For Newbies THE HISTORY OF IBILL short version

[F-U-Jimmy]

Years ago a processing company called Ibill swindled web-masters and affiliates out of more than 33 million $ of their hard earned money.

They knew First Data was closing their merchant account six months before it was closed, yet did nothing to get a new one. They left it too late and tried legal action to make First Date give them more time. They lost that action and webmasters lost millions, their homes their families their lives. The 33 million was never paid back to web-masters or their affiliates

Now a ex IBILL employee Jonas Brown, Director of Business Development of the old IBILL has started up IBILL again. To gain your trust he is doing exactly what the old Ibill did, "Send us a copy of your worthless promissory note and we will exchange it for stock in iBill at 1.00 per share. This is just our way of trying to make something out of nothing. We will be sending out the PPM on Sept 1, 09 as well as the certificates. Why not, it is free?"
Why exchange one useless piece of paper for another ?

In one of his post on GFY he stated he would answer any questions, to this date he has not responded to one on GFY

There are at least two good reliable companies online CCBILL and Epoch that are trusted, have been around way longer than IBILL, have better webmaster tools, more reliable software and are honest ! Don't be fooled by offers of low commission rates, short term hold backs etc they never last and are only made to get you to open an account.

Here is a link to a site that has more details on Ibill and what they did to web-masters

http://www.ibill-sucks.com This makes for some interesting reading




Whois details

Jonas Brown
10640 E Bethany Dr
Aurora, Colorado 80014

Hosting is Texas - San Antonio - Macquarie Bank.

[Dirty Dane]

They owe me 35 bucks

[F-U-Jimmy]

Originally Posted by Dirty Dane

They owe me 35 bucks

Bastards

[AsianDivaGirlsWebDude]

Dear Jonas Brown/iBill,



How about instead, you simply pay me the $30,000+ worth of sales that I made using your billing system.

If you do, I won't even hold you accountable for the lost rebills and other major costs that I incurred because of iBill's lies and incompetence.

If that is asking to much, then at least have the decency to explain who actually took the money I earned (people paid for my product and I delivered it, even though iBill screwed me over), and why they have any right not to pay me the money which they were only the processor for.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but there appears to me to have been some major breach of fiduciary responsibility and somebody should be held accountable.

In Laymen's terms, I spent money to build and promote my websites - many people paid money to join my sites, and iBill collected the money on my behalf, and was supposed to forward me the balance after subtracting their fees. Somebody kept the money my Members intended to pay to me, since I paid lots of money, and invested lots of my time, to create and promote the content which they downloaded and enjoyed.

I delivered the product which my Members (customers) paid for, but somebody kept more than just the fees - in my view, they stole my money.

Jonas Brown, before anyone should trust you or iBill, I think that you/iBill should explain where my money is, and the money of many other webmasters is, whom were ripped off the same way I was.

Your proposal as stated comes off as just another totally self-serving scam and con job, like the original promissory notes.

If you want to do some good, and get people back on your side, then either sue the bastards that ripped us off and get our money back, or tell us who to sue and how to sue the people that took our hard earned money.

Whenever I hear the names Daniel Staton, Steve Markley or Gary Spaniak Jr, all I hear is liar, scammer, thief and other less civil words.

Add Marc Bell of the Bell/Staton Group (later PMGI, Penthouse, and AFF / Adult Friend Finder to that list.



ADG

[donteattuna]

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude

...

If you want to do some good, and get people back on your side, then either sue the bastards that ripped us off and get our money back, or tell us who to sue and how to sue the people that took our hard earned money.

Whenever I hear the names Daniel Staton, Steve Markley or Gary Spaniak Jr, all I hear is liar, scammer, thief and other less civil words.

Add Marc Bell of the Bell/Staton Group (later PMGI, Penthouse, and AFF / Adult Friend Finder to that list.



ADG

thanks to all for the info !
nice content on your site! i'll have to join up later.

[Fucking myself]

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude

Dear Jonas Brown/iBill,



How about instead, you simply pay me the $30,000+ worth of sales that I made using your billing system.

If you do, I won't even hold you accountable for the lost rebills and other major costs that I incurred because of iBill's lies and incompetence.

If that is asking to much, then at least have the decency to explain who actually took the money I earned (people paid for my product and I delivered it, even though iBill screwed me over), and why they have any right not to pay me the money which they were only the processor for.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but there appears to me to have been some major breach of fiduciary responsibility and somebody should be held accountable.

In Laymen's terms, I spent money to build and promote my websites - many people paid money to join my sites, and iBill collected the money on my behalf, and was supposed to forward me the balance after subtracting their fees. Somebody kept the money my Members intended to pay to me, since I paid lots of money, and invested lots of my time, to create and promote the content which they downloaded and enjoyed.

I delivered the product which my Members (customers) paid for, but somebody kept more than just the fees - in my view, they stole my money.

Jonas Brown, before anyone should trust you or iBill, I think that you/iBill should explain where my money is, and the money of many other webmasters is, whom were ripped off the same way I was.

Your proposal as stated comes off as just another totally self-serving scam and con job, like the original promissory notes.

If you want to do some good, and get people back on your side, then either sue the bastards that ripped us off and get our money back, or tell us who to sue and how to sue the people that took our hard earned money.

Whenever I hear the names Daniel Staton, Steve Markley or Gary Spaniak Jr, all I hear is liar, scammer, thief and other less civil words.

Add Marc Bell of the Bell/Staton Group (later PMGI, Penthouse, and AFF / Adult Friend Finder to that list.



ADG

BEAUTIFUL !! Well said

[F-U-Jimmy]

Bump

[sexuallyhealed]

Originally Posted by Dirty Dane

They owe me 35 bucks

godamn,,,,

[mikesinner]

They owe a sponsor I pushed a lot of money and I still haven't been paid that $550

[baddog]

Originally Posted by mikesinner

They owe a sponsor I pushed a lot of money and I still haven't been paid that $550

Make that $33,000,550

[MsCheyenne]

Originally Posted by baddog

Make that $33,000,550

They owe me 20k. Does anyone have copies of their sincerely worded emails about catching up payments? They came across like boyscouts. A lot of webmasters had been with them for so long that we bought it, hook - line and sinker.

Cheyenne

[bobby666]

i am lucky, they owe me nothing

[seeandsee]

jesus 30 mil ?!

[Paul Markham]

Think about it long and hard before you let YOUR money flow through SOMEONE ELSE'S bank account. Do yo trust them so much you would give them control of thousands of dollars of your money?

I think not.

[Iron Fist]

To da top folks, this is an important one.

[Manowar]

just seeing the name makes me wince

[DWB]

To the top.

[dav3]

shady bastards

[WDG]

Bump forever.

[JayDeeZee]

Originally Posted by F-U-Jimmy

Years ago

I am curious, when did this happen?

[Nikki_Licks]

Bump for you. It's good to see this type of information staying at the top so others don't fall for iBill's bullshit lies.

[epitome]

Originally Posted by JayDeeZee

I am curious, when did this happen?

They were notified in early '04 about losing their merchant account.

Shit started hitting the fan late '04, early '05.

Not long ago in real life; forever again on the Internet.

[F-U-Jimmy]

Remember this incident with IBILL ? in 1998


"Earlier this month, WiReD magazine reported that iBill had leaked seventeen million customer records. Leaked information included names, phone numbers, addresses, email addresses, logins, passwords, and even IP addresses. Indications are that this was an inside job rather than the work of an external cracker. The information is now available on the internet, being bought and sold in a spammers' and fraudsters' black market.

A later story in WiReD indicated that iBill was innocent after all: iBill president Gary Spaniak Jr. claims that iBill cross-referenced the stolen information against their own database and only found three matches out of seventeen million.

However, new information indicates this may not be the case after all.

Neil reports that on Monday he received a phishing attempt that contained personal information intended to convince him that the phish was legitimate. In this particular case however, the information had been tagged when it was submitted, and thus we know it could have only have come from iBill."

[F-U-Jimmy]

Originally Posted by JayDeeZee

I am curious, when did this happen?

This is a link to a long article in the New York Times that gives specific dates and some of the names of people who new about the deception. They give a list of 14 people and state that the list could be as much as 8 times as big, thats 112 people who could have had a hand in one of the internets biggest frauds ?

http://www.newyorkdailytimes.com/home.htm?m=ibill

[F-U-Jimmy]

Note: As of September 2005, iBill has not cleaned up their act. They are still committing fraud, lying, cheating, and stealing from their customers. The shear fact that we can state this, openly, publicly, is decent evidence that iBill knows they cannot win any kind of law suit. It is time someone or something put these criminals out of their misery. Or is this just the American Way? I think not.

[Sosa]

They took a lot of my money that I would have had with rebills etc. Bastards

[SilentKnight]

This should be made a sticky.

[Nikki_Licks]

Originally Posted by SilentKnight

This should be made a sticky.

The big question is...why hasn't this been made a sticky?

You would think this should be at the top so others get to see the history of this name.
Until they pay back every dime, they are not worth trusting....no matter what and then I would have big apprehensions.

[camperjohn64]

Originally Posted by SilentKnight

This should be made a sticky.

I second that!!

They owe me $584. Ok it's not $30,000 but it's still $584

[imageman]

I turd i mean third that

[TheDoc]

Missing about 100k from iBill on this end... is the payment still pending, already gone out 3 times...

or do I have to pay another account rep a % of the money to get paid?

[TylerBang]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Missing about 100k from iBill on this end... is the payment still pending, already gone out 3 times...

or do I have to pay another account rep a % of the money to get paid?

And Nobody is in Prison or found "suicided" hanging from a belt?

[F-U-Jimmy]

New years bump

[F-U-Jimmy]

Bump

[CaptainHowdy]

Bumpin'...

[u-Bob]

bump bump bump.

[jakethedog]

to the top .. this was a life changing fuck up by them .. Sweet was owed hundreds of 1000's ..
we laid off people left right and center ... All kinds of people lost everything ..

[selena]

They were the first company/person to burn me online. Fortunately, I was just getting started, and the amount they got me for was small.

But huge to me at the time, and it's still the principle of the matter.

Fuck iBill.

[hypedough]

What are they thinking taking a name with such a horrible reputation and past? It wasn't that long ago that people were getting fucked by them.

[DaddyHalbucks]

A few questions:

1. Where did all the money go?

2. Did anyone go to jail?

[captainjapan.]

Originally Posted by DaddyHalbucks

A few questions:

1. Where did all the money go?

2. Did anyone go to jail?

1 - in the pockets of upper management and sales associates . All of it.

2 - Not even one person

[Tube Ace]

So they didn't steal anything? They just stopped billing the CC's since their merchant account was shut down?

[jmcb420]

Originally Posted by Tube Ace

So they didn't steal anything? They just stopped billing the CC's since their merchant account was shut down?

They knew First Data was closing their merchant account six months before it was closed, yet did nothing to get a new one. They left it too late and tried legal action to make First Date give them more time. They lost that action and webmasters lost millions, their homes their families their lives. The 33 million was never paid back to web-masters or their affiliates

Call it what you like, someone ended up with all that money and it wasn't the people who it belonged to.

Fuck IBill.

[F-U-Jimmy]

Originally Posted by Tube Ace

So they didn't steal anything? They just stopped billing the CC's since their merchant account was shut down?

33 million $ billed to surfers before IBILL lost its account web masters and affiliates got zero / zilch nothing, what would you call that, giving to charity ?

[Matyko]

Bump Bump! Nice read btw...

[CC]

iBill owes me about $20,000. To anyone associated with them, past or present--PAY UP.

[F-U-Jimmy]

The Current owners of IBILL obviously purchased the name to make money, from the traffic that still flows from old links, and its old reputation of being the biggest and oldest on line processor. They didn't think the backlash from web-masters would be as strong as it is ? Therefore one can deduce that they purchased the name for its reputation and money making opportunities and for profit. If thats the case then there may be a cause of action for a class action law suite. Im not an attorney but it's a possibility ?

Secondly if you read the paragraph below you will see the statements that the current bank only rejects the word TEEN in a website which opens up a whole new avenue and opportunity for illegal scat sites, etc, etc. Putting you money at even more risk.

Also their bank is in the UK, im a Brit so I have access to people in the UK I dont think it will be hard to locate who they use. If they are new and so honest why on earth use a UK bank why not a bank in the USA?

"Brown said that investors scooped up iBill’s trademark after the defunct company let the name expire and then completed an acquisition for the iBill.net domain for $14,500 from an employee of the original processor (the old iBill used iBill.com as its URL).

The company currently services about 20 adult websites ( fools ) and more than 40 mainstream customers, using two accounts with a European payment processing company Brown wouldn’t disclose with the exception that it is near London. Oddly, that European processor has only one exclusion: any reference to “teens” in websites"

[F-U-Jimmy]

Anyone know of some good mainstream forums that i can post these warnings on. I know you cannot post the links to other forums here and i respect that so if anyone know of a suitable forum or forums to post on please send the link to projects(at)fantasyforge.com
Cheers

[GetSCORECash]

Originally Posted by F-U-Jimmy

The company currently services about 20 adult websites ( fools ) and more than 40 mainstream customers, using two accounts with a European payment processing company Brown wouldn’t disclose with the exception that it is near London. Oddly, that European processor has only one exclusion: any reference to “teens” in websites"[/COLOR]

That is truly amazing that they have 20 adult websites processing with them.

I still have a windows '98 box with ibill bookmarked...

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by SCORE-Cash

That is truly amazing that they have 20 adult websites processing with them.

I still have a windows '98 box with ibill bookmarked...

What's the betting they will not name them?

100 to 1 would be a good bet.