Yeah...it's so exciting. :helpme

I just finished up graphics work (which I don't particularly like doing) for some promo material for the Vegas AEE show.

Now I'm about to add a few hundred galleries to my TGP's and a few new vids into my tube site.

I don't know if I can handle all of this "fun" and "excitement". If it weren't for Crockett & Mark Prince I'd die from boredom :1orglaugh

Not to end the Robbie fest, I admire him as much as the next man, but photovoltaic technology is sort of coming into its own after like 25 years.

I was in Maryland the other day and saw a bunch of Solar City guys and I asked them about how things were going and they said the industry was really booming.

Regardless of where you stand on global weather patterns you have to say photovoltaic power is a good thing if the cells are silicon rather than rare earth metals.

I'd love to put solar on my home. As I've said before...I almost pulled the trigger on it in 2006 when I lived in South Caronlina. It was a total home system that would not require ANY power from the "grid".

It had a huge solar panel that was on a motorized stand and moved with the sun.

The cost was over $50,000 for it though!

More recently I checked into a company that puts up solar panels on your roof. They don't charge you for the panels or installation or maintenance. But they charge you per month at a rate "much lower than the electric company". (that's the Solar City company you talked about)
Problem is, you have to sign a 20 year contract.
I'm not sure I want to stay in my home for the next 20 years (kids are grown up and the house has 7 bedrooms and 5 baths AND an outside casita where my office is that has another full kitchen and full bath, way too much for just me and Claudia Marie to live in)

Robbie:

You dismiss what I say because you think I only read liberal media, and therefore probably think I'm biased.

Ok, that's fair, because I think that people who claim the opposite, especially without quoting science publications, are biased as well.

There is no way that Lefties can change the minds of righties here on GFY by stating facts. While there can be only 1 truth, "truth" is told in different ways by different interest groups.

Therefore, I propose a different type of conversation.

Let's try single, simple questions. Each one of us gets to ask 3 questions, before the other can ask 3 questions. Let's see where this takes us.

Question #1 : Do you believe that the earth is in trouble? That the climate is warming up, and that there is too much pollution?

(Yes this is all one question).

Please post your answer here in this thread and I'll follow up with another one or two. Then I promise I will answer your questions.

Peace.

Reasonable people are still often wrong and many people that at first appear reasonable are not quite what they seem after you talk to them for more than one conversation. :2 cents:

This topic is nothing more than the same one that has been carried out many times prior. It's always the same, just a different thread title. Robbie is one of those guys that will ignore all proof given to him if it's something he doesn't agree with politically, yet will latch on to a single shred if it agrees with his opinion.

Both of you guys are still caught up in politics and "left" vs "right".

Team sports.

I take each issue on it's own merit. I don't give a damn about "left" and "right" and I especially don't give a damn about Republicans and Democrats.

You guys are two of the most politically biased people on GFY. And ALL you either talk about is how "evil" the Republicans are and how great the Dems are.

I and many other intelligent people have tried to tell both of you that there is NO difference between Republicans and Democrats when you look at the big picture.
The 2 party system is designed to keep them in power.
Period.

Now, to address the actual ISSUE here:
Do either of you believe that Al Gore is correct when he claims that the polar ice caps will be gone in 7 years?
Do you?

Or can you disassociate the politics for one second and see the insanely profitable reasons that Mr. Gore is promoting this fear?

I know I can see it plain as day.

Maybe that's why I'm so good at making money.
It's just obvious to me.

I actually have kinda grown to like both of you as far as your characters you portray on GFY.
I have a feeling that you guys are both pretty normal guys who would be fun to kick back with and have a few drinks at the strip club with.

I hope that neither of you think I have any personal animosity towards you. To me this is a discussion. And I think you're both full of shit on most subjects (as I'm sure you think the same of me).

So I'll ask it again: Do either of you believe that Al Gore is correct? Keep in mind he's filthy rich and runs a business that depends on doomsday. So he definitely has access to more scientific data than 99.9% of us.

So he knows what he's looking at and he knows the truth. Yet he still rides around in big limousines and private jets and has a big mansion with a HUGE carbon footprint.

Tell me...what do you think about his prediction?
Is he right, or is he flat out lying to make more money?

What?
Liberals like mark price, Crockett, and other douche bags ignore facts?
http://www.teaparty.org/new-governme...paign=s ocial

You do realize that you are quoting "TEAPARTY.ORG", right?

Just a heads-up for anyone still reading this thread: Science is truth, period. But trying to argue "truth" is impossible sometimes not only because what us regular non-non-scientiist folk (want to) believe, but also because how we arrive at our "facts".

What happens is this. Many people search for information online not necessarily to gather the truth, but to gather the "truth" that supports their pre existing ideas of what truth is.

Believe it or not, Google is partly to blame. Google and others serve information to users that they are likely to click on, because they are likely to believe in it.

For example, if you think that Tom Cruise is Gay and you see 2 headlines : "Is Tom Cruise kissing a new starlet?" vs "Is Tom Cruise kissing a dude?", you are more likely to click on the "Dude" headline because it reinforces your preconceived notion or beliefs.

So anyway, before everyone gets all bent out of shape about their beliefs in global warming, do this: Forget Al Gore. His message, whether you believe it or not, is lost in the white noise of politics. Also, forget left wing or right wing media as distributors of pure science. Instead, go to http://www.Nasa.gov, or http://www.noaa.gov, and get your information there. If you don't believe what they say, you should.

Peace.

What a crock of shit. Scientists say "man made global warming is a huge problem" and cite supporting studies... other scientists say "man made global warming is not real or grossly exaggerated at best" and cite supporting studies.

And you are saying there is only "truth. Science is faith. Just as any other faith. Though there may be some standards as for the burden of proof which may not exist in other beliefs, saying science is only "fact" or "truth" is so wrong its beyond laughable. You can prove any side of an argument with studies and statistics and call it "truth". This is why it is insanely difficult to remove bias and why it can't be done completely. You should know that as well as anyone. Your beliefs are oddly consistent with a Liberal brain. You think your beliefs are wholly unbiased and based on facts? This is why you yourself, are also everything you despise in Republicans.

yes, douche bag, I do. Thats the problem with our least intelligent. They worry about the source instead of the facts.
Have someone read the article to you. Its about NASA, then go do a search on the subject and re-read it from whatever source you imagine is will slant it in your direction. Then go read it from the NASA website.



silly kid

ah fuck it, let me rub your idiot nose in it now instead:
http://www.nasa.gov/press/2014/octob.../#.VDvXRhbtC-I

"""""The cold waters of Earth?s deep ocean have not warmed measurably since 2005""""

Did you like the link to nasa.gov that I sent you re: snow and sea ice formation..?

No. I lose interest in chatboard clowns pretty easily.
When your arguments are,"the ice is melting, we're all doomed" and "the ice is growing, we're all doomed"
I leave the pearls in my pocket.

LoL ok sure... cool story...

science is truth, period? :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

google fucks up science because, you know, tom cruise is gay? :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh


this post actually explains pretty good **********'s comprehension level

I keep seeing that faux-liberals dismiss the Tea Party, I guess because of crazy Michelle Bachman and Sarah Palin trying to hitch their wagons to it.

Aren't the REAL Tea Party members a lot different than the dozens of lifetime/career politicians who pretend to suddenly have converted to it to try and get votes?

I would see the liberal media on MSNBC and CNN talk about Bachman and Palin and Cruz as the "leaders" of the Tea Party (much the same way they would claim that Rush Limbaugh was the "leader" of the Republican Party) in an effort to destroy that movement.

And then I would see the actual REAL Tea Party representatives from different areas of the country go on the news and refute that over and over saying that "no" there are are no "leaders" of the Tea Party and that their party stands for "Taxed Enough Already"

The real people in that movement don't want lifetime/career politicians and they are sick of the Feds taxing us and then spending trillions on stupid shit like invading other countries.

It's the liberal mindset that tries to make them "bad" somehow. (as they do with ANYTHING that isn't a Democrat)

I think Palin and Bachman and Cruz are simply bureaucrats who did some polling and figured out that they could gain political clout by attaching their names to the TEA Party.

But that would be too much a stretch for people who get all their info from liberal biased sources who do nothing but parrot Democrat Party machine talking points.

"Team Sports" once again. It's a sad situation, and one of the reasons that nothing ever really changes.

I think the 20 year thing is as much good old Elon Musk wanting to make money as it is cost per KWH. But I'll give you it doesn't make sense. Most people stay in their homes for 7 years, I think the stats say.

A lot of the trouble is, as you've pointed out, self interested parties on both sides making millions (and billions) while they use the knuckleheads as foot soldiers.

I believe Paul just owned you six ways from sunday lol.

manbear pig

Yeah, that's why I keep pointing out that the govt. isn't doing anything.

When a REAL crisis hit...World War 2 for instance...the whole country mobilized. The govt. actually did it's job. Cars weren't even made because the car factories were being used to make tanks and other military vehicles.

Now...supposedly this is the greatest threat to mankind EVER (well, until the next boogieman they make up to fleece money from the people). And what does the govt. do?

Put up solar panels on every home?
Mandate all cars to be electric starting NOW and have every mechanic shop in the country outfitted with conversion kits to take out the combustion engines from current cars and replace them with the already working Tesla style engines that are 100% electric and have a big range on them?

Wow! That would create jobs, stimulate the economy, and SAVE THE WORLD!

Nope...they took 2 TRILLION dollars and handed it to the banks. And the money did what exactly for the people?
"Saved" us?

Well, if the bullshit that crockett, Mark Prince, and other sheeple believe is true...NONE of that matters with the banks. Because mankind is doomed unless humans can somehow "stop" "global warming". And you can't spend money when you're dead.

You see, that's where I draw the line and call BULLSHIT.

The President has all the REAL data right in front of him. He knows if it's really true or if it's just a money scam.

So let's see what he's doing in this extreme emergency...
He's having the military produce a gigantic CO2 footpring with aircraft carriers and jet planes bombing the latest Mid-East boogieman/defense industry savior: ISIS

And ISIS has an "army" that is basically the size of the National Guard of a small state in the U.S.

Does that sound like "man made" climate change is real to anyone with an ounce of intelligence?

If you want to know the TRUTH. Just watch what the ruling elite class (govt bureaucarts/lifetime politicians) DO.
They are good at talking the talk. But just watch them NOT walk the walk and you can see the truth.

:thumbsup:pimp:angrysoap:bowdown:thumbsup




.

Looks like 12clicks fell off the roof again and bumped his head..

I suspect Robbie has never read the definition of faux-liberal as it fits him to a tee but he calls everyone else one..

Faux-liberal
Someone who constantly talks about their liberal viewpoints to overcompensate for other things. These people say they are liberals but don't believe in equal rights for women, own guns, or have other traditionally conservative viewpoints.

..or perhaps he is a faux-consertive.

No Crockett, that's not the definition of it.

Faux means FALSE. You are a false liberal.

True liberal giants of this country would laugh at you and your pandering to govt.
It's the very antithesis of what a truly liberal minded person is.

But you are welcome to continue to believe you are "liberal" while you continuously support more govt. oversight and less freedom in your life.

True liberals were all about freedom.

This new brand of "liberal" is nothing but about giant govt and less freedom.

But that's cool. I understand that you need the govt. to hold your hand because you may feel that you have limited abilities or something.
Free-thinking liberals like Abbie Hoffman, Bob Dylan, Malcolm X, etc. would label you what you are: A conservative authority-loving conformist.

Well see that's where speculation gets you. I've never once called myself a liberal. That's a title you and your circle jerk partners love to toss around at everyone whom disagrees with you. I've always maintained that have have liberal views about various things as well as conservative views about others.

What you fail to understand, despite me explaining it many times, is that I am anti-Right wing because they have gone bat shit crazy. I've also never once said I agree with everything g Obama does but once again you and your circle jerkers just assume, that because I dislike the right wing that it makes me a liberal..ect..ect..

I call myself an American, I don't put any party before that, something you right wingers should learn how to do. I do however usually vote Democrat as I usually find most right wingers to be.. Well bat shit crazy or just full of bullshit. However, once again I've never once called my self a liberal...so if you think calling me a faux-liberal makes me sad, lol well it doesn't.

I was just calling out your simpleton thinking being you fit the definition pretty well, being you love to tell us how liberal you are.

Sorry crockett, but this time it's you who must be corrected.

I'm not a member of any "circle jerkers" on GFY.

As for you, you are blatantly and 100% a Democrat who thinks that anyone who doesn't agree with the DNC's party line is obviously a "right winger"

Yes, Michelle Bachman-types in the Republican party ARE definitely "bat shit crazy".

So is Nancy Pelosi (though that may be the onset of dementia at her age) and other Democrats like former Democrat Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney.

But the vast majority of Democrats and Republicans are not crazy. Not at all. They are holding hands with each other to keep a 2 party system that nurtures lifetime/career politicians in power and NOTHING ever changes for our country.

That is the part you are too blind to see.

You are a "team sport" person. Common in this country now.

You aren't a "liberal". You are a follower. I doubt very seriously that you have a true liberal bone in your body. You are a FAUX liberal. A fake who thinks he is real.

I'm pretty certain that you aren't really this way. But you've created a personality for yourself on GFY and you are kinda trapped in it now.

You've painted yourself in a corner and you can't get out.

Theoretically, Obama could murder a school house full of children tomorrow and you would claim it was George Bush's fault.

And conversely, Bush could come out tomorrow and admit everything he did was wrong and announce he is fully supportive of every detail of the DNC party but will stay a Republican...and you would attack him and start babbling about the Koch Brothers and Fox News.

That's why I enjoy you. You're very predictable. And always funny. :)

One other thing crockett: Do YOU believe the polar ice caps will be gone in 7 years? Do you?

Robbie you just talk in circles and try to act as if everyone else is the bad guy and you are the hero of all. I don't blame Bush for anything he didn't do.. However it sure was you that blamed Obama non stop for everything g congress did or couldn't get done..

Hello pot, meet the kettle.. See this is your problem, you always try to exclude yourself from doing anything wrong but everyone else is the problem.

woo new definitions of a 'liberal'.. some bizarre form of libertarian!

you'd think with all the common ideologies of liberalism, unions, freedom for all, blah blah, one wouldn't suggest that 'liberalism is against a government'

but this is bizarro world

I literally have no idea what you're talking about.

So I'll ask you again: Do YOU believe that the polar ice caps will be gone in 7 years? Yes or no?

And I don't exclude or include myself from anything. I'm not PART of the govt. and thus I have ZERO power to do any of the shit they have done.

I do believe in being VERY skeptical of the govt.
You know, like a REAL liberal is.
Or as Pres. Obama's own FBI Director James Comey said on 60 Minutes this past week: Americans should question the govt. because they can't be trusted and that is why the Founding Fathers divided it into 3 branches in the first place.

That's straight from the horse's mouth.

I just wish that I could somehow convince you to be a lot more skeptical of what the elites are doing in Washington D.C. and stop playing politics like it's a "team sport".

Let's see now...

1: Objects to being labelled
2: Then applies labels to others
3: Uses insults to try to shut down discussion

Yup, he's a liberal all right :1orglaugh

I never objected to being labeled. I just told him he was using the wrong label.


Try again..

So crockett, do you think the polar ice caps will be gone in 7 years?
Or do you think Al Gore is lying to make more money?

- Nasa

12Clicks, just because you disagree with me is no reason to call me an idiot. I personally have a concern that all the pollution we are sending into the air and water is doing some real damage, and like you I'm sure, I want to learn as much as possible and hopefully do something about it.

Don't strain yourself too hard to understand my point. You might hurt yourself.



Interestping point, Robbie, and maybe you are right. When I think "Tea Party", I think Palin, Cruz, Bachman as perhaps not the leaders, but definitely the spokespeople for it. If they're not true leaders, who is? (I'm not trying to poke you in the ribs - its an honest question - I really don't know).

And you're right, MSNBC constantly refers to Rush as the "Leader of the GOP". Of course Reince Priebus is (Isn't he? I could be wrong). MSNBC jokingly calls Rush the leader of the GOP because it seems that talking points he may use today are repeated by GOP'ers in office the next day once in a while.

What I would really love to see, is some people paying attention to what scientists are saying, and start curbing emissions, cleaning up the air and water, and lay seriously heavy penalties against companies that pollute on purpose or by accident. That's all. What makes me sick, are heavy polluters get away with it again and again, AND treat people like idiots, AND fight to bend the rules, AND try to reduce / eliminate the EPA, etc. It takes a stupid, preventable problem, and makes it much worse.

Robbie I'm afraid you just don't understand what is happening. Please let me explain.

First, Yes, the ice is thicker and covers almost 2 million kilometres more than it did 2 years ago, but it doesn't mean that the earth is cooling or that the problem of climate change is going away, or even that Al Gore was wrong.

From http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astro...aggerated.html

"Arctic sea ice reaches a minimum in late September every year. The overall trend for the amount of ice at that time is decreasing; in other words, there is less ice all the time. Some years there is more than others, some less. But the trend is down.

In 2012, a mix of unusual causes created conditions where the minimum reached a record low, far below normal. The next year, in 2013, the ice didn?t reach quite so low a minimum extent, and this year looks very much the same as 2013. But saying the ice is ?recovering? is, to put it delicately, what comes out the south end of a north-facing bull. You can?t compare two years with a record low the year before that was due to unusual circumstances; you have to look at the average over time.

http://www.slate.com/content/dam/sla...l-original.jpg

You should read the entire article - it will help explain what is really going on.

I'm not a scientist, and Al Gore is not my God.

I have no idea what the time line is for the polar ice caps melting. However I have seen enough evidence to understand that they are in fact melting at an increasing speed.

I'd be perfectly happy if Al Gore was proven wrong and the ice melting stops, as that means we wouldn't end up with many countries costal,areas flooding and displacing millions of people.

What I do think is odd, is that you are so obsessed with Al Gore, meanwhile you seem to have no concerns with the Koch bros.

You are obsessed with a guy that is no longer in office and might make some money writing books. Meanwhile Koch Bros have been responsible for ridiculous amounts of pollution as well as deaths due to their putting profits before maintenance.

Added to this, they are the main supporters of the anti-global warming theory, meanwhile you have no worries about their mucking around in politics where there is clear profits to be had by denial.

So Robbie, if you are such a deep independent thinker, why is it you only complain about Al Gore yet never have anything to say about the Koch Bros and their lies?

Robbie did you know from 1999 to 2003, Koch industries had 300 oil spills across 6 states?

In 1996 a butane line operated by Koch, ruptured and caused an explosion killing two children and displaced 25 families? Meanwhile they had a policy of "no" preventive maintenance and a policy of "fix it when it's broke" which lead to this explosion.

These are the guys that feed you your anti global warming hoopla. Yet Al Gore is the bad guy that you spend so much time upset over..

Please get back to me when Al gore's books kill someone or burns down their house..

I don't know the koch brothers or al gore and neither do any of you. I met al gore, but I don't know him. I would probably punch the koch brothers in their respective dicks if I had any backbone. Al gore honestly didn't seem like a bad guy but politicians are good at acting, of course. I know to him I was completely invisible, as he had to meet like 1000 people.

1. No, the evidence is that they are expanding (in case you missed all that about the RECORD growth of 29% in 2013). And scientists are saying that within the next couple of hundred years the polar ice caps will extend far south as they did in the 14th century.
But I guess your "evidence" that you get from your "Team" doesn't mention that.

2. If you were to post incessant exaggerations about Al Gore, then I would correct you on that too. Since you only defend the members of your "team" I never have the opportunity to refute you.
Go ahead, attack Gore and use the same kind of rhetoric that you do about others. When I see it, I'll point out where you're wrong for doing that.

You honestly can't see how extreme and biased your political views are can you?
You mock me for NOT playing team sports and call me an "independent thinker" in parenthesis to denote that somehow I'm lying about my beliefs.

Well, I'm not. I have no reason to lie or be deceptive on a message board.

But you? You tend to post things that are exaggerations and deceptions with a clear agenda. Maybe you should ask yourself WHY you do that.

Is it just to troll? To vent?

No Robbie, global warming and ice melt is not looked at as a year by year basis and then determined to which way it's going. For the last 100 years the average temp has risen and the ice has melted.

For the last 50 years once again the temp has risen and ice sheet has shrunk.

For the last 20 years the temp has risen the ice sheet has shrunk.

For the last 10 years the temp has risen the ice sheet has shrunk.

Even over the last 5 years the temp has risen and the ice sheets have shrunk..

Yet once again Robbie Logic to the rescue, because we have a 2 years that the ice has grown, but the temp has still risen.. Yet Robbie is here to declare everyone is wrong.

Yep Robbie Logic to the rescue..

You don't look at one or two years and decide everything is ok, you look at 10 year periods of time as scientist do. Come back in even 5 years and let's see where we are...