Almost all statistics based off race are pointless. The proper data shows its all about income and location. Your race doesn't matter, if you are poor and live in an inner city but are white or asian or latino or something else, yup you are less likely to have an ID maybe and more likely to get shot by police.

But if you are rich and live in the nice area of town, and happen to be black or asian or white, or native american or anything... I bet you have an ID and the police say "Hello Sir, wonderful day today, glad to protect and serve you."

Has nothing to do with race whatsoever.

So why do more blacks and latinos end up poor in inner cities? They all CHOOSE to live there! The apartments are MUCH cheaper if you move out of the city, I am white and would NEVER live in a city if I was poor, I would move out of the city to a small town where its CHEAP and SAFE and the schools are MUCH better.

I really don't understand why they aren't moving out of inner cities in droves.

I just keep asking the same question... HOW can any functioning adult in the United States NOT have an ID.

You have to have one for everything you do in life. From getting a place to live, to turning on electricity, to get running water, to have a phone, even to get welfare (for those "poor" people we keep hearing about).

I keep seeing posts telling me that this is hurting minorities...then somebody explain to me why minorities don't have any ID? And if they don't...how do they live with no home, no electricity, no water?

Please...somebody explain to me how that works these days.

Unless all these poor, inner city people have secret farms built in the ghetto where they get all their food and have secret water supplies that they get their water from and have built their homes with their bare hands on some secret land that nobody else owns.

Can somebody explain that to me? These poor minorities whom some of you are convinced are just so dumb and weak that they can't go get an ID...but they somehow are surviving with no electricity, water, or a home. And they are chomping at the bit to go vote on election day. lol

Here is a good story by NPR that explains who doesn't have the proper ID and why. It seems like about 11% of the adult population overall doesn't have a valid government issued picture ID. However, many of them have other ID cards that have pictures on them. For example a Costco card, a student ID card, a credit card etc. They have been able to get by using these other forms of ID. These voter ID laws won't allow those types of ID, they require a specific government issued ID.

That NPR link uses the Brenan study.

They called people on the phone and asked them if they had an ID. lol

It's not a real study that shows anything close to real numbers.

I would imagine that 9 out of 10 people hung up the phone when they realized they were just cold called by a think tank. And the rest might have told the truth or might not have.

Not even close to actual numbers.

And every story, just like the NPR one you just linked to, use the Brenan "study" as their "proof".

I just don't think that is accurate data under any circumstance.

And if you're telling me that all the "poor" "minorities" who just couldn't get a govt. issued picture ID of any sort...were then able to get college ID's (I thought they were poor?), Costco ID's (I thought they were poor?), and credit cards (I thought they were poor?) and use those...then I say to you:
If they can get all of that, and are just raring to go to vote (lol)...then why on Earth are they not able to get a govt. issued picture ID?

It just doesn't make sense.

As for getting a "special govt. issued ID"...uh, yeah. That's what a valid "ID" is. Try going to a nightclub and see if they let you in with your Costco card. Or buy a beer at the store and see if they let you do that.

Here in Nevada you can go to the DMV and get an 8 year ID card (expires and has to be renewed every 8 years)

Here is the cost:
Under 18 years old: $9.25.
18 – 64 years old: $21.25.
65 years old or older: $7.25.

Doesn't seem like that should be out of reach for anybody.
I even googled up to find out if the fee can be waived for homeless people and other's who are too poor.

Found a page full of links for that. Looks like it's true in every state (though I did not take the time to fully investigate that).

From everything I can see...there is no reason (except for very old people who were born before records were kept properly and have no birth certificate) for any healthy person in the United States of legal age to NOT have some form of ID.

It's easy to do, it's cheap, and if you can't pay...the govt. will waive the fee apparently.

And again, on that Brenan report...they literally called a small sample of people on the phone and asked them if they had ID.
And every anti-voter ID site in the world uses THAT "study" as "proof".

I say that because all the ones I found on Google had links to sites and they all cited Brenan. Just like the NPR link you posted.
I have yet to find anything that doesn't use that "study" as the basis for their flawed thinking.

I even found a link that "Debunked" a newspaper story about how inaccurate the Brenan report was. Guess where I found that? On the Brenan website! LOL!!!

So the people who made some phone calls and are cited as proof...then "debunked" (The word "Debunked" was actually in the page title) a newspaper story that called them out on it!

That's as bad as the Dept. Of Justice investigating itself. heh-heh

As I have said before in this thread, if the voter ID laws were just about ID I wouldn't have a problem with them. Most states could quickly come up with a solution for those who are too poor or in a bad situation and can't afford or aren't able to get to the location to get an ID.

The problem is that most of these laws also want to restrict other voting options. They do things like restrict registration dates, reduce the days for voting, change where and how you can vote and other things like that.

If they just want a vote ID bill, great. Put up a bill that is just about voters having to get and show an ID to vote. But don't put in a bunch of other shit that is meant to reduce the number of votes cast and call it bill that is meant to fight fraud when in reality it is a voter suppression bill.

No that's not true. Every politician needs and wants as many votes as they can get. If you don't need someone's vote, don't you think your competitor will try to grab them?

Hmmm... no, not the best idea I don't think..

Not true. The more information you know, the better your decisions on managing your business, or in this case, delivering your message to potential voters will be. Differences in race means differences in cultures. Addressing cultural concerns is extremely important. This is one area where the GOP fails constantly. They delivery a message alright, but its always the wrong one.


I'll give someone else a chance to answer this one... :)


It's not that they don't have an ID, its that they don't have a "VOTER ID". In many places, especially where minorities live, the GOP has made it harder and harder to get a Voter ID, and harder and harder to vote. This is the problem.

Why do you think the Republicans are interested in this now?

let me be very specific Larry.. you are a creep, in my opinion. I have no personal information to threaten you with. I have no inner need to belittle you.

I personally find you to be a bigot in the 'purest sense of the word' : a person who strongly and unfairly dislikes other people, ideas, etc. and I also find you to be a bully and arrogant and intellectually dishonest... and possibly not that smart? who know who cares...

take your creepy stuff and bother other people and just stay out of threads I start.... thanks

BTW if in my opinion needing ID to vote is a positive thing, that's my opinion AND I have every right to that opinion by law. I have not tied that opinion to race, you have, and in doing so have tried to paint with the racist brush .... very weak logic Larry... don't you have something better to do? like earn a living or something?

these are the 2 wisest posts in the thread. thank you for your insights...

:)

Now I finally understand why police ask for ID.... DAMN RACIST BASTARDS!!!!

I've also just realised that my bank is racist, the local store that asks for ID with a credit card is racist, the state goverment department that runs the guardian ad litum program that asked me for ID when volunteering is racist, the local library that wanted an ID for a library card is racist, the airlines are all racist, The local state tax office asking for my ID is racist, the DMV when I registered my car.... SHIT!! THERE ARE RACISTS EVERYWHERE!!!!!! THE LIST IS ENDLESS!!!




:helpme:Oh crap:disgust:mad:





.

And that's pretty much it. It's very transparent as to what they're trying to do by limiting as many democratic voters as possible. One Pennsylvania politician even admitted that voter ID and voting time restrictions would help Republicans win their campaigns.

Higher voter turnout always fovors Democratic candidates. Republicans know that most of the country is not going in the same direction. The only option they have at this point is to cheat, because they sure as shit aren't going to get votes by being against everything...except tax cuts. That's the only thing they give a shit about.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:thumbsup


.

Don't be stupid..

If you are driving police have the right to require you to provide your drivers license because it is not a right to drive, but rather a privilege. If you are walking down the street a police officer can not force you to show him your ID. Unless you are breaking the law he has no right or authority to hold or detain you due to not providing a ID unless you are driving.

A bank account, is also not a right but a privilege. Voting however is a right..

Howdy -

You're missing the point. Asking for ID is normal for anything such as banking, etc, and its ok to ask for it for voting too. The problem is that most of the ID's that SOME people have are now, suddenly, good enough. For example, in some states, a drivers license was not good enough. I don't recall the details but there are stories of some 90+ elders who had always been able to vote in the past, but now find that things like their birth certificate, marriage license etc, are not good enough.

To get the proper "NEW" ID, meant that it would take weeks or months, or having to jump through many hoops, or do a lot of travel etc, just to get the ID.

At the same time this was going on, many polling stations were being moved to hard to get to areas, or had the number of voting machines reduced to increase already very long voting lines.

They also took away things like Sunday voting which was very very popular with the Cristian black groups.

All of there above were policies put in place by republicans. They seem to be making it harder and harder, for minorities and or low income people to vote.

GFY'ers here love to find correlation between unrelated events, stitch them together and call it proof. But when it seems to fly in the face of perceived conservative values, they protest, and sometimes too much.

Peace.

haha yeah...all of these shenanigans are in states run by Republicans. Any idiot can do the math and see what's going on.

Are republicans suddenly the crusaders for voter fraud that's been proven to not exist?

If a democrat was pushing for voter ID would it still be a racist idea? Or common sense?

Bullshit.

I just pointed out that a quick search of google on how to get a state issued ID came up with this:

You go to the DMV.
And here in Nevada for instance, the cost is: Under 18 - $9.25, 18-64 - $21.25, 65 or older - $7.25 If you are homeless or do not have the means to pay...the fee is waived.
You walk out with your new ID right there. It's similar in the other states as well.

Tell me some more about all this "travel" and "hoops" to jump through, and waiting "weeks or months".

It's simply NOT true.
Pure propaganda by the far "left" (I say "left" because they certainly aren't true liberals).

Their motivation is besides the point - the Democrats are no better, they'd like as many disadvantaged and helpless people, and that includes DEAD people, to vote as possible knowing they'll vote for the party that promises to give them free stuff. So both parties have their own self interests front and center in this tawdry sport.

All that aside, if you want to vote, whether you're old, black, immigrant, whatever - if you can't get it together enough to get an ID card your vote is worthless, we may as well give the vote to 6 year olds and people in comas.

Dude... its not only TRUE, but its been going on for a while. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_suppression

And, here's 7 ways the GOP are currently causing voter suppression : http://www.alternet.org/story/153509...r_vote_in_2012

NO...what YOU said is NOT true.

I showed you that it is easy and cheap (and free if you can't afford it) to get a govt./state issued picture ID in one day.

You claimed it would take months, was difficult to get and required long travel.
You were either lying...or totally misinformed (as usual).

I googled up how to get a state issued id. Try googling that for yourself genius. :)

Then come back and tell me how it's gonna be "suppressing the vote". LOL!
The only thing it will "suppress" would be the DNC registering DEAD people to vote. (as they have done many times in the past)

I think you all waste a lot of time and energy on things that are so common in other countries that we don't even think about it - like a picture ID and health insurance.

meanwhile you carry guns and pay with cheques...

Is it really 2014 already over there? :winkwink:



(j/k - don't shoot me :helpme)

"We" don't carry guns. lol

I have a gun. It lives in my closet in case anyone ever breaks in.

From what I could see on Google there are approximately 6 million Americans with concealed weapons licenses. Most of them are law enforcement officers who carry a gun when off duty.

There are over 300 million people in the U.S.

So no, the vast majority of people here don't carry a gun like it's a cowboy movie.

As for "paying with a check". Yeah, if you're a company paying your bills.

But normal people? When I was a kid I remembered people carried around their wallet-sized checkbooks. These days? It's all credit and debit cards.

I think you might be generalizing and using cliches. :)

Ha, read my mind. I've been voting here in Canada since the early 80's, and have had to show my ID EVERY . FUCKING . TIME. Not once have I ever heard anyone start spouting racism over it.

Then again it really isn't surprising in this day and age of entitlement in the U.S. Haven't you heard? There's racism everywhere and in all things, at least according to Sharpton and Jackson.

https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/5002874368/hB9EB25F4/

:winkwink:

nothing worse than being on line at the grocer behind a little old lady paying with a check. They NEVER even start to dig their checkbook out of their purse until they hear the total, then it's dig dig dig to find it, then scroll scroll scroll to the next blank check, then dig dig dig for a pen, then begins the delicate writing out of data on check. then tearing it off ever soooooooooooooo slowly so it doesn't tear.

over here people pay amounts like $2 by credit card, equally annoying because you have to wait for the connection, entering PIN code etc.

drives me crazy and seriously: who doesn't carry at least 10-20 bucks in cash?

No way.

The motivation IS the point.

All you people (Robbie, Mutt, Grapesoda, L-Pink, sperbonzo) are calling out the democrats on this issue and you are all correct that they ARE using race when race is not an issue.

But you do not call out the republicans for their motivation. Pretending to care about electoral reform when really it's to gain an advantage. By taking the issue of voter ID and defending it like you all are you are supporting a political position that is opportunist. It is not consistent. Because of that you are not about fairness and consistency but rather - "This is logical right now (voter id) and so let's pay attention to it right now because it gives us an advantage right now and if it comes up in the future and is not advantageous to us then we'll ignore it. If it happened in the past and wasn't advantageous to us we'll forget it.)

That is not about what is right but about what is good for the republicans and you are helping to push their agenda by arguing this and bashing one side only.

I'm supporting common sense.

I don't mind paying with cash but only if its exact. I avoid change as much as possible. So if its $2 I may pay with cash but if its $2.32 I will definitely pay with my card.

I also get 2% cash back so I use my card on everything too so that I can get the cash back.

many smaller places here charge an extra fee if the transaction is under $5 or $10 and the customer uses a cc/debit card, so it discourages those small transactions too it seems

checks, though, it seems to me are mostly used by senior citizens and in some specific payment situations. I know many businesses charge a convenience fee if you pay a utility bill via internet, I know, insane, nevertheless, so peeps end up writing out check and snail mailing that. The convenience fee is just a shitty way of getting more cash from a customer.

Then on this issue that would mean you support neither party's position.

at least at you i could yell, here no one understands me :winkwink: :1orglaugh


I think the last time I used a check was before 2000. We occasionally receive them from clients and everytime it's big drama at our bank because only one person there knows what to do with them

What i find interesting is you saying blacks, browns and young people are inculpable of obtaining id?

nice :1orglaugh:1orglaugh …. should these guys be able to vote too? https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1140498


.

I seem to always get behind this woman in the express lane when I am in a hurry.

The other day I got behind a woman who got into a big argument with the cashier over the price of an item. She had grabbed the wrong item off the shelf and then was pissed when she didn't get it at the sale price. After getting her the correct item and finally getting it all straightened out she then pulls out the check book. I was trying to get home for the start of a game and could only shake my head in disbelief.

I didn't say they were incapable. I'm saying the Republicans changed the laws and are making it harder for younger people and minorities to vote, in a feeble attempt to help them win elections that they cannot possible win on merits alone.

"You know, a stereotype isn?t a stereotype if it?s true and racial profiling isn?t racial profiling if it?s true, it?s only racial profiling if it?s wrong. "

- George Lopez

How do you figure it is "harder" for young people and minorities to have an ID?

Your logic is totally screwed on that.

Every state in the union...you go to the DMV. You get a state issued photo ID card in a few minutes very cheap...and if you are homeless or can't afford it, they waive the fees in every state that I looked up.

If they think it's "hard" for them to get an ID card...then I fear for them when they actually ever have to do SOMETHING in life. It might be too "hard"?

Your statements are both racist and now also age-discriminatory. You think minorities and 18 year olds are too lazy and stupid to go to the DMV and spend an hour getting an ID.

Think about what you are saying Mark...that is really what you are insinuating.

Damn....I'm one of those "people"? Is that racist? lol

And yes I have pointed out the Republican motivation. Over and over in this thread I have said time and again...this is about "illegal immigrants" getting to vote.

And I said (look for yourself), that there is one party that gives things away for "free" and one party that does not.

The Dems know who an illegal immigrant would vote for and so do the Republicans.
It's totally political.

But as usual...the DNC lovers in here are pretending it's not. THEY are the ones pretending that the Democrats are just looking out for poor "minorities" who are being "supressed" by having to go to their local DMV and get a freakin' ID.

And I'm pointing out over and over...that getting an ID is easy and cheap to do. And that most people have an ID anyway.

You are the one trying to make it into some kind of political statement. Not me.
Republicans don't want to let illegals vote because they know they will vote for Dems.
Dems don't want people to show ID because they have a long history of signing up non-existent and dead people to vote AND they know that illegals will vote for them also.

Neither "side" gives a shit about you or me. Never have and never will.

Now back to the issue and original question:
It is NOT racist to think people should show an ID. It's NOT "voter suppression" to show ID either.

Every state in the union is set up so you can go to your local DMV and get a state issued photo ID in minutes for a few dollars.
Not hard, not expensive, and doesn't take long.

Why on Earth would the Democrats NOT want people to show ID?
Gee, I wonder why...

You weren't paying attention to what I've been saying.

Again you weren't paying attention to what I've been saying.
I don't see that in this thread.
That's nice. Maybe good for another discussion but not the point people are trying to make here.

Yes finally. But it's not just illegals.

I have been also saying that it is not racist.

But I do believe it is voter suppression because of the other groups aside from illegals who are affected.

if a person isn't interested enough in the privilege of voting enough to get ID why in the fuck do you care if they vote of not if they don't fucking care? that's totally on them... or are thinking people aren't responsible for their actions?