another gun thread ( win hotel rooms )

[DirtyDanza]

OK with all these gun threads there was a few comments on one thread that really errks me... having a shotgun as home defence.... are they good or are they bad... that is the question... shotguns are great weapons.. hold a great one shot stop ( with the right ammo) but are they the "best" for home protection in my "expert" opnion? NO

well what makes me an expert on guns and home protection? well according to the NRA, USMC, LVMPD, FBI, ATF I am considered an expert when it comes to handguns.. not longguns... but one thing I do know is that I will use a handgun for any threats that are closer than 50 yds I can hit farther but the fact of the matter is that if the threat is 50 yds away you can use evasive tactics to get away from the threat... now back to in home...


shotguns loaded with 00 9 pelets will hold a pretty tight pattern at 50yds but without the proper chokes you will have some off the target... maybe not the first time you shoot at the paper but you will TRUST me... now handguns... my primary handgun is an HK usp 40 why the 40? personal prefrence.. all handguns will stop a human being with the proper shot placement... thats where I come in....

if you own a handgun and do not fire at least and I mean at least 3000 rounds a year your not shooting nearly enough... you miase well sell me your gun...

how do you train at the shooting range? most people when they get handguns start shooting human siliutes targets right? well thats bad... next time you shoot say you want a tactial training target... it's numbered and has shapes like so

now why that target? cause this is where your shooting buddy.. comes into play... he yells off commands from behind you... "square 4" or center mass... sometimes he will yell false commands ... then you shoot at nothing... now all of these drills should be done from the CCW position from your holster with the ammo you carry.. both at night and during day... you HAVE to shoot at night.. 90% of all shootings are at night.. and if you don;t have the know how to look past muzzle flair you may " temporarly blind" yourself and render you and every weapon you have useless...


now on to the fun part... how are you going to win hotel rooms and possiably my company? well I am a pretty confident person... so whats the closest thing to real world sitiations?

Paintball...


heres how we will do it... I will run with a team of 4 others of my choice... we will all play with handguns with 8 shots per mag... you guys.. the keyboard warriors.. the ones that know so much about guns and what not... you guys will have full auto machine guns with over 2000 rds... if you can shoot me out you get a free night in vegas at the palms... thats room only with 100 dollar credit ( room service , movies, ect ect,) now if someone does happen to shoot me which is possiable... I will show you that handguns in the right hands will stomp anything...


so whos up for it?

plus I think would be a nice daytime event during internext or before when everyone is arriving... I got a crew of 3 already I just want anthony on my team and we iwll play 5 on 30 all day long... whos up for it?

[Makingcoin]

I'm bringing a bazooka.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

OK with all these gun threads there was a few comments on one thread that really errks me... having a shotgun as home defence.... are they good or are they bad... that is the question... shotguns are great weapons.. hold a great one shot stop ( with the right ammo) but are they the "best" for home protection in my "expert" opnion? NO

well what makes me an expert on guns and home protection? well according to the NRA, USMC, LVMPD, FBI, ATF I am considered an expert when it comes to handguns.. not longguns... but one thing I do know is that I will use a handgun for any threats that are closer than 50 yds I can hit farther but the fact of the matter is that if the threat is 50 yds away you can use evasive tactics to get away from the threat... now back to in home...


shotguns loaded with 00 9 pelets will hold a pretty tight pattern at 50yds but without the proper chokes you will have some off the target... maybe not the first time you shoot at the paper but you will TRUST me... now handguns... my primary handgun is an HK usp 40 why the 40? personal prefrence.. all handguns will stop a human being with the proper shot placement... thats where I come in....

if you own a handgun and do not fire at least and I mean at least 3000 rounds a year your not shooting nearly enough... you miase well sell me your gun...

how do you train at the shooting range? most people when they get handguns start shooting human siliutes targets right? well thats bad... next time you shoot say you want a tactial training target... it's numbered and has shapes like so

now why that target? cause this is where your shooting buddy.. comes into play... he yells off commands from behind you... "square 4" or center mass... sometimes he will yell false commands ... then you shoot at nothing... now all of these drills should be done from the CCW position from your holster with the ammo you carry.. both at night and during day... you HAVE to shoot at night.. 90% of all shootings are at night.. and if you don;t have the know how to look past muzzle flair you may " temporarly blind" yourself and render you and every weapon you have useless...


now on to the fun part... how are you going to win hotel rooms and possiably my company? well I am a pretty confident person... so whats the closest thing to real world sitiations?

Paintball...


heres how we will do it... I will run with a team of 4 others of my choice... we will all play with handguns with 8 shots per mag... you guys.. the keyboard warriors.. the ones that know so much about guns and what not... you guys will have full auto machine guns with over 2000 rds... if you can shoot me out you get a free night in vegas at the palms... thats room only with 100 dollar credit ( room service , movies, ect ect,) now if someone does happen to shoot me which is possiable... I will show you that handguns in the right hands will stomp anything...


so whos up for it?

plus I think would be a nice daytime event during internext or before when everyone is arriving... I got a crew of 3 already I just want anthony on my team and we iwll play 5 on 30 all day long... whos up for it?

OH fuck. Are you nuts?! LOL WIth full auto and 2000 rounds we are bound to get hit!!!

Sounds fun though!

[L-Pink]

May i bring these compressed air beauties?






kidding

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by Anthony

OH fuck. Are you nuts?! LOL WIth full auto and 2000 rounds we are bound to get hit!!!

Sounds fun though!

trust me dood we will stomp as long as we keep our cools... ask zombiegirl how I do on the battlefield....

here is my handgun I use


http://tiberiusarms.com/ the tac8 or tiberius 8 what ever you want to call it.. I call it sweeeeeeeeeeeet......just ordered the tac9 as well shuold be here very shortly...

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by L-Pink

May i bring these compressed air beauties?






kidding

HELL YES bring those fuckers.... the way we have been playing via milsim is bazookas tanks launchers ect ect... once your shot dead you lose the launcher and the other team can take it and use it aginst your team... but yea bring it... I will say this.. we will play handguns only.... as for anyone else... anything goes.... I have an ion that shoots 32bps (ballspersec) really really fast.... I just love the excitement of being underfire from 10's of thousands of rounds.... puts my mind at ease... hbahah

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

trust me dood we will stomp as long as we keep our cools... ask zombiegirl how I do on the battlefield....

here is my handgun I use


http://tiberiusarms.com/ the tac8 or tiberius 8 what ever you want to call it.. I call it sweeeeeeeeeeeet......just ordered the tac9 as well shuold be here very shortly...

and just for the record zombiegirl is on our team as well she is great on the field with a marker in her hand

[L-Pink]

You realize the one on the right shoots quart cans of paint don't you?

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by L-Pink

You realize the one on the right shoots quart cans of paint don't you?

yeah I have seen items like it and played up aginst items like it.... like I said I am up for anything... I won;t say no.... LOL.. I like the challenge...

[~zombiegirl~]

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

and just for the record zombiegirl is on our team as well she is great on the field with a marker in her hand

AWWWW... thanks Danza!! Crap, now I can't get the free hotel room since I"m on your team huh?
Too bad there's no pics of us playing paintball together!

[Angry Jew Cat - Banned for Life]

are you challenging me with an 8 shot paint pistol? tell me you're kidding me! and whats with 2000 rounds? a 200 shot hopper will be far more than enough. if you've ever up in canada (alberta or bc) with your team, let me know! your challenge will be answered...

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by ismokeblunts

are you challenging me with an 8 shot paint pistol? tell me you're kidding me! and whats with 2000 rounds? a 200 shot hopper will be far more than enough. if you've ever up in canada (alberta or bc) with your team, let me know! your challenge will be answered...

yup... any time.... do you play sup air or mil sim? I play both not the best at sup air... but milsim yeah you can play with your tipmann a5 or anything you want... me and my pistol will dominate...

[CaptainHowdy]

Originally Posted by Makingcoin

I'm bringing a bazooka.

!!

[scardog]

That does sound fun. Do they have a paint shotgun?

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by scardog

That does sound fun. Do they have a paint shotgun?

LOL... I am sure you could make one but then you take a chance on shooting someone with like 200 balls at once... I dunno i will look into it.. I am sure there is.. if so... bring em... LOL

[scardog]

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

LOL... I am sure you could make one but then you take a chance on shooting someone with like 200 balls at once... I dunno i will look into it.. I am sure there is.. if so... bring em... LOL

200 would be too many. 10 paintballs would be nice. If it shot 200, you might as well use a firetruck pumper full of paint.

[Angry Jew Cat - Banned for Life]

I play alot of speedball now, I love the fastaction shooting. The area I was working in this summer seemed to have nothing but crappy little fields full of stacked-tire bunkers, made for good play. Playing sup gives the game more of a competitive sport feeling. I like it...

Military simulation I really enjoy though, it's the only way I can justify paying to go play paintball. I pump enough money into filling canisters and buying balls already. I'd really like to go play milsim in a field with a really good setup. Alot of the fields I've gone to up here are nothing but old farmers grainbins, trashed cars, and flimsy tire fortresses, which are fun, but not THAT fun.

I like to play in a natural setting the most. Get my team out on the mountainside and you're in serious trouble.

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by ismokeblunts

I play alot of speedball now, I love the fastaction shooting. The area I was working in this summer seemed to have nothing but crappy little fields full of stacked-tire bunkers, made for good play. Playing sup gives the game more of a competitive sport feeling. I like it...

Military simulation I really enjoy though, it's the only way I can justify paying to go play paintball. I pump enough money into filling canisters and buying balls already. I'd really like to go play milsim in a field with a really good setup. Alot of the fields I've gone to up here are nothing but old farmers grainbins, trashed cars, and flimsy tire fortresses, which are fun, but not THAT fun.

I like to play in a natural setting the most. Get my team out on the mountainside and you're in serious trouble.

nice .... we have a few fields here that are all NPPL size supair fields.. I play both all the time... supair on wensdays scenairo on sats and sundays... I play sup with my ion pretty much fully loaded virtue board freak kit... yadda yadda about 1800$ bucks worth.... was playing with LTZ alot here I dunno if you follow NPPL or Xball at all.... I didn't make the supair challenge because in supair like you said it's a very fast paced sport game .... I am good but no where near good enough to run my mouth for supair...

on to mil sim / scenario..

now this I can run my mouth at because we are a team of 5 with handgun only that have gone un defeated all year for SPPL our fields we play on here are great we have abuot 4 if you ICQ me I will show you photos and what not.... we have everything from underground tunnels to catacombs to abandon cars, city simulation... we run drills on everything in the urban field... we just got a contract to train swat for san bernadino , and north las vegas police on it...

our team consist of
myself fmr ssgt USMC
my right hand man which he was some shit with ireland I have no idea he don;t speak much but he is good
a fmr navy seal
and a guy who is just a radical at it...
then a sniper that is gone on active right now

so we have a blast and have a good time at it....

[Mr. Romance]

Originally Posted by L-Pink

May i bring these compressed air beauties?






kidding

those are cool
]
Mr. Romance

[fuzebox]

Shotgun no good for home defence? A couple security guys recommended a shotty to me to keep under the bed or something. Partly because they're cheap, and there's a good chance I'll hit whoever's breaking in even if it's dark or I'm drunk etc

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by fuzebox

Shotgun no good for home defence? A couple security guys recommended a shotty to me to keep under the bed or something. Partly because they're cheap, and there's a good chance I'll hit whoever's breaking in even if it's dark or I'm drunk etc

this is true... but what else will you hit with it is the question?... what goes up must come down... if 2 of the 9 pellets miss the target then where do they go? thats the only point I am making... if you were staying at my huose and someone broke in and took you hostage I have no doubt in my mind I could one shot stop the situation with you getting no more than a little blood from the perp on ya... with shottys it's also hard to "flight" mechenisim rather than fight.. shottys are bulky and long to "get the hell outta dodge" and take new ground... many many reasons why handguns beat shotguns... but I am only one person.. the bottom line if you ask me is get what makes you feel comfy... if you get a shotty cause everyone says geta shotty and you hate it.. chances are you are going to use it bad during a real world situation... so go with what you want and like and most importantly can shoot half way decent...


personal prefrence....

but from a tactics and elemnation point of view I keep my HK... now if you want me to use a glock I will take the slingshot over the glock.. at least I know my hand will survive a slingshot

[Evil1]

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

so whats the closest thing to real world sitiations?

Paintball...

Not even close, theres no fear of death in paintball. in one situation worst case senario is you have laundry to do, in the other worst case is you are dead.

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

heres how we will do it... I will run with a team of 4 others of my choice... we will all play with handguns with 8 shots per mag... you guys.. the keyboard warriors..

keyboard warrior. exactly what you look like right now.

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by Evil1

Not even close, theres no fear of death in paintball. in one situation worst case senario is you have laundry to do, in the other worst case is you are dead.

keyboard warrior. exactly what you look like right now.

it's not so much death that we are afriad of it's getting shot... and if you think there is no fear then come to the field and see if you shake when paint is whizzing past your head at 200mph

[Darkland]

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

... if 2 of the 9 pellets miss the target then where do they go? thats the only point I am making...

but from a tactics and elemnation point of view I keep my HK... now if you want me to use a glock I will take the slingshot over the glock.. at least I know my hand will survive a slingshot

If your so "qualified" you would "know" the reasons why shotguns are said to be the best home defense. I come from a LEO background and used to teach this to civilians...

1. Unless your in a mansion your gonna be in a close quarters situation 10-15 feet, 20 tops. You significantly increase your odds of striking down your target with a shotgun due to large radius of damage.

2. As mentioned above reflex shots will be more accurate over a handgun.

3. Shotguns are much more cost efficient, easy to use and reliable(less parts) to the general public because of the simple point and shoot of a shotgun.

4. And this is the most "Important" thing people dont think about. With a handgun as you only defense you have the potential for injury to your family and neighbors. Missed bullets dont stop for mere wood and sheetrock, they continue untill all there energy has been spent and I have seen cases where this has happened and collateral damage occured.

Also not all shotguns sold today are cumbersome, my riot style shotgun is compact enough for me to do a 360 in a small hallway. So in this regard it would depend on the "Type" of shotgun that makes it an ideal weapon. A hunting/skeet shotgun would not make a good home defense weapon.

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by Darkland

If your so "qualified" you would "know" the reasons why shotguns are said to be the best home defense. I come from a LEO background and used to teach this to civilians...

1. Unless your in a mansion your gonna be in a close quarters situation 10-15 feet, 20 tops. You significantly increase your odds of striking down your target with a shotgun due to large radius of damage.

2. As mentioned above reflex shots will be more accurate over a handgun.

3. Shotguns are much more cost efficient, easy to use and reliable(less parts) to the general public because of the simple point and shoot of a shotgun.

4. And this is the most "Important" thing people dont think about. With a handgun as you only defense you have the potential for injury to your family and neighbors. Missed bullets dont stop for mere wood and sheetrock, they continue untill all there energy has been spent and I have seen cases where this has happened and collateral damage occured.

Also not all shotguns sold today are cumbersome, my riot style shotgun is compact enough for me to do a 360 in a small hallway. So in this regard it would depend on the "Type" of shotgun that makes it an ideal weapon. A hunting/skeet shotgun would not make a good home defense weapon.

you make very good points... like I also said earlier would also depend on various situations do you live alone? family? ect ect... I have a shotgun here for the wife and the way it is loaded is it sits cold so when she loads the first round there is an audible warning... then a less than lethal round is first.. then we go buck , bird, buck, bird, but I alwasys think of worst case .. hostage situation.. ect ect... I know I can shoot the dime out of someones hand at anything closer than say 40 ft.. 21 for sure but 40 is close enough to pick your shot... thats why I say handgun.. very easy to conceal.. if someone breaks in and you don't hear them till they have your kid... there are so many what if factors involved with homeprotection and self protection it's not even funny... the bottom line no matter what I say and what you say or what anyone says... if you feel more comfy with a shotty use a shotty... dont use something because I say so or you say so or tom says so... get what feels the best to you.... and what you can shoot profecently...

[_Richard_]

i don't care how good you are.. 2000 round auto against 8 mag handgun?

what do you plan to do? Hide the whole time?

R

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by Mr.Sexbankroll

i don't care how good you are.. 2000 round auto against 8 mag handgun?

what do you plan to do? Hide the whole time?

R

nah just make every shot count...... and hiding is the worst thing to do.. then everyone knows where you are....
move around alot then you keep em confused and always on the defence

[_Richard_]

that T9 pro is pretty sweet

R

[_Richard_]

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

nah just make every shot count...... and hiding is the worst thing to do.. then everyone knows where you are....
move around alot then you keep em confused and always on the defence

Every shot count.. i'd say so. I was playing these kids in toronto that liked going as skins.. said that it made the whole game better.. so funny

R

[DirtyDanza]

the thing you got going for you with the handguns is silent..... were not spraying and praying like machine gunners do.... I have played games where every shot I shot had a target at the end of it

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Evil1

Not even close, theres no fear of death in paintball. in one situation worst case senario is you have laundry to do, in the other worst case is you are dead.

keyboard warrior. exactly what you look like right now.

I disagree. First time with paintball, I was scared shitless. Adrenal dump is the same.

[_Richard_]

I disagree too, paintball does involve risk.. i've had blood drawn from getting hit in weird places (neck, elbow).. it's an interesting and fun game.

I would rather a shot gun than a hand gun for a home protection. In situations like that, i would rather have the dumbass looking down the barrel of a shotgun than a hand gun. Makes a bigger boom, and maybe the guy will take off.

R

[DirtyDanza]

look I am not trying to come off like a keyboard warrior those who know me know I really don;t mean to it may look like it on the boards here but.. paintball is the closest thing you can get to real world situations... you shoot and get shot.. and theres pain involved... adrenalin is flowing all the time.. reason I said the 25 on 5 of us is the fact that I am going to prove that training is where it's at.. and if you have weapons you should train with it.. I train everyweekend so I am going to prove that someone who trains with a pistol will pretty much take anything in range..... thats all I am trying to prove... oh and also trying to have some fun to... I love paintball... hahaha I am a firm advocate for guns.. but even more so an advocate for training with your firearms... at least as much as cops have to 4x per year.... some people never shoot the gun they own.. sad... very sad... just think if this country had more people that are trained like myself, anthony, the guys I roll with, some others here on the boards.... . crime would be down 10 fold...

[dennisthemenace]

The setup here is handguns for rooms nearest easiest points of entry (note, easiest, not easy) anyway.

.45 acp and heavy JHP is personal preference for handguns for here. Then in the bedroom, the "hold up" room if you will is the modified Remington 870 with 00 buck / 00 buck / 00 buck / slug / slug / slug (in that order) loaded.

The handguns are in case we're taken by surprise where we are OR to clear the house if we hear weird noises or whatever. The shotty (and other stuff if shotty fails.. shhhhh..) anyway.. is there with wireless phone and some other stuff so we can fall back to there and hold up until police come.

BTW DD - what is your camera and recording setup, saw the video, liked the quality. Thanks.

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by dennisthemenace

The setup here is handguns for rooms nearest easiest points of entry (note, easiest, not easy) anyway.

.45 acp and heavy JHP is personal preference for handguns for here. Then in the bedroom, the "hold up" room if you will is the modified Remington 870 with 00 buck / 00 buck / 00 buck / slug / slug / slug (in that order) loaded.

The handguns are in case we're taken by surprise where we are OR to clear the house if we hear weird noises or whatever. The shotty (and other stuff if shotty fails.. shhhhh..) anyway.. is there with wireless phone and some other stuff so we can fall back to there and hold up until police come.

BTW DD - what is your camera and recording setup, saw the video, liked the quality. Thanks.

Nice setup... looks like I am not the only parinoid one on GFY... makes me feel better...

my set up was done by my neighbor he works at the Mirage here in vegas as head of survelance... now tell me if he is the head of survelance why the hell was camera 3 out of focus so we missed the plates hahaha it was bad lens from factory it has been replaced.. then I record on a 16 channel I have 16 cams through the huose... and outside... not that big about 4200 sqft of a house.... so every inch is covered and then some... I mean we overlap each cam as you can see... what you saw on video was just front of huose.. ch 1-4 I think... I have ptz cams now up top and inside... now I have to hire someone to watch these fuckers all day long... ahahah but set up is easy...


just get a dvr either 4 8 or 16 channel depending on how many cams you want to run... get a harddrive right now we can record about a week at a time without having to record over what we already have.. which shuold be pleanty of time to go over things... we just run a 24 huor 7 day a week loop here...

[dennisthemenace]

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

Nice setup... looks like I am not the only parinoid one on GFY... makes me feel better...

my set up was done by my neighbor he works at the Mirage here in vegas as head of survelance... now tell me if he is the head of survelance why the hell was camera 3 out of focus so we missed the plates hahaha it was bad lens from factory it has been replaced.. then I record on a 16 channel I have 16 cams through the huose... and outside... not that big about 4200 sqft of a house.... so every inch is covered and then some... I mean we overlap each cam as you can see... what you saw on video was just front of huose.. ch 1-4 I think... I have ptz cams now up top and inside... now I have to hire someone to watch these fuckers all day long... ahahah but set up is easy...


just get a dvr either 4 8 or 16 channel depending on how many cams you want to run... get a harddrive right now we can record about a week at a time without having to record over what we already have.. which shuold be pleanty of time to go over things... we just run a 24 huor 7 day a week loop here...

Oh my.. I think I just came.. that sounds sweet. Do you keep the DVR in a strong box or something to keep it from being 'lifted'?

Do your cameras do IR?

Thanks for the info..

[killerkay]

fuck a hand gun ill take my .270 anyday

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by dennisthemenace

Oh my.. I think I just came.. that sounds sweet. Do you keep the DVR in a strong box or something to keep it from being 'lifted'?

Do your cameras do IR?

Thanks for the info..

yeah 75 feet in total darkness if I am not istaken they have 24 IR's per cam... I know my big PTZ on the top has 64.. all the others have 24.. all and all good system abuot 5grand worth... would have been much more but my neighbor installed for free and ordered everything at cost via his account through the mirage...

oh yeah the DVR is under lock and key... RF adapters on all tv's so mno matter what room in the house your at you can hit the button to turn on survelance and watch... also had to get a moduler to be able to operate the DVR with it being locked away... BTW it is locked away in basement in a cage mounted to the concreate wall with my filing cabi's for my 2257's and raw footage...

[4Man]

This is right.

[dennisthemenace]

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

yeah 75 feet in total darkness if I am not istaken they have 24 IR's per cam... I know my big PTZ on the top has 64.. all the others have 24.. all and all good system abuot 5grand worth... would have been much more but my neighbor installed for free and ordered everything at cost via his account through the mirage...

oh yeah the DVR is under lock and key... RF adapters on all tv's so mno matter what room in the house your at you can hit the button to turn on survelance and watch... also had to get a moduler to be able to operate the DVR with it being locked away... BTW it is locked away in basement in a cage mounted to the concreate wall with my filing cabi's for my 2257's and raw footage...

That sounds awesome, exactly what we've been looking for. The basement lock down sounds like something we've been working toward with the 700# fireproof filing cabs and safe.. Definitely gotta look deeper into a system like that. Sorry to distract from the main purpose of the thread..

So uhh.. yeah, hollow points.. yummy, ask for them by name

[Pleasurepays]

the premise of this whole thread is a little silly and misguided. shotguns are preferred for the simple fact that any idiot can point and shoot a shotgun and it has more knockdown power than anything else. the point of a shotgun is its stopping power... not its lethality. "any idiot" (without continual training and practice) is not going to pull out their 9mm and start going for head shots, in the dark in a hostage situation. furthermore, you would be hardpressed to find any incident EVER where this has ever even been necessary or even happened. the statistical chance of this happening is most likely so astronomical that its more logical and rational and statistically appropriate to spend your time planning on how to avoid getting struck by lightning... or avoid asteroids.

the "what goes up, must come down" remark is a pretty poor argument since you are comparing buckshot to bullets.... not .223 rounds to 7.62 rounds or any rational or relevant comparison... and the lethal range of buckshot is many times less than that of a bullet. buckshot hits shit and stops (or at least its velocity is significantly reduced to non-lethal speeds). bullets tend to go through walls, cars, across the street, through more walls and into bedrooms where other people are sleeping.

and your gonna substantiate your arguments by proving that training is what matters? how does that make sense? i could spend 10 years studying Ninjitsu as a means of home defense and challenge random people to a fight.... that still has no relevance to what weapon is the most useful or practical to the average person who is not going to spend a comparable amount of time training to use a pistol or anything else.

its a scary thought when admittedly paranoid people start talking about fantasy situations they are privately hoping for, somewhere deep inside, when they are collecting weapons, surrounding themselves with surveillence equipment and lecturing on killing people with head shots.

[Angry Jew Cat - Banned for Life]

Originally Posted by killerkay

fuck a hand gun ill take my .270 anyday

haha, i'm shooting a .270 right now too. can hit pretty much anything on the run within 300 yards, that 300-500 yards running is pretty sketchy shooting. i don't like to take long running shots. up to 500 standing is doable with the .270. i don't particularly like my .270 that much though, would like to upgrade to a 7mm stw for some long range killing power.

i don't know if i'd want a rifle for home protection though. i keep a bowie knife between my bed and my nightstand. hopefully noone with a gun breaks in, i'll look awfully stupid shot up on my bedroom floor with a knife in my hand...

[Z]

DD...we need to get to know one another. I'm a former USMC Sgt. I was a CID agent and was on the SRT team at Camp Lejeune.

As far as your challenge...sure man...I'm in. I've been playing paintball since it existed and shooting since I could pick a .22 pistol up.

Hit me up, we'll talk shop and shooting.

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by Pleasurepays

the premise of this whole thread is a little silly and misguided. shotguns are preferred for the simple fact that any idiot can point and shoot a shotgun and it has more knockdown power than anything else. the point of a shotgun is its stopping power... not its lethality. "any idiot" (without continual training and practice) is not going to pull out their 9mm and start going for head shots, in the dark in a hostage situation. furthermore, you would be hardpressed to find any incident EVER where this has ever even been necessary or even happened. the statistical chance of this happening is most likely so astronomical that its more logical and rational and statistically appropriate to spend your time planning on how to avoid getting struck by lightning... or avoid asteroids.

the "what goes up, must come down" remark is a pretty poor argument since you are comparing buckshot to bullets.... not .223 rounds to 7.62 rounds or any rational or relevant comparison... and the lethal range of buckshot is many times less than that of a bullet. buckshot hits shit and stops (or at least its velocity is significantly reduced to non-lethal speeds). bullets tend to go through walls, cars, across the street, through more walls and into bedrooms where other people are sleeping.

and your gonna substantiate your arguments by proving that training is what matters? how does that make sense? i could spend 10 years studying Ninjitsu as a means of home defense and challenge random people to a fight.... that still has no relevance to what weapon is the most useful or practical to the average person who is not going to spend a comparable amount of time training to use a pistol or anything else.

its a scary thought when admittedly paranoid people start talking about fantasy situations they are privately hoping for, somewhere deep inside, when they are collecting weapons, surrounding themselves with surveillence equipment and lecturing on killing people with head shots.

well in some parts of this post you make great sence.. but in others let me defend I hope to never encounter a hostage situation at my house or with anyone for that matter.. if it should arise I am ready... 2nd training... you have to learn to drive your car you do it everyday.. reason being you can kill someone with a car same with a gun.. if you own one train with it.. if you don't want to train then don't own a gun bottom line... your never going to convince me that a 25 year old single mother that has never shot a gun before needs a fucking street sweeper sorry... in that case I would say take your chances because with the gun there you may shoot yourself or your loved ones without proper training... stress training ect ect... classess are cheap and great there is no excuse.... if you have the time to buy the gun you have the time to shoot with the gun untill you can shoot the gun with the ability to pass a profecency test just as all law enforcement officers would... were talking a gun here... it WILL kill... and saying one shot stop is a fancy way of saying killing... we had an old saying.. if there breating there a threat... if my life is in danger someone is dying me or them....
now on to what goes must come down

weather a 22 or a 762 12 gauge or bird even slug there is always a danger danger zone.. yes there is no smart round that only hits it's targets... saying the pellets from a 12 00 is not as dangerous as a 9mm is a little off base because a fucking stone can kill you...

[Pleasurepays]

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

well in some parts of this post you make great sence.. but in others let me defend I hope to never encounter a hostage situation at my house or with anyone for that matter.. if it should arise I am ready... 2nd training... you have to learn to drive your car you do it everyday.. reason being you can kill someone with a car same with a gun.. if you own one train with it.. if you don't want to train then don't own a gun bottom line... your never going to convince me that a 25 year old single mother that has never shot a gun before needs a fucking street sweeper sorry... in that case I would say take your chances because with the gun there you may shoot yourself or your loved ones without proper training... stress training ect ect... classess are cheap and great there is no excuse.... if you have the time to buy the gun you have the time to shoot with the gun untill you can shoot the gun with the ability to pass a profecency test just as all law enforcement officers would... were talking a gun here... it WILL kill... and saying one shot stop is a fancy way of saying killing... we had an old saying.. if there breating there a threat... if my life is in danger someone is dying me or them....
now on to what goes must come down

weather a 22 or a 762 12 gauge or bird even slug there is always a danger danger zone.. yes there is no smart round that only hits it's targets... saying the pellets from a 12 00 is not as dangerous as a 9mm is a little off base because a fucking stone can kill you...

i agree fully that NO ONE should ever have a gun for protection if they are not willing to put in the time learning how to use it, learning how to get better etc. i also realize that just doesn't happen.

i dont think anyone "needs" a shotgun or any gun for that matter. if you live in a place where you feel you are in constant mortal danger and don't have the sense to move... then you are already making some pretty shitty and irresponsible life choices, the least of which... is deciding what gun to own.

anyone that says "if someone is threatening me or my family, i will have no problem killing them" is delusional. you can't make that statement unless you have been there and done it. i have been there. its not easy. in fact, i almost got killed when i realized i was not going to shoot the guy and he decided he wanted to die and rushed me with a knife. looking someone in the eye and killing them is not something that people can just unequivically state "oh yeah, i could do that". killing without thought or hesitation requires either training... or a psychotic personality.

i have owned a martial arts school and have personally seen countless people that couldn't even get used to the idea of hitting someone in a controlled environment. i would bet that the average person will fail in almost any situation where killing is required no matter what the circumstances are.

and whenever the topic of weapons came up... my response is always the same. "don't attempt to use any weapon that you don't want taken from you and used on you"

[GooSearch]

GO
KEYBOARD
WARRIORS

so where do i sign up

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by GooSearch

GO
KEYBOARD
WARRIORS

so where do i sign up

nice double a5 setup

[DirtyDanza]

Originally Posted by Pleasurepays

i agree fully that NO ONE should ever have a gun for protection if they are not willing to put in the time learning how to use it, learning how to get better etc. i also realize that just doesn't happen.

i dont think anyone "needs" a shotgun or any gun for that matter. if you live in a place where you feel you are in constant mortal danger and don't have the sense to move... then you are already making some pretty shitty and irresponsible life choices, the least of which... is deciding what gun to own.

anyone that says "if someone is threatening me or my family, i will have no problem killing them" is delusional. you can't make that statement unless you have been there and done it. i have been there. its not easy. in fact, i almost got killed when i realized i was not going to shoot the guy and he decided he wanted to die and rushed me with a knife. looking someone in the eye and killing them is not something that people can just unequivically state "oh yeah, i could do that". killing without thought or hesitation requires either training... or a psychotic personality.

i have owned a martial arts school and have personally seen countless people that couldn't even get used to the idea of hitting someone in a controlled environment. i would bet that the average person will fail in almost any situation where killing is required no matter what the circumstances are.

and whenever the topic of weapons came up... my response is always the same. "don't attempt to use any weapon that you don't want taken from you and used on you"

this is true... no one needs a gun.. it is a personal choice... my reason may differ from your reason which may differ from anyone elses... and as far as what situations I have been in and how I would act? I will not speak of to confirm nor deny... and your right... but one thing that the human brain has in it the the ability to harness it's killer instinct with a little bit of training... nature is survival of the beast no matter how you look at it... you answer the threads with a very wise statement " never have a weapon that you would not wants used on you" I like that one... but let me add my own

as the famous t-shirt said " SHIT HAPPENDS" and when it does it does not hurt to have a bit of training... even a 80 hour class for any gun owner would be enough...

[~zombiegirl~]

omg, that was a lots o text to scroll through. SO what's going on DD? Is there enough peeps to put together some games or what??
I can attest that Danza is amazing with just his pistols against guys with machine guns, etc. I'll play with a pistol too if this is happening