Possible Fraud Affiliate - Need Advice - GoFuckYourself.com

Lifer · 03-10-2005, 11:50 PM

I have had some very successful conversion with one of my affiliates.

The conversion is very high... too high in fact.

He is making sales right and left while other affiliates have done next to nothing for a long time.

Is it possible that an affiliate can make fraud memberships, get the commission, and then later, I get the charegbacks?

Can CCBill investigate the new members to be sure they are legal?

I really need some good informantion here.

eMonk · 03-10-2005, 11:53 PM

shit... these days... i wouldn't be surprised...

Spunky · 03-10-2005, 11:53 PM

Start shaving his ass and cancel his account

Steen2 · 03-10-2005, 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spunky

Start shaving his ass and cancel his account

warlock5 · 03-10-2005, 11:59 PM

Maybe he just has really good traffic? Try to find out where its coming from...

xenigo · 03-11-2005, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

I have had some very successful conversion with one of my affiliates.

The conversion is very high... too high in fact.

He is making sales right and left while other affiliates have done next to nothing for a long time.

Is it possible that an affiliate can make fraud memberships, get the commission, and then later, I get the charegbacks?

Can CCBill investigate the new members to be sure they are legal?

I really need some good informantion here.

Why are you comparing your productive affiliate to your "other affiliates that have done next to nothing"?

Steen2 · 03-11-2005, 12:02 AM

Maybe the affiliate is sending popunder traffic or type in domains.

That's if it's referrer or conversion problems.

BV · 03-11-2005, 12:04 AM

check and see if those usernames show in your members area logs

graphicspimp · 03-11-2005, 12:19 AM

terminate his ass

Dalai lama · 03-11-2005, 12:22 AM

So...

A. check the traffic sources
B. CCBill is really hard to 'card' signups
C. why not call him?

Goodluck

$5 submissions · 03-11-2005, 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warlock5

Maybe he just has really good traffic? Try to find out where its coming from...

Exactly. Sometimes, guys really hit it on the head and make filters that fit their traffic like a glove. If this is the case, you really can't penalize the guy for taking the time to study and hone his campaigns' conversions.

For tips re traffic: http://justtraffic.blogspot.com

Lifer · 03-11-2005, 03:04 AM

Xenigo... If I haven't made a sale in six months...

and I am 0:60,000 with tgp traffic (for the most part)... - No brag

Then I get a sign up every day from this guy from the first day on...

I am a little worried that something is fishy.

CCBill will pay the affiliate... and chargeback later if needed.

I don't want to owe CCBill money in the end.

On the other hand, I am getting more traffic to the tour, the members are from all over the world, france, US, etc, and the members are actually going in and looking at the content.

Maybe I am just lucky...

Maybe I am paranoid.

I'm just asking the experts since I am new at this.

budz · 03-11-2005, 03:06 AM

0:60k, thats really bad lol

media · 03-11-2005, 03:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

and I am 0:60,000 with tgp traffic (for the most part)

NOT a very good sales pitch for your webmaster program..

Lifer · 03-11-2005, 03:38 AM

It might be a bad sales pitch for the webmaster program... but it is the truth

The problem is the design and not content.

I have much of the same conrent as everyone else.

But I will take care the site design later... not a priority at the moment.

I just want to be sure I don't lose money in the long run as a result of fraud.

Tgp traffic sucks anyway in my book.

Theo · 03-11-2005, 03:45 AM

i've done as low as 1:4 with more than 10 sales in row.
a shitload of times below 1:50
Something tells me I would make you anxious lol

what's his ratio if you dont mind?

Lifer · 03-11-2005, 03:54 AM

2 sales 1:188

Yeah... you would probably scare the hell out of me if you were successful.

It might just be the traffic source.

That is why I am asking.

I really only had one other affiliate sending tgp traffic... 0:10,000 per month

And I was sending stuff myself... 0:1000 per month

Theo · 03-11-2005, 04:02 AM

Lifer,that's a normal ratio. If your results are not good it's possible not due to your tour, but how you market the sites or related tp ypur traffic source/s. For sure you shouldn't worry.

Rex · 03-11-2005, 04:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

other affiliates have done next to nothing for a long time.

Not a good way to advertise

hydro · 03-11-2005, 04:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BV

check and see if those usernames show in your members area logs

agreed, if a big chunk of the members are logging in soon after the purchase and are downloading stuff then i guess they are real sales. Sometimes people can convert thier traffic on sites and programs that don't convert for others.

justsexxx · 03-11-2005, 04:08 AM

So everyone who does better then 0:60.000 is a cheater :D

Serious, just look if the user/passwords login to your site. Also check the ip stamps of the joins, and compare them to the logins.

Do some tracerts to the ip's top see where they are from. Also when it are all CC's signups, I wouldn't be TO worried. But wstill check the things above

03-11-2005, 04:20 AM

welcome to the internet

rowan · 03-11-2005, 04:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

2 sales 1:188

Yeah... you would probably scare the hell out of me if you were successful.

It might just be the traffic source.

That is why I am asking.

I really only had one other affiliate sending tgp traffic... 0:10,000 per month

And I was sending stuff myself... 0:1000 per month

2 sales is "He is making sales right and left" ??? I wouldn't be worried about fraud from 2 sales unless they appear to have originated from identical destinations or have duplicate info. Even then it could just be a surfer who stuffed up and managed to sign up twice.

Do you really mean your ratios are 0:1000 or 1:1000? 0:1000 means 1000 uniques, zero sales.

The Other Steve · 03-11-2005, 05:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

I have had some very successful conversion with one of my affiliates.

The conversion is very high... too high in fact.

He is making sales right and left while other affiliates have done next to nothing for a long time.

Is it possible that an affiliate can make fraud memberships, get the commission, and then later, I get the charegbacks?

Can CCBill investigate the new members to be sure they are legal?

I really need some good informantion here.

Pardon me for being blunt about this but you don't need information - you need a brain

You're scared shitless over some affiliate who has a ratio of 1:180?????????

You think he's a cheat and he's trying to defraud you??????

Oh Pulease!!!!!!!!!!!!

Last month my partner and I were 1:8 with a new sponsor. He didn't hit the boards whining about the fact that we might be cheating - instead he wrote to us and congratulated us.

That's what you should be doing to this guy - 1:180 is nothing remarkable and if you've got your panties in a bunch about it you should immediately go sell your paysite and take up some other far less stressful occupation.

Lifer · 03-11-2005, 06:37 AM

Thanks for the advice.

d00t · 03-11-2005, 06:47 AM

If you need fraud systems in place, hit me up

I do 1:1 with many sponsors, including epic and lars. My traffic is just gold. If I was termed for this there would be major problems..

Hit/signup ratio is not really an indication of fraud... signups by proxies, bad browser types, shady countries, no member logins etc... theres some clues for fraud.

LeeNoga · 03-11-2005, 06:48 AM

If it were me, I would ask around other sponsors and just ask politely is this gent on a "blacklist"....suspending webmasters is a serous matter and it takes alot of research, and hard fact to arrive at the decision of suspension. If you cannot turn up any dirt, let the account alone.

But, if he/she is a cheater it will eventually come to light.

I have not found one sponsor that has no answered me on a webmaster inquiry. Ask for references, and you will be surprised at the cooperation you get.

Lifer · 03-11-2005, 07:01 AM

Thanks for the two responses above.

I checked the stats... it appears to be up and up... ips are different, traffic is running to the site, log ons are ok...

By the way, the conversion I gave is way out of line.

My real numbers are 1:67 with non traditional adult non porn traffic, and 1:6000 with tgp traffic... I don't know if that is bad or good.

I would assume bad, but as you can tell, there is little difference between me and a turnip seed

d00t · 03-11-2005, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

My real numbers are 1:67 with non traditional adult non porn traffic, and 1:6000 with tgp traffic... I don't know if that is bad or good.

.... ummm

TheSaint · 03-11-2005, 07:34 AM

I have some affiliates using the shittiest tgp traffic, blind links, popups, exits, etc. and the conversions are total shit. Then I have a steady number of affiliates doing way under 1:100, month in, month out.

I think its up to ccbill to screen signups, not me.

Nasty · 03-11-2005, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

The conversion is very high... too high in fact.

Whats too high? I have a few hundred sites, almost 0 tgp traffic and 50-100k hits a day from search engines, 70% of that is teen traffic, if I really get behind a new teen program and bust my ass to get it implemented into 50 or more of my
sites I generally get a ration of less than 1/100 and I get 5-10 sales a day for weeks on end.

Maybe this guy just has good traffic, a few of us actually have good traffic hehe

mcmc · 03-11-2005, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

Xenigo... If I haven't made a sale in six months...

and I am 0:60,000 with tgp traffic (for the most part)... - No brag

Then I get a sign up every day from this guy from the first day on...

I am a little worried that something is fishy.

CCBill will pay the affiliate... and chargeback later if needed.

I don't want to owe CCBill money in the end.

On the other hand, I am getting more traffic to the tour, the members are from all over the world, france, US, etc, and the members are actually going in and looking at the content.

Maybe I am just lucky...

Maybe I am paranoid.

I'm just asking the experts since I am new at this.

Actually, you should be warned. There are guys out there who are doing exactly what you described. Signup ... chargeback and go on.
Anyway ... in your CCbill admin you see the adresses and credit cards. Are they all coming from the same country/location? Similar entries?
I would talk to CCbill anyway

Basic_man · 03-11-2005, 08:48 AM

Wow ! 0:60 000 !!! That's the baddest ratio I've ever heard about !

Dalai lama · 03-11-2005, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

Xenigo... If I haven't made a sale in six months...

and I am 0:60,000 with tgp traffic (for the most part)... - No brag

Like you are proud on the fact that you have send 60k hits in 6 months to your own paysites ? even without a sale. Seriously, you know the problem, so fix it.

Trixxxia · 03-11-2005, 08:54 AM

Lifer - In your CCBill panel, check your member's info - where they come from, IP, if the name makes sense & what info they have provided (CVV2,Postal Code matches....). If it's a few sales, then maybe it's beginners luck / he could have made his own mini-tour and is linking directly to the join page / member's area upsell ....there are many reasons why - verify for fraud but if they're clean, I'd say learn from what he's doing.

arg · 03-11-2005, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rowan

2 sales is "He is making sales right and left" ???

One sale was on the right, the other was on the left!

mcmc · 03-11-2005, 08:59 AM

Just 2 sales???
well, everything ok then.

Lifer · 03-11-2005, 11:15 AM

You all are absolutely right.

I feel so stupid.

That is what you do when you are a new guy... ask dumb questions.

But it is part of the learning process.

I have since really dug into the stats, checked the ips, names, amount of use and activity on the site... and everything seems to be ok.

I apologize to anyone that thinks I really am stupid and over reacted.

You don't have to say it, I know it already.

Thanks for letting me know what I needed to check and for the guidance.

I got a couple new affiliates as well... so that is good!

03-10-2005, 11:50 PM	#1
Lifer Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Working Posts: 871	Possible Fraud Affiliate - Need Advice I have had some very successful conversion with one of my affiliates. The conversion is very high... too high in fact. He is making sales right and left while other affiliates have done next to nothing for a long time. Is it possible that an affiliate can make fraud memberships, get the commission, and then later, I get the charegbacks? Can CCBill investigate the new members to be sure they are legal? I really need some good informantion here. __________________ CCBill Sponsor Programs Get Paid On Time - Everytime!

03-10-2005, 11:53 PM	#3
Spunky I need a beer Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: ♠ Toiletville ♠ Posts: 133,943	Start shaving his ass and cancel his account __________________ *YOUR INFORMATION HERE*

03-11-2005, 12:02 AM	#7
Steen2 Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 7,662	Maybe the affiliate is sending popunder traffic or type in domains. That's if it's referrer or conversion problems. __________________ ICQ: 2262.73945

03-11-2005, 12:22 AM	#10
Dalai lama Strength and Honor Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 16,540	So... A. check the traffic sources B. CCBill is really hard to 'card' signups C. why not call him? Goodluck __________________ A program you can trust. Gallerybooster Run multiply TGPs of 1 script

03-11-2005, 03:04 AM	#12
Lifer Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Working Posts: 871	Xenigo... If I haven't made a sale in six months... and I am 0:60,000 with tgp traffic (for the most part)... - No brag Then I get a sign up every day from this guy from the first day on... I am a little worried that something is fishy. CCBill will pay the affiliate... and chargeback later if needed. I don't want to owe CCBill money in the end. On the other hand, I am getting more traffic to the tour, the members are from all over the world, france, US, etc, and the members are actually going in and looking at the content. Maybe I am just lucky... Maybe I am paranoid. I'm just asking the experts since I am new at this. __________________ CCBill Sponsor Programs Get Paid On Time - Everytime!

03-10-2005, 11:53 PM	#2
eMonk Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 2,310	shit... these days... i wouldn't be surprised...

03-10-2005, 11:59 PM	#5
warlock5 Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Uranus Posts: 2,808	Maybe he just has really good traffic? Try to find out where its coming from...

03-11-2005, 12:04 AM	#8
BV wtf Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Bikini State, FL USA Posts: 10,914	check and see if those usernames show in your members area logs

03-11-2005, 12:19 AM	#9
graphicspimp Registered User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: south central Posts: 60	terminate his ass

03-11-2005, 03:06 AM	#13
budz Disruptive Innovator Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Vegas Posts: 4,230	0:60k, thats really bad lol __________________ C:\Code\ C:\Code\Run\

03-11-2005, 03:38 AM	#15
Lifer Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Working Posts: 871	It might be a bad sales pitch for the webmaster program... but it is the truth The problem is the design and not content. I have much of the same conrent as everyone else. But I will take care the site design later... not a priority at the moment. I just want to be sure I don't lose money in the long run as a result of fraud. Tgp traffic sucks anyway in my book. __________________ CCBill Sponsor Programs Get Paid On Time - Everytime!

03-11-2005, 03:45 AM	#16
Theo HAL 9000 Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 34,515	i've done as low as 1:4 with more than 10 sales in row. a shitload of times below 1:50 Something tells me I would make you anxious lol what's his ratio if you dont mind?

03-11-2005, 03:54 AM	#17
Lifer Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Working Posts: 871	2 sales 1:188 Yeah... you would probably scare the hell out of me if you were successful. It might just be the traffic source. That is why I am asking. I really only had one other affiliate sending tgp traffic... 0:10,000 per month And I was sending stuff myself... 0:1000 per month __________________ CCBill Sponsor Programs Get Paid On Time - Everytime! Last edited by Lifer; 03-11-2005 at 03:56 AM..

03-11-2005, 04:02 AM	#18
Theo HAL 9000 Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 34,515	Lifer,that's a normal ratio. If your results are not good it's possible not due to your tour, but how you market the sites or related tp ypur traffic source/s. For sure you shouldn't worry.

03-11-2005, 04:08 AM	#21
justsexxx Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 13,723	So everyone who does better then 0:60.000 is a cheater :D Serious, just look if the user/passwords login to your site. Also check the ip stamps of the joins, and compare them to the logins. Do some tracerts to the ip's top see where they are from. Also when it are all CC's signups, I wouldn't be TO worried. But wstill check the things above __________________ Questions? ICQ: 125184542

03-11-2005, 04:20 AM	#22
X37375787 Guest Posts: n/a	welcome to the internet

03-11-2005, 06:37 AM	#25
Lifer Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Working Posts: 871	Thanks for the advice. __________________ CCBill Sponsor Programs Get Paid On Time - Everytime!

03-11-2005, 06:47 AM	#26
d00t Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: In your mind Posts: 3,766	If you need fraud systems in place, hit me up I do 1:1 with many sponsors, including epic and lars. My traffic is just gold. If I was termed for this there would be major problems.. Hit/signup ratio is not really an indication of fraud... signups by proxies, bad browser types, shady countries, no member logins etc... theres some clues for fraud.

03-11-2005, 06:48 AM	#27
LeeNoga Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Egg & Sperm Mutation Posts: 3,043	If it were me, I would ask around other sponsors and just ask politely is this gent on a "blacklist"....suspending webmasters is a serous matter and it takes alot of research, and hard fact to arrive at the decision of suspension. If you cannot turn up any dirt, let the account alone. But, if he/she is a cheater it will eventually come to light. I have not found one sponsor that has no answered me on a webmaster inquiry. Ask for references, and you will be surprised at the cooperation you get.

03-11-2005, 07:01 AM	#28
Lifer Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Working Posts: 871	Thanks for the two responses above. I checked the stats... it appears to be up and up... ips are different, traffic is running to the site, log ons are ok... By the way, the conversion I gave is way out of line. My real numbers are 1:67 with non traditional adult non porn traffic, and 1:6000 with tgp traffic... I don't know if that is bad or good. I would assume bad, but as you can tell, there is little difference between me and a turnip seed __________________ CCBill Sponsor Programs Get Paid On Time - Everytime!

03-11-2005, 07:34 AM	#30
TheSaint Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Everywhere at once Posts: 991	I have some affiliates using the shittiest tgp traffic, blind links, popups, exits, etc. and the conversions are total shit. Then I have a steady number of affiliates doing way under 1:100, month in, month out. I think its up to ccbill to screen signups, not me. __________________ I have no signature

03-11-2005, 08:48 AM	#33
Basic_man Programming King Pin Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Montreal Posts: 27,360	Wow ! 0:60 000 !!! That's the baddest ratio I've ever heard about ! __________________ UUGallery Builder - automated photo/video gallery plugin for Wordpress! Stop looking! Checkout Naked Hosting, online since 1999 !

03-11-2005, 08:54 AM	#35
Trixxxia Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Montreal, Canada Posts: 5,600	Lifer - In your CCBill panel, check your member's info - where they come from, IP, if the name makes sense & what info they have provided (CVV2,Postal Code matches....). If it's a few sales, then maybe it's beginners luck / he could have made his own mini-tour and is linking directly to the join page / member's area upsell ....there are many reasons why - verify for fraud but if they're clean, I'd say learn from what he's doing.

03-11-2005, 08:59 AM	#37
mcmc Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Switzerland Posts: 1,705	Just 2 sales??? well, everything ok then. __________________ http://www.AdultDVDdb.com Conversion: 1:149 (so far this year with more than 650 000 unique hits) @ http://www.pimproll.com

03-11-2005, 11:15 AM	#38
Lifer Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Working Posts: 871	You all are absolutely right. I feel so stupid. That is what you do when you are a new guy... ask dumb questions. But it is part of the learning process. I have since really dug into the stats, checked the ips, names, amount of use and activity on the site... and everything seems to be ok. I apologize to anyone that thinks I really am stupid and over reacted. You don't have to say it, I know it already. Thanks for letting me know what I needed to check and for the guidance. I got a couple new affiliates as well... so that is good! __________________ CCBill Sponsor Programs Get Paid On Time - Everytime!