Are you that sure?

I should have said that's how it "should" be. Unfortunately in this industry many people do business with people because they are "cool" or gave them a hooker for a night or whatever (not referring to anyone specific here, just a general about the industry). That is not how things should be done. That is why over the next 5 years you will see less and less of the unprofessional people and more and more business people in this industry.

wow.... that has got to be the saddest thing i've heard so far...... you do realize the number of possible clientel you just lost.. :2 cents:

Not a single one I'm sure. It's great to be friends, buddies, etc. But business should be based on the best business decision, not who bought you a beer at the last show.

Should you be friends with who you work with? Absolutely. Should you only work with your friends? Absoultely not.

you guys need some serious marketing help, and some of you just shouldn't post for the sake of the buisness... if you knew what you were doing, this thread would not exist

As far as success goes, I'll compare anytime you'd like.

We haven't built NATS up to where it is by making bad decisions.

edit: Sorry, I had just replied to you so was in the mindset that it was directed at me specifically. If it wasn't, my appologies.

Anyway, it's Christmas eve and I have family over. I'll be back to this thread in a few hours.

I love NATS, I support NATS, and I have talked to tons of webmasters that have changed over or are in the process of changing over. It has made my life easier.

NATS is software (yes some others do suck) but without NATS my sites would convert the same. I could use NATS or many other choices of software and do just as good. As you know I have my own software too, which other than I don't have to maintain NATS, it isn't and doesn't do anything different than 99.9% of the programs that don't use NATS. There are programs on the market that have more features than NATS could add in over the next 5 years. Of course they cost 20-50k.

You ?CAN? have programs built for 5k all day long. For 10k, every feature NATS has and then some. Maintenance, servers, database structure, coders, and many other reasons, make people not go with custom software. NATS is easy to use, maintained by others, and stable. That is the features that mater.

I'm strong enough in this opinion that we have been working to change the total look and every feature within Evil Genius Cash. We don't want webmasters to know we use NATS. I want webmasters to use my sites because they convert, retain, and make my webmasters money. The software has nothing to do with that and shouldn't be a factor in a webmasters choice to promote or not to promote my company.

LOL.

Welcme to porn.
Its custom to buy your buddy a whore.
Its custom to make deep decisions with a toast.
Its custom t negotiate traffic deals when the tequila bottle hits the wall.

Hey just like the Oil Industry, textiles industry, architecture industry oh hell the music industry to.

WHAT IS and what SHOULD BE are completely different realms.

merry christmas :xmas-smil :xmas-smil

50 :):):)

You might want to think about that statement.

Most of my friends are competitors!
I have helped people get started in this industry in the EXACT same field/niche!
Sure conduct yourself in a business manner, but not sharks like the car sales people.

I think that statement has been mistaken a bit. It did not mean you shouldn't compete with friends or be friends with competition. It did not mean you should not do business with your friends.

It simply meant that you should not base your decisions soley on who's "cool" or you consider a buddy.

for the few people that say developing a custom solution is 6 figures, you might wanna shop around a bit, i could hook some shit up for numbers in the lower five figure range (might want more if you want some beastly server setup / clusterring, etc... but it wouldn't be development costs)

Yeah no kidding...

Hire a team of Russains or better yet East Indians.
Thats what I thought was so arrogant about both MPA and NATS...

Don't they realise a custom solution can be created for pennies without the baggage?

Hello $?=ID=webmaster!!!

How fucken hard is that to wire up to an established API by processors?
Aint very tough with MYSQL some PHP and following Processor guidlines with a post back here and there.
Big mother fucking deal!
It aint hard folks a custom solution can be writtin in a matter of weeks.

i'm not even saying that, i'm in the us, and i don't work for some $2 / day bullshit, i charge a rate that's decent, not overly cheap, and not outrageously expensive either, and if someone tells you they can't develop affiliate software for 10k (just to cover programming cost themselves) then their bullshitting you, or just trying to get as much as they can from you. I'll code DAMN NEAR ANYTHING for 10k, lol

Well you should be saying that Intrigue...

Affiliate scripts are not that tough bud. It can be done for less than 100K easy.
Less than even 10K.
10K is a piss in the bucket for a functioning system.
I culd write one in a week that would work.
with FHG's and hahahahas.
Bells and whistles add another 10K maybe if that tops! The very TOPS!

they really aren't, sure you want it to be rock solid, highly optimized and running as smoothly as possible, but i want that from EVERY SINGLE LINE OF CODE THAT I DELIVER not just certain scripts. And before anyone says that for me to do it for that low of a price it wouldn't be as high quality as NATS, MPA, etc... save it, everything i deliver is quality (being a bit of a perfectionist is a bitch at times)

No word from Mansion on this?

Well I am sloppy I am more of a designer than programmer, I just know the basic science behind the shit and enough to get the job done if need be on any server running MYSQL and PHP.

Hit me up anytime click the sig:)

at the moment, i'm too cheap to hire a designer, i take care of anything in house
:tongue:

You oughtah respect that:) It is the Holidays bro for the Western World.
Even though they in EU I think they got them to:)

I am to cheap to hire a programmer so what are you saying?

Ya like Spaghetti?

hmmm, oh yeah the holidays, maybe i shouldn't be here atm :smokin

hell yeah, had some last night, was some tastey shit!

Thank you for not saying it can be done for $1k :)

It can deifnately be done for $10k (tho many have spent much much more).

However, after all is said and done what about support?

What about testing, getting the bugs out, being sure of reliability, etc. If you have someone create a custom solution it is new. It hasn't been used by others before in a live situation. It is software that a business depends on. Testing over a period of time and being sure it is stable and scaleable are very very important.

Beyond that there is the time it takes to have the software written. Could be anywhere from weeks to months depending on the features wanted and people who are writting it.

Custom solutions are a way to go for some people. However, for the majority of people out there it is not the way to go.

You're not going to write your own operating system or come up with your own image format. Why write your own affiliate software.

Great post and I agree there is way too much bitching and not enough biz going on...

All these options..But never a mention about the 3rd party proccessers that we all depend on to make these stats accurate. I've been around for a long time..and i know 101% 3rd party processers are not as accurate as they might or most people think they are. I've been testing 3rd party processers for years and have found out that many singups get passed or are missed.

:2 cents:

Happy Holidays :xmas-smil

merry christmas buddy :xmas-smil :xmas-smil :xmas-smil

i know, i'm not trying to step on anyones toes, just trying to stand up for us programmers that have went the custom route, and in that sense, i can't speak for everyone, but if i were to do it, i always include testing, bug fixes, and some support into the price of whatever i'm on. I also agree on the 'time tested, program owner approved' theories.
Please don't think i'm bashing anyone or any program, i haven't seen nats code, or mpa code (since i haven't ever bought it nor had to work on any installs yet), Hell i even give you guys props for using smarty (instant brownie points in my book).
And personally, i would write my own, but that's because i'm a code monkey and i have strong feelings about using other peoples code (or atleast tweak the hell outta NATS, and use a semi-homebrew version)

Hell, i'll give props to both MPA and NATS just for having the balls to get where your both at :drinkup

Likewise Al, Wish ya the best bro..

Because in all that you forgot twe things.

REPUTATION and CUSTOMERS!

Don't you realise that or ya gonna be an arrgant pig every step of the way for the clients? It goes beyond just shit talkin on the boards. Many a conversations I have had with many program owner's. Ya know what...

One thing they had in common is t have a system that does not have the drama! Fucken Paulo frm TripleXcash for example! The guy is fucken gold has a big heart and keeps it real and ya know what...
He put alot of though in the decision to use NATS and yes I believe without putting words in his mouth that he felt he had no choice because of the shit talking and drama behind scripts. If he had a choice he wuld make his own fucking script.

Now STFU and listen to me...
Take you shit low and stop the shit talking.

Just because the timer n GFY repost sucks let me do a correction:


Because in all that you forgot twe things.

REPUTATION and CUSTOMERS!

Don't you realise that? Or ya gonna be an arrogant pig every step of the way for the clients? It goes beyond just shit talkin on the boards. Many a conversations I have had with many program owner's. Ya know what...

One thing they had in common is to have a system that does not have the drama! Fucken Paulo from TripleXcash for example! The guy is fucken gold has a big heart and keeps it real and ya know what...
He put alot of thought in the decision to use NATS and yes I believe without putting words in his mouth that he felt he had no choice because of the shit talking and drama behind scripts. If he had a choice he would make his own fucking script.

Now STFU and listen to me...
Take your shit low and stop the shit talking.

You're missing the point. We're not here to "talk shit". You and some others interpret it as such. For the 5000th time, when someone asks me to compare my product to another or when they bring my product into a conversation about another product, I'm going to tell people the differences. I don't bash people or "talk shit". You've invented this in your head.

I use nats for one reason and one reason only.


John sent me nude pictures of himself.

You have talked shit you moron...
I have been fllowing this for months.

You wouldnt believe who I am friends with. Even friends that would be ashamed to admit it. I am telling you to consider the clients.

Castle Media them guys got the low key factor down. You do that and you might just might be gold.
Ya wanna who thought of Cascade Procssing?

I did. I gave the idea to some gifted people a few years back when scripts fr affiliate systems only had minute choices or a custome solution or one prvided by the processor. What you got aint shit, it aint that great but it des help.

Wake up before you make yourself obsolete as other webmasters get a hard on to make another script without the drama.

:thumbsup Never thought you were bashing anyone, I was just stating the other side. :)

I love seeing that word misspelled.

You've told me to "shut the fuck up" and called me a moron at this point. I'm not going to sit here and have it out with you. This is the kind of thing that is "talking shit". You're not here to make things better you're here to call names, scream at people and try to tell me how to run my business.

I met you years ago when you worked for some video company. You didn't seem overly professional then and you certainly don't now that you're running some design site.

I'm not going to converse with you. I tend to avoid people who tell me to shut the fuck up and call me a moron and this and that. That is what I call "shit talking". We're out there marketing our product. You with your name calling and such are the one turning it into "drama".