The Zimmerman case may go to the jury - GoFuckYourself.com

theking · 07-10-2013, 03:44 PM

...tomorrow.

Remembering that by law the burden of proof is on the prosecution...and remembering that Zimmerman by law is not required to prove anything.

How many of you that actually watched the trial think that the prosecution proved its case against Zimmerman "beyond a reasonable doubt"...which is what the law requires?

Helix · 07-10-2013, 03:47 PM

Zimmerman will walk. The prosecution failed to prove its case against Zimmerman "beyond a reasonable doubt" imo.

L-Pink · 07-10-2013, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helix

The prosecution failed to prove its case against Zimmerman "beyond a reasonable doubt" imo.

same.

vdbucks · 07-10-2013, 03:53 PM

I think either a mistrial or recommendation for a lesser charge, possibly walk... it really all depends on how bias the jury is.

If he walks, I think he won't make it past the courthouse steps before someone ends his life.

kane · 07-10-2013, 03:59 PM

I haven't watched/listened to the trial, but have been following it in the news. I think the jury will not find him guilty of 2nd degree murder. The evidence doesn't appear to be there for that. However, it is much easier to convict someone of manslaughter which I think will ultimately be what will happen. I 'm not sure how that procedure takes place, but I think that is what the jury will come back with.

If he is found not guilty of all charges I don't think he will be immediately killed in the streets, but he will go into hiding and then he will end up back in court for the civil trial.

Juicy D. Links · 07-10-2013, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

...tomorrow.

Remembering that by law the burden of proof is on the prosecution...and remembering that Zimmerman by law is not required to prove anything.

How many of you that actually watched the trial think that the prosecution proved its case against Zimmerman "beyond a reasonable doubt"...which is what the law requires?

Prosecution did not at all....

I am afraid though that they will hit him with the "manslaughter" charge though... thats 30 years in the can...

brassmonkey · 07-10-2013, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdbucks

I think either a mistrial or recommendation for a lesser charge, possibly walk... it really all depends on how bias the jury is.

If he walks, I think he won't make it past the courthouse steps before someone ends his life.

damn it would hit youtube fast!

L-Pink · 07-10-2013, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vdbucks

I think either a mistrial or recommendation for a lesser charge,

I don't like that someone can be found guilty of a lesser charge. That gives the jury an out which defeats the guilty/non-guilty purpose of a trial. The district attorney should pick a charge then ask the jury to decide guilty or not.

.

Just Alex · 07-10-2013, 04:16 PM

Countdown is on

kane · 07-10-2013, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-Pink

I don't like that someone can be found guilty of a lesser charge. That gives the jury an out which defeats the guilty/non-guilty purpose of a trial. The district attorney should pick a charge then ask the jury to decide guilty or not.

.

I think this is why often the DA will pick the biggest charges they can and throw as many charges as possible at someone so they can always fall back to lesser charges.

I don't know if the jury can just come back and say, "guilty of manslaughter," but they do have an option for lower charges if they want.

BFT3K · 07-10-2013, 04:30 PM

For what it's worth...

http://www.mediaite.com/online/even-...erve-25-years/

kane · 07-10-2013, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BFT3K

For what it's worth...

http://www.mediaite.com/online/even-...erve-25-years/

Very interesting.

theking · 07-10-2013, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-Pink

I don't like that someone can be found guilty of a lesser charge. That gives the jury an out which defeats the guilty/non-guilty purpose of a trial. The district attorney should pick a charge then ask the jury to decide guilty or not.

.

Yeah the deck is stacked against you. Police lay on as many charges as they can when you are arrested. The prosecutor will lay on as severe a charge that he can and multiple lesser charges in an attempt to get you to plea to a lesser charge...in order to save the money that a trial costs. And if you do go to trial with the multiple lesser charges the jury will almost always convict you of something.

A very famous criminal trial defense attorney once stated that he never asks a client if he is innocent or guilty because he always considers them to be guilty as the police are to stupid to arrest anyone other than those that are obviously guilty.

Fortunately one of the only saving graces about our justice system is that the overwhelming majority of defendants are guilty.

L-Pink · 07-10-2013, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kane

I think this is why often the DA will pick the biggest charges they can and throw as many charges as possible at someone so they can always fall back to lesser charges.

I don't know if the jury can just come back and say, "guilty of manslaughter," but they do have an option for lower charges if they want.

A compromise verdict is a crutch for an indecisive jury to say he was sorta guilty. It allows them to walk away without really making a decision.

It allows a prosecutor to shoot for a big charge while hoping for a lesser conviction he might not have gotten if the lesser charge was what the defendant was actually being charged with.

The jury decision should be black/white not in the big gray area.

.

kane · 07-10-2013, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-Pink

A compromise verdict is a crutch for an indecisive jury to say he was sorta guilty. It allows them to walk away without really making a decision.

It allows a prosecutor to shoot for a big charge while hoping for a lesser conviction he might not have gotten if the lesser charge was what the defendant was actually being charged with.

The jury decision should be black/white not in the big gray area.

.

I agree. Sadly, this is the modern system. If you get arrested for something they often will throw every charge they can possibly think of at you in order to get you to plea down to one of the lesser charges. Crime is now big business in this this country. Prosecutors want to pad their numbers so they can get elected or get better paying jobs, jails wants convictions so they can bill the state/city/federal government and police want convictions so they can show that they are doing their job.

PornoMonster · 07-10-2013, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

Yeah the deck is stacked against you. Police lay on as many charges as they can when you are arrested. The prosecutor will lay on as severe a charge that he can and multiple lesser charges in an attempt to get you to plea to a lesser charge...in order to save the money that a trial costs. And if you do go to trial with the multiple lesser charges the jury will almost always convict you of something.

A very famous criminal trial defense attorney once stated that he never asks a client if he is innocent or guilty because he always considers them to be guilty as the police are to stupid to arrest anyone other than those that are obviously guilty.

Fortunately one of the only saving graces about our justice system is that the overwhelming majority of defendants are guilty.

In this case the Public Pushed for his Arrest....

PornoMonster · 07-10-2013, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-Pink

A compromise verdict is a crutch for an indecisive jury to say he was sorta guilty. It allows them to walk away without really making a decision.

It allows a prosecutor to shoot for a big charge while hoping for a lesser conviction he might not have gotten if the lesser charge was what the defendant was actually being charged with.

The jury decision should be black/white not in the big gray area.

.

Question,

Doesn't manslaughter still have to be proven, just as if the prosecution started with only that charge and not second degree????

bronco67 · 07-10-2013, 05:21 PM

He will walk...but common sense says you can't claim self defense when the authorities told you not to pursue, and you did.

L-Pink · 07-10-2013, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PornoMonster

In this case the Public Pushed for his Arrest....

"some of" Please insert.

theking · 07-10-2013, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PornoMonster

Question,

Doesn't manslaughter still have to be proven, just as if the prosecution started with only that charge and not second degree????

Yes it has to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt...but lesser charges often...wrongfully in my opinion...allow a jury to compromise.

L-Pink · 07-10-2013, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PornoMonster

Question,

Doesn't manslaughter still have to be proven, just as if the prosecution started with only that charge and not second degree????

No, the jury can find him innocent but then find him guilty of a lesser charge feeling a compromise best serves everyone. Guilty or not guilty of the charge against him should be all the jury decides.

theking · 07-10-2013, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bronco67

He will walk...but common sense says you can't claim self defense when the authorities told you not to pursue, and you did.

At no time was he told not to pursue...and that is a fact in this case.

theking · 07-10-2013, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-Pink

No, the jury can find him innocent but then find him guilty of a lesser charge feeling a compromise best serves everyone. Guilty or not guilty of the charge against him should be all the jury decides.

The charges against him at this point in time is 2nd degree murder and the lesser charge of manslaughter. I heard yesterday via attorneys saying that the prosecution can...if they choose to do so...add...even at this late date...multiple lesser charges in addition to the two charges he is currently charged with.

blackmonsters · 07-10-2013, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

...tomorrow.

Remembering that by law the burden of proof is on the prosecution...and remembering that Zimmerman by law is not required to prove anything.

How many of you that actually watched the trial think that the prosecution proved its case against Zimmerman "beyond a reasonable doubt"...which is what the law requires?

It's interesting that you are so excited.

Ok, I'm kidding about it being interesting.

theking · 07-10-2013, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackmonsters

It's interesting that you are so excited.

Ok, I'm kidding about it being interesting.

It is more interesting to me why you think I am in the least bit excited. I really don't give a fuck about the outcome of the case one way or another. I am just killing time...sport.

Webmaster Advertising · 07-10-2013, 08:13 PM

This is exactly what is wrong with Murica, why is a court case entertainment?

theking · 07-10-2013, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Webmaster Advertising

This is exactly what is wrong with Murica, why is a court case entertainment?

They should not be televised or discussed in the news and should be like the British system...but they become like a circus here which is somewhat entertaining...at least to me...it is a way to kill the time.

blackmonsters · 07-10-2013, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

It is more interesting to me why you think I am in the least bit excited. I really don't give a fuck about the outcome of the case one way or another. I am just killing time...sport.

Good point.
You are not excited :

This one : https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1115037
https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1115047
https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1113909
https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1114164

.

theking · 07-10-2013, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackmonsters

Good point.
You are not excited :

This one : https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1115037
https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1115047
https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1113909
https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1114164

.

Not in the least...sport.

bronco67 · 07-10-2013, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

At no time was he told not to pursue...and that is a fact in this case.

Zimmerman said he was following Trayvon, and the dispatcher said "we don't need you to do that." You can twist it around all you want, but that means "don't pursue".

Wouldn't he be saying "help, someone is trying to kill me" to the dispatcher if he was in need of lethal self defense? He's guilty as hell. The call lays out everything. He was an overzealous punk with a gun, on the losing end of a brawl that he instigated by pursuing a thuggy black kid who probably would be a little jumpy if a white guy was following him.

Sure, he could get off because of technicalities, but that kid should still be alive. He just went to the fucking store for a snack and was going to a house he was visiting in that neighborhood. A man shot him for that. That man is guilty whether or not he ends up in jail.

theking · 07-10-2013, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bronco67

Zimmerman said he was following Trayvon, and the dispatcher said "we don't need you to do that." You can twist it around all you want, but that means "don't pursue".

Wouldn't he be saying "help, someone is trying to kill me?" to the dispatcher if he was in need of lethal self defense?

It is you twisting it around to mean what you want it to mean. Words have meaning and in no way does "we don't need you to do that" equal "don't persue".

In addition he said "O.K." and he said he did not persue because he had lost sight of him... in the darkness and rain anyhow...and was walking back to his truck when Martin came out of the darkness and confronted him.

We know that it was Martin that confronted him and not Zimmerman confronting Martin...if you believe the girls testimony that Martin was talking to on the phone.

DirtyDanza · 07-10-2013, 10:28 PM

watched from start to finish... innocent on all charges by all means... this punk teen tried to be a baddass and got got... it's simple

blackmonsters · 07-10-2013, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DirtyDanza

watched from start to finish... innocent on all charges by all means... this punk teen tried to be a baddass and got got... it's simple

I find it hilarious that you called someone a punk trying to be a bad ass.

baddog · 07-10-2013, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bronco67

He will walk...but common sense says you can't claim self defense when the authorities told you not to pursue, and you did.

The thing is, your scenario is not what happened.

bronco67 · 07-11-2013, 07:46 AM

I'm going by what I heard on the phone call.

It sounds like some of you are going by what you want to be true. That guy carrying a gun carried out some kind of justice.

brassmonkey · 07-11-2013, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baddog

The thing is, your scenario is not what happened.

listen to the 911 call he confirms following him. anyway any prison time is good

_Richard_ · 07-11-2013, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bronco67

Zimmerman said he was following Trayvon, and the dispatcher said "we don't need you to do that." You can twist it around all you want, but that means "don't pursue".

Wouldn't he be saying "help, someone is trying to kill me" to the dispatcher if he was in need of lethal self defense? He's guilty as hell. The call lays out everything. He was an overzealous punk with a gun, on the losing end of a brawl that he instigated by pursuing a thuggy black kid who probably would be a little jumpy if a white guy was following him.

Sure, he could get off because of technicalities, but that kid should still be alive. He just went to the fucking store for a snack and was going to a house he was visiting in that neighborhood. A man shot him for that. That man is guilty whether or not he ends up in jail.

baddog · 07-11-2013, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brassmonkey

listen to the 911 call he confirms following him. anyway any prison time is good

That is not what bronco said that I disagreed with.

seeandsee · 07-11-2013, 08:27 AM

So final results are?

Captain Kawaii · 07-11-2013, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kane

I agree. Sadly, this is the modern system. If you get arrested for something they often will throw every charge they can possibly think of at you in order to get you to plea down to one of the lesser charges. Crime is now big business in this this country. Prosecutors want to pad their numbers so they can get elected or get better paying jobs, jails wants convictions so they can bill the state/city/federal government and police want convictions so they can show that they are doing their job.

Quite the fascist totalitarian system we have allowed to unfold. It's sad that Egyptians gathered 22 million signatures to remove a dictator and cheered when their military agreed to step in and keep order, keep peace...and some filth in our government balks at a "coup."

To me, the Egyptians are practicing democracy by getting rid of a tyrant who lied to them. We can now see what would happen if the American people tried to remove a tyrannic or criminal regime, say, accused of massive spying and other illegal activities.

American judicial system is an evil institution and the prosecutors in Florida are proving it.

I can almost bet if Zimmerman is found not guilty, government will see to his death. If nothing else, to make a point, "Don't fuck with our system."

Captain Kawaii · 07-11-2013, 08:47 AM

Bomb threat called into civil courthouse. Police telling reporters they believed it was meant for the criminal courthouse where Zimmerman is being tried. LOL. Guess whose supporters fucted up?

bigluv · 07-11-2013, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-Pink

A compromise verdict is a crutch for an indecisive jury to say he was sorta guilty. It allows them to walk away without really making a decision.

It allows a prosecutor to shoot for a big charge while hoping for a lesser conviction he might not have gotten if the lesser charge was what the defendant was actually being charged with.

The jury decision should be black/white not in the big gray area.

.

Well said.

bigluv · 07-11-2013, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Kawaii

I can almost bet if Zimmerman is found not guilty, government will see to his death. If nothing else, to make a point, "Don't fuck with our system."

This the stupidest thing I've heard anyone say in a while.

pornguy · 07-11-2013, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-Pink

I don't like that someone can be found guilty of a lesser charge. That gives the jury an out which defeats the guilty/non-guilty purpose of a trial. The district attorney should pick a charge then ask the jury to decide guilty or not.

.

They made it that way for exactly this reason.

brassmonkey · 07-11-2013, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Kawaii

Bomb threat called into civil courthouse. Police telling reporters they believed it was meant for the criminal courthouse where Zimmerman is being tried. LOL. Guess whose supporters fucted up?

fuck bombs just wait

pornguy · 07-11-2013, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

...tomorrow.

Remembering that by law the burden of proof is on the prosecution...and remembering that Zimmerman by law is not required to prove anything.

How many of you that actually watched the trial think that the prosecution proved its case against Zimmerman "beyond a reasonable doubt"...which is what the law requires?

Actually if people want to admit it or not, the " Burden of Proof " is upon both parties in a trial like this.

The state has to prove its charges, and the Defense has to prove the innocence.

07-10-2013, 03:44 PM	#1
theking Nice Kitty Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: The good old USA!!! Posts: 21,053	The Zimmerman case may go to the jury ...tomorrow. Remembering that by law the burden of proof is on the prosecution...and remembering that Zimmerman by law is not required to prove anything. How many of you that actually watched the trial think that the prosecution proved its case against Zimmerman "beyond a reasonable doubt"...which is what the law requires? __________________ When you're running down my country hoss...you're walking on the fighting side of me! FOR THE LYING LOWLIFE POSTING AS PATHFINDER...https://gfy.com/fucking-around-and-pr...athfinder.html

07-10-2013, 03:47 PM	#2
Helix Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Michigan Posts: 5,958	Zimmerman will walk. The prosecution failed to prove its case against Zimmerman "beyond a reasonable doubt" imo. __________________ Free jscott !!! Free OneHungLo !!! Free Baddog !!!

07-10-2013, 04:16 PM	#9
Just Alex Liv Benson to You, Bitch Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Maryland and WV Posts: 6,060	Countdown is on __________________

07-10-2013, 05:21 PM	#18
bronco67 Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 29,032	He will walk...but common sense says you can't claim self defense when the authorities told you not to pursue, and you did. __________________

07-10-2013, 10:28 PM	#32
DirtyDanza Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: BP4L.... Las Vegas, Posts: 8,369	watched from start to finish... innocent on all charges by all means... this punk teen tried to be a baddass and got got... it's simple __________________ AVN Nominated Camming Couple

07-10-2013, 03:53 PM	#4
vdbucks Monger Cash Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 2,773	I think either a mistrial or recommendation for a lesser charge, possibly walk... it really all depends on how bias the jury is. If he walks, I think he won't make it past the courthouse steps before someone ends his life.

07-10-2013, 03:59 PM	#5
kane Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: portland, OR Posts: 20,684	I haven't watched/listened to the trial, but have been following it in the news. I think the jury will not find him guilty of 2nd degree murder. The evidence doesn't appear to be there for that. However, it is much easier to convict someone of manslaughter which I think will ultimately be what will happen. I 'm not sure how that procedure takes place, but I think that is what the jury will come back with. If he is found not guilty of all charges I don't think he will be immediately killed in the streets, but he will go into hiding and then he will end up back in court for the civil trial.

07-10-2013, 04:30 PM	#11
BFT3K Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Narnia Posts: 10,764	For what it's worth... http://www.mediaite.com/online/even-...erve-25-years/

07-10-2013, 08:13 PM	#26
Webmaster Advertising So Fucking Banned Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,360	This is exactly what is wrong with Murica, why is a court case entertainment?

07-11-2013, 07:46 AM	#35
bronco67 Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 29,032	I'm going by what I heard on the phone call. It sounds like some of you are going by what you want to be true. That guy carrying a gun carried out some kind of justice. __________________

07-11-2013, 08:27 AM	#39
seeandsee Check SIG! Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Europe (Skype: gojkoas) Posts: 50,945	So final results are? __________________ BUY MY SIG - 50$/Year Contact here

07-11-2013, 08:47 AM	#41
Captain Kawaii So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 6,748	Breaking news Bomb threat called into civil courthouse. Police telling reporters they believed it was meant for the criminal courthouse where Zimmerman is being tried. LOL. Guess whose supporters fucted up?