This is how America is supposed to be. Land of the dreams. Work hard, be rewarded. But it's not asking too much to put a little bit back in.

Then you should go back to school and take some reading comprehension classes.

Where do I say I want anyone to get taxed more.

I will save you the time looking. I NEVER have said that. I have said countless times that I think the government should spend less.

Well said.

^^^QFT


Interestingly, it looks like taxes may go up on everybody next year anyway....






http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxto...scal-cliff.cfm






http://www.urban.org/fiscal-cliff/im...HighRez-01.jpg

http://www.urban.org/fiscal-cliff/im...HighRez-02.jpg




:2 cents:.

I guess we have different definitions of The American Dream. Kind of sad that everyone thinks they must be rich and they can't have a great life unless they are rich.

Every time I meet an immigrant I ask them how they like America. The reply is always the same. "I love it."

That's what The American Dream is to me. Not sure what to tell all of those that dream of getting rich easily. That was never The Dream before, not sure why it suddenly is now, but that is more of a delusion than a dream. Very few people get rich easily. Sitting on the couch complaining about it is certainly not going to make that dream, or delusion, come true any quicker.

I have strong feelings about this subject. I guess I'm biased. My story is a little different than most. I believe that if *I* can live out what I consider to be The American Dream, than anyone can. I wish more would see it that way.

The huge disappointment in this graph, is that we all know that everyone will get an increase in their tax bill and it won't even come close to reducing the deficit.

Its not my definition of the american dream but just what it seems for a good segment of america. look at this way, most american born citizens in the last 30-40 years were born into middle-class-dom and so the idea of just living a better life is somewhat pointless because life is already fairly comfortable. to these people the american dream is something more than living an average life with an average income. i think celebrity worship is also somewhat to blame, people see movie starts and athletes making millions for what they view as having fun. unless you come from a poor country, fascist country or poverty stricken america, just making a better life doesn't cut it.

Absolutely. Spending will still go way way up, and the debt will continue to skyrocket.


Don't doubt it




.

He learned his lesson after Kosovo :2 cents:

I am gay. Rather than listing them you already know them.

I think everyone would agree that if Minte does for employees what he says he does we need Republicans like him to take back their party.

Since I never see Minte weigh in one way or another on social issues seems like he is the live and let live type.

Minte for President in 16!

http://i.imgur.com/Izkt4.png

How about straight from the CBO.


And I don't care if it's the Dems or the Republicans doing it. It has to stop.

http://www.heritage.org/research/rep...chart5750.ashx

http://www.heritage.org/research/rep...600&h=521&as=1

http://www.heritage.org/research/rep...600&h=546&as=1


It HAS to stop. Or it will simply stop on it's own. And that won't be pretty....

http://www.heritage.org/research/rep...600&h=528&as=1

You said two things. spending will still go way way up and debt will skyrocket. I argued the former, you seem to be under the impression I've argued the latter (which I agree with).

The debt too high crowd, should be embracing this. Raises taxes to pre bush cut rates and cut all programs 20 percent. If you want to cut the debt this should do the trick.

Minte and I differ on many issues, but I have zero doubt he wants what is best for the country and would work toward that goal with as much determination as I would. I wouldn't vote for him because our views differ, but if he got elected I wouldn't have a feeling of panic and anger over it the way I did when GWB was elected.

I miss the days of being able to favor one candidate without having to fear the other. My main hope for 2016 is two candidates who are not crazy or dangerous. So we can choose one and still respect the other. Hillary Vs. Christie or Bloomberg for example... :2 cents:

I saw on the news that the "Fiscal Cliff" (which is nothing more than the program Congress passed and the President signed and CONGRATULATED themselves on doing...that puts in automatic cuts and ends the Bush tax cuts for everyone) will only cut 600 billion dollars...OVER TEN YEARS!

What the fuck??? That means this horrible, dreadful "fiscal cliff" (that Congress was saying was a great thing just a year ago), will only cut the spending by $60 billion a year.

What a fucking joke.

The Feds are spending 10.6 billion dollars a DAY.

That means that with this big, bad "fiscal cliff" they will only cut what they spend in 5 days for the whole year.

Washington D.C. is nothing more than a pack of thieves. Career politicians who don't know how to stop spending.

The cuts will never happen. They will be SEEN to be happening, by using base-line accounting, Q.E., and other tricks, but nothing will actually be cut IMHO




.:2 cents:

Christie is a clown, Nobody would vote for him.

Look at Hillary in just the last few years, At this rate 4 more years and she will be in a hospital bed.

Neither of them would make a decent president :2 cents:

That's well said. I read something remotely like it the other day. The poster was saying that when comparing a little left to dangerous right that they would vote left every time, even though they personal considered themselves to be conservative.

I am not entirely sure Rochard is able to read what people say before he forms an opinion on what they said (in his head that is.)

That's me exactly... I would love to vote Republican and used to often... in the last few elections it's not possible. GWB, Bachman, Santorum, Cain, Romney, Palin.... the Dems could run almost anyone against that and win. It would be the same if the Dems were running Biden, Al Sharpton and Kuscinich... any Republican beats them.

We need 2016 to be the year of the normal sane people with different ideas from each other. I don't 'like' Christie but he is not insane. Hillary is sane. Bloomberg. Maybe Rubio. It's time to stop gathering people who should be in the Howard Stern whack-pack and calling them Presidential nominees.... :2 cents:

I'd have voted for either of them over Romney or Obama. Neither is a dream... but compare them to Santorum, Sharpton, Bachman, Perry and the other retards who have been running as of late.

Where did you see that?

The "fiscal cliff" includes $7 trillion worth of tax increases and spending cuts over a decade. would lead to the biggest single-year drop in the annual deficit as a percent of the economy since 1969.


_________

:thumbsup

CNN Money has a good read on what it's all got in the bill

Some of it isn't pretty.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/11/08/news...html?hpt=hp_c1

I read through the first half of that. That could hit the middle class very hard.

Medicare doc fix

Expires. Medicare payment rates for physician services drops by 27%

This one will get a lot of peoples attention.

The 'deal' has almost definitely already been made behind closed doors.

My guess is they let the cliff happen so taxes skyrocket and then before anyone pays any of the new rates they announce a deal in January calling it 'the biggest tax reduction in the history of our nation' returning us to the pre-cliff rates :2 cents:

Child tax credit: Falls to $500 per child from $1,000. The refundable portion also reduced.

And this one will nail everyone on the opposite end of the age spectrum.
The rest of them are things that the middle class really won't be affected by.

That might actually be a good PR move. People with cash who have been sitting on the fence would have to see that as a step forward.