You obviously aren't a photographer. Casual theft of your work would really piss you off. A good law that stops Piracy is what I would like. I'll take a sort of good one. Hell, I might even take a shitty one that we can change later.

Under this law, the forum owner would simply have to either a) not ask people to upload stolen goods and promote the forum as a place for infringement or b) respond to complaints. Because Facebook and Twitter and do not advertise as pirate sites, and are used by people other than thieves, they are immune under this law. You're worried about a make believe bill, or maybe, last yearns bill. None of your concerns apply to this bill.

That would suck for awhile too Robbie. But it too would spark innovation. There would just be a middleman that would take card and it would be a go between. Like Paypal will not process for adult sites. Yet, they make a fortune processing for adult material of file lockers.
When the money is that big, there will be a work around.

According to this bill if somehow something has been posted on this blog wich a copyrite holder claims he ALLEGES that it may be in vviolation of his rights the website will be taken off the internet no "fair use" or any judge will be involved!

If this is correct, then this may be the poison pill put into the bill so that it could never pass. If I say google has my images, they will take down google? Even if they don't have my images. That is power to the people for sure!

If your "alarm bells" only go off because you're not making money, you may want to re-think that...

From NetCoalition (Google, Yahoo, etc)

Exactly only globalist companys like google will get a magic waver.

Even a MC donald sign in 1 of your outside pictures may be reason to take down your website if MC donalds claims this is bad for its reputation.

Any "alarm bells" that go off for me are based on my years of experience in this business.
I've seen and read and heard "the sky is falling" many, many times over the years.

But it really DID fall over the last few years with piracy. It's destroying everything.

If people want to argue over an updated law that replaces the current DMCA law that is far, far behind what is happening...then I would suggest you turn your arguments toward the PIRATES.

It's not the honest hard working guys like me who work hard for a living and take risks, etc. that are causing these new "restrictive" laws to come into place.

Nope.

It's the greedy fucking pirates and thieves who are going to end up being the end of your perceived "freedom" (and as I read this thread...it appears that "freedom" translates into youtube, message boards, and facebook for most of the video game playing generation).

For me..."freedom" means the freedom to create and work and not have to worry about spending half my time dealing with thieves who steal everything.

I guess it's all a matter of where you're standing that determines your perspective on it. And from where I'm standing...this industry has been raped by piracy.

Not that the govt. gives a shit about us. But since pirates have also turned their greed and corruption towards mainstream business and fucked them too...now it's time to pay the piper.

Fuck pirates and thieves.

“In Germany they came first for the Communists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me, and by that time no one was left to speak up.”

~ Pastor Martin Niemöller, 1945

Just a little less freedom every day....

i doubt so

[post censored]

You are not serious. I think you don't realise we are talking about a police state.
3 strikes and you are out with some laws like that ?
Cya in jail....

Which part?

Not to use lame analogies, but its like throwing the baby out with the bath water -- or cutting off your head to cure a headache.

we are no more in 1999

Read the bill. That's simply not true. You're argung against something that would be very bad if it were real, but it simply isn't real. In fact, under this bill, if the site owner responds to complaints he's off the hook. Also if the site is mainly something other than theft, he's off the hook. Only if he makes a site designed and marketed as a theft ring and fails to handle complaints can a judge order it be delisted.

The Patriot Act was designed to protect our freedom too.

The idea behind the bill is generally a good one, but a power-grab is lying in the grass.

I can imagine the heart of this idea fitting on maybe one or two pages of legal text.

The current version is already 70 pages, and who knows how much it will grow and change by the end.

eliminate piracy and we'll see. :thumbsup

Power grab? You mean returning power back to content owners and taking it away from theives? No Avatars? Going to jail for breaking the terms of service of a website? Come on. The more I hear these sky is falling arguments against it, the more I know this is the best thing ever. Baby out with the bath water? Is the baby the ability to take copyrighted material until you get caught and DMCA'd by the owner, then just to have it uploaded again? Then yeah, throw it all out.

why does everyone keep saying the government doesn't like porn? take away the pirating, and just imagine the taxes paid...

No one's fucked up this industry more than the people in this industry.

I'm not going to revisit the insane pro-tube vs anti-tube battle again, but if any of you still believe that giving away unlimited porn, while trying to SELL PORN, is a brilliant business plan, then I don't know what to say.

Piracy sucks, but it is only a portion of the revenue loss. The bulk of the loss is self-inflicted.

Now all of the "small government conservatives" here, are so confused that they are willing to allow BIGGER government to step in and play Daddy for us.

It's a trojan horse I tell you!

I'm not wanting anybody (especially the govt.) to play "daddy".

But you know as well as I do that the DMCA laws are outdated. And I have already stopped caring about the dumbass sites that have joined into the race to the bottom...if they want to put all their content up for free so they can get a big traffic number, then that is their business.

But as for you and me? We are shooting unique stuff. Not generic porn. And when our content is stolen and posted up on big tubes, torrents, file shares, and pirate forums it hurts our business big time.

Having the laws changed to reflect new technology is not asking the govt. to play "daddy" in my opinion. It's simply putting the proper laws in place to go after thieves.

If you truly believe that the U.S. govt. is going to be expending time and energy chasing down people's avatars on message boards or going after YouTube and Google, I think you are mistaken.

All this law is going to do for us is give us a way to FINALLY have our attorneys move on these thieving scumbags. The govt. not only won't play "daddy", but they aren't going to lift a finger to help us in any way.

But the law is the law is the law. And we will finally have the ability to take legal actions against pirate sites. And when we do...and WIN, then the authorities will be able to take the actions that the new law empowers them to.

That's the way I see it. As I already said...I'm not going to lose one tiny iota of freedom from this bill. Nobody will.

If the average person wants to upload something on the internet..then they will have to CREATE it themselves. Just like they used to have to do. And webmasters will have to actually WORK their own sites...just like they used to do.

True user uploaded content will actually become REAL amateur porn and the all around innovation and creativity of the internet will increase in my opinion. How? Easy. People will have to LEARN to do shit again and create content and film stuff and write songs, etc. The only "innovation" I see from piracy is figuring out better ways for people to steal shit and upload it. Whoopty doo. I ain't impressed.

Anyway...millions of us were "free" on the internet before user upload shit became so prevalent. Am I "more free" now because I can steal something and upload it? Does that make me more "innovative"?

No.

And this is exactly the kind of law I've been calling for for the last couple of years.

When a bill finally is passed that replaces the bullshit whack-a-mole DMCA law that has stripped our industry to the bone...that is the day that things will turn around for this industry and real porn producers.
And it's also the day that pirates and ALL people (ones who advertise on their sites, their hosting companies, and every little bottom feeding fringe person) who make money directly or indirectly from other people's stolen content will begin to hurt as badly as they have been hurting all of us.

As if the freedom of speech exists only to ensure that any random idiot can upload any clip he likes to youtube, instantly and anonimously. Or use any picture he likes as his avatar on a message board. And if he has to use his iphone to snap a pic for his avatar, oh noes, totalitarism and oppression.

I'll rephrase it for more relevance.

First they came for the shoplifters, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a shoplifter.

Then they came for the burglars, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a burglar.

And then they came after me.

Maybe that's because stealing other people's work and posting it at my torrent site wasn't such a good idea after all?

It's already illegal to steal copyright content.

You are getting too old to think straight. Piracy is at its current levels because of technology, not legislation. Compression algos and codecs making files smaller on one hand while broadband makes connections faster.

In the 90's people bought DVD's because it would have taken years to download them with their 33.6 modems. They didn't even have Divx codecs to compress the mpegs back then.

People didn't rip your websites because it would have taken months and they needed to use the phone occasionally.

The cat is not going back in the bag, old man.

We might need freedom from internet ...

QFT :thumbsup

It just sounds like tech has caught up with people's flawed ethics and morality. What if they knew there would be consequences for doing the wrong thing? Wouldn't that make them think twice before doing it?

I am not saying I agree with you but even if you are 100% right ethics and morality will continue to be "flawed" regardless of legislation and technology and human ingenuity will continue to outpace the "law".

Example: In the US Drugs are illegal, and they are everywhere. Prostitution is illegal and it is everywhere.

People will find a way to do what they want regardless of the law and everyone knows it.

There are only 2 kinds of people who want this:

1) over the hill content producers who think they are somehow going to bring back the 90's by turning downloaders into Felons and

2) people with a hidden agenda to use claims of IP violations to stifle real freedom of speech.

Even if some of the content producers win it wont be the ones producing adult content cashing in, it will be the ones producing shitty movies like Green lantern and shitty artists like Justin Bieber. Nobody gives a fuck about porn, except while they are actively masturbating. The second they cap that geyser with a sock they cant turn it off fast enough.

Jesus fucking Christ.

A law is proposed to curb piracy and some prick throws in quotes about facism.

Freedom does not mean that you get to steal without threat of sanction.

But the Nazi thing seems be be used a lot in US political debate. Same with Obamacare, same with gun control debates. It just sounds silly to me.

True, this is going to hurt a lot of sites that we all love, but anything that forces creation of original content, instead of pilfering from other sources is fine by me.

Anything? Really? Because for example burning all of society to the ground would probably force a lot of creativity and original works.

before internet and legislation
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_UpzX-kaOlS...mbling1894.jpg

after internet and legislation
http://images.nationalgeographic.com...70_600x450.jpg

So speaks a man who advertises on piracy sites. :Oh crap

So speaks a man without a brain. There was porn before the Internet.

You will risk the consequences of posting pirated content?

anyone who thinks that is a pirate or piracy supporter. The more money you make creating = the more creation.

This argument is falling into two camps. those who think they can't be hurt from piracy or benefiting from it and those who are getting hurt by it. If I plug into Vendzilla's webcam sites and download the live content for free, he'll be calling in this law faster than I can say troll.

If I plug into any of the supporters sites or wares and use it for free, they are all over me.

Porn existed long before the Internet. It was available in most civilised countries and withing reason pretty well uncensored. In certain places there was a limit. Could still produce, sell and buy magazines like Mayfair, Playboy etc and make money.

The "freedom" slant is "Freedom for me to steal what you have and benefit from it."

Make plans, this law will pass and all the bleating in the world won't stop it. It will need the Supreme Court to do that.

Paul, I went on anti-Apartheid marches in the 90s, does that make me black?

I get that the problem is real, but forcing ISP's hosts and etc. to police the internet and giving the DOJ authority to shut down websites with no due process is not the solution.

And if you think pirated porn is what they are after then you are fucking deluded. The TSA is looking for nothing in the world but drugs all the while crying about "terrorism bla bla bla african guy blew up his penis on a plane, so dump that water bottle and give me your nail clippers".

This is nothing but the government wanting more control over the internet after watching governments topple all over the world with the help of social networking.

If the law was limited to your interpretation, them I'm totally onboard. Let's read the final version of the draft, and see how it is ultimately implemented.

To believe someone else has the right to profit from OUR EXCLUSIVE CONTENT, that we paid to produce, without our consent, is obviously absurd, and I'm surprised it has ever happened, and equally surprised by how long it is taking to correct.

I'm on your side 100% on this, but I worry that the new laws proposed will be overreaching, and filled with surprises, with consequences and results we are not discussing right now.

For now, I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

I still believe the devil is in the details.

Considering the special and government interests that are onboard with this, makes me to believe it will not be helpful in the end.

It sure smells a whole lot like bigger government and internet censorship, packaged and sold as an anti-piracy bill.

I hope I'm wrong...