well spill the beans man, what you talkin bout willis? inuendo is so unbecoming of you. are you saying I owe someone money ? or there is something wrong with my link sales?

not going to get involved in more drama.. :thumbsup

Here is what Jonah is talking about, he delivered a sub par product and we got burned by him on it so he thinks we still owe him for his time.

[16:59] Jonah: i never received payment for the dvd project.
[16:59] Jonah: and you stopped answering icqs
[17:01] Joesho: ahh that, well if you want to dispute that on the board, lets have at it man, that was Earls decision due to you substandard work in his view. he paid you 1700 deposit, you went 4 weeks past time deadline and delivered a subpar product that had to be re done by a professional studio. I remeber when earl and I broke up that I apologized to you for fighting wiht you on a message board over the adultseriescash purchase. but if you want to go back to fighting we sure can. I prefer not to but it is up to you .
[17:02] Jonah: i sent multiple messages (which i still have) asking what changes you'd like so we could complete the project honorably.
[17:02] Joesho: you are a decent guy in my book jonah, if you feel slighted then lets take care of it .
[17:03] Joesho: you did not do a good job in earls determination and he dedcided to go a different direction, and that is what we did.
[17:03] Joesho: but if you prefer to fight with me over your work, when it is not an issue live now, we can certainly do that too, as I will not just let an inundendo sit out there that I owe someone something wiht out it being true .
[17:04] Jonah: i do feel slighted. It was a (very) rushed project because you wanted it fast to show to distributors. You wanted to see something right away, so i sent what we had at that point. It was a big project, and i took a big loss on it.. that's not right.

As far as i;m concerned, I offered to fix any problems, and the payment is outstanding.
[17:05] Joesho: Jack contacted you as a matter of fact to discuss it wiht you as I was not going to discuss it further, as I had to get the project done on a timeline, and you put him on ignore.
[17:05] Jonah: yeah, you were my contact, and my agreement was with you, besides Jack was contacting me about Adult Series Cash, not the dvd.
[17:06] Joesho: well lets take it to the board then if you prefer, as you are not owed anything by me and never have been, NO ONE will or does pay for substandard work. you delivered us substandard work in the decision makers eyes and that is the end of the story. do you want to discuss it on the board now >
[17:06] Joesho: and it was 4 weeks late and yes it was a rush project, and fixxing it was not an option when it was done so poorly in the first place, so I had to find a production house to do it correctly.
[17:07] Jonah: there is no such thing as correctly.. its subjective.
[17:07] Jonah: and i offered any changes you saw fit.. honorably.
[17:09] Jonah: anyhow, i'm over it.. doing very well now with mainstream. I just think it sucks how you bash JTF.. especially all the ups and downs you've been through yourself. And i know that you don't you pay your bills.
[17:11] Joesho: well we were the buyer and it was unsatisfactory to us at the time, so we spent almost 18K to have another 6,000 discs made profesionally, if your work would have been objectivly acceptible we would have used it , but it was not and you got a 1700 deposit and never returned any of the orignal material to us in fact. Earl wanted to sue you for it LOL and I said not worth it and lets let it go.. I never hammered you about doing shitty work and had no intention of ever doing so, bnut with your inuendo out there now I mkust answer that what you are referring to is an old disputed project that you did unsatisfactorily and the product you produced was in fqact trashed and never used, and we had to spend a great amount opf money to get it done right, you caused us over a mont hdelay and cost us thousands of dollars by sending us soemthing less than what you claimed you could do . do you want to dispute that with me now ?
[17:11] Joesho: I always pauy my bills Jonah whne they are due and done correctly and not substandard work.
[17:12] Jonah: i still have all the footage.
[17:12] Joesho: Although I in fact argued for you and got you the gig, when we were gonna drop you in the first place after you started a week late, so yeah that part was my fault I guess to believe that you could get done what yu said because I liked you .
[17:13] Joesho: Well earl actually wants it back, I am not partners with him any longer as of Jan. but you can send it to him it would make him happy , I bet he has fogot now about you and it though actually
[17:13] Jonah: he can buy it from me.
[17:13] Joesho: JTF is an asshole that bashes people all the time a racist and wishes death on people and runs his motuh constantly.
[17:13] Joesho: That is between you and him then, as I am not advocating his position any longer for him.
[17:14] Joesho: feel freeto call him anytime do you need the number ?
[17:15] Joesho: and as far as your inuendo on the board, I guess unless you answer it that I in fact do not owe anything or my product is not bad, then I will have to set the record straight and we can spend the night arguing with each other on the board about your work product being sufficent enough for us to pay you on it or not . i would rather not as I wish you no ill fellings as I said to ytou befoere, but now you have started something there I must acknoledge and defend . what would you like t5o do ?
[17:16] Jonah: I wouldn't call earl, he owes me money he's refused to pay.. if i wasn't such an honorable person myself, i would have sold the footage 10 times already.
[17:16] Joesho: That is between you and earl at this point., but your message board comment is between me and you. how would you like to resolve it ?
[17:17] Jonah: i don't give a shit what you write on gfy. The people that matter can see that you're bottom feeding, and the newbs.. well.. hopefully they can afford $1 links.
[17:19] Joesho: OK no worries then have a good day Jonah, and best wishes to you and your mainstream stuff. I am offering a product to people that they can afford to get started with, and as for people that matter well i guess we will see who has the links on the product, those are the people that matter to me . :-)
[17:21] Joesho: Glad to know your inuendo was just that inuendo about a product you did poorly in an industry you say you now do nothing in and to know that you think newbs are some sort of lesser species as you were once a newb and had to get out because you couldnt make money in the industry youself 9 other than selling me your company) wich I paid you in full for a good amount as a matter of fact. ( since it was what it was and what you said so I paid it in full!) but the video editing work you did was not and that is unfortunate actually.
[17:23] Jonah: never claimed to achieve anything great in adult.. and you shouldn't either. Also don't post that you don't owe anyone in the industry a dime, because actually you do. That's why i posted, and for the time-being, that's all i;m going to post.
[17:24] Joesho: wel I do not owe anyone anything. you work was substandard and like I said late by 4 weeks and cost us a tremendous amount of extra pressure and money. to bad i had high hopes for you at that point actually.
[17:26] Jonah: the work was the best it could be at that time, and budget. I had only gotten graphics a week or so earlier from Nick papgorgio. You'r expectations were totally unrealistic because it was your first dvd project.
[17:26] Jonah: hopefully you've learned something about it since then. It was a very cheap bid, and was done very quickly.
[17:27] Jonah: and the deal was honorable, on my part.
[17:27] Joesho: 4 weeks late and a substandard piece of work, in fact the production house actualy laughed at us when we showed it to them. I did learn something, do not use a guy to do work just because you like him and want to believe him, make him show you other projects of a like kind first hand and save myself a lot of time stress and money by doing so.
[17:27] Jonah: i think that's what matters most.
[17:28] Joesho: honorable? it was 4 weeks late and not a good product, and you recieved half the money for the project up front LOL
[17:28] Jonah: i laugh at projects, too.. doeasnt mean anything. Show it to a distributir.. that wouldn't laugh.
[17:29] Jonah: that half went to cost. lot of editing/graphics/rendering.
[17:29] Jonah: for me, it was a loss.
[17:29] Joesho: You and I did a deal for tens of thousands of dollars on your selling me your company. i paid you in full, you delivered in full, that part was done honorably, but your vide oediting project was a sdisaster
[17:31] Joesho: I am going to post this conversation to set you inuendo straight , so again, I wish you best of luck sorry you felt the need to try to take a shot at me when i paid you a lot of money and gave you the chance to do some work but you failed on the work part. Again i wish it didnt come to this, but you want it this way I guess.
[17:31] Jonah: this is a personal conversation.
[17:31] Joesho: no this sets the record straight on your false inuendo, unless you would prefer to do that yourself like an honorable man that you claim to be.
[17:32] Jonah: i'll post something if you wish..
[17:32] Jonah: i don't post conversations.. i think it's tacky.
[17:32] Joesho: I have said and will say again I do not wish to fight with you over the quality of your work on a message board that means nothing to you anyway, but you have made a claim wiht inuendo that is unacceptable to leave out there .

[17:34] Joesho: I think it is tacky too, but so is false inuendo trying to harm someones business . I never said your work was shoty and tried to harm your business while you were still trying in adultr, nor have I ever came into a thread and tried to cause you any grief whatsoever ( other than our fight about ccbill)
[17:35] Jonah: it's not false innuendo. I am owed the outstanding payment. I've stayed out of your threads until you said that you don't owe anyone any money because actually you do.. me.
[17:36] Joesho: But if defending JTF or trying to harm my business means that much to you, then we can dispute there and candidly with this conversation and any continuance you want. I prefer not to, the choice is yours i would rather you accept my apology for talking down to you when I did over this issue before, and thqat you not have inuendo out there about me . but either way it must be straightened out
[17:36] Joesho: I do not owe you anything, but you have the right to claim I do, i will defend that i do not as your product was late and sub par.
[17:37] Jonah: defendinding jtf means nothing to me, neither does hurting your biz. I posted that for you to see only.
[17:37] Joesho: Then at least my prospective customers can amke up their own mind and not just wonder what the false inuendo is all about
[17:38] Joesho: well as you well know I am not the only one to see it, and icq would have been a better place. not to mention this deal is over a year old now too.
[17:38] Jonah: i already posted. I'm not into more drama.
[17:40] Jonah: i just jumped in to remind you that you do have outstanding balances.. that's all.
[17:40] Joesho: sorry yu felt the need to not tell the truth that i do not owe, I will talk to you on the board I guess. as that is not sufficent and leaves inuendo still out there .
[17:40] Joesho: and no balannce is outstanding on a 4 week late sub par product that was nevfeer used as it was worthless.
[17:41] Jonah: its not my problem if the product was used or not. I was contracted to produce the dvd which i did, and was never paid for.
[17:41] Joesho: an un usable product that caused great and costly delays .
[17:42] Joesho: how is that a finished product lol?
[17:42] Jonah: how could you know what sub par is..? on your first dvd, and i offered countless times to fix any issues you had with the product. You ignored me on icq, and refused to pay.
[17:43] Jonah: You wanted something immediately to show to distrubtors at a show (miami i think) so i sent what i had.. i had already told you on several occasions it wouldn't be finished by then.
[17:43] Jonah: you disappeared and refused to pay.
[17:44] Joesho: what and take 8 more weeks to fix the numerous problems? it was substandard and we had a deadline that you knew about and you could not deliver a useable product . it is that simple. I am sorry your ego and pride can not take that as fact.

Jonah [5:47 PM]:
not ego or pride.. more like professional dedication.. i've never had negative business dealings like this before or since. Perhaps you're more accustomed.
Jonah [5:49 PM]:
While you continuously fail at one venture after another, I take great pride in my work. My video/editing clients include Hallmark, Chanel, Diesel, New Balance, Los Angeles Opera and others. You have no idea how much color correction we had to do on Earl's crappy, dark video just to make it watchable.

Very unfortunate that a guy that is no longer in this biz as he could not get the video work ( substandard material delivery will do it everytime) and yet he still comes to GFY as an addiction to watch for drama.

Jonah as I said you are not really a bad person, I guess it just hurt your feelings that the XX,XXX.XX number of dollars I paid you in full to buy your program was not enough to satisfy your ego that we were rejecting your video editing work. Even though you were paid half upfront on good faith for an unusable finished product. That was unmarkletable and went in the trash.

So, the bottom line is that Joesho is a failure, and a quitter. That doesn't pay his bills.

He got me involved in a dvd project which i succesfully started even tho it was very low budget, had crap video to work with, and an impossible timeline. I'm an NYU film-school grad, and have done numerous similar projects (mainstream)

I got 90% of the way through it, and then Joe disappeared from icq and refused to pay.

Now he's a $1 link salesman. This too shall fail.

STAY AWAY.

4 weeks late and sub par product.... do you still do work for any of those companys now? did you personally do the video editing?

ahhh so now you say it was the shooters fault , I see.

So in fact nothing is owed to you, you failed and could not deliver a product and are mad that you couldnt get more permant work is that it ?

90% done but 4 weeks late and you expect to talk to me still LOL

I had to meet a timeline and get it done properly so my days and time were to valuable to waste saying the same thing as I have had to say to you now numerous times .

ANSWER THESE TWO QUESTIONS .

WAS IT A COMPLETED MARKETABLE PRODUCT ? EVEN THOUGH YOU SAID 90% DID YOU GET IT TO ME 4 WEEKWS LATE AND UNUSABLE ( EVEN THOUGH YOU CLAIM YOU WOULD FIX IT, IT WAS UNUSABLE CORRECT?)

WHEN I BOUGHT YOU COMPANY FOR XX,XXX.00 DOLLARS WERE YOU PAID IN FULL? and is it not fact that your inuendo here is over a disputed balance on an unusable product ?

The work wasn't submitted for acceptance/rejection.. this wasn't a contest or festival.. I was hired. And never paid. And I offered countless times to fix any issues you had with the dvd.. but instead of doing the honorable thing, and completing the project as agreed.. you disappeared.

You're a coward and a flake.

And i don't come here for drama.. you're the only one i have drama with.

I'm on this board for biz. I work with MANY affiliates on this board.. more than you ever will selling useless $1 links that will NEVER convert.

Of course the video was crappy.. you told me that before i even got started.. remember? It was dark, shaky, and out of focus. Earl is magic with stills but horrid with video. We both know that. I have 3 campaigns currently running with Diesel, and another for New Balance which i personally edited.

Do you seriously think i would want more permanent work with you low-end, now dissolved company?! :1orglaugh:1orglaugh

One more, since you are no longer in adult business why do you come to GFY ?

did you make it in the adult industry at any part of it ?

why do you insinuate that newbies are not an important part of this business and are bottom feeders as you put it ?

why do they not deserve a good product, unlike those that you sent us ?


Anyone interested in a good traffic deal should check it out for themselves.

how can you lose for a dollar a month? that is only 12 dollars a year, hell one sale and you double your money and get the hard link to your site as well so the SE spiders crawl that as well. what is not to like?

Thats about typical of Joesho.

I currently generate 10-20 sales a day for adult sponsors, as an affiliate. The newbs aren't bottom feeders, you are. You're praying on them.. they have less to spend on ineffective links, and don't yet know how crappy your placements are. We both know these links would never convert.

YOU were contracted to perform and deliver a service and a product YOU FAILED. and it hurt your ego.

BTW Joes bullshit is already failing out of the gate. I'm working with someone right now whos gonna own him. Already does actually. 1500 sites WITH traffic and pr etc, etc.

10 - 20 whole sales ... and you say our 800K a day network wont convert HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAH

sour grapes from a sour person....

you did faulty work and got paid half for it, while getting multiple thousands of dollars paid to youfor a buy out of your company in adult by me remember LOL

Plenty of work ,for traffic buyers are everywhere Jim and they all need hardlinks and traffic as well, so I wish your friend well as it is not an us or them decision for most . but an all inclusive as many want all they can get .

I will have over 1,000 sites myself by new yrs, and many web 2.0 style to go along with them......

Got to go now girls... time for dinner here at the ranch....

see ya tommorrow .

Thanks for the ride it's been fun

Jonah--- 4 weeks Late and sub par material will not get you more work. it is Ok to blame me or the shootter or the weather, but the end result is all that matters when you are contracted to do a project .. this is not Wal Mart and you do not get paid just to show up.

Jim glad to see you got a job, maybe you can hang on to this one long enough to pay soime bills and get yourself right, good luck to you man and thanks again for the sales you brought me today I appreciate it .

I think actually what hes gonna do, and I advised him to do so, is double the quantity and halve the price of the shit you have.

Maybe WE TOO can then lie our asses off about converting 10:1 on GFY.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Gawd you're an imbecile. 10-20 sales a day is a small fraction of my biz. I do hundreds of mainstream leads per day, netting $1,000's per day.

Listen carefully.. I'm talking conversions, and revenues.. not hitbot traffic numbers. Everyone knows you'r traffic is crap, no matter how much of it you have. You've never amounted to much. And 800k foreign, crap, hitbot clicks isn't going to change that.

You keep mentioning that you bought my adult program.. as if that somehow justifies you're skipping out on a dvd project bill that you owe for.

DON'T DO BIZ WITH JOESHO.. HE ISN'T HONORABLE.

ahhhh... drama.