paysites and sponsors

[Pornkings]

what is your average retention on your paysite or paysites

you can choose more then one

[Penthouse_mike]

<h1>YES</h1>

[Pornkings]

I hope some sponsors or paysite owners tell it how it really is since everyone thinks that we are not giving the sufers what they want


the ones over 3 months do you have a revshare program.

I would like to test your sites out I'm sure I have enough traffic to gauge what your retenion is.

Please feel free to spam this thread.

or is your site or program anon? because you don't want more members?

[Maximillion]

Sign up for PornKings under me and I'll give anyone help on how they can bank in off them.


Hit the sig

(By the way I'm a long time lurker, first time poster)

[Pornkings]

Originally posted by Maximillion
Sign up for PornKings under me and I'll give anyone help on how they can bank in off them.


Hit the sig

(By the way I'm a long time lurker, first time poster)

thats a funny sig

Everyone talks about sites retaining so well cause they have exclusive content etc. nows the time for you to post and bank but if you don't average 3 months it will be posted.

[Pornkings]

Originally posted by Penthouse_mike
<h1>YES</h1>

Yes to what? LOL

[BradShaw]

Roger, there are 100 different ways to compute this.

[Penthouse_mike]

YES we have retention.

Send me some free traffic, and i will tell you how much money it made me in six months.

[Penthouse_mike]

Originally posted by BradShaw
Roger, there are 100 different ways to compute this.

Good point.

I have members since 1997. they tend to distort 'average' retention.


I find using the percent of current members who were successfully rebilled is a better measure than a length in months. Cause it also reminds me that declines and thru-put on the rebill have an effect on the retention as well as content, etc.

[Pornkings]

Originally posted by BradShaw
Roger, there are 100 different ways to compute this.

I'm trying to keep things simple so everyone understands

but feel free to add your

[Pornkings]

Originally posted by Penthouse_mike



Good point.

I have members since 1997. they tend to distort 'average' retention.


I find using the percent of current members who were successfully rebilled is a better measure than a length in months. Cause it also reminds me that declines and thru-put on the rebill have an effect on the retention as well as content, etc.

yes we also have members who never cancel you still should know what the average is to know what a sufer is valued at to payout webmasters

what I'm asking is after they become active or have paid a full price membership how many rebills do you get out of them what is that average.

penthouse doesn't have a trial so what is your average membership length? do you retain more then 2 months on an average.

and do you have a revshare program?

[WiredGuy]

Originally posted by Penthouse_mike
Send me some free traffic, and i will tell you how much money it made me in six months.

Does Penthouse have an affiliate program?
WG

[Penthouse_mike]

Roger,

We do have a trial, but it is very hidden.

http://www.penthouse.com/free/join.html

I liked bradshaws post because it pointed out the imperfect math involved in computing retention rates, and i am a bit of a math nerd.

I know the retention rate, and mean subscription length computed in a number of different ways. I just mentioned i like looking at it as a percent rather than a length in time because declines are a not insignificant part of my cancelations.

I don't have a revshare or PPS now.

[Pornkings]

Originally posted by Penthouse_mike
Roger,

We do have a trial, but it is very hidden.

http://www.penthouse.com/free/join.html

I liked bradshaws post because it pointed out the imperfect math involved in computing retention rates, and i am a bit of a math nerd.

I know the retention rate, and mean subscription length computed in a number of different ways. I just mentioned i like looking at it as a percent rather than a length in time because declines are a not insignificant part of my cancelations.

I don't have a revshare or PPS now.

glad to hear you guys are doin well

why no programs? maybe we should talk

[Penthouse_mike]

Originally posted by WiredGuy


Does Penthouse have an affiliate program?
WG

WiredGuy,

I don't have a WM program now, but it is in the works. I have seen some of your sites in the SERPS, so I will definitely let you know when we do.

We will need some beta testers too (with a higher lifetime payout), if you like send me an email at mike AT penthouse dot com and I will get in touch with you when the timie is right.

-mike

[WiredGuy]

Originally posted by Penthouse_mike
I have seen some of your sites in the SERPS, so I will definitely let you know when we do.

We will need some beta testers too (with a higher lifetime payout), if you like send me an email at mike AT penthouse dot com and I will get in touch with you when the timie is right.

You have? Oh oh. I usually try to hide my domains as much as possible such that other webmasters don't try to copy my SEO work

Either way, I am definitely interested in promoting you guys once your program goes into beta. I'll send you an email with a note and my contact info and you can contact me when you're ready.

WG

[Penthouse_mike]

Originally posted by Pornkings


glad to hear you guys are doin well

why no programs? maybe we should talk

thanks roger

Sure, drop me a note at mike AT penthouse DOT com.

I don't think we will go the way of playboy, hustler, vivid and basically 'license' our webmaster program to another program operator. They would have to be above reproach, and I think it is important we develop new competencies on-line, rather than cool our heels and collect checks. the margins are better
and you control your own destiny. It is slower though.


cheers, mike

[Penthouse_mike]

Originally posted by WiredGuy


You have? Oh oh. I usually try to hide my domains as much as possible such that other webmasters don't try to copy my SEO work

Either way, I am definitely interested in promoting you guys once your program goes into beta. I'll send you an email with a note and my contact info and you can contact me when you're ready.

WG

Cool.

I noticed on PJ when you posted a url of a site promoting Sunny for Rogers' program. pretty good shit. only a couple backlinks; mostly on page stuff. Nice!

cheers, mike

[WiredGuy]

Originally posted by Penthouse_mike
I noticed on PJ when you posted a url of a site promoting Sunny for Rogers' program. pretty good shit. only a couple backlinks; mostly on page stuff. Nice!

Ah yeah, that's the only url i've publicly given out. That reminds me, time to rotate the backlinks again, it's a constant battle to hide the true backlink source

WG

[Pornkings]

Originally posted by Penthouse_mike


Cool.

I noticed on PJ when you posted a url of a site promoting Sunny for Rogers' program. pretty good shit. only a couple backlinks; mostly on page stuff. Nice!

cheers, mike

Yea hopefully he will list more of our sites. LOL

thanks WG and remember Florida

[johnny5]

hey pornkings,
if your sites only retain about 2 months i have a few questions..
1)what would having an affiliate program have anything to do with retention?
2)have you thought about making all your members areas look different and have a little bit of niche content?
3)let the surfer into all your members areas?
4)update YOURSELF, not some plugin?

theres alot of stuff you can do to get retention up... if there wasnt a way then all the recurring programs would go out of business cuz none of the webmasters made any money...

maybe you might want to think about hiring a full time employee that just always changed shit in your members areas, added shit, etc....

[jayeff]

Sometime in '96-'97 there was a lot of discussion on YNot about what - if anything - could be done to influence rebills. Several still well-known names were involved and no-one had found a way to stretch the average membership beyond the 2-3 months that was then the norm. It seems like some subjects just won't go away

The only sites that appear to have a consistent edge are those based around a personality or in "lifestyle" niches. In the mainstream, successful novelty sites do better for a while. But then novelty wears off...

There are a lot of strategies around, based on assumptions, traditional wisdom, perceived logic: whatever you want to call it. Since none have been very effective, maybe the answer is some serious market research so that we can stop guessing why customers cancel.

[Penthouse_mike]

Originally posted by jayeff
Sometime in '96-'97 there was a lot of discussion on YNot about what - if anything - could be done to influence rebills. Several still well-known names were involved and no-one had found a way to stretch the average membership beyond the 2-3 months that was then the norm. It seems like some subjects just won't go away

The only sites that appear to have a consistent edge are those based around a personality or in "lifestyle" niches. In the mainstream, successful novelty sites do better for a while. But then novelty wears off...

There are a lot of strategies around, based on assumptions, traditional wisdom, perceived logic: whatever you want to call it. Since none have been very effective, maybe the answer is some serious market research so that we can stop guessing why customers cancel.

We have an exit interview, and it deliever loads of good info.

[Snake Doctor]

I have to agree with Roger on this one.
Average retention after the trial is about 2 months.....and this is coming from someone who sends 80% of his traffic to partnership programs with exclusive content.

Retention seems to be the same about everywhere based on my experience. (unless the site really really sucks, then you'll never get anyone to convert from the trial)

I have one particular sponsor that out retains others, but its a 24.95 a month site, as opposed to most peoples $30 or $40 a month site, so it still has the same value per sign up as the other sites, give or take a buck or two. (less money X a longer time VS more money X a shorter time)

I promote exclusive content sites because they convert traffic to signups better, not because they retain better.....in most cases they don't.

[Snake Doctor]

I'll also add that there are sites out there that do 4+ months in retention, BUT, they're not offering trials.

If you don't offer trials its a whole different ballgame, almost any site can do that kind of retention if there are no trial memberships.

But 90% of the time you'll make more money by offering a trial, because the increased volume will more than offset the loss in average retention.

[Pipecrew]

Originally posted by johnny5
hey pornkings,
if your sites only retain about 2 months i have a few questions..
1)what would having an affiliate program have anything to do with retention?
2)have you thought about making all your members areas look different and have a little bit of niche content?
3)let the surfer into all your members areas?
4)update YOURSELF, not some plugin?

theres alot of stuff you can do to get retention up... if there wasnt a way then all the recurring programs would go out of business cuz none of the webmasters made any money...

maybe you might want to think about hiring a full time employee that just always changed shit in your members areas, added shit, etc....

Very true

[WiredGuy]

Mike, is the link in your signature related to Riemann sums and integral calculus? It's nice to see other mathies around here

WG

[Penthouse_mike]

Originally posted by WiredGuy
Mike, is the link in your signature related to Riemann sums and integral calculus? It's nice to see other mathies around here

WG

yup.

I was doing programming for digital signal processing
and Cultural studies at McGill before Penthouse.



cheers, mike

[spooky181]

My site has been up for about 10 months and it already is averaging just under 3 months. I think most extreme sites find it pretty easy to retain if they have a lot of exclusive content.

When I first started my site I only had around 3000 of our exclusive extreme content, but we only retained at around 35% for the first month. But now we have over 10,000 of our pics and vids, and retain at well over 50% for the first month.

Thanks Spooky

[WiredGuy]

Originally posted by Penthouse_mike
yup.

I was doing programming for digital signal processing
and Cultural studies at McGill before Penthouse.



cheers, mike

Cool, I went to Marianopolis for my CEGEP and then went to UWaterloo for a CompSci and Combinations/Optimization degree. That C&O stuff was like Google training 101, gotta love it


WG

[Pornkings]

Originally posted by Penthouse_mike

thanks roger

Sure, drop me a note at mike AT penthouse DOT com.

I don't think we will go the way of playboy, hustler, vivid and basically 'license' our webmaster program to another program operator. They would have to be above reproach, and I think it is important we develop new competencies on-line, rather than cool our heels and collect checks. the margins are better
and you control your own destiny. It is slower though.


cheers, mike

Maybe it's time we talk.


July 18 ? Penthouse Magazine, long a staple of adolescent fantasies and a favorite topic of discussion for Howard Stern, could soon be disappearing from the publishing world. What?s more, by next week Penthouse founder Bob Guccione could lose his fabled Penthouse Mansion, a century-old residence that is one of the largest private homes in Manhattan.

PENTHOUSE EMPLOYEES ON Friday received only 25 percent of their usual salaries, according to several employees at the company. And Kennedy Funding, a commercial real-estate lender, is planning on foreclosing on the mansion on Tuesday, according to Joseph Wolfer, Kennedy?s founder and principal. Meanwhile, employees and the magazine advertising community are questioning whether the once high-flying skin magazine will ever publish again.
Lainie Speiser, a spokeswoman for Penthouse, insisted the magazine had no cash-flow problems. When asked whether employees would receive their full paychecks, she declined to comment. She also refused to comment on whether the magazine, or any of its print spinoffs like Penthouse Forum and Penthouse Black Label, would publish again.
Last Tuesday, the magazine?s employees were called to a meeting and told Penthouse had missed its printing schedule?no new issues of the monthly magazine appeared from late April until early July?because the company had been unable to pay printing costs, according to several people who were present at the session and asked to remain anonymous. The break in publication resulted in significant lost revenue and could make it hard for Penthouse to sell future ads.
Only one editorial employee, associate editor Deidre Goldbeck, was reachable in Penthouse?s offices on Thursday. When asked about Tuesday?s meeting and this week?s paychecks, she said, ?I?m not allowed to talk about that.? In response to queries, editor Peter Bloch left a message that said, ?I can?t talk about the situation at the magazine.? Stephen Gross, Penthouse?s president, did not return several messages asking whether Penthouse was ceasing publication. Late on Thursday, a Penthouse employee reached at home said the magazine?s staff was given the option of working from home until further notice.
Meanwhile, Guccione is apparently fighting to hold on to the Penthouse mansion. ?They owe us around $15 million,? Kennedy?s Wolfer said. ?And they?ll need to find a way to come up with it by Tuesday.? Wolfer said Guccione is ?very resourceful,? and that another unnamed lender was trying to secure financing to pay off the debt. But, he said, ?We?re at the end of the line.? Guccione could not be reached for comment.
Around Manhattan, newsstand vendors said they had been told after Penthouse missed its publication schedule that it was likely the magazine would not be reappearing. As a result, several newsstands were not displaying the new issue, which was shipped earlier this month, illustrating how difficult it can be to regain newsstand positioning.
The Penthouse mansion
?The advertising community has been watching a series of disintegrations with Penthouse,? said Steve Greenberger, a senior vice president and director of print media at Zenithmedia, a media-buying firm. ?The circulation?s been declining, and the editorial content is a lot raunchier than most clients will accept. Even alcoholic beverages and tobacco companies are saying, ?This is starting to be too much?.? Greenberger said the fact that the magazine missed its publishing schedule is a problem. ?No one wants to take risks in this economy. It?s going to be hard to re-establish itself as a viable alternative in a media plan.?
In April 2002, The New York Times? David Carr wrote a piece describing the tenuous financial position of the magazine. Carr quoted Guccione, who is sick with throat cancer, as saying there is ?no future for adult business in mass market magazines.?
The first American issue
When Penthouse was launched in America in 1969, Guccione was gunning for Hugh Hefner?s Playboy. During its peak in the 1970s, Penthouse had a circulation of more than 5 million. By comparison, GQ?s current circulation is around 800,000, and Esquire?s is just below that. Playboy, while also down from its peak, still has a circulation of more than 3 million.
For years, Penthouse has been squeezed from both directions by the Scylla and Charybdis of men?s entertainment. On the one side, the monster growth of hard-core pornography on the Internet has meant that consumers no longer need to suffer the embarrassment of receiving their mail in plain brown wrappers. On the other side, the rise of laddie publications like Maxim and FHM has meant there are publications that show a lot of skin without the stigma of being pornographers.
In response to these pressures, Playboy has remained relatively staid-the nudity of its models sometimes seems almost incidental. But Penthouse has gone ultra hard-core. These days, the extreme close-ups of Penthouse?s pictorials seem more appropriate for a medical manual, and the live-action sex scenes are as graphic as anything available. Penthouse?s circulation is hovering around 500,000.
Last month, Bloomberg reported that Penthouse had defaulted on $41.8 million of bonds in April and was facing eviction from its Manhattan corporate headquarters. Wendi Kopsick, a spokeswoman for Penthouse?s landlord, confirmed there were legal proceedings involving Penthouse?s office space but would not comment further.
?There are some of us who still believe in this magazine,? one Penthouse employee said Thursday night. She asked not to be named because, she said, magazine staffers had been told that speaking publicly could jeopardize their future positions at the magazine. ?Plus, it?s not like there?s a lot of other jobs out there. So we?re just hoping we?ll struggle on.?

[Pornkings]

Originally posted by johnny5
hey pornkings,
if your sites only retain about 2 months i have a few questions..
1)what would having an affiliate program have anything to do with retention?
2)have you thought about making all your members areas look different and have a little bit of niche content?
3)let the surfer into all your members areas?
4)update YOURSELF, not some plugin?

theres alot of stuff you can do to get retention up... if there wasnt a way then all the recurring programs would go out of business cuz none of the webmasters made any money...

maybe you might want to think about hiring a full time employee that just always changed shit in your members areas, added shit, etc....

Why is it when i asked who retains more then 3 months post here

and no one did? If someone has the magic Potion I will be glad to send them alot of signups on a revshare deal.

To answer your question we have done all of the above. and it didn't matter

[khy]

Based on monthly membership signups for the first 6 months of 2002, Sexynoelle billed 3 months on average and hollyheartbreak billed 2.5 months on average.

I'd still recommend you try promoting Holly along with Noelle as Holly's conversions are typically much better...

But hey, give us a shot. I'm getting ready to launch a promo for gfyers only. Won't be announced for a few yet, but give me a shout and I'll hook you up with a great deal on trying our program out. (hint: earn pps AND revshare!

(727) 644-7274