially when it wasn't 30 seconds free. Oh no, you had to give away 3o MINUTES for free.

At some point your brain, if you had one, told you that free and traffic was king. Not conversions and SALES.

The fact of the matter is that, online, any retard can join this business. So you have people with NO BUSINESS SKILLS in it. You have people who think they will make a mint on AFF ads, so giving away the farm doesn't mean shit to them.

You have those affiliates who need fresh new content, and they are all scrambling to get it from the sponsors who do NOT rerun the same old tired content and programs.

Then you have the content dudes who have seen their budgets and work cut because of the loss in sales, and consolidation. Programs not buying new content, just whole other programs and their licenses.

This doesn't get into the cross sales, and other shady bullshit. But there is a bigger picture here as well....

When you people talk about "the industry" you have to, or should, go to a show and the reality will start to sink in.

There are about 12-24 'major bro players' if that. My guess is that their revenues probably make up a good chunk of this business, and as a collective (number of people in this business) they are maybe the top 1-3%. I am talking about online, not major porn studios.

Now,.. you have let's say 12 (for simplicity sake_, major bros. Their making millions, sponsoring shows, buying up other programs, and cross selling, upselling, and branding like a mofo. They make up 5% of the business and 50% of the sales (again, ball parks).

The other 95% of the business is everyone from affiliate marketers, content people, small and mid market companies, solo girl self run sites, mom n pops, small to medium networks, applications, and so on.

That top 5% doesn't give a shit about what troubles most of the 95% that doesn't make them money.

Case in point. People at conferences talking about what big 'bro' is getting sued. Who fucking cares? Why? Because they have the resources and money to defend themselves in court.

I would be more worried about the small piss ant mom n pop who gets sued and does NOT have the resources. They could be railroaded in the Florida panhandle and the same law that comes out of that case, hits us ALL in this business.

Is there any unity for the piss ants? Nope. Just the bros.

Most of the people who are FULL TIME in this industry and never going to get beyond the mid level market in this business. Don't be fooled. It's the fact of the matter. (unless you get a merge, get capital investment, etc) If you are REALLY in the $XXX,XXX range and can maintain. You are doing better than 90% of GFY.

Mainstream online is the same way. You have the top people worrying about what the top issues are to THEM. They do not care about the plight of the piss ant.

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Why

no offense but someone who recently sold out aint really the person to be telling the rest how to adapt. apparently it didnt work well for you either?

Rochard

That's beautiful really. Very well put!!!!

I agree that there are multiple things affecting our industry. The truth is we have flooded the Internet with so much free porn that no one needs to pay for it. I post on a few non industry message boards and everyone thinks the porn industry has become a joke - why pay for something if you can get it for free?

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TheDoc

EGC was not my first program to build and sell. And I sold EGC for several reasons. The main reason was my Webmasters, I didn't do anything with the program, they wanted more, so I found a new owner that would take care of the sites and start updating them again.

About 3 years ago I started taking on contract jobs from other programs to integrate the technology that auto ran egc, onto 100's of other programs. From here we created unique tools for nats and built several programs from the ground up, over and over again.

I build programs for a living, and now I want to put a huge amount of my time and attention into my blog, once I know the integration of egc into duke$ is 100% mint!

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TheDoc

We are jokes to the non adult people, from traffic to our income, we think we are gods when our industry is nothing but a pin dot in the global scale of things.

Webmasters that have skills of any kind, have always been able to get everything for free, from porn, software, music, ect. Some purchase, most don't, that isn't just a trend for adult purchases.

From free porn to piracy to social sites, whatever it is. It all still converts. Just years ago we would build something and people found us, today we have to go remind the people that we are here. The nice thing, technology is making it easier for us to do this but a the same time it's making others that don't adapt, not able to join in on the fun and games.

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Barefootsies

"I'm Your Huckleberry"..

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Enough Said.

"Would you rather live like a king for a year or like a prince forever?"

Paul Markham

While Eva has been away I've been surfing some Tube sites and this is the general impression.

If they are competing with us for customers and taking them away, we are too blame. This is why.

Most of the porn I found appeals to kids and was clearly shot by kids. It's bad, cliched and lacks imagination and reality. A scene I watched last night is a great example of what is wrong with a lot of sites.

The scene starts off with a girl interviewing a girl who's about to do her first porn scene. It looked genuine and the porn girl was attractive, great body and seemed a little nervous and excited about doing the scene. By the time they led the boy in she was very keen, when she saw his cock she was open mouthed!!

She then proceeded to suck on it for her own and his pleasure. There was no fake moaning and a lot of smiles and eagerness. The only problem was the guy getting the blow job had a bigger mouth than his dick, he never shut up with the cliched phrases.

Then we got a cut and she starts to moan while sucking. In real life girls don't do this. Then the dude tells us how good she is, how much she wants this, how much she is going to get fucked and what ever else came into his lame head. I started to lose it at this point.

As he's fucking her she's faking the moaning and she's talking like a street whore, which for a nineteen year old teen is not good. But his talk is dominating the whole thing and at this point the girl was clearly losing interest and faking it more and more.

I watched it all the way through and there was more pussy close ups than anything else, the scene was crap.

This is a good example of a lot of the porn on Tube sites and if they're ripped off members sites it's little wonder some are not converting and retaining. No one wants to spend $30 for a months membership to a site with male porn studs with egos and mouths bigger than their dicks.

Porn needs to be worth buying if you're going to sell it. Shooting porn is not hard, it takes a bit of imagination and some thought. AND the director to tell the dick head who is the dick in the scene that it's not about him, it's about her and her sexual gratification.

Now you can all tell me it's about traffic.

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Barefootsies

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klaze

The content was definitely not shot by kids but the same ego pushers that post here.

It's how 80% of the content in online adult looks. gonzo/reality.. is soo popular tho.. so I don't blame them..

Tubes suck but Most advertising for adult sites is horrible and if yer not a hardcore porn fan or on the tubes you are going to miss out on a lot of good online porn..

I hit tubes hoping someone will post that one video i've been waiting my whole life to see. Unfortunately the idea of the illegal tube has been raped and it's not about people posting the best shit they have found.

Kudles

That sucks

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pornguy

Oh dont you know those are a secret, and he is making millions with them?

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klaze

edit: double

polle54

well as I might agree to some extend your argumentation sucks so hard it's hard to describe.

Promoting tube sites -> Free porn to surfers -> Paysites will die.

I hope you see it yourself now, but if not let me spell it out:
Where the FUCK do you think free porn comes from - THE PAYSITES. If they die your scenario is non existing. No more new porn, I fucking highly doubt that.

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CDSmith

"Adapt or die" doesn't necessarily have to mean go over to the dark side.

There are smart honest long-term ways of adapting that don't crap all over the rights of others.

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Karupted Charles

It was not shot by kids and with your years of experience I would have thought you would know to watch your mouth when making comments like that.

Second just because you were bored by it and found it tasteless does not mean its not what 90% of people want to see. We learned a long time ago to think based on members and feedback not on what we like. Out of our most popular models i would only call 2 or 3 super hot. Most of the ones I absolutely love and would be a member for are not rated above a 7 on our site. The reason is what I like and want to see based on watching porn 8 hours a day is not what joe shmoe middle america wants to see.

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