Cross Sell partner clearly needed...

[Rick Latona]

Yo,

If you have an Epoch cross sell item that can be prechecked that has a decent payout, email rick AT cjbucks.com.

[BradShaw]

I think within a month or two, there will not be anyone who can accept cross sells left. CB rates on them are simply too high.

[Rick Latona]

Originally posted by BradShaw
I think within a month or two, there will not be anyone who can accept cross sells left. CB rates on them are simply too high.

Silvercash cancelled today. I can't say that I blame them. But if anyone wants to buy some, I have some to sell.

[GrimShawn]

Originally posted by BradShaw
I think within a month or two, there will not be anyone who can accept cross sells left. CB rates on them are simply too high.

Not sure I agree, I would say that about prechecked ones

[Mike AI]

We are in the market as well....

so e-mail luke AT purecash dot com

[WiredGuy]

Originally posted by BradShaw
I think within a month or two, there will not be anyone who can accept cross sells left. CB rates on them are simply too high.

I'll agree with that on pre-checked ones. The ones that are unchecked I think still have a tolerable ratio.

WG

[makefuckingmoney]

I think if you cross sale for lesser amounts.. you are fine..

Some are crossing at full price

[PR_Phil]

Pimp Roll's paying $15 per Free X-Sale with 27 sites to promote


Send them our way!



Phil

[NetRodent]

Why not cross sell something of your own?

[PR_Phil]

Originally posted by NetRodent
Why not cross sell something of your own?

because generally, your own member sections tend to be at least somewhat similar and share at least some of the same feeds, if not most of them. Someone elses member sections will almost certainly look different and have some products that your member sections do not.

because of this, if you run a program, it is easier for you to get someone elses cross sales to convert to full membership than it is to convert cross sales you send yourself.

similarily it is easier to send your own cross sales to someone else who can get them to retain than it is to send them to yourself and scale down your member sections so they are all unique in the hopes of canverting them to a full membership.


Phil

[Hank_Heartland]

Originally posted by Rick Latona


Silvercash cancelled today. I can't say that I blame them. But if anyone wants to buy some, I have some to sell.

Guys the problem is not with upsells the problem is with the fuckin pre-checked box.

We do upsells without the pre-checked box and we don't get chargebacks.

You don't want cb's uncheck the fuckin box, nuff said

[Halcyon]

I have 2 nice homes for pre-checked EZ clicks if you're selling @ $15
No pets. Smokers OK.
icq: 261416675

[Lensman]

I will buy all your x-sells.

[Hooper]

I have a good friend with a home for free prechecked xsells. High volume accounts only.

[makefuckingmoney]

I just added pimprolls..seem to be doing fine..

They are free as well..

Lens is your info public for that?

[NetRodent]

Originally posted by NWPhil


because generally, your own member sections tend to be at least somewhat similar and share at least some of the same feeds, if not most of them. Someone elses member sections will almost certainly look different and have some products that your member sections do not.

[edited for brevity]

Phil

Do you have actual numbers to back those assertions up?

In my experience the only benefit of cross selling a third party's site, is when customers write in to cancel their membership you can only cancel your half of the transaction. Of course the customer thinks he's cancelled everything, so when he finds out that he's still being billed he's pissed and likely to chargeback.

Interestingly, when you cross sell your own sites you don't have a significantly increased chargeback risk. The chargeback rates on the primary and secondary transactions are comparable.

[Rick Latona]

Originally posted by Lensman
I will buy all your x-sells.

Lensman,

In order to have two prechecked boxes I need a 1-3 dollar trial that rebills at less than 10 bucks a month. I'll send you an email because you probably have what I need.

[NetRodent]

Originally posted by Hank_MrSkin


Guys the problem is not with upsells the problem is with the fuckin pre-checked box.

We do upsells without the pre-checked box and we don't get chargebacks.

You don't want cb's uncheck the fuckin box, nuff said

Or cross sell your own stuff and when someone asks to be cancelled, cancel both accounts.

[Hooper]

we cross sell to phil and he has always been very good to us.

[Jason]

[Jman]

I might have something, hit me up Rick

[Dugan]

Originally posted by NetRodent


Do you have actual numbers to back those assertions up?

In my experience the only benefit of cross selling a third party's site, is when customers write in to cancel their membership you can only cancel your half of the transaction. Of course the customer thinks he's cancelled everything, so when he finds out

[edited for brevity]

You just jumped into a whole new topic while trying to respond to his, he was talking about retention, which is where money is made, if your cross selling your own sites, and the user gets in and gets most of the same shit by staying with one site then he/she is not going to rebill to two of your sites...
and opposite if he/she was the member of a totally different programs site

[NetRodent]

Originally posted by TheNewKid


You just jumped into a whole new topic while trying to respond to his, he was talking about retention, which is where money is made, if your cross selling your own sites, and the user gets in and gets most of the same shit by staying with one site then he/she is not going to rebill to two of your sites...
and opposite if he/she was the member of a totally different programs site

Again I have to ask if your assertion is based on any actual numbers or just an assuption that it "has to work that way"?

[Lensman]

Originally posted by Rick Latona


Lensman,

In order to have two prechecked boxes I need a 1-3 dollar trial that rebills at less than 10 bucks a month. I'll send you an email because you probably have what I need.

No problem. We have every thing you need.

[Dugan]

Originally posted by NetRodent


Again I have to ask if your assertion is based on any actual numbers or just an assuption that it "has to work that way"?

I've never really done a study on retention for self-"cross-selling",
have you tried it?

[PR_Phil]

Originally posted by NetRodent


Again I have to ask if your assertion is based on any actual numbers or just an assuption that it "has to work that way"?

I'm not just spewing crap at you here, If I give you my thoughts on retention it is from experience and definately based on number crunching. It still seems pretty logical however, people don't want to pay for the same thing twice, and I already know that my member sections are similar with overlapping content. So, If I cross sell my own sites I have to convince the surfer that he needs 2 memberships to 2 sites that have similar content in order for him to retain. Also, if the customer was unsure of weather or not they would keep their membership, signing them up to a second site that has virtually the same content certainly isn't going to instill the trust in them that could have helped them convert. Conversely, if I send those X-sales to a Reality site from some other program, with custon content and a unique member section, there is a possibility that the surfer will keep both memberships, which is good for me because They convert on the sale that I paid a webmaster $40 for, and I make $15 on the cross sale; and it is good for my relationship with the company I am sending to because retention on my sales is good. I don't know this because I figure this is the way it should be, but rather because I spend all day staring at conversion and retention numbers and graphs; and value per member analysis and cost per sale comparisons make up a large portion of my day.

If you want to research it for yourself, just X-sale yourself for a while, track the sales on the acct, and track the rebills, chargebacks and refunds. then wait a month and track the recurring revenue off it. If your not above $15 per member on those X-sales, you might as well send them some place else!




Sorry, I'm wasted!

Phil

[Dugan]

Originally posted by NWPhil


I'm not just spewing crap at you here, If I give you my thoughts on retention it is from experience and definately based on number crunching. It still seems pretty logical however, people don't want to pay for the same thing twice, and I already know that my member sections are similar with overlapping content. So, If I cross sell my own sites I have to convince the surfer that he needs 2 memberships to 2 sites that have similar content in order for him to retain. Also, if the customer was unsure of weather or not they would keep their membership, signing them up to a second site that has virtually the same content certainly isn't going to instill the trust in them that could have helped them convert. Conversely, if I send those X-sales to a Reality site from some other program, with custon content and a unique member section, there is a possibility that the surfer will keep both memberships, which is good for me because They convert on the sale that I paid a webmaster $40 for, and I make $15 on the cross sale; and it is good for my relationship with the company I am sending to because retention on my sales is good. I don't know this because I figure this is the way it should be, but rather because I spend all day staring at conversion and retention numbers and graphs; and value per member analysis and cost per sale comparisons make up a large portion of my day.

If you want to research it for yourself, just X-sale yourself for a while, track the sales on the acct, and track the rebills, chargebacks and refunds. then wait a month and track the recurring revenue off it. If your not above $15 per member on those X-sales, you might as well send them some place else!




Sorry, I'm wasted!

Phil

[NetRodent]

Originally posted by NWPhil


I'm not just spewing crap at you here, If I give you my thoughts on retention it is from experience and definately based on number crunching. It still seems pretty logical however, people don't want to pay for the same thing twice, and I already know that my member sections are similar with overlapping content. So, If I cross sell my own sites I have to convince the surfer that he needs 2 memberships to 2 sites that have similar content in order for him to retain. Also, if the customer was unsure of weather or not they would keep their membership, signing them up to a second site that has virtually the same content certainly isn't going to instill the trust in them that could have helped them convert. Conversely, if I send those X-sales to a Reality site from some other program, with custon content and a unique member section, there is a possibility that the surfer will keep both memberships, which is good for me because They convert on the sale that I paid a webmaster $40 for, and I make $15 on the cross sale; and it is good for my relationship with the company I am sending to because retention on my sales is good. I don't know this because I figure this is the way it should be, but rather because I spend all day staring at conversion and retention numbers and graphs; and value per member analysis and cost per sale comparisons make up a large portion of my day.

It certainly wasn't my intention to imply that you were spewing crap. However I don't believe anecdotes I only believe numbers. That's why I asked my original question if your anecdote about members being more likely to rebill at different sites was grounded in numbers. There are lot of preconcieved notions about how things in this industry "should" work, I have them myself, but as often as not they don't pan out when you start looking at the numbers.

Originally posted by NWPhil

If you want to research it for yourself, just X-sale yourself for a while, track the sales on the acct, and track the rebills, chargebacks and refunds. then wait a month and track the recurring revenue off it. If your not above $15 per member on those X-sales, you might as well send them some place else!

I wouldn't have stuck my nose into this thread if I didn't have bit of experience with cross sells. Here's a little background so you understand where I'm coming from. We run mainly mega sites (both gay and straight) and generate about 95% of the traffic that goes to those sites in house. We've been running cross-sells to our own sites since the fall of 2002. Most of that time the cross-sells were pre-checked. Due to the organization of our sites, members who cross-sell on a straight site get completely different content in each site while members who cross-sell on a gay site get largely the same content. Overall we make about $30 per cross-sell. Slightly more on the straight ones where the content is different and slightly less on the gay ones where the content is mostly the same. However we also retain better on the straight non-cross-sell transactions than on the gay non-cross-sell transactions. At $15/cross-sell we'd be hurting.

Originally posted by NWPhil

Sorry, I'm wasted!

Phil

Nothing to apologize for. Some people don't post as well sober.

[Kick Ass Chat]

Originally posted by BradShaw
I think within a month or two, there will not be anyone who can accept cross sells left. CB rates on them are simply too high.

I would agree with this. They are tricks, and cause way to many Charge Backs