There is a difference between capable employees, and self starters in this business. It is possible to be a very good part of the machine, without being able to put it all together on their own.

I've seen inside their MILF site and it would have to be the top of the pile for MILF sites.

I've seen your MILF site too and it isn't that far behind - maybe it would be even better if the guys who shot your content remembered take the lighting with them when they did a shoot.

I was sending Nastydollars a shit load of quality SE traffic to their MILF site and it didn't do well at all! Sure their members area might be top notch but .....

... me too. I think I must be something like 0:4k since I last had a sale with them.

I'm not sending them much traffic anymore but I used to do 1:20 so it really is disappointing to see such pathetic figures these days.

MR ARS, YOU NEED PSYCHIATRIC HELP

WHY IS IT THAT FUCK UPS ARE NEVER YOUR FAULT

IT IS ALWAYS GIM OR IBILL OR THIS PERSON OR THAT PERSON

IT IS A COMMON THREAD WITH YOU AND YOUR PROBLEMS THAT IT IS NEVER YOUR FAULT

I READ THE ARS BOARD AND EVERYTIME SOMETHING GOES WRONG IT IS NEVER YOUR FAULT

ACCEPT RESPONSIBILITY

WHO MADE THESE SITES AND PUSHED THEM ON GIM IN THE ?DEAL?

NOW IT IS ALL THEIR FAULT

WHY DID YOU DROP FREE TRIALS LAST MONTH

WHY NOT JUST TELL ALL YOUR WEBMASTERS YOU HAVE BEEN BROKEN OUT UNDER THE NEW VISA RULES AND YOU ARE SCRAMBLING TO STAY IN BUSINESS.

DENY THE ABOVE

SINCE THIS IS A TRUTH FEST, WHY NOT TELL ALL OF YOUR LOVING WEBMASTERS YOU ARE LESS THAN 60 DAYS FROM BEING PUT OUT OF BUSINESS

SO NOW YOU ARE TELLING WEBMASTERS THAT A CHANGE NEEDS TO HAPPEN

YOU ARE SCRAMBLING TO MAKE MORE CHANGES BECAUSE YOU CAN NOT GET YOUR CHARGE BACK RATE IN LINE QUICK ENOUGH

GIM SAW THIS COMING AND OPENED PIMP ROLL

INSTEAD OF POCKETING YOUR 1MIL(US) A MONTH YOU SHOULD HAVE BEEN PUTTING THAT MONEY INTO CONTENT AND INNOVATIVE IDEAS INSTEAD OF TRUCKING IT OUT TO THE FARM

IF WE ARE GOING TO BE LAYING IT ALL ON THE LINE WHY NOT TELL THE REAL REASONS BEHIND YOUR INNOVATIVE CHANGES

YOU BUILT YOUR COMPANY ON THE BACK OF MAX CASH?S DEMISE ? KARMA IS A MOTHER FUCKER

YOUR ASS IS ABOUT TO BE PUT OUT OF THE GAME

ARS was aggressive at the right time and Marc's ideas were very innovative, although I think now with the current state of the industry, drastic changes will be very tough to make.

It is much more difficult to plan so far ahead with Visa being half way up everyones bunghole.. and I think webmasters in general now are more willing to change traffic a lot quicker then they were in the past. And small/medium sized programs seem to be flourishing now, while larger programs are faced with more difficulty. Victims of their own success..

ARS has been #1 for some time and I am sure will continue to be, but just as the market has changed, so have the webmasters.

I look forward to copying, err I mean emulating, your revised program!

Chris

Our porn surfers are NOT happy.

http://www.somethingawful.com/cliff/...49/image-6.jpg

DH

Im going to retype my post in CAPS..damn it!

lol

Ah forgot about the talks the processors have been having about who is and who isnt above the required chargeback ratios.

Wasnt it Epoch who initiated these discussions?

Seriously, if you would just speak your mind without looking like a dropout anon poster with sour grapes.. it would dramatically increase the power of your post. You discredit yourself without anyone else needing to say anything in response.

sad but true

you know what i'd really REALLY like to see?

paysite owners paying people who genuinely know each niche to make each site "talk the talk" and to help choose the content. that generic text sucks, but if you want a site to keep its members, you need to give them what those particular members want.

a guy who likes 18 year old boys doesn't have to join a site with a bunch of 28 year olds on the tour, and uses text no guy into teen guys would use. and then the member area full of hairy guys, mature guys, generic guys, and balding twinks over 30 *LOL* the same applies to teen girl sites, and most other niches of sites in large programs.

why not sell the people using what they want to see and then give them what they want in the member area? no large program seems to try that - they'd rather complicate things. when i see some of the programs i use that know their member base and the retention of this site, i just gotta keep asking myself and the program owners - why don't you do that?

and they always tell us it's not that simple. but i suspect it is.

i talk to our rep at epoch who tells me how well exclusive content reality sites do, retention wise. maybe it's really that simple - make your tour really reflect the niche and the site's content and give them regular updates of the content in the niche they want.

Marc, if you were into cumshots, which paysite would you rather be a member of?

http://www.fantasticfacials.com

OR

http://www.cumonherface.com/splash.htm

Great Post basschick. :thumbsup

I consider ARS as a solid program with good ideas..

there is no one leader in this industry im sure you will agree.

Do I aspire to be as large as ARS? absolutely.

BYOT is a great idea that I took advantage of.. but I disagree that you own any right to it, or gave its name value.. search google man.. byot is all over google for similar systems.. and there are atleast 3 other adult programs that offer byot other than ARS before I cam along..

dont hate the player, hate the game :)

we will be friends one day.. I will grow on you like a fungus that you love to hate :)

HOW FUCKING FUNNY SOME PEOPLE THINK THEY ARE... ANYONE ELSE GUESS WHO THIS GUY IS BESIDES ME?

***********************************************
So anyway, at the end of the day, what have we learned from all these pages of thread?

I'm speaking strictly business...

The traditional pay per join on a recurring surfer membership doesn't work.

Fraud is ridiculous, surfers AND affiliates, and I'll wager a few bucks that before the end of the year the model is dead all the way around.

Surfers cancel, many times before they even log in. The ones that don't cancel that fast don't stay long, EVEN WITH ORIGINAL AND EXCLUSIVE CONTENT, in numbers that make the revenue model viable as it stands. The sites that do retain that well don't have enough members to compare with the huge affiliate program model, so let's not have a debate on how someone with 100 members can retain them for a year, they still don't make the money that someone doing 100 joins a day does.

Visa and Mastercard have had about enough with the entire business, that's obvious from the tighter and tighter restrictions they keep putting into place. The federal government is most likely going for some new regulations, one way or another from some rumors I hear as well.

Who was the big program that dumped pretty much all their affiliates recently? I don't see them out of business, just spending alot less time on fraud control and fighting chargebacks due to 'overmarketing' by overzealous resellers desperate to make a sale.

Oh well, enough ranting from me for the moment.

This isnt a vote on what is best for the surfer..this is what is best for webmasters to make the most money possible, while keeping surfers as long as possible..

I think what ARS is looking to do is maximize both..

CECash has been doing this since forever.

I don't think Marc ever claimed to be the one and only leader of the industry.

Marc is absolutely one of several leaders.

i agree totally and content will be king... its all about providing the surfer with regular updates, interactive abilities to promote a community and unique content...

Thats why when we produced Mens-Network we did just that, 10 updates a day and much more.

This is why stuff like www.uniqueplugins.com works so well in keeping members.

wondered how long it would take for this thread to attract spam

Whelp, as soon as they post that announcement in thier management panel, looks like they'll have one less advertiser. My job is to send them the traffic and get a trial signup - it's thier advertiser's job to convert it. If the advertiser's conversion rate is less than what he likes, the advertiser should make a better ad.

There were some problems processing your application. Please go back and try again. If you continue to experience problems, our support staff is available at [email protected] to answer your questions. Providing the errors below in your message will help them to assist you with your application.

It appears that you have signed up for an ARS webmaster account in the past 24 hours. According to the Terms of Service, that is not allowed.

:mad:

READ! READ EVERYTHING...


-He said there will be no paycut
-He said they will not turn to a per active model


My guess is they will be comming with a whole bunch of GIM gold sites (better tour, better content)

you rather get shaved?

:glugglug

totally agree.

:glugglug

You need to calculate value per click you send. It's the only way to compare apples to apples across various sponsors. I don't care if I get paid per web surfer ejaculation, per bald surfer that signs up for a 5 day trial, etc etc.

Calculate the value per click and it doesn't matter if they shave you or not.

Assuming two sponsors A and B, they both are equally as likely to pay you (you have valid references for both sponsors).

Sponsor A shaves you, but your traffic is worth $0.02 per raw click based on your tracking.

Sponsor B does not shave you, but your traffic is worth $0.01 per raw click based on your tracking.

Which one will pay you more money for the same traffic?

I'm not condoning shaving. However, evaluating sponsors in this manner is the only way to accurately measure the performance of 1 sponsor vs. another.

anything that comes outta this foul mouth never listen to this stooge.. "he's just a cheap con"

take this guy out to a drop off to view the cliff then this is a wise move. *shove* he.he

my english not so good..

I think it all started along time ago with fantasymans program..
now it sounds like no money?
like his program and others.. shall I go further..

confirmed signup/sting/

he.he.

I laughed when I saw Marc-de's speech like he tried 6 months ago! when webmasters cried foul back then now its back..

Marc-de is burning all the webmasters he can.. could be.
I never like the knob. nor ever admire his scam.

your on the way out there ARS.. like MAXCASH..
:Graucho

Exactly.

Hmmm, I have similar e-mails in my archives from 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, and now 2004.

The resounding point that so few programs choose to resolve (especially the ones running cookie cutter scripts from the various script shillers) is the issue of affiliate fraud.

If the various programs got their affiliate fraud under control, provided what they are selling on the main pages, and brought their payouts in line instead of being the no-net leaders, these issues would be less of a factor.

As I have stated numerous times in other threads, it is the quality of the content and the customer support that makes the sales and keeps the recurring. This has been proven year over year. People are throwing out the keywords of 'reality sites' etc etc. Regardless of what it is, as long as the content is not the same over sold bullshit - the sites will sell and keep members. The sites selling is clearly shown by the sales numbers the ARS sites do. The people were sold on the tours, they got into the member's areas and they bailed. Does that mean the business model sucks? No. The marketing was good, the internals of the site's suck, and to a lesser extent possible sticker shock for what was presented to them.

This post was not directed at ARS, it was in response to the e-mail Kimmy posted. I have known Mark for quite sometime and I will be interested to see what direction they go in... hopefully not some choke and puke $10 per site fantasy.

-dd

Lastly, as for the fear and uncertainty in that e-mail, will you people stop living your lives in fear and focus on living. I meet way too many people who think the boogie man is right behind them. Caution - Good. Paranoia - Bad.

I want to sign up to your program but it looks like I can't-- is it really so bad?

I figured it out now.

:helpme

*sips soda, reads... smiles...*

Okay so other than bitching about members areas that you can't change but continue to send traffic to (hello?) - anyone want to guess on what the new Visa/MC regulations will be?

thanks..but this wasn't sponsor vs. sponsor. But in the end do you really want a wife that cheat on you?

:)

Game Over

:glugglug

They are not going on ACTIVE membership payout model (like CECash)

Change is definitely afoot... Note that past tense above (BLEW). I think Marc's idea will catch on. Definitely time for CONTENT to be king again.

Marc....

Suspense is killing me: what do you mean by this:
I also believe there is other opportunities other than paysite promotion that webmasters can use to generate revenue from their traffic inventories (and easier).