Internet marijuana seed dealers raided by RCMP, extradition to US requested by DEA - GoFuckYourself.com

ricks · 07-30-2005, 12:36 PM

I remember KRL asking about the legalities of internet seed dealing about a year ago. The indictment says it is a $3 million dollar a year business that Emery was running.

From the looks of the indictment he is charged as if he was selling marijuana and conspiring with Americans to cultivate. His seeds have been traced to illegal grows in a number of states.

Mainstream media reports:

http://news.google.ca/nwshp?hl=en&gl...story_id%3D280

Here is the article from his site regarding the raids, a different point of view:

http://www.cannabisculture.ca/articles/4466.html

Alot of questions have been raised on this forum from non-US residents about what can happen if you break US law and do not reside in the US, this is a perfect example of the use of the MLAT between the US and Canada.

The DEA requested cooperation from the Canadians and got it without hesitation. If extradited and convicted, Emery will likely die in jail.

xlogger · 07-30-2005, 12:37 PM

Damn, where i am going to bye my weed from now!?

pr0 · 07-30-2005, 12:38 PM

the war on morality just keeps heating up!

candyflip · 07-30-2005, 12:39 PM

I hope he really doesn't keep a list of clients like he claims he does

ricks · 07-30-2005, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by candyflip

I hope he really doesn't keep a list of clients like he claims he does

Whats funny is that on all the marijuana boards they are saying the same thing, like 'I hope he dosent give up his client list'.

Fact is, the DEA most likely has his client list now, that is the purpose of the search warrant and raid. It is not his to negotiate with or to give up if he feels like it or not.

If they did not find it in the raids they could compel him to produce it under the threat of contempt charges.

pr0 · 07-30-2005, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by candyflip

I hope he really doesn't keep a list of clients like he claims he does

you better believe theres going to be several thousand american grow ops served over this

who better to attack than canada's most visible pot figure-head.....

emery won't last a minute in jail in the U.S., he'll roll on all his customers & contacts

candyflip · 07-30-2005, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricks

Whats funny is that on all the marijuana boards they are saying the same thing, like 'I hope he dosent give up his client list'.

Fact is, the DEA most likely has his client list now, that is the purpose of the search warrant and raid. It is not his to negotiate with or to give up if he feels like it or not.

If they did not find it in the raids they could compel him to produce it under the threat of contempt charges.

He claims to not keep a client list. So if this is the case, there should be nothing to worry about.

Gonna have to watch and see how this pans out. Thank God for fake names and office delivery

pr0 · 07-30-2005, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by candyflip

He claims to not keep a client list.

^ just re-arranged that for you

pr0 · 07-30-2005, 12:49 PM

I'd love to know who the other 2 were......anyone got that info?

V_RocKs · 07-30-2005, 12:50 PM

Damn... oddly enough it isn't illegal to order it... I like that.

BradShaw · 07-30-2005, 12:50 PM

And this has nothing to do with national security...... ding ding ding

People who think they are safe in Canada, or vise versa have smoked too much.

Spunky · 07-30-2005, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pr0

I'd love to know who the other 2 were......anyone got that info?

His assistant,some chick and some dude working in the store..He is based in Vancouver

ricks · 07-30-2005, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pr0

I'd love to know who the other 2 were......anyone got that info?

Gregory Williams and Michelle Rainey-Fenkarek were picked up in Vancouver.

Apparantly there were other raids and arrests at the hemp festival in Halifax, all done simultaneously involving other seed dealers, this is according to forum gossip on some of the marijuana boards that I follow.

Emery was definately the biggest in the business though.

ricks · 07-30-2005, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by V_RocKs

Damn... oddly enough it isn't illegal to order it... I like that.

I think for an American the possession of a seed is illegal.

ricks · 07-30-2005, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BradShaw

And this has nothing to do with national security...... ding ding ding

People who think they are safe in Canada, or vise versa have smoked too much.

Large scale distribution, smuggling and trafficking of illegal marijuana seeds to the US for the past 10 years is a bit different than a Canadian who alledgedly 'hacked' or exposed the vulnerabilities in your servers. Besides, you are a pornographic webmaster, it is the DEA that appealed to the Canadian government to get this special warrant, I doubt you have that sort of pull. Yes, the MLAT is there, but is is rarely used and when used it normally involves a crime of some significance.

BRISK · 07-30-2005, 01:01 PM

I think for extradition to be granted, his conduct needs to be punishable both in America AND Canada (not just one of the countries).

Is Emery's conduct punishable in Canada?

WiredGuy · 07-30-2005, 01:05 PM

Is selling Marijuana seeds legal in either Canada or the US? I didn't think it was.
WG

pr0 · 07-30-2005, 01:05 PM

sounds like the DEA strongarmed the canadians into enforcing this MLAT shit....sounds like they didn't even wanna do it

ricks · 07-30-2005, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRISK

I think for extradition to be granted, his conduct needs to be punishable both in America AND Canada (not just one of the countries).

Is Emery's conduct punishable in Canada?

It is a violation of Canadian law to export known contraband.

WarChild · 07-30-2005, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BradShaw

And this has nothing to do with national security...... ding ding ding

People who think they are safe in Canada, or vise versa have smoked too much.

Next you're going to be telling me they'll be arresting Canadians for breaking US copyright laws by downloading shared music files, and deporting them to the United States. Oh wait.

ricks · 07-30-2005, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WiredGuy

Is selling Marijuana seeds legal in either Canada or the US? I didn't think it was.
WG

It is definately illegal in the US. I remember some stores on Yonge St. in Toronto being raided years ago for selling seeds, not sure what resulted though. I think it would be a summary offence in Canada (which is like a US misdemeanor).

WarChild · 07-30-2005, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pr0

sounds like the DEA strongarmed the canadians into enforcing this MLAT shit....sounds like they didn't even wanna do it

Strong armed how? Despite what you might think, Canada doesnt just fold to American will.

Witness file sharing laws.
Witness missile defense shield.

BRISK · 07-30-2005, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricks

It is a violation of Canadian law to export known contraband.

know contraband in any country? or known contraband in Canada?

Are marijuana seeds considered contraband in Canada?

BRISK · 07-30-2005, 01:10 PM

The process for extradition from Canada continues to have both a judicial and an executive phase. At the judicial phase, a judge will determine if the conduct constitutes an offence in Canada and if there is sufficient evidence such that, had it occurred in Canada, the person would be committed to stand trial. At the executive phase, the Minister of Justice will decide whether or not to surrender, taking into account all of the circumstances and any applicable ground of refusal

http://www.oas.org/Juridico/mla/en/c...-gen-desc.html

pr0 · 07-30-2005, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarChild

Strong armed how? Despite what you might think, Canada doesnt just fold to American will.

Witness file sharing laws.
Witness missile defense shield.

ricks · 07-30-2005, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRISK

know contraband in any country? or known contraband in Canada?

Are marijuana seeds considered contraband in Canada?

It is illegal to export something to a country where the product is illegal, regardless of the legality of the product in Canada. It is the responsiblity of the exporter to know the laws of the country which he is exporting to.

Here is a similar case involving a product that is legal in Canada but illegal in the US and the MLAT was used in this case also:

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/20...?oneclick=true

ricks · 07-30-2005, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricks

It is illegal to export something to a country where the product is illegal, regardless of the legality of the product in Canada. It is the responsiblity of the exporter to know the laws of the country which he is exporting to.

Here is a similar case involving a product that is legal in Canada but illegal in the US and the MLAT was used in this case also:

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/20...?oneclick=true

Quote:

Daniel Pelchat of St Etienne, Quebec, described by Assistant US Attorney James Kennedy in Buffalo as one of the biggest providers of GHB in the world, was indicted for unlawful use of the Internet and importation of GBL and BD after 1,452 gallons of the chemicals were seized on Wednesday from his business and residence.

GBL and BD are both legal products in Canada (used in industrial cleaners without restrictions) but controlled in the US, they are the precursors for GHB.

candyflip · 07-30-2005, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricks

It is illegal to export something to a country where the product is illegal, regardless of the legality of the product in Canada. It is the responsiblity of the exporter to know the laws of the country which he is exporting to.

Here is a similar case involving a product that is legal in Canada but illegal in the US and the MLAT was used in this case also:

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/20...?oneclick=true

Can you post the text of this article...I don't feel like signing up.

<--- typical stoner

dready · 07-30-2005, 01:18 PM

Marc Emery is a Canadian hero and has been for years. I wish him luck.

ricks · 07-30-2005, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by candyflip

Can you post the text of this article...I don't feel like signing up.

<--- typical stoner

This is an old article, if you do a search for 'Daniel Pelchat' and 'GHB' you will find many articles on this, he made millions exporting GHB 'kits' to the US which were comprised of products that are technically legal in Canada but illegal in the US.

ricks · 07-30-2005, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dready

Marc Emery is a Canadian hero and has been for years. I wish him luck.

Even most of the stoner community sees Emery as a jackass, except on his Cannibus Culture forum.

candyflip · 07-30-2005, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricks

This is an old article, if you do a search for 'Daniel Pelchat' and 'GHB' you will find many articles on this, he made millions exporting GHB 'kits' to the US which were comprised of products that are technically legal in Canada but illegal in the US.

That I can do. Thanks.

BradShaw · 07-30-2005, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricks

Large scale distribution, smuggling and trafficking of illegal marijuana seeds to the US for the past 10 years is a bit different than a Canadian who alledgedly 'hacked' or exposed the vulnerabilities in your servers. Besides, you are a pornographic webmaster, it is the DEA that appealed to the Canadian government to get this special warrant, I doubt you have that sort of pull. Yes, the MLAT is there, but is is rarely used and when used it normally involves a crime of some significance.

This has nothing to do with my servers. Fris is a criminal, goes way beyond any kiddie games he played on my servers. In time, sheep will see and I once again will be applauded for helping to fry a scammer.

detoxed · 07-30-2005, 01:24 PM

fucking crazy though, that the US government officials are putting so many blatantly setup and fake statistics and warnings:

"People don't say that, but right now in America, there are more kids in treatment for addiction to marijuana than every other illegal drug combined."

These kids dont NEED treatment for marijuana, they just want to smoke it and rebel against parents, parents say ok, you are going into treatment, or because they got caught with weed and they were FORCED into "treatment" by the court

So the government forces kids into treatment and then uses it as their reasoning for marijuana being bad

ricks · 07-30-2005, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by candyflip

That I can do. Thanks.

Here's an informative link about this case:

http://www.usdoj.gov/dea/ongoing/webslinger.html

ricks · 07-30-2005, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricks

Here's an informative link about this case:

http://www.usdoj.gov/dea/ongoing/webslinger.html

http://www.drugwar.com/caddenghb.shtm

VeriSexy · 07-30-2005, 01:35 PM

Damn, they must have a list of addressed of thousands of clients

cool1 · 07-30-2005, 01:52 PM

pretty fucked up that he gets busted by the US for selling seeds.

wallst · 07-30-2005, 02:00 PM

doesn't look like it's stoppin' this guy...

http://www.thcseeds.com/new/

instruction:

http://www.thcseeds.com/new/content/view/42/59/

Mike Okitch · 07-30-2005, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by detoxed

fucking crazy though, that the US government officials are putting so many blatantly setup and fake statistics and warnings:

"People don't say that, but right now in America, there are more kids in treatment for addiction to marijuana than every other illegal drug combined."

These kids dont NEED treatment for marijuana, they just want to smoke it and rebel against parents, parents say ok, you are going into treatment, or because they got caught with weed and they were FORCED into "treatment" by the court

So the government forces kids into treatment and then uses it as their reasoning for marijuana being bad

"People don't say that, but right now in America, there are more kids in treatment for addiction to marijuana than every other illegal drug combined."

That's pulled directly from the "no shit Sherlock" files. As if kids would have easy access to coke, heroin, crystal meth, etc. OF COURSE pot is easier to obtain than other drugs and consequently more kids get caught with pot than with anything else.

The Vancouver Police Department has known about Emery selling seeds for years and if they would have been able to get a conviction in Canada for this, he would have been shut down a long time ago. It's because of the DEA that the shit has hit the fan. An extradition process can take a very long time to get done, especially with someone like Emery who's got the financial means to drag it on for many years. Even then, there's no guarantee that he'll have to get to Seattle to face charges.

ricks · 07-30-2005, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by candyflip

He claims to not keep a client list.

It is an offence in Canada to not maintain proper business records.

Mike Okitch · 07-30-2005, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricks

It is an offence in Canada to not maintain proper business records.

Business records for taxes and whatnot yes. But to not maintain a list that could be used for marketing (mail, telemarketing or whatever) is something else. If it was like that, every store would do like Radio Shack and ask you for your phone number and name every time you buy a soda.

ricks · 07-30-2005, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Okitch

Business records for taxes and whatnot yes. But to not maintain a list that could be used for marketing (mail, telemarketing or whatever) is something else. If it was like that, every store would do like Radio Shack and ask you for your phone number and name every time you buy a soda.

I don't see how you could maintain proper business records if you state on your site that you destroy order information as soon as it is shipped.

BRISK · 07-30-2005, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricks

It is an offence in Canada to not maintain proper business records.

What section of the criminal code mentions that?

ricks · 07-30-2005, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRISK

What section of the criminal code mentions that?

286(3) of the excise tax act for instance, there are similar provisions in the income tax act.

Mike Okitch · 07-30-2005, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricks

286(3) of the excise tax act for instance, there are similar provisions in the income tax act.

tax records are entirely different from client records. If the two where as intertwined as you suggest they are, Safeway would ask for all your details when you're getting groceries.

ricks · 07-30-2005, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Okitch

tax records are entirely different from client records. If the two where as intertwined as you suggest they are, Safeway would ask for all your details when you're getting groceries.

True. I still imagine that records existed though, lets say he emailed order confirmations, every order would be on the server.

JuiceMonkey · 07-30-2005, 02:51 PM

I am actually personal freinds with Marc, and extremly close friends with one of the people involved in the raid last night (got a call as they were being arrested).

This goes way deeper than you could imagine..

Mike Okitch · 07-30-2005, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JuiceMonkey

I am actually personal freinds with Marc, and extremly close friends with one of the people involved in the raid last night (got a call as they were being arrested).

This goes way deeper than you could imagine..

elaborate on that

blackfeet · 07-30-2005, 03:29 PM

helll...i didn't know you could make money off of seeds?

i been throwing mine away. lol

07-30-2005, 12:36 PM	#1
ricks Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 924	Internet marijuana seed dealers raided by RCMP, extradition to US requested by DEA I remember KRL asking about the legalities of internet seed dealing about a year ago. The indictment says it is a $3 million dollar a year business that Emery was running. From the looks of the indictment he is charged as if he was selling marijuana and conspiring with Americans to cultivate. His seeds have been traced to illegal grows in a number of states. Mainstream media reports: http://news.google.ca/nwshp?hl=en&gl...story_id%3D280 Here is the article from his site regarding the raids, a different point of view: http://www.cannabisculture.ca/articles/4466.html Alot of questions have been raised on this forum from non-US residents about what can happen if you break US law and do not reside in the US, this is a perfect example of the use of the MLAT between the US and Canada. The DEA requested cooperation from the Canadians and got it without hesitation. If extradited and convicted, Emery will likely die in jail. __________________ [QUOTE=DavieVegas]Now i apologize for people who I have scammed in the past or future.QUOTE]

07-30-2005, 12:37 PM	#2
xlogger Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: NY Posts: 9,507	Damn, where i am going to bye my weed from now!? __________________ ---------- XLOGGER [REFLECTED] [OH]

07-30-2005, 12:38 PM	#3
pr0 rockin tha trailerpark Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Location: ~Coastal~ Posts: 23,088	the war on morality just keeps heating up! __________________ __________ Loadedca$h - get sum! - Revengebucks - mmm rebills! - webair (gotz sErVrz)

07-30-2005, 12:39 PM	#4
candyflip Carpe Visio Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: New York Posts: 43,064	I hope he really doesn't keep a list of clients like he claims he does __________________ Spend you some brain. Email Me

07-30-2005, 01:01 PM	#16
BRISK Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 12,240	I think for extradition to be granted, his conduct needs to be punishable both in America AND Canada (not just one of the countries). Is Emery's conduct punishable in Canada? __________________ I post on GFY so that when people ask me what I do, I can tell them that I work with the mentally retarded.

07-30-2005, 12:49 PM	#9
pr0 rockin tha trailerpark Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Location: ~Coastal~ Posts: 23,088	I'd love to know who the other 2 were......anyone got that info?

07-30-2005, 12:50 PM	#10
V_RocKs Damn Right I Kiss Ass! Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Cowtown, USA Posts: 32,409	Damn... oddly enough it isn't illegal to order it... I like that.

07-30-2005, 12:50 PM	#11
BradShaw Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: KB's trailer Posts: 7,840	And this has nothing to do with national security...... ding ding ding People who think they are safe in Canada, or vise versa have smoked too much.

07-30-2005, 01:05 PM	#17
WiredGuy Pounding Googlebot Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 34,482	Is selling Marijuana seeds legal in either Canada or the US? I didn't think it was. WG __________________ I play with Google.

07-30-2005, 01:10 PM	#24
BRISK Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 12,240	The process for extradition from Canada continues to have both a judicial and an executive phase. At the judicial phase, a judge will determine if the conduct constitutes an offence in Canada and if there is sufficient evidence such that, had it occurred in Canada, the person would be committed to stand trial. At the executive phase, the Minister of Justice will decide whether or not to surrender, taking into account all of the circumstances and any applicable ground of refusal http://www.oas.org/Juridico/mla/en/c...-gen-desc.html __________________ I post on GFY so that when people ask me what I do, I can tell them that I work with the mentally retarded.

07-30-2005, 01:18 PM	#29
dready Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Toronto, ON Posts: 5,247	Marc Emery is a Canadian hero and has been for years. I wish him luck. __________________ ICQ: 91139591

07-30-2005, 01:24 PM	#34
detoxed vip member Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 17,798	fucking crazy though, that the US government officials are putting so many blatantly setup and fake statistics and warnings: "People don't say that, but right now in America, there are more kids in treatment for addiction to marijuana than every other illegal drug combined." These kids dont NEED treatment for marijuana, they just want to smoke it and rebel against parents, parents say ok, you are going into treatment, or because they got caught with weed and they were FORCED into "treatment" by the court So the government forces kids into treatment and then uses it as their reasoning for marijuana being bad

07-30-2005, 01:35 PM	#37
VeriSexy Join The Royal Family Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 25,463	Damn, they must have a list of addressed of thousands of clients __________________ Looking for a KICK ASS TEEN SPONSOR? Check out ROYAL CASH - THE KING OF TEEN! Incredible webmaster tools FHGs, Morphing Blog and RSS Feeds, Embedded FLV & WMV Videos. With TOP RATIO Sites like TeenStarsOnly.com - Earn $$ with our New Site & Bonus Payouts!! ATMovs.com \| iTeenVideo.com \| TeenSexMovs.com \| TeenSexMania.com

07-30-2005, 01:52 PM	#38
cool1 sex is good Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Carman, MB Canada Posts: 24,939	pretty fucked up that he gets busted by the US for selling seeds. __________________

07-30-2005, 02:00 PM	#39
wallst Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: South East Posts: 1,621	doesn't look like it's stoppin' this guy... http://www.thcseeds.com/new/ instruction: http://www.thcseeds.com/new/content/view/42/59/ __________________ Earl Miller Cash 20th Congress

07-30-2005, 02:51 PM	#48
JuiceMonkey Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Brisbane/Vancouver/SanFran Posts: 3,581	I am actually personal freinds with Marc, and extremly close friends with one of the people involved in the raid last night (got a call as they were being arrested). This goes way deeper than you could imagine..

07-30-2005, 03:29 PM	#50
blackfeet Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 589	helll...i didn't know you could make money off of seeds? i been throwing mine away. lol