250 jobs effect!

saying that here in 2003 got you labelled right away as a terrorists lovers, USA hater, and so on ....:2 cents:

He took responsibility, saying it needed to be done anyways doesn't change that, it's still his responsibility, or are you saying it's not?

He didn't however say anything like "it didn't matter any how", he said Saddam Hussein needed to be taken out, do you disagree with that?

He owned it as a mistake, Obama never owns anything, just blames others.

Biggest lie of 2013, " If you like your insurance, you can keep it"

First he tried to rewrite what he said till later he was forced to apologize

I understood why we went into Afghanistan, but we should have just went after Osama

Remembering what the USSR put into taming that country and failing, I just didn't see the point.

The when we went into Iraq, I hoped they knew something we didn't know. Apparently they didn't, but Sadam got his number stamped.

The Obama ran for president and said he was going back to Afghanistan and the liberals that hated Bush for the wars were behind him, fucking idiots!

Bush and Obama doing the same things, but when Obama does it, it's some how better?

There's just not much to be said to the guy who is arguing that less people working is good for the economy - furthermore, we all now have to pay for your wife. Wonderful.

I love this new insane spin on a shitty economy and slow job growth "we're not in a recession, we're freeing jobs up for those that 'need' them".

Wow...... Just....... Wow.

I TOTALLY disagree with that.

It's not our business to decide who gets "taken out" and who isn't. That isn't what America is supposed to be about.

Not only did we have no business invading another sovereign nation...we also fucked everything up by doing it.

Using my gift of 20/20 hindsight, I can see that Hussein was exactly what was needed in Iraq.

Just like Mussolini did in Italy...Hussein "kept the trains on schedule" if you know what I mean.

There wasn't any terrorism. Baghdad was a bustling city.

Now? Post-Hussein? Citizens are killed by the hundreds. The place is unsafe for it's citizens (and for anybody).

Without Hussein there as a "strongman" to keep the muslim radicals in check, Iraq is doomed.

I wish it weren't that way. I really believed it when CNN was talking about how the people there were yearning for freedom and welcoming our troops as liberators, etc., etc.

I should have known that was total bullshit.

Hell, half of our country HATED Bush when he was President. Half the country HATES Obama now.

But if some foreign country had come in and invaded us to "liberate" us from either man??? The vast majority of us would be pulling together to drive the invaders out.

Anyway, we had no business invading Iraq OR Afghanistan.

The only thing that the govt. of Afghanistan did was refuse to turn over Bin Laden IF they ever had him to begin with (which they didn't confirm or deny).
So for that we just invaded the entire country. :(

And then it turned out that Bin Laden was in our "ally" Pakistan the whole fucking time. And yes, Pakistan denied it all along. But Pakistan has nuclear weapons and a real army so we weren't going to invade them.

I'm really getting sick of the Federal Govt.
Nothing but lies, schemes, spying, and more lies. :disgust

i disagree and i am happy that back then the german government disagreed as well

https://youtube.com/watch?v=oupzUw4-oSI

start at roughly 40:00 mins


back then before the invasion:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=_k_QbpFl7RM

Same as Christie taking responsibility and blaming it on someone else and firing him.. Meanwhile no responsibility taken for all the miss use of Sandy funds, guess we get to see who he throws under the bus for that.

Yea anyone that didn't agree with Iraq was a freedom hater and a commie. I remember being called that when I said the case for war was bullshit, before we even went to war.

Less people working, is not the same as less people needing jobs. However it does mean there will be more jobs open for people that don't have one.. Humm that kinda means people are still working doesn't it?

or "the old europe"

very interesting article btw from todays point of view:

http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/me...sprj.irq.wrap/


but it gets even better - this gentleman almost became president:

:upsidedow

Let me clarify something
I was against going into Iraq ( I have said that already )
But being there for whatever reason, he should have been taken down since we were already there.

"whatever reason" is not enough to invade other countries :2 cents:

He didn't take responsibility at all. "It's my fault, but it was a decision based on bad intelligence, and it was the right thing to do anyhow" isn't taking responsibility at all.

LOL.

http://www.goodfellasmagazine.com/wp...s-lol-face.jpg

But you might have a point there.... Maybe we should have left well enough alone. Seems we did more damage than good.

Do you need a copy of hook on phonics, that's not what he said

"It is true that much of the intelligence turned out to be wrong," Bush said during his fourth and final speech before Thursday's vote for Iraq's parliament. "As president I am responsible for the decision to go into Iraq. And I'm also responsible for fixing what went wrong by reforming our intelligence capabilities. And we're doing just that."

He said he is responsible for all of it! He didn't blame anyone, he said he was responsible for the bad intelligence too!

Quit cherry picking and changing his words

Like I said, I was against going in there. I'm tired of nation building

I know what you're saying...but it's wrong.

We should NEVER have went in there. (or Afghanistan)

Attacking and invading other countries when they didn't do anything to us is not only wrong...but it's against international law.
Yeah, we used loopholes to get around it...but it shouldn't have been done.

As I said before...just imagine if some other country did the same thing to us. :(

I grew up thinking that the United States was the country that stood against that type of thing.

The only way we should go to war with another country is if a sovereign nation attacks us with their military.
All this talk of "pre-emptive" b.s. is just an excuse.

At the time it happened, I'm sorry to say I was all for it. Swept up in a nationalistic furor and just plain out sick and damn tired of motherfucking muslim extremists thinking they could get away with shit and have no consequences for their actions.

But now...I see quite clearly that we were 100% in the wrong.

they had the correct intelligence, given to them by their partners. they just decided to ignore and deliberately lie about it to start the invasion anyways

You accept a loss of jobs as fact and defend it with the argument that they will be quickly taken by those that "need them" which is speculation.

Funny stuff, you guys. I never knew that people rushing to stop working because they've been incentivized to do so and losing jobs in a bad economy was such a great thing. By the way.... Turning the worker and contributor into what you both describe is then just a taker, contributing nothing that actual tax payers then have to pay for. Wonderful. Marx, Engles, Mao and Lenin would be so proud of how far you've came.

Not going to get into that, this thread has strayed so far from the OP because of liberal tactics like the president uses to change the subject. Bringing up immigration reform when we still don't know what happened that caused a IRS chief to take the fifth and quit her job.

Point being, he took responsibility for what happened.

I started losing faith a little when I lost a friend in Vietnam. He got sent off and never came back. When I learned from my history teacher what Vietnam was all about, it just didn't make sense. He was an awesome history teacher.

Wait !!! IRS??? You mean "mr transparency" isn't being open and honest as he promised?

Crockett doesn't get it, never will

Yep, that's it in a nutshell

Actually it was explained the first page, it's been explained what was meant by CBO themselves but somehow you and Glen Beck know more than everyone else.

You mean this?

Is that really in the CBO Report?

Because Vendzilla was taking it from the actual report.

What BFT3K is typing there sounds like a Pro-ObamaCare advocate spinning the report. And yep...it's just some writer from ThinkProgress.Com A biased pro-Democrat website. lol

crockett, can you find in the actual report where it says that this is a "good thing"?

You don't think it's good do you? A drop in the labor force and tax base is never a good thing for the overall economy and is in fact the exact OPPOSITE of what we were told needed to happen for ObamaCare to make sense mathematically isn't it?

Remember? There were going to be so many people PAYING for it in a "big pool" that it was not only going to NOT cost the govt. "ONE THIN DIME" (as the Pres. said over and over in speeches) but it would also LOWER the cost of healthcare (as the Pres. said over and over in speeches).

As I understand it, the majority of people who have bothered to sign up for "ObamaCare" have signed up for the expanded Medicare. The FREE part.

Very few have signed on to actually pay for anything. :(

And now the CBO Report explicitly says that 2.5 million (at least) will drop out of even trying to have a job. Which means that is 2.5 million MORE people who aren't contributing.

How can that make sense? Or as the Pres. loved to say when attacking his opponents in speeches over and over: "The math just doesn't add up"

I posted a report and everyone told me I was lying

Shows just how much people actually read anything, kinda funny really!

Yep, you should have posted a website's OPINION on the report instead. :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Funny thing is...these guys will now take that post that BFT3K put up of an OPINION by thinkprogress.com spinning and then somewhere in this thread they will tell you that the CBO Report "has already been DEBUNKED"

That seems to be the new favorite word of Obamapologists who are constantly spinning and rewriting history. lol
"Debunked"

When will we all stop playing politics and see that Obama and all the Dems and Repubs are fucking bureaucrats who could give two shits about the American people?

6 pages of opinions on opinions that never existed !!!!

I have more fun making fun of some of these guys. Next weekend I will be gone, no posting!

Obama lover
A follower of Barrack Hussein Obama. Someone who blindly follows Obama no mater what he says or does. Most Obama lovers are liberals who reject any valid criticism of Obama, and often refer to his critics as "racists". Obamalovers are often unreasonable and are not able to partake in any discussions that might have negative reflections on Obama.
1) That Obama lover doesn't understand that printing and spending money without the wealth to back it up will cause severe inflation and devalue the dollar.

2)That Obama lover became really upset when I told him that I thought Obama was inexperienced and unqualified to serve as president.




Over the last 15 months, we've traveled to every corner of the United States. I've now been in 57 states? I think one left to go. Barack Obama

You two should get a room already..

It's Not like I posted a direct link to Politifact's article on this very subject that said it was "mostly false".

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact...ull-time-jobs-

Of course it doesn't say what either of you want to read, meaning it's obviously wrong. As always you are both right, everyone else just doesn't get it...

You cherry one little part of the report while ignoring the rest..

Of course you ignore the rest because it doesn't fit the agenda..

Don't let me get In The way of you two's circle jerk though,.. I'm sure you two can give each other a few more attaboys before the night is over..

crockett, which is correct: The CBO report OR Politifact's spin on it?

Are you really not getting it? Come on!

You didn't post that url correctly. But from looking at what the URL says...it appears that it's Politifacts spinning off of something that Gretchen Carlson spun from the "other side" on Fox News.

Jesus man. What the fuck does Gretchen Carlson's dumb ass OPINION or Politifacts dumbass OPINION about her dumbass OPINION have to do with what the report itself plainly says?

Seriously? Are you going to pretend that you can't read the report for YOURSELF and see what it says in plain English?

Or would you rather get your info from Politifact spinning about Gretchen Carlson spinning?

There really isn't much hope for this country with this kind of thinking.

He posted a single line from the report and didn't represent what it said in context with the entire report. He cherry picked one line and ignored the rest,,

Why did he do that? We all know why, because that's what he was spoon fed from Fox News. He then ran here to tell us all how horrible Obamacare is, yet once again.

The CBO did not say the economy was not going to get better because of Obamacare. That is what Fox News said and it's HIS opinion not what was presented in that report.

He cherry picked a single line from a report that is about 200 pages long because it said a cut in jobs. He didn't however read the report or even the single page he claimed proved his point. He listened to Fox News or some right wing tell him what he wanted to hear website..

Why do I know he didn't read even page 118? Why? Because on the very page HE listed as HIS proof goes on to disprove the message he is trying to present. You guys cherry picked a single sentence from a paragraph in a report almost 200 pages long. In that paragraph you cherry picked a single sentence from, it goes on state what I quoted above...but hey since I know you guys didn't read it anyway I'll quote it again..

It's funny how he managed to selectively ignore what the entire paragraph stated, simply because he read a single sentence out of context provided by Fox News trying to make it seem as if these cut jobs would cause people to suck on the govt tit.

BTW since I know you guys didn't read the report in the first place as you just took what Fox News spoon fed you hook line and sinker, I bet you also missed the part where the report sates that the exchanges will save on average an additional 15% on healthcare polices for 2014 over what was projected in 2013. Humm sounds like the exchanges are doing what they were supposed to do.. Create open competition to lower prices...

It also goes on to state that 2015-17 period the govt will now save 8 billion in risk corridor payments because it was cut in half, from 16 billion to 8 billion..

You can find that nugget on page 114 btw...

You cannot debate to save your life. I am not cherry picking anything.

He places blame on the intelligence in the first line: "It is true that much of the intelligence turned out to be wrong." He is clearly placing blame on the bad intelligence.

YOU are the one who cherry picks stats. You posted a link to a long and detailed report that painted a very pretty picture on unemployment, the deficit, housing, healthcare, and every aspect of the economy and tried to paint it in a bad light, and failed in a horrible way.

He took responsibility for Iraq and the bad intelligence, can't you read?

This isn't a debate, this is what HE said. Ignoring what he said when he took responsibility isn't going to make you right

I didn't fail anything, it came from the CBO, the head of the CBO didn't think it was a good thing when he gave an interview.

Go back read it again, this time try a little harder to understand it Richard

"The act creates a disincentive for people to work."
- Douglas Elmendorf, CBO Director

Fuck Richard, do you read anything? The link I posted was from the CBO's actual report, what exactly are you debating? How can you debate it, it's the CBO report?
I didn't give any opinion, I asked a question
Please tell the class how asking a question can be wrong?

I dunno who Richard is, but I take it you are just going to ignore that I just shot your entire basis behind this topic down yet again? Guess you can start a new topic now and pretend to forget about this one, just like you forgot about the last one in which You were also proven wrong and also cherry picking .

You know the topic where you thought it was normal for a charity to hand out money to politicians and hand out shotguns to good ol white people and that there could be no possible reason they should be under extra scrutiny.

Can't wait til the next topic where you don't look any further than the cherry picked info you hear from your favorite entertainment news source.

He's not hardly going to post the entire 200 page report. If you have an issue with the part(s) he did post then prove it wrong.

Venz read as much of that report as Obama did the ACA laws..yet now it's a law and if you don't follow that law you will get fined...or I guess taxed.

Also, a CBO report..entertainment? The site that numb-nuts the cartoon poster referenced is an entertainment/opinion site.

He didn't need to post 200 pages.. He only needed to read the paragraph in which his entire post was biased on. I realize you guys love to stick up for each other Minte ,but don't you think that if you really wanted other people to be convinced that you are right, that you would at least present the info in accurate form?

He copied and pasted a single sentence then went on to tell us his opinion on how that one sentence proved that Obamacare was going to cause the economy to fail and it's just the proof he needed to tell us all once again how bad Obamacare is.

Other people came in and showed him that the cut in jobs was not due to companies cutting back, but rather people quitting jobs that they only had to have insurance. Of course he claimed it was BS opinion but it wasn't it was right from the same report he used to create this topic. Of course we now have 6 pages of arguing based on his misrepresentation of using a single sentence out of context.

After I posted it in context as it shows in the actual report it's amazing that it says just what others in this topic said it did and vend and the others kept denying.

Don't you think if you wanted to convince people you were right, that it's best to use facts and present them with out cherry picking and trying to make it seem it says something it doesn't? Of course not if you have a an agenda which is harmed by actual truth and facts..

As far as entertainment.. That's in reference to the fact we all know he didn't read the 200 page report and think up his opinion on it all by him self. Fox News did a piece on the report and you guessed it, they cherry picked this very sentence that Vendy here used for his argument. It's pretty obvious that he knew we would all point and laugh at something from Fox News, so instead he linked to the report to try and hide that he was spoon fed it from Fox.

I first posted a link to Politifact where they debunked that actual report from Fox News as "mostly false". I did this on the 2nd page and here were are page 6 with pages of denial from Vend and his followers even though the facts have been posted more than once,

News is about bullet points. I went to page 117 of the CBO pdf and read what Venz posted in context. If anyone wants to read the entire report it's there. I still have no idea how you can refute the statement he posted.

It's right there on the Congressional Budget Report. I could take a screen capture of it and post it. If he had posted the entire page, you would've picked one statement and argued it. Completely ignoring everything else.

At the end of the day, I don't really care much about any of it. If Obamacare is a good thing for the nation then great.. if not, it will crash and burn. The republicans will win the senate, and that will be the end of obamacare as it's currently written.

Officially, take out the mandate. Acknowledge the fact that we have millions of illegal aliens in the country and they will need healthcare too. I am not against healthcare reform. I pay the premium for a large group. It's ridiculous at how much we pay for garbage coverage.
Something needs to be fixed. But not obamacare as it's written.

You are dead wrong. You say he accepted blame. In the very first sentence of him accepting blame he blamed it on someone else. Accepting blame is saying "I accept 100% blame and I am sorry for all of the families who lost loved once and the damage I did to our country". Instead he placed blame on "bad intelligence", and then of all things said "We needed to do it anyhow" as if it was no big deal.

Christie didn't accept blame either. He fired a scapegoat and is trying to move on.


This entire thread is fail on your part, again. You do this all the time - In a report that details how our economy is improving and makes Obama look like a savior, you picked one things that sounded bad. The Republicans were instantly all over this one little bit and tired to make it sound horrible.

The truth is, once again, this is a good thing. Two million people who do not need to be in the work place will leave, opening up two million jobs.

You keep trying to make Obama look bad and you continue to fail at it.

Vendzilla - and Fox News - took a single sentence out of context. They took a long and detailed report that was over all good and desperately tried to turned into an opportunity to bash Obamacare yet again.

Vendzilla highlighted:

But if you read the entire paragraph you find...

People will be working less not because they will be unemployed, but because they will be able to work less to get healthcare.

I'm sorry, but at this point the Republican party is nothing more than sore losers who are kicking a dead horse. The Republican party has put a huge amount of effort trying to get Obamacare shut down, and failed at every attempt - They even brought it all the way up to the Supreme Court and failed to get it knocked down.

If only the Republican party had put it's efforts into fixing the problem instead of complaining about....

You have car insurance, don't you?

I posted the entire paragraph.. No one is refuting that the sentence is in the report it's there I posted it in my quote. What we are refuting is what Vend went on to say by "using" the sentence out of context. He's trying to say that because there will be a cut in jobs that that equals Obamacare is hurting the economy.

When myself and others brought up the fact that it's people choosing to leave jobs because they don't need them just for insurance. We were told that obviously everyone wants to work and any job cuts means people sucking off the govt tit. Robbie went on to mimic this very position. 12clicks as well..

This was 12clicks little gem..

Robbie went on to tell how everyone should want to work, because he has no intention to ever retire. Meaning there obviously can't be any reason people would quit their jobs unless they are lazy...

Here is one of his gems from this topic...

Obviously it's all Obamacares fault... Relentless went on to post yet another article that debunked the idea and rather than reading the article and debating it. Robbie just claimed Rolling Stone is too liberal so obviously the article can't be correct...

Vend went on to tell us again ACA was gonna kill all the jobs ...again..

The funny thing, is the report actually stated that the workforce would grow, despite the 2 million expected jobs that people will leave because they no longer need it. Hey of course Vend didn't read that part of page 117 either...


Honestly Minte you are a fairly smart guy I'd assume. Do yo really think spreading ignorance as Vend does daily with half facts and cherry picked info is the best way to convince people that Republican's stance is correct? If they are correct, then why is it they always resort to trying to fool people?

Car insurance is a choice, let me know when I have to pay for it or I get fined please.

I can take the bus, walk or get a ride from someone.

Yea I know, the sad fact is their fan base actually believes it's the other way around. It's no wonder they always want to cut funding to education and teach creationism in schools. Their dumbing down of America is the only way they stand a chance..

LOL, REALLY?

Geez, Richard.
The CBO is saying the the employment or work force is getting smaller and the economy is not getting better, that's what I said in the OP
http://vendzilla.com/cbo.jpg
from the first page on the CBO
Shows no economic growth and a smaller work force

Where the hell did we lose you?

The Faux News / Hate Radio propaganda machine has proven itself capable of totally brainwashing the ignorant. It's really too bad.