2257 - Non Us Webmasters - GoFuckYourself.com

rml1608 · 07-30-2005, 04:57 PM

This may be a stupid question, but ...

I have never in my life seen so much stink over something that affected only US Based Companies !!! In the past we have had so many different times congress has tried to regulate this industry and we will continue to see more of it.. .But it is in the US Only ...

There are legal loopholes, always have been and always will be ...

It is just a matter of time until someone comes out with a system so the smaller webmasters will still be able to publish their explicit content but out of the U.S. with no links to them ... There are multiple ways this could be done, and it will eventually...

Why is it ... the 2257 even has foreign webmasters so concerned? Because they are working with U.S. webmasters so often?

I think 2257 is a good thing, don't get me wrong.. It seems to be seperating the truly professional players in the game from the ones who aren't nearly as professional... I have seen this in many ways so far already.

But everyone thinks the sky is falling, truth is this is just another 'loophole' that has to be worked aorund as the bottom line.. JMHO though ..

Paul Waters · 07-30-2005, 05:33 PM

I think the biggest hit of the revised 2257 will be content production in the US.

The foreign performers need green cards as IDs.

rml1608 · 07-30-2005, 05:59 PM

That I can definately see as an impact - However it is mostly webmasters who are crying "The Sky Is Falling"

I find it 'semi' humourous as this is NOTHING compared to the huge change in CC Processing back when Epoch got hit with the (I think the amt is right) $12,000,000 fine. You want to talk about a change that DRAMATICALLY affected the industry... That's one of them.

It is also nothing compared to what congress has up their sleeves I assure you

mahoney · 07-30-2005, 06:50 PM

"Why is it ... the 2257 even has foreign webmasters so concerned? Because they are working with U.S. webmasters so often? "

Yes, that is exactly why

rml1608 · 07-30-2005, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mahoney

"Why is it ... the 2257 even has foreign webmasters so concerned? Because they are working with U.S. webmasters so often? "

Yes, that is exactly why

Free Hosting

Like I said, loopholes...

Make the hosting paid hosting, but you deduct the fees out of their sales. If they don't produce sales it is free. There will always be work arounds for this .. You will see affiliate managers throwing them at you right and left within 6 months as the scare dies off ...

iBanker · 07-30-2005, 08:23 PM

Whether you like it or not, the US dictates much of what happens with the rest of the world. You ignorant (Canadians) or other "folk" can attack me as you so often do, but it is the truth. (Take that with a grain of salt, I like Cnada, just having a fued right now with a guy that gives you all a bad name, I know Im childish)

So, to answer your quest, YES, US law will dictate international law and intent whether you like it or not. There is nothing I, or you, can do about it. Just be happy it is not Iraq/Russia,/Canada/Columbia/Cuba being turned to.

And as to your questions coming up next:

Why?

Because we are the dominating world power. Deal with it. I don't always agree with it but I damn sure have learned to accept it. When another country is looking for a solution, they don't tuen to Mexico.

Period.

iBanker · 07-30-2005, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iBanker

Whether you like it or not, the US dictates much of what happens with the rest of the world. You ignorant (Canadians) or other "folk" can attack me as you so often do, but it is the truth. (Take that with a grain of salt, I like Cnada, just having a fued right now with a guy that gives you all a bad name, I know Im childish)

So, to answer your quest, YES, US law will dictate international law and intent whether you like it or not. There is nothing I, or you, can do about it. Just be happy it is not Iraq/Russia,/Canada/Columbia/Cuba being turned to.

And as to your questions coming up next:

Why?

Because we are the dominating world power. Deal with it. I don't always agree with it but I damn sure have learned to accept it. When another country is looking for a solution, they don't tuen to Mexico.

Period.

I have to go but I will bookmark this and be back later....

rml1608 · 07-30-2005, 09:21 PM

LOL That is the funniest thing I have ever read.

#1) I am American

#2) When we went through Prohibition did 'The Whole World' Follow Suit because we are SUCH a power to be dealt with?

#3) Are Drug Policies the same everywhere as they are in the U.S.

People like you that THINK America dictates the world is what makes people in Iraq who don't know alot about our country hate us. We are NOT the world's ruler, we do not dictate the globe, and we sure as shit have many many policies that are not proper.

American or not... Your argument is asinine ... Oh and before you go there - This has nothing to do with whether I am partiotic or not, as I am

directfiesta · 07-30-2005, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rml1608

LOL That is the funniest thing I have ever read.

#1) I am American

#2) When we went through Prohibition did 'The Whole World' Follow Suit because we are SUCH a power to be dealt with?

#3) Are Drug Policies the same everywhere as they are in the U.S.

People like you that THINK America dictates the world is what makes people in Iraq who don't know alot about our country hate us. We are NOT the world's ruler, we do not dictate the globe, and we sure as shit have many many policies that are not proper.

American or not... Your argument is asinine ... Oh and before you go there - This has nothing to do with whether I am partiotic or not, as I am

Nice to see that there are still some americans with common sense

thaifan99 · 07-30-2005, 11:57 PM

simple economics.......... more money..bigger stick!

mardigras · 07-31-2005, 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rml1608

There are legal loopholes, always have been and always will be ...

It is just a matter of time until someone comes out with a system so the smaller webmasters will still be able to publish their explicit content but out of the U.S. with no links to them ... There are multiple ways this could be done, and it will eventually...

Money laundering is a felony that carries up to 20 years. Regardless of how many "no links to them" loopholes webmasters may find, there is some contact point where they get paid.

Don't forget, last year servers belonging to Indymedia were seized in the UK, upon request from the US FBI. Is your freedom worth that kind of Russian roulette?

Spankys Teens · 07-31-2005, 12:18 AM

i am european and as many other euro webmasters i do my best to comply with the US laws eventhough i don;t have too.
I like to keep it clean and safe, eventhough i am sure this law won't solve it's original issue, kiddie porn. The same goes for the proposed taxes...the gov said they would spend the tax revenues on tracking down porn offenders.
What i find absolutly disgusting is that they track down internet offenders (good webmasters) but on the other hand they seem to do so little to the actual private induviduals that go for example to romania and hump kids that live on the street. I saw this documentaire on the Discovery Channel and it was sick to see that people from all around the world have sex with kids for a couple of dollars and some food.
I think the DOJ should get these people first, they are actually having sexual intercourse with underage kids...of course the DOJ should take on the perverts running kiddie porn as well. I just feel that actual sex is more severe than jerking off too some underage pics.
I guess this aint the right thread but i had to get this off my mind...

Sorry

rml1608 · 07-31-2005, 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mardigras

Money laundering is a felony that carries up to 20 years. Regardless of how many "no links to them" loopholes webmasters may find, there is some contact point where they get paid.

Don't forget, last year servers belonging to Indymedia were seized in the UK, upon request from the US FBI. Is your freedom worth that kind of Russian roulette?

That's what good attorney's and properly structured shell corporations are for. Think about it, I form a corporation right now and shoot legal content. I then sell the content to a corporation in Europe, the Caymans, Antigua... You name it.

That company decides to operate web sites on a membership basis, have affilaite programs, the whole kitten kaboodle.

They contract your firm, of which you are the CEO of ... To run their business, make sure payroll is taken care of properly, and all webmasters are taken care of. You are then working for a foreign corporation who is operating outside of the U.S. law.

This means you have a seperate company btw who is taking care of just photo shoots being paid by the shell corporation not by your U.S. Based company that is 'handling the day to day operations' of the paysites in question.

As long as you are not an officer of that corporation then you have done absolutely nothing illegal. Now owning an offshore corporation, not being an officer is where the tricky paperwork and expensive ass attorney's come into play with a TON of paperwork... But it's very possible to do entirely legal. Just don't go around telling people you 'Own' Websites X,Y, and Z.

Serious pain in the ass ? Yes ... But when you have millions and millions of dollars it becomes worth it. If you honestly think there aren't thousands of people with corporations setup similarly right now to avoid certain US laws the govt knows about - you are naive

just a punk · 07-31-2005, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Waters

I think the biggest hit of the revised 2257 will be content production in the US.

Not only them. Don't forget about Web hosting companies. Everyone know that porn is a biggest Internet traffic source. And this source moves to Europe now. So the US hosting system will be fucked up very soon as well as the US content providers.

mardigras · 07-31-2005, 02:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rml1608

That's what good attorney's and properly structured shell corporations are for. Think about it, I form a corporation right now and shoot legal content. I then sell the content to a corporation in Europe, the Caymans, Antigua... You name it.

That company decides to operate web sites on a membership basis, have affilaite programs, the whole kitten kaboodle.

They contract your firm, of which you are the CEO of ... To run their business, make sure payroll is taken care of properly, and all webmasters are taken care of. You are then working for a foreign corporation who is operating outside of the U.S. law.

This means you have a seperate company btw who is taking care of just photo shoots being paid by the shell corporation not by your U.S. Based company that is 'handling the day to day operations' of the paysites in question.

As long as you are not an officer of that corporation then you have done absolutely nothing illegal. Now owning an offshore corporation, not being an officer is where the tricky paperwork and expensive ass attorney's come into play with a TON of paperwork... But it's very possible to do entirely legal. Just don't go around telling people you 'Own' Websites X,Y, and Z.

Serious pain in the ass ? Yes ... But when you have millions and millions of dollars it becomes worth it. If you honestly think there aren't thousands of people with corporations setup similarly right now to avoid certain US laws the govt knows about - you are naive

In your scenario, if you are shooting legal content why is there a need to circumvent 2257?

Most people here wanting to circumvent US laws are not shooting content, they are running websites. Moving websites offshore to avoid US law didn't turn out too well for this guy. Millions and millions of dollars are no fun when you're sitting in the big house

But hey, everyone who thinks they're above US laws ignore the truth and move your sites offshore with your various schemes, there's a chance you won't be nabbed.

07-30-2005, 06:50 PM	#4
mahoney Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Las Vegas Nv Posts: 5,318	"Why is it ... the 2257 even has foreign webmasters so concerned? Because they are working with U.S. webmasters so often? " Yes, that is exactly why __________________ Vegassexparty.com

07-30-2005, 08:23 PM	#6
iBanker Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: San Diego, moving to Portland. Posts: 2,758	Whether you like it or not, the US dictates much of what happens with the rest of the world. You ignorant (Canadians) or other "folk" can attack me as you so often do, but it is the truth. (Take that with a grain of salt, I like Cnada, just having a fued right now with a guy that gives you all a bad name, I know Im childish) So, to answer your quest, YES, US law will dictate international law and intent whether you like it or not. There is nothing I, or you, can do about it. Just be happy it is not Iraq/Russia,/Canada/Columbia/Cuba being turned to. And as to your questions coming up next: Why? Because we are the dominating world power. Deal with it. I don't always agree with it but I damn sure have learned to accept it. When another country is looking for a solution, they don't tuen to Mexico. Period. __________________ www.JasonandAlex.com Christopher's ICQ: 268-843-170

07-30-2005, 09:21 PM	#8
rml1608 Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Central IL Posts: 985	LOL That is the funniest thing I have ever read. #1) I am American #2) When we went through Prohibition did 'The Whole World' Follow Suit because we are SUCH a power to be dealt with? #3) Are Drug Policies the same everywhere as they are in the U.S. People like you that THINK America dictates the world is what makes people in Iraq who don't know alot about our country hate us. We are NOT the world's ruler, we do not dictate the globe, and we sure as shit have many many policies that are not proper. American or not... Your argument is asinine ... Oh and before you go there - This has nothing to do with whether I am partiotic or not, as I am __________________ ICQ : 253483920 DICK.IN \| RXAR.COM - ICQ OFFERS Last edited by rml1608; 07-30-2005 at 09:23 PM..

07-30-2005, 11:57 PM	#10
thaifan99 Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: London UK Posts: 3,029	simple economics.......... more money..bigger stick! __________________ ARE YOU A FAMILY MEMBER? CLICK HERE TO FIND OUT!

07-31-2005, 12:18 AM	#12
Spankys Teens Confirmed User Join Date: May 2005 Location: The Porn Land Posts: 1,414	i am european and as many other euro webmasters i do my best to comply with the US laws eventhough i don;t have too. I like to keep it clean and safe, eventhough i am sure this law won't solve it's original issue, kiddie porn. The same goes for the proposed taxes...the gov said they would spend the tax revenues on tracking down porn offenders. What i find absolutly disgusting is that they track down internet offenders (good webmasters) but on the other hand they seem to do so little to the actual private induviduals that go for example to romania and hump kids that live on the street. I saw this documentaire on the Discovery Channel and it was sick to see that people from all around the world have sex with kids for a couple of dollars and some food. I think the DOJ should get these people first, they are actually having sexual intercourse with underage kids...of course the DOJ should take on the perverts running kiddie porn as well. I just feel that actual sex is more severe than jerking off too some underage pics. I guess this aint the right thread but i had to get this off my mind... Sorry __________________ Banners - Design - TGP & more Trade: Teenies In Action icq: 256664696

07-30-2005, 04:57 PM	#1
rml1608 Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Central IL Posts: 985	2257 - Non Us Webmasters This may be a stupid question, but ... I have never in my life seen so much stink over something that affected only US Based Companies !!! In the past we have had so many different times congress has tried to regulate this industry and we will continue to see more of it.. .But it is in the US Only ... There are legal loopholes, always have been and always will be ... It is just a matter of time until someone comes out with a system so the smaller webmasters will still be able to publish their explicit content but out of the U.S. with no links to them ... There are multiple ways this could be done, and it will eventually... Why is it ... the 2257 even has foreign webmasters so concerned? Because they are working with U.S. webmasters so often? I think 2257 is a good thing, don't get me wrong.. It seems to be seperating the truly professional players in the game from the ones who aren't nearly as professional... I have seen this in many ways so far already. But everyone thinks the sky is falling, truth is this is just another 'loophole' that has to be worked aorund as the bottom line.. JMHO though .. __________________ ICQ : 253483920 DICK.IN \| RXAR.COM - ICQ OFFERS

07-30-2005, 05:33 PM	#2
Paul Waters Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Toronto, Ontario Posts: 4,402	I think the biggest hit of the revised 2257 will be content production in the US. The foreign performers need green cards as IDs. __________________ Paul

07-30-2005, 05:59 PM	#3
rml1608 Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Central IL Posts: 985	That I can definately see as an impact - However it is mostly webmasters who are crying "The Sky Is Falling" I find it 'semi' humourous as this is NOTHING compared to the huge change in CC Processing back when Epoch got hit with the (I think the amt is right) $12,000,000 fine. You want to talk about a change that DRAMATICALLY affected the industry... That's one of them. It is also nothing compared to what congress has up their sleeves I assure you __________________ ICQ : 253483920 DICK.IN \| RXAR.COM - ICQ OFFERS