clutch_hicks

i agree that bigger stories are lost in the news. but, not often does somethin like this go unnoticed.
and i also agree that until this is proven factual, this man should be left alone.
should it be proven factual then yeah, he should be set apon like hyenas on a zebra.

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D

It's all about Monkey Spheres.

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escorpio

I see a psych evaluation and discharge in that guy's very near future.

halfpint

If you want to see the shit that is really going on over in the war zones then take a look at http://www.nothingtoxic.com or http://www.liveleak.com

Its on the net all the time but it just gets ignored

My brothers son just recently came back from serving in Afganistan and he bought some footage back with him and it aint pretty . I asked him if he was gonna put it on the net and he said no because it could get him into trouble for even bringing the footage out of Afganistan. A lot of the bad shit that is going on in these war zones are never shown on the news and the general public never really see what is going on but it is being posted on the net and still people just seem to "look the other way"

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quantum-x

Absolutely: The military don't want the footage out for a good reason.
If you had 24 hour feeds of people with their innards as outards - no matter what 'side' they were fighting on, noone would be fighting.

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Anthony

I understand about being bothered by this video, I am too. Spouting off racial epithats however, is uncalled for.

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VikingMan

As marketers we understand the concept that poeple will not "act" on something until they have heard it repeated over and over and over. You cannot just put an advert in a magazine and expect a flood of business. You have to put that advert in the magazine month after month to being to see the full results of your efforts.

Same with news. People can hear about something but unless CNN, FOX, or any of the other outlets speak about a story over and over and over than it does not exist as far as most of the public is concerned.

kmanrox

war happens... if you dont think your brain would be fucked if you experienced war you're wrong... unless you were in war and saw alot of combat you have no right to sit behind your computer and whine about it... yes it was wrong what he did, tragic and cruel even... not even i would do that and im a pretty cruel, likes-to-fight-all-the-time kind of guy... but i havent been in the thick of war, who knows how it'd twist me.... or anyone for that matter...

tossing a puppy is probably G rated compared to many of the atrocities going on from both sides of the fence...

how about the westerners getting their necks slit open on camera while they're bound? how about the supporters of a free iraq getting lined up and executed?

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VikingMan

Anthony,

If you think that is racial I am sorry. The guy was white, I am white. I used the term "slope heads" in place of "Neanderthals", or "knuckle draggers".

Thanks for the tip. I will choose my words more carefully next time.

Bliz

Just went to LiveLeak and the first video I click on was a real stellar preformence...

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=4c1_1204552006

An apache comes in a blows up the wrong building. Then they fire a few hundred rounds and when the gunfire stops a solider says, "there's nothing there!"

Yes the solider throwing an puppy off the cliff was sick, sad, and cruel. Although nothing compared to the daily slaughter of innocent Iraqi men, women, and children.

Once heard an Iraq/Afghanistan vet laughing about punching Iraqi children in the face, and giving them chewing tobacco instead of candy while on "peace missions". WTF

I love my country, but shit makes is hard to continue being proud of it.

halfpint

A responce from Kathleen Motari on bebo

http://www.bebo.com/Profile.jsp?MemberId=3042738902

Kathleen Motari
thank you to the people defending david. i cannot believe the reactions people are getting from this when there are other innocent people dying also. people believe in abortion but yet they cant kill a dog? this world is so messed up. people are more concerned about a dogs life than a human being? im not saying that what occured here is right but i dont know the conditions of the situation neither do the rest of you. for all you hateful people who are saying these nasty comments you are no better. if you think that saying these crude things makes you right then i think you need help mentally. david, i love you and whatever happens your family is here for you and we can get through this.

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Ayla_SquareTurtle

I love when people throw in shit that has NOTHING to do with ANYTHING in hopes that it somehow makes them sound more morally correct or something. Abortion? That relates here HOW exactly? Fucking blind bitch. Wake up and look at your family!

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clutch_hicks

yes, war happens. it's a horrible part of humanity. but we're not talkin bout an act of war. we're talkin bout what looks like a bored jarhead commiting an intentional act of cruelty. there's no rhyme or reason and sure as hell no excuse for it.
i'm still not sold on the authenticity. but, again, if it is real...the punishment should fit the crime.

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kane

hum, imagine that. You train someone to be a killer, send them to a country where they are being shot at daily and they are killing people and then...gasp...they are not perfect civilized well thought out human beings.

Please. What he did was wrong. There is no way to try to spin what he did any other way, but when you live under the stress of combat every minute of every day for weeks and months on end it fucks up your brain. War is not a neat clean black and white little thing where the good guys are Capitan America and the bad guys are all evil Hitler types.

I have never been in a war, a friend of mine has. He has shot and killed people and seen things that most people have never seen nor would ever want to see. He is still haunted by it today even though it has been over a decade since it happened. Until I have been there and walked in those shoes I will chose to not judge this guy. It amazes me how the keyboard warriors seem to think they would be perfect, angelic people in a war zone when the reality is most, myself included, would shit their pants and do anything they had to in order to survive and keep their sanity.

clutch_hicks

AGAIN...this is not an act of war or even a result of war.
doesit really have to be said that throwin a puppy or ANY livin being off a cliff is just wrong?
quit blamin the war. it has nothin to do with any of this. there's absolutely no justification for it.
i haven't served in the armed forces...i haven't been in a warzone. but i am smart and civilized enough to know there are some things ya just don't do.
don't blame the situation...blame the idiot.
how is throwing a pup off a cliff an act of survival or an attempt to save sanity? by commiting an insane act????

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Brent 3dSexCash

Best post in this thread

SifuE

fucking asshole i hope he gets killed out there

Brent 3dSexCash

People develop all kinds of mental disorders directly related to being in combat. How can you say the war had NOTHING to do with it?

kane

You said it yourself. You have never been in war or a warzone (neither have I). One of my best friends has. When I listen to him talk about it I get the sense that it is hell on earth. You have moments where you see the light and you are happy or just normal, but much of the time you are stressed out to a level you never knew you had, your brain is all fucked up and you are mentally in a different place. It is how your brain helps you cope with what you doing and seeing. The point is that it gives you a fucked up sense of reality. For many soldiers the line between right and wrong becomes so blurred that it no longer exists. As I said, what this guy did was wrong. But in the end he is a trained killing machine. We cannot be surprised when we build a killing machine and then it kills a puppy.

If you raise a pit bull and train it to attack, are you surprised when one day it bites you or someone you know or love? Not really.

We know nothing about this guy. We know nothing about what he has seen or done or had done to him. I have heard some pretty fucked up stories about some of the things soldiers do in war to amuse themselves. Cruelty becomes a way of life. I don't approve of what this guy has done, but until you have gone through the mental stress of being in a war, maybe you shouldn't be so quick to be certain that you know what you would do, how you would react and what type of person you would become. The human heart is a deep dark river and war brings the ugly water to the surface.

Tom_PM

Fault can exist without blame.

War might be at fault for this soldiers obvious mental condition, but he can't blame the war when he's sitting in court.

Thats peoples point. If he was on leave in the US doing this, he'd be waiting trial right now and we all know it, sheesh.

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Adam_M

WHAT THE FUCK has this got to do with war????

This is just total bull shit with two assholes that think it's cool to kill a dog for on reason what so ever.

I thing both of these liitle weeds would cry like babies at the first sign of trouble

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firecracker

I hope HE gets thrown off a cliff..! Discharged and reduced in rank, I hope he gets someone sees that and prevents him from owning any living thing, or having a girlfriend. Disgusting! Sadly, it looks just like my 2 pups at home.

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halfpint

What you say is so very true, War changes people and affects people in different ways, We have noticed this in my brothers son since he came back from Afganistan. He was a very outgoing and cheerful guy but now he is very quite and almost withdrawn and he also keeps telling us that he is dreading going back out there in June and that he now wants to leave the army. I myself saw a lot of violence over in South Africa when we lived out there. Although this was not the same as a war zone it was still very violent and bloody. When you first see it happening you feel sick to your stomach but you keep on watching even though you know its not right. When you see it over and over again your brain almost swithces off and it just becomes the norm. I was only a teen when all the riots and murders were going on but I can still remember it very clearly and its something I will never forget. I am not sticking up for this guy as it is totaly wrong what he did but I understand where you are coming from

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teg0

the whole war is retarded, not just this one puppy getting killed.

america, fuck yeah

clutch_hicks

k...after watchin the video again, yer right. these two guys look like they've been through tet offensive and normandy like conditions. not at all like they're patrollin some worthless piece of sand ridge.
they're so outta their heads from the unspeakable horrors they've seen that they ain't lucid enough to have someone film the whole spectacle.
i'm not an idiot. i have family that has seen combat. i've heard the stories. this doesn't look like anything they've described to me. this looks like 3 kids who apparently felt the need to pull the wings off a fly on a much bigger scale.
i ain't buyin any stress disorders in this situation. this was an act of cruelty that was planned out enough in advance to have a camera present to record it for posperity. which by definition makes it premeditated. not somethin that people outta their heads from witnessing horrors usually do.

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Brent 3dSexCash

LOL @ judging their mental state and what they have been through from watching a clip of video.

AsianDivaGirlsWebDude

Looks like David Motari is about to have some serious regrets about his stupid act, if he didn't already:



For generations, most of the men (and some of the women) in my family have served in the military, including my Father (Marine), my Brother (Army and Marine), and myself (Navy), and I feel that brutal, cowardly, and senseless acts such as what David Motari apparently did reflect badly on the country and on the uniform.

Motari needs to sit in a cell for awhile and think about what he did, then he desparately needs some counseling (which I hope the military will provide so that he doesn't hurt someone else or himself), after which he should be tried and dishonorably discharged if found guilty.

ADG

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kane

So by watching a 20 second video clip you can fully judge a persons mental state? If this is true you are in the wrong business. Maybe you are right, but I would bet that if it were a few years ago this action is something this dude would never think of doing.

Here is a good example of cruelty as fun in a war zone. My buddy was in the marines and was in somalia (among other nasty, ugly places including the first gulf war). One day he and several guys are on patrol and they happen across a huge bloodstain on the road. The stain is about 5 feet in diameter. One of the guys takes off his helmet and lays with his head next to it pretending to be dead. He tells them to take a picture so it looks like he is dead with his brains blown out. They all laugh and take several pictures of each other clowning around playing dead with the blood stain. Then a few of them took the most realistic looking pictures and mailed them to friends of theirs back home with a note attached that simply read, "sorry about your friend." So imagine you get a letter and in it is pictures of your friend where it appears he is dead in the middle of the street and no explanation. You would freak out. A week or two later they sent the rest of the pictures with a letter explaining them and showing he was still alive. That is cruel. That is something could really cause someone to freak out. My buddy didn't do it, but three or four of the guys did and thought it was funny. Is that the actions of someone that is in a normal state of mind?

In the end the guy's actions are his own and he will eventually have to accept the responsibility for them, I'm not trying to say he is a victim here, I'm simply trying to point out that if you take normal people and put them in ugly, violent situations like a war it changes many of them and we shouldn't be surprised when it happens.

StarkReality

War and extreme mental stress may be an explanation for what he did, but never a justification.

Justifying this with the war would be like a rapist claiming he was abused himself as a child and isn't responsible for what he did. Our environment influences us, but in the end, everybody is making his own decisions.

Noone forced this sicko to throw the puppy off the cliff, it was his decision and I don't see any reason why he shouldn't face serious consequences for it.

spooky181

Haven't seen too many other soldiers do anything like this, I bet your friend didn't and millions of other soldiers that have gone to war haven't either. This guy still stands out on his own as a low life coward....

Pleasurepays

really? liveleak is totally full of videos of soldiers blowing people up and laughing and cheering about it....and they definately aren't face to face with an enemy.. they are at 20,000 feet in a C130 gun ship... they are 200 miles away watching where their missile is going to hit via the camera in the nosecone.. they are looking through the scope of a sniper rifle from a 1/2 a mile away.. they are calling in artillery strikes... they are blowing up entire houses and buildings where a suspected sniper is etc etc etc etc etc... laughing, cheering and screaming for joy every step of the way with each successful hit. thats what people who are trained to kill do.

not defending killing the dog... but people really are desperate to make distinctions that simply aren't there.

quantum-x

Hey that was what I always link to! Damn internets, I didn't share it!

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quantum-x

It's very simple: When you're pushing buttons at 'targets' miles away, of course you're elated. You've acheived something.

If you then had to go and walk into the building, sift through the rubble and piece bodies back together, hold someone's innards in as they died, and then front to their family and say it was you: you'd never lift a finger in anger ever again.

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Tjeezers

That fucker...

Karma will hit him back

RIP doggy

D

It's a great lil essay. :-)

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clutch_hicks

in that same 20 seconds you can tell me he's compensating for the horrors of his environment?
all i'm sayin is the guy AND his friends seem to have their faculties in order enough to have the foresite enough to have a camera ready to record their actions. and show absolutely no remorse for what they've done.
i appreciate yer example of how some people act under stressful situations. i've heard horror stories before and i know what yer sayin. not tryin to debate that point. even though you do seem to be makin exscuses for them.

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clutch_hicks

exactly!

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kane

I'm not making an excuse for them nor am I saying without doubt that these guys are having mental problems. Maybe he is just an asshole. My whole point to my posts is that war can fuck people up pretty badly and cause them to do things they would normally never do so maybe this guy deserves a little benefit of the doubt and we should wait to fully pass judgment until we know all the facts.

should he have done what he did? no.
Should he have to take responsibility for what he did? sure.
should he be shot, hanged, drug behind a truck or any number of other things people in this thread have suggested? no.
It seems to me that a normal person wouldn't do what he did there. So now the question is why. He needs treatment and evaluation and if turns out he is having mental problems he needs to get help for them. If not and he decided to just do this for fun, he needs to be punished.

In the end though, I'm a little surprised by the shock a lot of people have come forth with. Like I have said: You can't break someone down in boot camp then rebuild them as a soldier, train them to kill, send them to a war where they are under immense stress 24/7 and expect them to be perfect human beings.

kane

Most soldiers don't do this type of stuff. Most are good people and sometimes they make a bad decision or react badly. My friend tried his best to be a good person, but he admits sometimes things just flow over. When he was in Somalia he was standing guard over a bunch of captured rebels and a reporter came up and demanded to be let in to see the commander. He told the reporter he wasn't allowed on the base. The reporter got in his face and started yelling. The rebels started getting restless and he said the only thing he heard in his head was that he had to make sure the rebels knew who was boss. He told the report to back off and when he didn't my buddy kneed him in the gut then butt stroked him across the head. The guy hit the ground and he called to have him taken away.

I ask him about this and he says there were 10 better ways to deal with it. He should have just taken him to a tent and let the Lieutenant handle it, but he just saw red and acted out of impulse and fear. In the normal world he would have never done that, but under stress and under fire, things were different.

quantum-x

So summary:
1] Killing puppies is fucked up, inexcusible
2] War fucks people up
3] Fucked up people do inexclusible things, that they should be held accountable for.

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Jai

shit happenes like this everyday. whats the difference of killing livestock

pocketkangaroo

We are killing livestock for food. This was just for a quick laugh.

Pleasurepays

give me a fucking break. i don't know what they told you about war in the country of Butterfly and Kitten Happiness where you seem to live... but you've been misinformed.

tony286

also you never read about a cow or chicken saving someone's life.

helic0pter

When you see your friends head get blown apart, peoples bodies exploding, and kill people on a daily basis which could include women and children by accident, killing a puppy just doesn't seem like that big of a deal now does it

candyflip

Still doesn't make it "right".

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VikingMan

It IS and always will be a "huge deal" to anyone who I consider to be a friend .

RFremont

Ignorant, lying fucking cunt.

18teens

It made the news in Motari's home state of Washington at least:
http://heraldnet.com/article/20080303/NEWS01/367822819

halfpint

We are a funny lot us humans. Every day civilians are killed in wars and conflicts around the world but there is no outcry about this, now what this marine done was sick and uncalled for. When I first saw the vid the first thing that went through my mind was "what a sick bastard and why would he do this" then as everybody started posting on here it hit home that I have seen far worse things where humans are beating/killing other humans so why did it upset me so much, and thinking about it, its most prob because of the enviorment that I now live in, I feel safe sat at home typing on my computer I am no where near all the hatred and killing so it repulsed me to see that marine throwing the puppy over a cliff. But when I watched people being beaten to death all I did was stare at them and said nothing. It was the "norm" for me because it was hapening most days. Its very hard to understand what goes through peoples minds when put into different situations and even harder still to see how people react when put into a very violent situation. To this marine he might not see it as we do here, to him it might be the "norm" or his way of coping with a very difficult situation that he has been put into. We are all different in the way we cope with our surroundings and some people do very extreme things when they cant cope. I am not saying this guy should not be punished for what he did, but its easy for us to sit here and rip the guy to peices whithout even knowing why he even did it. The other thing I find strange is there is a huge outcry about this puppy and we all know that it was wrong but we all know that killing innocent civilians is wrong too, but it happens every day.... and we call ourselves "civilised humans" and you are correct it does not make it "right"

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