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And Romney destroyed businesses? http://farm1.static.flickr.com/142/3...f641aa9afb.jpg |
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But the social liberals in this country are completely hung up on what the percentage of Capital Gains tax is (you know, the tax rate that is also used for RETIRED people's 401K and other investments...money that was already earned long ago and taxed at that time as well). If he were to release it, it would just cause another stupid barrage babbling about percentages. Romney wants and needs to focus on the big issue of the economy. Not his personal money. As for "foreign accounts" and taking every tax loophole availabe...so does EVERYBODY. You take every deduction and money saving legal way to not give away your money on your taxes. So do I. So does everyone. No, you and I may not have enough money to put it in foreign accounts. But if you did...you would. And is that Romney's "fault"? No. It's the stupidity and greed of the federal govt. When you set tax rates too high...people move their money to countries smart enough to know how to draw money to them. That has ALWAYS been the case. If you're really worried about whether all multi-millionaires put their money in the local Bank Of America OR overseas...then the federal govt. needs to stop penalizing people for saving and investing in this country. Why aren't any of you up in arms over the Federal govt. spending 7 MILLION DOLLARS PER MINUTE. And borrowing 3.5 BILLION dollars per day??? No, let's don't worry about that. The feds BORROW more money in a day than Romney has made in 20 years. But let's don't worry about that. Let's just keep getting distracted from the real problems in this country. Wars, debt, jobs....these are the things that should be discussed. But Democrats want no part of that discussion it seems. Did liberals come after Kennedy when he was President? He and his family had money all over the world to avoid taxes. Did they go after their beloved Roosevelt? NOPE. |
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If you point is that Jon Stewart should not be elected President... I'm inclined to agree with you. I think he does just fine at what he does now. Including incisive commentary that rips through the layers of veneer and gets to the core of why Romney is an even worse choice than Obama. None of that makes Obama a good choice. It's probably the worst set of candidates in my lifetime... but when choosing between an F and another F, I'd rather choose the F who is ineffectively leading us in the right direction than the F who would likely more-effectively lead us in the wrong direction. :2 cents: |
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its so funny watching little stewart piss and moan about his betters and their money in every political thread. He's obama's target audience.
worrying about someone else's money is about as low as it gets. spend more time worrying about your own and watch how it grows |
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If you made a fortune on tax loopholes for decades and you are campaigning on the promise to fix tax loopholes... you damn well have to have a SPECIFIC set of which ones you would close and why. You need to articulate that to voters before, not after, the election. His decision to give very vague, nearly meaningless replies to requests for specific policy agenda regarding tax loopholes is absolutely his "fault"? Yes. Quote:
Personally I think our tax rate system is idiotic. We ought to have a very low flat tax rate (somewhere around 10-15%) with a one time exclusion of 50K for every income earner. And we ought to have a federal sales tax of 3-5% on all items except basic substance staples like milk, home heating oil, diapers, etc... No other exclusions, no other loopholes for anyone. Then tax policy becomes a very simple matter of adjusting the flat tax rate and the sales tax rate each year based on revenue and budget. It's pretty much the only system that actually makes sense... and yet you'll never see either party actually push to implement it. Quote:
I am all for true Conservative government... the GOP is not. I am all for Pragmatism... the Democrats are not. These are the parties of Romney, Obama, Bush, Pelosi, Bachman, Plain, Santorum, Biden, Ried ... do you really think any of them will solve the problems we face? They are all bought and paid for by the same group of post-nationalists... and you get what you pay for.... :2 cents: |
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I have voted Republican, Democrat, Third Party Candidate and will continue to do so based on issues and the character of the candidates. I don't wear a blue or a red shirt politically and I think people who do are doing themselves a disservice. I don't think Obama has done a good enough job, and the ONLY thing likely to get him reelected is the fact that GOP ran a retard-go-round of candidates that allowed Romney to become the pick of the litter. Had they run ANYONE sensible they would have won by a landslide. Now, instead of having 25% under/unemployement and an easy win in the election, Romney has managed to give Obama quite an easy path to reelection. Your idiocy won't change that. :2 cents: |
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I'm just addressing this whole "Romney's Money" non-issue that is being used to distract all of us from what the Federal govt. is doing to destroy our economy. Romney hires an accountant...just like everybody else with money does. He hires investment firms. They move his money in ways to capitalize on it's optimal financial gain. Just like everybody with money does. As for him running for President...Kennedy didn't show his tax returns, and his family money came from his daddy (bootlegging liquor) and they kept money in offshore accounts and did WAY more shady things than Romney has ever done (mob ties, criminal activities, etc) Did it have any bearing whatsoever on Kennedy's ability to be the President. No. How about Roosevelt? One of the most famous wealthy families of all times. He never showed his tax returns. Was he "hiding" something? And his money too was old family money. Does that mean he shouldn't have been President? I think history proves otherwise. As far as I know we have never had a President who wasn't a multi-millionaire. And it's only in the past couple of decades that candidates VOLUNTARILY showed their tax returns. If I were running for President...I'd tell the press to "kiss my ass" in exactly those words when it comes to my personal life. Of course I'd also legalize drugs and prostitution...so don't expect to see "President Robbie" in office anytime soon in this uptight country. lol |
Relentless is shooting all of yalls BS down one by one like he was shooting ducks at a carnival
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And I'm SURE you made just TONS of money posting on boards over the years. Thats EVERY trolls claim to fame.:1orglaugh |
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And he was elected and was a great president. Just like Roosevelt was as well. |
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The part where Cyn chimes in to agree with you and then I post specific links to her recommending me to other clients AFTER my work for you was completed speaks volumes. So does your testimonial from the wayback machine. There are dozens of top companies I have worked with over the years at this point Ronald who are happy with my services. Your petty axe to grind because I refused to send you any xsales not withstanding. Though it is interesting that each time you fail to argue a topic on the merits you resort to failed attempts at deriding the other people in the discussion. Perhaps you should stop making ridiculously wrong predictions about Giuliani or Newt being the next President and people would take your political rants with a bit more credibility. Threads like this do prove one important fact... I can supply large quantities of marketable original text in a very short period of time, reliably - with an excellent impact on ranks, conversion ratios and branding. It's one of the many services I offer and I continue to work tirelessly to improve my entire product line every day. |
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I thought we had to choose Obama, Romney or Johnson. So I was under the impression it was their records that count this time. Please let me know how to reelect Kennedy, Roosevelt or Lincoln in 2012. Of the three choices, it seems to me only Romney has shifted millions of dollars off shore, bankrupted profitable companies for his own profit and suggested plutocracy is the way we ought to go. :2 cents: |
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I then gave you very specific examples of great Presidents that you would have said were not qualified because they inherited their money, moved it offshore, and even had criminal ties. But as history showed...that had absolutely NOTHING to do with their ability to be effective Presidents. That was my whole point. Either you just don't want to see what I was trying to say...or you are just disregarding it to go with the media's narrative of how important Romneys money and taxes are (even though I don't see that they have ANY importance or effect on whether the President can create a business friendly environment to grow the economy) |
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If Romney gave specifics of his tax policy plans, we could discuss them. He hasn't and said he won't until after he is elected. He said I'll fix it if you elect me... and expects us to take his word for it. That makes his past deeds and credibility even more important. I am sure he told the people at Kaybee Toys he would help grow their business... it is very unlikely that he said 'Hi, let me bankrupt all this for you and put all your employees out of work so I can profit from the debt you incur.' If Steve Jobs said 'Hey I can be a bit of an asshole to work with, but Ill fix this economy for you, just vote for me' I would take him over Obama in a heart-beat. With or without his tax returns. He could probably do a better job while dead than Obama and Romney can do alive. Bloomberg, Mort Zuckerman (if he wasn't Canadian-born)... there are people out there with the track record to make those kind of bold 'trust me' campaign statements. Romney isn't one of them. Donald Trump isn't either, but Trump isn't running... so his lack of financial credibility doesn't matter. Romney's does. |
I'm not talking about Slave owners.
I deliberately chose two liberal Democrat party ICONS of the 20th century who moved our country forward. You are trying to deflect what I said and not address it. Neither Kennedy or Roosevelt "earned" their VAST fortunes...they inherited them. Kennedy's money came from his dad Joe's bootlegging operations during prohibition and he had lots of mafia ties. Neither ever showed their tax returns.And both families were well known for their "Swiss Bank Accounts" throughout history. My question to you is: You wouldn't have voted for either man according to your criteria. Does that mean that maybe, just maybe.....tax returns and how much money you inherited don't really have a thing to do with leadership abilities? I'm not attacking you by the way. I'm sincerely presenting this to you in hopes that maybe it's something you hadn't considered before and maybe sway you to think about it and perhaps come to a different conclusion. |
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If Romney had the track record and credibility to overcome his decision to skip releasing his returns he would be in good political position. He doesn't have the military record Kennedy had... He doesn't have a history of successful policies that he sticks with and fosters... during his time as Governor he did just about everything he now says is wrong. Putting the tax returns completely aside... what about Romney makes him likely to be as good a President as Kennedy? What has he shown you that makes him the next Roosevelt or Eisenhower? Romney ran the most expensive Olympics in US history and squandered a fortune doing it. Romney created the precursor of Obamacare as Governor of Massachusetts. Romney isn't a self-made man, he was handed a fortune by his daddy. Romney didn't serve in the military during wartime as Kennedy did... he got an exemption to do Missionary work in Paris from his father. I agree with you, no candidate should be rejected SOLELY for failing to supply his tax returns. In this case, it's just one of a very long dirty-laundry-list of problems Mitt faces... and it becomes especially poignant because much of the economic policy he espouses relies on closing unspecified loopholes in the tax code. Romney isn't the conservative business leader the GOP should have run. He isn't the statesmen they could have run. He isn't the war veteran... hell he managed to piss off just about every country he visited from the UK to Palestine in a single trip, so he is no diplomat. What he is, is an opportunist looking for the next big score. If you know people like that, when they tell you they will 'fix it and we will all make money if you just trust me' you are smart enough to know that's not how things turn out. He is in it for himself... not for the nation... and that is the most dangerous kind of candidate that can run. :2 cents: ----- I am not attacking you either. Attack my ideas all you want... it's usually the best way for anyone to learn something. Spirited honest discussion without personal attacks is something this country badly needs more of... not less. |
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Federal govt. spending $10.46 BILLION dollars per day Federal govt. borrowing $3 BILLION dollars per day Fighting wars all over the world. A war on drugs at home that has the U.S. incarcerating more of it's citizens than ANY country in the world. And most important...high unemployment for the 4th year in a row as the economy still has not recovered. These are the things we need to talk about. What will Obama do differently if anything to change this course? What will Romney do to change it? Instead...they use the media to distract us with dogs on a roof, how many years of tax returns, class warfare, etc., etc. ,etc. Everything BUT the actual issues that we face as a nation. |
You cant compare FDR and JFK for today.They lived in a very different world. Tax returns weren't released until the 1970's. Before TV there weren't supreme court confirmation hearings. Its a different time
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THIS is what the campaign SHOULD be about. We were driven into a deep ditch by eight years of Bush and Obama has been walking around the overturned car ignoring the gas fire to look for the car keys during much of his four years in office. That is an excellent reason to vote for anyone other than Obama. Unfortunately, instead of real candidates, the GOP ran a slate of retards. Bachman, Herman Cain, Santorum, Perry, Newt... and Romney. That was what they decided would be the best possible field. Compared to the rest of that field Romney looks like a rockstar. Compared to almost anyone else... he looks like a plutocratic bustout salesman. Instead of talking about the issues you mentioned, and Gitmo still being open, US citizens being assassinated, Citizens United gutting our Democracy, the BP oil spill resulting in 0 arrests, just like the banking meltdown 0 arrests... We are left to deal with Romney being Romney and Obama being Obama... because nobody honestly expects either of these two "F" grade candidates to fix anything. I honestly truly wish either party had a better candidate. |
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And neither did Obama. What's your point? Kennedy BARELY was elected in a squeaker over Nixon. Nixon has a much bigger and "better" record than young Kennedy. If I were to just take the measure of Obama and Romney as LEADERS...I would definitely give the nod to Romney. Obama never led anything in his life until he became President (probably why his first two years sucked so bad) And my point wasn't that NOT showing tax returns made Kennedy a great President. You are deflecting again. My point was that his tax returns had NOTHING to do with his capabilities. Just like Obama's tax returns didn't help him turn the economy around in 3 years like he claimed he could in the election or it would : "be a one term proposition" for him (his words). A person's personal finances have nothing to do with their abilities or lack of them. Reality is that Romney is qualified. More qualified than Obama was in 2008 for sure. Not saying Obama wasn't qualified...he was and is. Theoretically you and I are supposed to be qualified to be President...but it turned out that only multi-millionaires really need apply. :( Your opinion is that Romney has shown nothing in his career. That's what the media is preaching. Reality is...the guy has been a success. Whatever you think about some of the companies going belly up...(KB toys? Come on! ALL brick and mortar toy store chains went out of business because kids didn't want those toys anymore...they want video games. Seen any Toys R Us Stores lately?) Romney's company did turn around more than failed. And made a lot of money for a lot of people. Yeah. the companies that went down are going to scream about that if they lost their jobs. I understand that 100%. But KB Toys was going DOWN one way or another. Just like any of the financially troubled companies that went down. Do you seriously think that KB Toys would still be in business today no matter what? Hell no. And the fact that I'm even taking the time to debate that with you is proof that we are being distracted from the REAL issues facing our country. I hope you can at least see what I'm saying about that. We should be debating HOW to get our country out of the trouble it is in and reign in the greed in Washington. |
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He said very plainly that the majority of people who are dependent on govt. will NOT vote Republican. And also...the reverse is true. The majority of people who own their own businesses will not vote Democrat. Of course there are plenty of exceptions...but overwhelmingly that's the way it shakes out. And I would definitely say that a guy who lives on welfare for 10 years (just grabbing any number out of thin air for this hypothesis) wouldn't make much of a LEADER. Neither would guys who are hard working but are more "worker bee" employee types who work hard but have no desire to take risk or lead. Certain people have the type of personality and ability to get people to follow them. Those are the people we elect. |
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So Robbie, now he is essentially telling American taxpayers... 'give me access to the Fed and let me fix things. I just need you to trust me to do unspecified things while I turn the economy around. Then after we borrow some more money and I have leadership authority things will be fine'. Doesn't that smell an awful lot like the same scam he pulled at KB all over again? The United States isn't just KB Toys... and I wouldn't trust Romney with a prepaid credit card at a gas station quickie-mart, let alone grant him the ability to print money. He is a bustout salesman looking for an even bigger score. |
Dude...everybody borrows money to buy out other companies. You use your own capital to secure the loan.
And kids don't BUY toys anymore. They buy video games. KB wasn't set up for anything remotely close to that. They were going bankrupt. Why the fuck are we talking about that? And by the way...the President has NO access to the Fed. That's one of the problems of The Federal Reserve. They are unelected and answer to nobody. If you think Romney is somehow inept and unable to create a business friendly environment that could help the economy and create jobs (I could do it in one day just by opening the Keystone Pipeline and approving some new nuclear energy plants)...then by all means vote for Pres. Obama. There is a good chance that he might have learned enough over the last 4 years to finally make a couple of moves that would be helpful in turning things around. I'm not trying to get you to vote Romney. I'm just trying to say: "why are the American people being deliberately distracted away from the real issues facing us" |
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EVERYBODY borrows money to buy other companies. Nobody uses their own money. I learned that from my grandfather in the Citrus industry in Fla. He never went to the bank and pulled out a million dollars to buy an orange grove. He put up a small bit of his own capital and the bank put up the rest. What Bain did afterwards with the company is irrelevant. If the company had a chance to survive and make profit, that's what Bain did. If it was going down anyway...they were smart and made money out of it. Again..why are we discussing this? What does any of that have to do with the ability to be President of the United States? Or is Romney the first really smart, aggressive guy to ever run for the office? |
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I read that solar panels across the Mojave desert here would power the entire country. And wind power would KICK ASS here in the desert as well. Yet...the federal govt. doesn't do ANYTHING. Instead he funneled money to his cronies at Solyndra. The govt. COULD have just hired Solyndra to build the damn panels out here in the desert...instead, they just handed them money with no clear directive or mission. It's called stealing taxpayer money. :( |
For the record, JFK (the pres) was not as popular as the youth of today think. If he had not been assassinated there would likely be a different picture of him. Like Tony mentioned, back before there was an Internet the press was pretty President friendly.
You think he could get away with banging MM in 2012? |
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But popularity isn't necessarily the measure of a Presidency. Clinton was so unpopular at the end of his term that Al Gore wouldn't even allow him on the campaign trail. But a few years later he is recognized as a great president. |
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