Yes... nice.... all good and well. But when an entity as massive as VISA, that affects people globally, starts deciding FOR YOU what you can and cannot purchase.... where does that end? I do not affect the bulk of the civilized world. VISA does. You can hardly compare VISA Corp with some newbie gallery submitter.


I shall. Indeed.

Yep. :) But in the end, Visa will bow to the pressure of money.

There's not enough money in beasty sites to force Visa to process for them. So they chose not to, perhaps in part to prop up their reputation to the general public, and other avenues will pop up for people to pay for their beasty subscriptions.

If they stop processing for anal sites, and enough people want anal sites, they will all get new cards and use them, and Visa will lose business.

If they stop processing for porn altogether, several companies will jump in and choose to do the processing. More competition, lower interest rates, etc.

It's the way the market works. Visa is not a stupid company. They're not going to cut off a $10 billion a year business because one of their executives doesn't like fisting sites, or anal sites, and if they did, who cares? The product was not made illegal, so there will be a demand for it, a supply for it, and someone will fill the role of the cash exchanger.

I'm not comparing visa to a newbie gallery builder.

I am comparing the principle of a site owner or program owner being able to establish rules for their programs.

Do you not have a certain set of guidelines on your own bbs that users have to abide by?

Why should you get to establish guidelines on how you wish to hancle your business or who you wish to do business with and not Visa?

We're not talking about denying the purchase of tickets to horror movies...we're not talking about denying your ability to buy guns...we are talking about beastie porn...an extreme scenario at best.

Ya know..... I haven't carried cash in my wallet in years.... no need for it. I can pay for every single thing I need with a credit card.... anywhere I go. It's actually very convenient. Plus I get a receipt for everything, so it's much easier to keep track of things.

But I think I will probably now have to start going back to the ATM's and keeping cash in the wallet again. Because tomorrow, I may not be able to pay for my dinner at Chevy's because the VISA CEO doesn't like Mexican food. That'd put me in a helluva bind wouldn't it? Probably end up washing their fuckin' dishes to pay for dinner.

Ahh... but it would be my fault anyway for not knowing that VISA didn't agree with burritos & beer. Hey..... they make the rules.... if I didn't like them, I should have had burgers instead.

Drama queen :1orglaugh

And you don't think there are people that consider movie violence or gun ownership *extreme*?

Take your blinders off eros.

LOL That's a little extreme don't you think? ;)

You could just get the new BurritoCard which has a 5% interest rate across the board, and a special 0% interest rate on all purchases at Mexican food joints. Or any of the other major cards that do allow mexican food purchases.

come on amp...be serious man.

I thought I would jump in. I have only skim read as this was already 3 pages when I got up this morning.

I dont approve of alot of this type of content but when you have a company like Visa censoring you have serious issues.

And this is of course partly government driven. What's easier for Ashxxxxx, try and process obscenity convictions which he may or may not win or get Visa to do it for him with the promise not to dig into their Cartel business practices which Visa hates.

Hell, we have Visa threatening to pull out of Australia all together right now because the goverment is doing a review of their rediculous interchange schemes. So Visa says you do that and we will just stop Visa cards in Australia - and you guys dont think that one day they will just stop porn althogether.

Actually I dont think they will, but I do think we are all going to be paying 50% acquirer fees to these pricks before long.

Yes I hate Visa, in my previous life I spent alot of time dealing with them and they are a law unto themselves.

Hell, companies like CCBill an IBill couldnt even exist in Australia because it is against Visa's scheme rules for this country. Thats right, scheme rules, not Australian law.

So what hapeens when they do that in the US and then we all have to try and get your own merchant accounts with massive upfront high risk acquirer fees and massive ongoing fees.

Trust me, whilst it may be a good thing to stop this Visa should not be allowed to not process transactions for cardholders that are legally allowed to view it from companies that are legally allowed to provide it. I dont know if it is legal or not in the US but it is in other countries so cardholders in those countries should be able to buy off sites in those countries.

Once again, I am not condoning content of any kind, just very scared of where this will all end.


Jayson

Not to stir the pot here (but then again I heard Clay does need a new dvd) but adult is not a drop in the bucket as far as money is concerned to Visa. They could shut adult off tomorrow and not notice it's missing.

Right or wrong, when something is legal, it should be available. Blech, you can't imagine how much that makes my face wrinkle up to say, given the nature of some things. Legal doesn't make it right, but the bottom line is that there is a line somewhere, and if that's what it has to be then so be it.

Eros..... here's the problem with your "VISA makes the rules like any other site owner" theory:

VISA is essentially a replacement monetary system. Not a store. It's completely different than Walmart deciding they don't want to sell guns. Walmart can do that. It's their damn store. They don't have to sell anything they don't want to.

But by VISA deciding what we can and cannot purchase, how is that any different than the US Treasury telling us that we can no longer use US currency to pay for something?

Money is money right? You can use cash to buy anything you want.

Well not anymore. They just decided you can't buy parts for BMW's anymore with good ol' US cash because they "don't want you to".

No Visa is a service provided to members in good standing.
You do not have a right to use Visa...it is a privilege that not everyone gets to enjoy.

Sorry man I'm not trying to make any enemies here...LOL

But this extreme view on how Visa is going to dictate my purchase habits in the future is just not holding water.



Someone else mentioned that if it's legal in another country Visa should process for it and it should be allowed here.

Does the same go with CP?

How about ordering drugs like hashish, and cannabis which is legal in other countries?

No I live in the US and must abide by my country's laws...remember when in Rome do as the Roman's do.

VISA's not a replacement monetary service. They're a convenience service. Instead of running to the ATM, withdrawing $20 and eating at your mexican restaurant, you whip out the VISA card, agree to pay VISA back for covering your bill, and go home without stopping at the bank.

Having a VISA card is a privelege not a right. It can be revoked at any time for anything, and certain uses for it can be restricted by the company who is loaning you money if they so choose to.

You can't go to the bank and take a loan out to buy beasty videos. They'd reject you in a second. This is the same thing, except Visa is across the board refusing loans to people to pay for beasty subscriptions in advance.

I actually have no idea..... how about we hear from some of the Amsterdam webmasters... can you buy smoke with your VISA card?

Okay.... I'll submit to that. Though it's still bullshit in my book, I will concede this one. Fuck VISA and their dictators. Time to switch CC's. Simple as that.

Also.... (was saving this till we wore this out....) if anyone is really interested... there are plenty of ways to work around this VISA ruling. Simply mask your site as something they will process for. (This will be happening in short order I expect.)

The bottom line is not whether beasty should or shouldn't be allowed.

The bottom line is that adult webmasters had best wake up and start realizing that putting all their eggs in Visa's basket is not a wise idea.

Mastercard's coming in strong with chargeback limits, so that's going to knock down some MC business. Visa's dictating what you can and can't have on your domain, and even what domain you can have.

Dialer people fight a constant battle to keep lines open and routes moving.

Paypal's a nice option but they are credit card based for the most part.

This is a wake up call.

Nice tag-team there Eros & Fatpad..... I almost never give up a debate.... but you got me with that one. Good job. :thumbsup

Where's that damn ATM billing when you need it? ;)

I just wanna know when I'm gonna get my damn GFY shirt!

LOL

I still love you man!

But not in that jock heterosexual way:Graucho

LOL It was good stuff. :winkwink:

bastards!!! :winkwink:

Actually Bonobos and Dolphins are the exception. Porn for Dolphins, now there's an idea....but I digress...

I'd like to remind people that this appears to be just Visa. Carry on with Mastercard, Novus, JCB, Checks, 900 etc. etc. I'm sure MC is just around the corner with their photocopy of Visa's rules with the header whited out, but not yet.

Law is provided to protect society from the selfish whims of the individual. Whenever the good of the many is threatened by the want of the one, you tend to find a law.

Therefore rape and murder is illegal. However simulated rape and murder is not, neither is beast in some places. It's not pretty, in fact I consider it to be pretty sick, but that's humanity for you. In general if someone is getting paid to provide such content and someone wants to pay to see it, then I say no harm done (yet), it is and should be none on my business.

Don't like it, vote for a new law. Many places in this world give you that freedom. Become one of the many.

i don't think VISA has the right to ban anything, Last I checked Government made the laws, not the fucking CC processors

http://www.totse.com/en/law/justice_.../beastlaw.html

Visa has the right to do business with who they feel comfortable doing biz with...but I'm too tired to debate this anymore...the arguements for both sides are available for you to read...LOL

Agreed, it's not about bestiality, it's about censorship.

You are right, KK. Too bad a lot of people don't seem to want to wake up.

plenty of animals are capable of homosexual behaviour.. i do actually draw the line at a guy fucking an animal.. but a chcick getting fucked by a male animal?? the fucking thing wouldn't do it if it DIDN'T CONSENT.. might as well whinge abtout how stud farms asnd zoo's collect sperm.. i still find it hilarious some fucking PORN PEDDLERS whinge about animals fucking.. hey guess what. if my dog starts humping my leg it's a NATURAL thing for the dog to do.. i hope anyone here cheering this decision is the first to lose their sites when an unelected VISA comes for them.. how are you ANY different from a christian coalition fundy saying that nudity is the devils whisper?.. keep your PERSONAL thoughts out of this.. thats what most of the guys in here are doing.. not many people LIKE beast personally.. they just don't give a flying fuck if someone else does.. is that so hard for you people to understand?

i do realise im coming across pretty harshly. but i personally find the backstreet boys more obscenely fleshcrawlingly nauseating than two animals fucking.. still not goning to ban boy bands are we... im just constantly amazed at how easily some people allow this sort of thing to happen.. if we allow boy bands, beasty should be legal too! :)

dammit if im willing to spend my hard-earned watching a shetland pony fucking a dwarf then so fucking be it...

iif you don't like beast don'twatch it.. don't create sites about it, don't advertise it... also .. don't give a hoot about anyone who does... larry flynt is against beast ONLY becase he can't publish it in his magazines and it's doing to him what his magazine did to playboy pentahouse etc..

i guess i mwould be lying if i didn't mention im whingeing in part because some niches i do actually participate in may or may not be next after this.. imagine if they went after voyeur because it's illegal to stalk/post photos without consent etc (and im talking simulated voyeur here too - i don't agree with REAL voyeur shots being posted on the web)...

anyone that brings up CP and beast in the same sentence needs some reality therapy.. maybe visit a farm.. and then visit a centre for the sexually abused.. i think you will find the answers you seek.

backstreet boys? you need help ;)

There's a lot of whining in this thread from the powerless losers... I guess your big egos have been deflated... along w/ your impressive stats totals. I'll laugh my ass off if Visa keeps going... and makes you all cry ;) HAHAHAHA!!!

When VISA dropped the Lolita sites I did not promote them, therefore I was not concerned. And when VISA dropped the sites with Lolita in them, I did not promote them, and therefore, I was not concerned. And when VISA dropped the Beastie sites, I did not promote them and I was not concerned. Then VISA dropped my niche ? and there was nobody left to be concerned.

i was going to make that parallel as well.. only it doesn't work quite as well there is such a big difference between CP and most any other fetish.. and it sooo sounds like im sticking up for beasty stuff as though i've got a few sites.. but it is along those lines.. if the animals aren't getting hurt and they're banning this shit it's going to be niches that i DO care about next.. and everyone that has ok'd this will have been implicit facillitators.

they don't make you want to puke???.. i would SOOO have more dignity telling people i was a chicken fucker on chickenanusesRUS.com than telling people i was in a boy band.


well.. maybe not.. but you get my drift.. :)

personally i'd like to see the backstreet boys fall off a cliff, so long as insync is roped to them... ;)

there's a good reason for VISA to ban bestiality because it doesn't involve 2 consenting adult HUMANS in the sexual act... i really don't think that they'll go further (maybe except scat and watersport sites but i really doubt it)...

My god, those who think animals DONT WANT to be fucked should think about it
eating some chicken or beef... Hmm Yes you're right, they dont want to be fucked they want to be KILLED
They want to WORK for you 4 FREE, they want to dedicate their life for MCDONALD $$$... In fact, Dead or alive
we just do anything WE want with them. And dogs ? what THEY want to do ? They probably hump your leg because
THEY want you to turn on the tv you'll say? Get real please... animals need sex like food. A dog humping your leg means what it means.
No judgment YES but also NO fucking care about where he will shoot his load

In UK or Canada, if someone fuck your dog he/she ends in jail longer than if he fucked your
own 10 yrs old daughter. Just watch news you'll see that your daughter has no big worth.
Many victims would love to be animals instead. With which money dogs, horses, cows, beef in your bigmac get their
rights to send people in jail for that long !? Animal domination on human or something ?

The funniest point: it isnt natural ! laugh. canabis, crack, cocaine is it enough NATURAL for you ?
If you think this type of sex should be punished the same way as kds sex I think you need some... Just wake up !

Zoo are about the same % than gays. If you complain
about the presence of gays in medias well its because you dont even know who are the zoos...
A huge part of altern, rock, punk, gothic groups. A load of tv ads and movies target them as a market. And they are !
Zoos may dont pay for porn because it's forbiden fine. We can't get their money? So if we want to look as a GOOD company why not ban them
and keep earning $$$ with any shit that converts. Censure ends where $$$ starts. Visa World lol, MasterCard , AMEX, be sure that no
company will change the top search engine keywords from your virgin eyes. Beastiality (even misspelled) will stay on TOP of any searches log.
Censored or not, accepted by CC or not !

Im in sweden, zoo stuff is fully legal here. Personally I prefer animals in my plate but anywhere else they could go... it would hurts NOBODY

"Democracy encourages the majority to decide things about which the majority is blissfully ignorant."
~John Simon

backstreet boys ? sounds dead to me

right bhutocracy, some wannabe with no dignity!

As far as Im concerned they can even fuck a chicken in their shitty 'music' videos... lol they just CANT look more loser

It will only be a matter of time before the EU will ban Bestiality/Zoophilia

http://europa.eu.int/ISPO/infosoc/le...s/protect.html

Right now a few countries in Europe are not doing anything about it, but its mostly because the countries are not aware that they are currently "safe haven" for Bestiality/Zoophilia... ex. countries like Denmark, and The Netherlands have strong animal protection laws, but when it comes to zoophilia, then no one has taken a look at this yet.

Today The Netherlands are used for processing Bestiality/Zoophilia using Visa, MasterCard, American Express, and even US ACH... some of the bigger processors in this business have helped to setup this in The Netherlands providing knowhow and backend systems...

I´m not here to say its wrong, but saying that Europe accepts Bestiality/Zoophilia is not correct - they have simply not taken action yet, but it will probably only be a matter of time.

Beast sickens me. But censorship sickens me even more. It's not up to me to decide what someone should be allowed to look at, especially when he/she is over the age of 18. It shouldn't be up to visa either.

Start of the dominoe effect?

put yourself in visa's position.... what's holding back consumers from using their credit cards like they do at the gas pump? The internet, as it exists is the largest un-tapped market.... something like 68% of consumers indicate that they are afraid of on-line fraud and you can bet that high-risk processing accounts for the majority of that.

Actually...it SHOULD have been the processors that stepped up and killed the CP and beastiality sites.

Bout fucking time.

I think I'm gonna take my VISA card and buy myself a really big gun.

Do they allow that? Or is it next on their list to ban?

I really hope the justice department puts their asses in line next year with that debit card fight. Visa thinks they're going to pass up US currency -the mighty dollar bill- as the #1 method of payment. I think not. The US will not allow that. They are in for an ASS reaming next year. Watch.

.cash-cash-cash-cash-cash-cash.

You are absolutely correct in your assumption! Give the bastards an inch they will take a mile! Once they have their foot in the door it will not stop!:2 cents:

Wake up Pedros someone finnaly snuff the rooster - Alice in chains is dead ! lol
Talking about overdose, I have a suggestion for VISA WORLD:

Why not automaticly bill some viagra to porn customers ? If your company thinks its
good for us it looks like you got this right ! folks looking for adult stuff (any niche) may encounter
erectile problems with their real-life partner.

Its serious deal... all based on the songs 'Oupss I'm not hard again' -Britney or 'Stay hard forever' -Spice girls
Visa reasons to ban zoo stuff aren't that deep an nobody cares so why not

VISA just follow my ref link: http://www.kwikmed.com/cgi-bin/pg.cgi?affid=123456&pg=webmasters.html

Peace