i think we should sponsor bumper cars at the next show. itd be such fun to see 50 drunk webmasters trying to kill each other with bumper cars...

Im just curious, did ibill SOLVE the 900 problem and find a replacement for worldcom, or am i just wasteing my time still allowing a 900 option as a form of payment on my paysites?

IBill has made other arrangements for their 900 services. I doubt they would make the same mistake twice.

According to their notification they have resigned with Worldcom. There are now two of them. The bankrupt one -- that isn't going to pay, no matter what you claim to be in court, receivor, creditor, somebodys babys mamma -- and the new one that apparently has the same management and set up as the old one.

Not that this is an uncommon tactic, I used to be in furniture and if any of you have heard of Levitz, they pulled a stunt like this some years ago, and cost a lot of furniture manufacturers millions in losses.

The ONLY hope, as I see it, their receivors have of getting their owed funds is by doing business with the new company, while the old debt is pretty much a write down, you just hope you can either charge more if you are buying, or get paid more if you are receiving, than you did on the old contract to try and make up the difference.

I don't give a crap about the 900 money, we payout more than that per hour probably to resellers. I just don't want to stand around waiting for the other shoe to drop if they happen not to get paid for some other transactions down the road.

interesting tactic they use... if an individual tried to do this theyd be in prison for years. but big companies can just go bankrupt & start over and nobody can do anything about it.

Well all i can add to this is it's true, CCBILL rules. I had a paysite about 2 years ago, that now i don't have anymore for soem reasons. I was processing for $100K and over a month for 2 years. Never got a problem with them, never had a late payment, never had a glitch or some other kind of fuck up.

I meeted up with them in Miami in 99 and in New Orleans in 00 or was that 01 oh well, they are all cool guys, and i owe them a Box of Cuban cigars. Hey CCbill next time i go to the convention you'll get your Box of Cuban Cigars.

Well sorry to hear about htat Lightspeed, and god speed ot you :)

I've been very happy with Ibill for the past year and a half. This latest stunt is really unfair. I was pretty surprised when I read their announcement about withholding the 900 payments. Won't be surprised to see this cost them a lot of business.

Jade

Still no response (or check) from Ibill

Guys, wtf?

Can you even spell SUPPORT?

I had a nice 1.5 hour phone conversation yesterday with them about my money I haven't received SINCE FUCKING APRIL! Of course the say check is in the mail.

for web900?

I didn't read the replies but I'll say this.

Lightspeed is 100% correct. But why just make ibill pay for this mistake?

look back through the boards, and you'll see many occasion of dialer broker or whatever having webmasters under him, then not getting paid by the dialer co. and somehow abdicting ALL financial responsbility to the webmasters. Bullshit. If you want to make money on margins like that, fucking pay your god damn webmasters whom YOU have a contract with. It's you damn job to make sure YOU get paid.

Same goes to sponsors who let "cheaters" keep sending in signups. Bah, all that traffic should be going to a "permission denied" or something page, or at the very least a 5 second redirect link that lets the WM know he's not getting paid. Underhanded practice at best, makes you just as bad as the cheater himself. "hrm, we could cut off his account, or we could just NOT PAY on it, and make cash since we don't have to pay him!".

But yes, ibill needs to be taken to court over this. badly.

-Phil

I'm not going to read this entire post.

Has Ibill finally released the payments and if not, is there a date when they will do so?

I was expecting checks from them too, but didn't realize this is why I hand't recieved anything yet.

Hello Phil, please take your head out of your ass and use your brain.

The two events are totally unrelated.

IBill has a contract with their clients. They are a billing service. If they have clients who attempt to defraud them (and it happens trust me) then IBill should not pay those clients a dime. But that is not what happened here.

Why should sponsors kill cheaters hits? If I paid a guy $100 bucks that he stole from me, I should not be allowed to recoup my money? It's not coming back from the cheater, that's for damn sure.

This is business, not charity.

Damn those are strong words...

Another option perhaps is change your name after you jack them -- then get plastic surgery.

i wonder if ibill_cathy or ibill_john would like to comment.

We have a number of new sites with designers right now and I have not decided to go with IBill on any of them. We have never since 1998 billed with anyone but Ibill.

Ibill has pulled some real bad ones over the past year. The 900 loss is not a big deal for us financially, but once this happens it makes you wonder how you will be dealt with if there are ever any serious problems and the cheques go missing. In light of this and the technical and decline issues beginning last year Ibill must honour their commitment to their clients. They just simply cannot pile up the ill will so high. It probably would not have been that tough to honour their obligations, and think of the positive PR they would have bought with it.

So who do we try? I hear CCBill is almost the same in terms of declines and arbitrary cancellations. Dunno.

You go CCBill all the way is what you do.. iBill is using an antiquated system written by programmers when the options were a lot less for a website. They're a sinking ship, never trust a sinking ship with your gold.

i have heard, at internext, they got a new deal that reoccurs??

CCBill has never missed a payment, never failed to pay a reserve, on time, every time.

So what, does that mean that you won't get paid for twice as much next time?

Kimmy,

While I'm sure plenty of webmasters due indeed cheat per signup programs and the like out of hard cash, plently more I've seen cancelled and NOT notified hardly "cost" the sponsor anything. In fact, the sponsor made money off of them. Just an easy cop-out way to make a few bucks. Hell, I've seen partnership sponsors cancel a webmaster for minor infractions (you resized our pics when we told you not to!) and then pocket the cash 2 months down the road when the webmaster wonders why he wasn't getting paid for this signups.

Plus, I never fucking attacked you. Why the hell go after me personally? Unless you of course engage in these practices..

If you can't see how the events are intertwined (not the same, but damned close) then well.. It all comes down to honesty. It's a shady practice at best, and you know it. I run a hosting company, adult hosts get dicked *A LOT* (yes, we talk amongst ourselves) on bandwidth bills. I never once have decided to steal a non-payers traffic or something to help "recoup" the cost. Been tempted a few times though. :)

I guess I wasn't clear, my point was let them know they are now cancelled, and will not be paid. Don't let it drag on and milk them. That is being underhanded in my book, period. If they keep sending traffic then, well.. Fuck em'.

Ibill at the very least should have as SOON as they knew trouble was brewing (note: I highly doubt they get a check from MCI every 2 months), mentioned it to people so they could make an informed decision.

Of course, I believe 100% they are liable for the monies. They had a contract. Period. It's just this underscores a rather common theme in the adult industry.

-Phil

i understand it is a new agreement, not the same deal.
this is no big deal to me because the 900 is a small %.
they are only another option.:2 cents:

I agree with you Phil.. Not to be the morals/ethics police here or anything, but this industry needs to grow some. Cancelling a cheater and then not bothering to notify him/her is straight out unethical - I don't care how much they cheated you.

Other industries wouldn't do it, why is it ok for the adult industry to do so? I think it has to do with the little high school punk mentality so many people in this industry seem to have. This is a business guys, just because there are naked chicks doesn't mean you can behave like you're 15.

Cheers,
Backov

Where's kathy from IBILL? I'd like to see a comment from her.

I too have had a few thousand worth of web900 sales "halted" by IBILL because of the worldcom issue.

It is fucking wrong. Simple as that.

We did not sign a contract with worldcom - we signed a contract with IBILL....

They are in breach of their contract with us and my lawyer is looking into this issue now also....

If anybody is looking for a joint legal bid against IBILL then please add me to the list...

If we let the off with this then it will only happen again....

Terry
www.projectvoyeur.com

Steve, I agree with you 100%. You didn't sign an agreement with worldcom, so it has absolutely nothing to do with you. This is unbelieveable.

Agreed they are screwing up big time this time.
Can't wait untill yetis is setup for us.

Anyone else noticed that Ibill is over 24 hours behind with processing or is that just me?

hmmn..


i think you are witnessing the beginning of the end.

This by no means is the main point of the topic, but you need to check your math d0g.

You got fucked ONCE, unless you consider paying for traffic as "getting fucked."

I dropped ibill for globill(see sig) three months ago, lucky me. No problems due to worldcom apart from a 10 days stop on #900 and the dialer service.

I once received a check from Globill where the stamp cost was more than the actual check amount :D

damn, how'd this post get so low in the list? How does the ranking work again?

Once again Phil you can't seem to grasp a simple concept here.

No one cheated IBill. Not us, not Lightspeed, not ARS, not Terry -- NO ONE. This is not about IBill dumping someone and not paying them for fraud violations.

If we had defrauded IBill in any manner I would not only expect non payment I would expect a process server in my driveway with notice of a lawsuit, and for them to attempt to recover their monies.

With cheaters grabbing 30 bucks here and 30 bucks there, it's not feasible -- you can't even go to small claims court for 30 bucks.

So if you have something pertinent to this thread by all means reply.

Otherwise start your own thread, since every time I see this one bumped up I think IBill has cut someone a check.

Lightspeed, this is old news.
it only cost me a minimal amout of money.
your programs are new, and not too bad, however
a lot of us have been around the block with
billing co's that don't pay. ibill has been ok, until
the mci worldcom politcal bullshit.
if i could only go into stories of the DMR, digiblase, epoch
stories of old.
they are looking to make it good, so we will see.

In other industries cheaters would be charged with fraud, i would LOVe to see some webmaster charged with fraud.

I'd love to see my dialer reseller wait for the telco money to come and pay me for my telcoweb minutes, but that won't happen. :BangBang:

:mad:

still no response from ibill.

:mad:

I emailed I-Bill a few days ago and said I was interested in using them for my 2 new paysites, but that I had some concerns regarding rumors going around that they are not paying their clients for #900 money owed. I asked if this was true and if so i f they could explain why they were not paying theis money.
Here is their reply
"I am not exactly sure what your questions are or the rumors you are hearing. Please see below a general overview of the products we provide."

Now if they are to stupid to figure out what I'm refering to i sure don't want them handeling my processing. On the other hand if they are avoiding the question, I REALLY don't want them touching my processing.

iBill is totally unprofessional. I could understand if they COULDN'T pay people - but it seems to me that they are just REFUSING to pay as they have lost money - and are passing it on to the customer.

This is why we pay them their commissions - THEY are supposed to manage risk.

I doubt the web 900 is a big part of their business - they should eat it.

If iBill keeps doing this stuff - CCBill and Epoch are going to cream them in the end.

900 sales make up about 5-6% of our total business, I would assume that proportion is the same for ibill

It should serve as a huge warning sign if Ibill is so cash strapped they can't even handle a 5-6% hit!

The people of Ibill are decent people, several of them are my friends. I wish they would all quit and go to work for a company that respects its customers.

nothing from them yet?

Hmm, I sent them the url to this thread and I also noticed they have replied in other threads this morning, Kind of funny that they have just ignored this thread don't ya think, Hmmm, could it be at the advice of their attorny that they are not commenting?

yeah, i've been thinking the same thing.

:321GFY

You know what tho Steve -- what if they aren't strapped for cash, and could easily afford to make the payout? I am not speculating on their cash flow, but I'm not sure which would be worse -- them being cash poor or them being cash greedy.

unless you run a free site.

adult: ccbill all the way baby! :thumbsup
mainstream: clickbank all the way baby! :thumbsup

i reeeeeeeeeeeally hope ibill crashes and burns one day with some type of corporate scandal. that would really make my day. sorry about what they did to you steve. ive said it before and ill say it again, ibill blows.