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-   -   Sean from AFF is an idiot... kudos to ShanesWorld Andrew Stoddard and Jason Tucker. (https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=812427)

tony286 03-05-2008 09:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambergirl (Post 13873406)
:thumbsup:thumbsup

Think back to early YNot, Rick, Ron, Serge, RB and JoeBonix days ? admittedly, my partner and I saw an opportunity to create membership sites with a fuck-load of content that we stole from newsgroups. We organized the stolen content beautifully, threw it up behind password protected areas and hooked up with DMR to process our sites.

At this point "stolen content" wasn't even a subject matter; back then, it was simply a free-for-all (*hint*nudge*hint* ? like tube sites today). After about a year of kick ass profits from our well organized stolen content we decided to cover our asses, got rid of all of the 'free' content we took and searched hard for company's that sold legal net content - we bought up all available copyright content that we could get our hands on.

Most of the alumni of our industry started their membership sites in this way. The point is, we saw an opportunity and we took it; and then we self-regulated (along with the rest of the industry).

In that same vein, I completely agree with you DrinkingHARDEST, "large tube sites are ALL going legit." Looking at the big picture, it's smart business (to be where the traffic is) and it's only a matter of time before the industry evolves to legit tube sites, the same way the industry has always grown, improved and evolved. :2 cents:
But they were paying from the beginning correct? I know its hard for the chiefs of the adult industry to understand, once someone is used to getting something for free. When you say now we are legit you have to pay, they don't say of course and take out their wallets.They go to the next free place. They have painted themselves into a corner.

Peaches 03-05-2008 09:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony404 (Post 13873438)
But they were paying from the beginning correct? I know its hard for the chiefs of the adult industry to understand, once someone is used to getting something for free. When you say now we are legit you have to pay, they don't say of course and take out their wallets.They go to the next free place. They have painted themselves into a corner.
No, as Amber correctly stated, they were getting it FREE from newsgroups. There were several software programs that could be used to automatically download all .gif and later on, .jpg files from newsgroups. You'd run them overnight (since everyone was still on dial up) and in the morning you'd have a massive folder of thousands of pictures of free porn.

What, you say? They were able to charge and make millions on pictures that people could get FOR FREE elsewhere? Yep. Free porn availability didn't keep people from making money - even when it was the exact same stuff :thumbsup

Cory W 03-05-2008 10:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tucker (Post 13871198)
AMEN to that. They are both VERY VERY smart!
I really don't see the big deal. Sean gave his side of things in a public forum. Shouldn't that be respected?

The only irritating part for me was XBIZ taking away his microphone.

GTS Mark 03-05-2008 11:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony404 (Post 13870844)
I bet if someone used your sweat and blood without your permission, I could hear your crying all the way here in GA.
http://www.linternaute.com/savoir/di...saur-world.jpg

GTS Mark 03-05-2008 11:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by justsexxx (Post 13872489)
It doesn't suprise me you stand up for your bro's!
I support those who do right by me, and they always have.

DH

tony286 03-05-2008 12:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peaches (Post 13873501)
No, as Amber correctly stated, they were getting it FREE from newsgroups. There were several software programs that could be used to automatically download all .gif and later on, .jpg files from newsgroups. You'd run them overnight (since everyone was still on dial up) and in the morning you'd have a massive folder of thousands of pictures of free porn.

What, you say? They were able to charge and make millions on pictures that people could get FOR FREE elsewhere? Yep. Free porn availability didn't keep people from making money - even when it was the exact same stuff :thumbsup
No your wrong she said they were getting it free to fill up membership areas where people paid for memberships. You cant give full scenes away for free and say now we are legit now you have to pay and now all free scenes are 3 mins.The people like go else where.
example : http://alexa.com/data/details/traffi...ls/gaytube.com

tony286 03-05-2008 12:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkingHARDEST (Post 13874169)
Fucking content producers is ok with you? Boy your a swell guy.

stickyfingerz 03-05-2008 12:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony404 (Post 13874795)
No your wrong she said they were getting it free to fill up membership areas where people paid for memberships. You cant give full scenes away for free and say now we are legit now you have to pay and now all free scenes are 3 mins.The people like go else where.
example : http://alexa.com/data/details/traffi...ls/gaytube.com
Yes and as Peaches said the content that they CHARGED for was readily available for FREE from the newsgroups. So people could get it for FREE but they still payed...

tony286 03-05-2008 12:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stickyfingerz (Post 13874877)
Yes and as Peaches said the content that they CHARGED for was readily available for FREE from the newsgroups. So people could get it for FREE but they still payed...
Because the average surfer doesnt know what a newsgroup is. They never did. Man I hope all this dick sucking you have been doing has been paying off for you.

GTS Mark 03-05-2008 12:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony404 (Post 13874800)
Fucking content producers is ok with you? Boy your a swell guy.
http://www.geologicresources.com/dinosaur245x289.gif

CarlosTheGaucho 03-05-2008 12:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stickyfingerz (Post 13874877)
Yes and as Peaches said the content that they CHARGED for was readily available for FREE from the newsgroups. So people could get it for FREE but they still payed...
Yeah but it doesn't make sense to compare internet and the education of its users 10 years ago and internet nowadays.

Now it's another extreme, you have surfers that will most likely NEVER pay again.

tony286 03-05-2008 12:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkingHARDEST (Post 13874931)
its not worth it

Peaches 03-05-2008 12:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony404 (Post 13874928)
Because the average surfer doesnt know what a newsgroup is. They never did.
Are you serious? BBS and newsgroups were what the surfers were using for porn back then. There was porn on the internet LONG before the first paysite, lol. In fact, there was a LOT of money to be made spamming newsgroups with paysite links and again, several software programs that did that. If the surfers didn't know about newsgroups, they sure fooled me.

The fact remains that what was available for free was also being sold - at quite a decent profit. Which was Amber's point.

stickyfingerz 03-05-2008 12:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tony404 (Post 13874928)
Because the average surfer doesnt know what a newsgroup is. They never did. Man I hope all this dick sucking you have been doing has been paying off for you.
lol. It has nothing to do with dick sucking, has to do with the logical progression of the internet. And again the people crying over and over and over about content theft dont give a shit about stopping the theft, only crying about the people using the stolen content. Bah not even going to try. :1orglaugh

stickyfingerz 03-05-2008 12:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlosTheGaucho (Post 13874955)
Yeah but it doesn't make sense to compare internet and the education of its users 10 years ago and internet nowadays.

Now it's another extreme, you have surfers that will most likely NEVER pay again.
No cause surfers back then were way more tech savy at the time than those on now. The percentage of people actually online then was way way lower. You had to spend a lot more money to even have a computer. It wasnt like it is now. Joe smo who drives a truck for a living wasn't too likely to get his porn via the internet. He got it from adult book stores in paper bags. So back then it was very likely that those that were online DID know how to use newsgroups. It was also one of the few ways then to get larger files since bandwidth costs for people to have a site were so much.

Its interesting how peoples perceptions of what really happened change over the years I guess. lol

tony286 03-05-2008 12:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peaches (Post 13874981)
Are you serious? BBS and newsgroups were what the surfers were using for porn back then. There was porn on the internet LONG before the first paysite, lol. In fact, there was a LOT of money to be made spamming newsgroups with paysite links and again, several software programs that did that. If the surfers didn't know about newsgroups, they sure fooled me.

The fact remains that what was available for free was also being sold - at quite a decent profit. Which was Amber's point.
Are you seriously comparing a newsgroup to the simplicity of a tube? Thats funny.

tony286 03-05-2008 01:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stickyfingerz (Post 13874986)
lol. It has nothing to do with dick sucking, has to do with the logical progression of the internet. And again the people crying over and over and over about content theft dont give a shit about stopping the theft, only crying about the people using the stolen content. Bah not even going to try. :1orglaugh
Logical progression,the only reason they are big is because they are filled with stolen content that is easy to access. Thats why no legal tube is even close in traffic. Yep hot new business model giving away shit for free that doesn't belong to you. It does keep those pesky content costs down.

tony286 03-05-2008 01:07 PM
Know what Im tired of arguing about this, it will play itself out someone will be right and someone will be wrong.

AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE 03-05-2008 01:10 PM
http://www.royswriting.com/pooldj.jpg

Now all I can say is when Airek came in and corrected that it was pure 100% unadulterated Ownage.

I never seen such ownage before.
Well I have but that was in the top 10.

tucker 03-05-2008 02:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WEG Cory (Post 13873922)
I really don't see the big deal. Sean gave his side of things in a public forum. Shouldn't that be respected?

The only irritating part for me was XBIZ taking away his microphone.
I agree with you Cory. Sean and I actually see eye to eye on a lot and I do understand where they are coming from. Its not up to me to tell someone else how to run their business. I was not slamming him, I give that team alot of kudos for what they have and will continue to accomplish. I might not like that they support certain web properties but again not my place to tell them how to run their business.

CarlosTheGaucho 03-05-2008 02:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stickyfingerz (Post 13875023)
No cause surfers back then were way more tech savy at the time than those on now. The percentage of people actually online then was way way lower. You had to spend a lot more money to even have a computer. It wasnt like it is now. Joe smo who drives a truck for a living wasn't too likely to get his porn via the internet. He got it from adult book stores in paper bags. So back then it was very likely that those that were online DID know how to use newsgroups. It was also one of the few ways then to get larger files since bandwidth costs for people to have a site were so much.

Its interesting how peoples perceptions of what really happened change over the years I guess. lol
Well I more like meant mass spam mailing, pop ups, exits, circle jerking, dialers, infinite rebills... that's what I speak about, not that people didn't had computers and bandwith sucked... do you know any early porn user that wouldn't burn his fingers at least once?

In general, it was a little bit easier to hunt for more buck per single internet user, or don't you agree?

CarlosTheGaucho 03-05-2008 02:38 PM
And to add - we are still dealing with the ACCESSIBILITY issue, of course that if you search every p2p in the world you willl be able to find there all the porn in the world.

But what is one word to describe an internet surfer - LAZY.

It will take you ages to find it and download it and you will get pissed with fake descriptions and filenames.

This problem was sucesfully eliminated - with illegal tube sites offering 25 000 scenes in one place, in good quality and immediately accessible. A new piracy2.0. emerged and to find something new and jack off will not take you more than a couple of minutes and you have enough video to keep on returning and jacking off for years.

CarlosTheGaucho 03-05-2008 04:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkingHARDEST (Post 13870709)
AFF Sean for President!!! :)

Boneprone tell it like it is man... I am going to bump this thread in 2 years and lets see how many hypocrites posted in here bitching about AFF and likes buying all the advertising up on the tube sites.

The reality is that the large tube sites are ALL going legit... Believe it or not within 6 months i would say 90% of the largest tube sites will all have worked out deals with content companies and large affiliate programs to license their content in exchange for traffic. I already know a couple that are in the midst of it right now.

DH
So in other words they just want to cover their ass with sharing some of the money they stole already from the others..

gideongallery 03-05-2008 06:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boneprone (Post 13867783)
I watched the whole thing twice now.

Am I the only one who doest think Sean came off as an idiot?

he made some good point and he made some bad points

but really did a poor job of arguing his point because he accepted the false premise that he was profiting off of stolen content

The fact is if the tube site is obeying the dmca take down request they are exploiting a loophole in the law to distribute the content without permission

it not theft anyway you slice it at best it would be copyright infringement and at worst it would be taking advantage of the legal system.

considering that the entire adult industry is based on a similar loophole it really surprising no one gets it.

GTS Mark 03-05-2008 07:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlosTheGaucho (Post 13876488)
So in other words they just want to cover their ass with sharing some of the money they stole already from the others..
No i think they see the profitability in working together with content owners and exclusive paysite owners...

gideongallery 03-05-2008 08:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tucker (Post 13870525)
Andrew didnt flame him out of the blue, he opened the door and he started with me...I actually asked him if he really wanted to have the conversation right then and there that was cut out and Andrew asked him a very valid question and made extremely valid points for which I commend him.

ALSO - read up on contributory infringement...in essence if you know they have a lot of stolen material and you...well...help them like advertise, you too can be held liable.

http://www.chillingeffects.org/dmca5...QuestionID=268

1. contributory infringement doesn't exist in all countries, canada only recognizes intermediary and direct infringement.

2. contributory infringement is the only infringement complaint that results in an abuse of fair use. (every win that has extended fair use rights has been a contributory infringement complaint)

3. you can only be guilty of contributory infringement if there is an direct infringement (see all of your examples from chilling effect) so if the distribution is fair use or comply with the safe harbour provision of the DMCA your arguement doesn't YET hold up.

Now maybe you will get such a ruling thru the courts some day, but accusing him of supporting piracy BEFORE you have met that burden is patently false.

He is supporting what YOU believe will be proven to be piracy some time in the future is a more accurate statement.

Martin 03-05-2008 08:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by will76 (Post 13867369)
I can't speak for Penthouse, but what Sean was saying was the EXACT shit that LARS was spewing about spyware 2 years ago. I would have to think that Andrew is on the same wave length as well. Someone over there at AFF/Cams is programming these morons to think this way. Its so obvious since they say the exact same excuses for everything, I would bet it's Andrew, seems the most logical. So I doubt he will get fired, they probably air high-5'ed each other when they saw the video and thought he did a good job, where as the rest of us thought he looked like an idiot.

Chances are Penthouse knew what they were buying with AFF/Cams and Penthouse decided to not only keep Andrew,Lars, Sean, etc... on after they bought AFF/Cams but they put them in charge of Penthouse's online properties as well. So, I would think there is no chance in hell that he will be fired, I can't see how Penthouse would have expected anything different than what happened.

Here is something really funny... Sean says " we tried to stop and we have pulled adds on torrent and tube sites but our competition just buys them...." Sean, you work for a Cams, Dating, and membership site... Everyone is your competition. Did you expect the illegal site to close down just because you pulled your ads? You can't be that stupid. There is always going to be shitty people that will do business with these companies. If AFF/CAMS/Penthouse took the high road and then asked all of their affiliates (and everyone else) to not do business with the " competition" who was buying these spots not only would they help clean things up and be heroes, they would make more money in the long run.... it all comes down to greed and how much can i make *tomorrow* mentality. :2 cents:
Will has a great point here.

Martin 03-05-2008 08:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkingHARDEST (Post 13870709)

The reality is that the large tube sites are ALL going legit... Believe it or not within 6 months i would say 90% of the largest tube sites will all have worked out deals with content companies and large affiliate programs to license their content in exchange for traffic. I already know a couple that are in the midst of it right now.

DH
Glad to hear it Mark! Tube sites are the way of the future. I have nothing against them. Just the ones ripping hard working people off and making money off it.:thumbsup

FreeHugeMovies 03-05-2008 09:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlienQ (Post 13875181)
http://www.royswriting.com/pooldj.jpg

Now all I can say is when Airek came in and corrected that it was pure 100% unadulterated Ownage.

I never seen such ownage before.
Well I have but that was in the top 10.
That is funny as piss.

CarlosTheGaucho 03-05-2008 10:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkingHARDEST (Post 13877265)
No i think they see the profitability in working together with content owners and exclusive paysite owners...
They don't want to risk gettin sued, so they will rather offer a content deal and every single producer that had his content stolen over there will sign up.

I would even believe that will happen, if no producer would sign up with a site where his content was stolen before - they would get into trouble.

mikeyddddd 03-05-2008 10:04 PM
one fiddy


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