Do you think AlienQ is really a designer?
 

And if he is, does he really get any clients?

I LOL'd Twice. :1orglaugh:1orglaugh

id have to agree with him.. its kind of a bitch making everything look right in all browsers, but i dig the small file size

That doesn't make them obsolete, just means theres less tard wanna be designers like AlienQ who think they can charge $150/hr to make a shitty site.

Its awesome that they can't do it. I'm no designer but I made my site work 100% in all major browsers with little work, so why can't anyone else? www.fukbag.com

I haven't seen any sites that he actually designed.

Except for his own. Which is crap.

Nah dude, i had him design for me once, check this out...

fucking-around-and-business-discussion/837552-alienq-designer-design-check.html

I can't believe he actually said that. It's the most retarded thing I EVER heard a designer say.

Yes, more likely if you have no idea what you're doing. There's a fix for EVERY display bug in every browser. If you take one day of your time, you can learn it all online.

:1orglaugh

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh ...

Did he really designed that yvette site? That's fugly! :Oh crap

If he is a designer, I am Jesus.

Im cooking up some Johnsonville Bratwursts...

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

It's frightening to think he makes ANY money when he makes comments like that.

It's basically the same as a corporate accountant claiming "No man, I use an abacus. Calculators LOLLLLLL what for? You can press the wrong button sometimes and not know it. Not worth it man. "

mmmm brats...

so Quinten what has AlienQ designed for you?

So true :1orglaugh:1orglaugh

When did all this table hate come in?
Don't blame tables cause you never figured out what rowspan and colspan are for and cause you let imageready slice up your site with 9,000 spacers and you couldn't figure out what the fuck was going on...

guess what fucknuts... tables work... without having to spend a bunch of wasted time working out all the various cross browser differences..

that being said...
i only use tables when i need something quick and dirty..

and yes, alienq is a designer...

Yeah, but once you do, it's easy to change the whole layout and design of your site. Then, it's just a matter of changing the CSS; you're not trapped in tables for life.

I still use tables, but that's because I don't claim to be a designer, and most of my shit is admin only, not user-facing. Anything I create that is user-facing is templated via Smarty.

HAHA!

Oh yeah thats looks so awesome...

Wait wait wait Jaysin fact is. If you actually used a table based design on that POS shit you would have less code!

OMG...
Case closed, game over. BYE Morons.

But, Thanks ya made my day.

OMG it gets even better...
The site is not even in PHP. I think you managed to defeat any purpose whats so ever for utilizing tableless design. I am not even going to try that in other browsers.

OH and it has IE errors to.

You go right on ahead and learn all the exceptions for browser compatibility. I will keep cashing my checks for clients that need professional design work done and apply what a project's requires to display properly:1orglaugh

While there is no love lost between Alien and I, one would have to be a total n00b or clueless idiot to not acknowledge that he is indeed a designer that has done some pretty good work.

Sure, I will.

In my opinion there's always room for improvement. I like to improve myself on both design and development, that way I can offer the complete package to both myself and my clients.

On a side note, I know for a fact that your designs would sell, tables or not. That's because a big part of the industry doesn't have a clue about SEO.

You're an amateur...
Bug off...
Jesus, just shut up and look smarter than you are OK?

LOL Are you serious?

Honestly, seriously, absolutely completely serious on what you just said? Do i really need to pwn your n00b face?

Anybody can hit me up and i'll prove its php...

Uhhh how exactly did you arrive at that conclusion? :error

alien invented design:)

Guess you can change the server controls to intepret HTML as PHP.

Still...
Its a retarded website and poor excuse for Tableless design, and it does have errors in IE.
For a script kiddie Nazi he is not doing the advantage of Tableless design any favors LOL!

Actually that site does not qualify as a design. Its a fucking mess.

Actually i wrote a cms for it to run but instead of ?pg=blah&something=else i use mod_rewrite to make it an actual page, ya know better for everything, but then again you're a "designer" and wouldn't know programming if it bit you in the ass

hey AlienQ, how much for a big image design for my site?

This is coming from a guy whos portfolio is 1 big image spliced into 3 sections...

How about you suck my fucking cock and die?

ITS NOT EVEN PHP!! LOOOOOOLLLLLL

3 sections yet uses DIV to style the layout to the center, while using targeted IfrAmEs and USING png'S FOR transparency. I can change the background to what ever I want with my design and never worry about something not blending right.

Actually when you really look at the design it is a small marvel. Sure no text it does not require it, thats what I felt was the right thing to do. It's my fucking picture and design not yours and the fuck to anyone that wants to tell me different. Its my site dick head.

I can add text to it anytime I want and it wouldnt be a problem, shit I could use text in the Iframe area's. The layout does more than the basic run off the mouth amateur can appreciate or realise.

So I am comfortable with it.
Soon I will release my blog. Maybe I will do that today then we can talk more about tableless design and layout approaches and oh my gawdz SEO!:1orglaugh
But I goto warn you I use Wordpress!

Can you just fuck off now you maggot? Thanks.

What's wrong, feeling retarded for that comment you made n00b?

Check out my site. I did a little something special for you.

designer = yes
web designer = yeah, if you still live in 1998 ( chopping up a jpg and calling it a website :Oh crap <-- 2008? ) ack ack ack

I think you should use what gets the job done. If the W3C isn't paying your bills I wouldn't go out of my way to make everything compliant. You should strive to make things as efficient as possible ... easy to update...

the trick is doing that and making it look good at the same time across browsers.

a good web "designer" ...
1. Creates something that is easy to update. ( not loads of shit code --->one reason css was developed to reduce that<---)
2. Easy to navigate.( not letting your ("I have this really different and great design idea" <--- that hinders usability)
3. Makes the client happy. ( if a blocky css design turns him/her/it on and gets the job done so be it ... )

Anyone can hate if they want but here it is.

FACT: Table based designs suck, period. Tables are for tabular data, the w3c will tell you this, as well as any professional that knows dick about web development. Not only does this make your markup semantically correct, but you get numerous other benefits (seo related, ease of maintaining, ease of change, smaller files, less bandwidth)

FACT: If you are a designer in 2008 stuck making table based layouts you should take the time to learn how to do css right, it's really not hard. Just because your a fossil and stuck in your ways doesn't mean the new ways are wrong, their not, they are better then the old ways, suck it up, learn something new and you'll be alot happier with your life, career, and cash flow.

As consumers, webmasters should always expect and demand web standards compliant designs, etc... from designers and programmers, for every shitty one out there that won't deliver that, there are 10 way better ones that will. It's just bad business to be losing money because some designer can't take the 20 minutes it takes to wrap your head around properly floating or positioning things.

Thus why my blog is all tableless:1orglaugh
YOu fucking retarded monkey's just stop...
I got work to do and you are making me laugh to hard.

I can agree there is advantages to tableless design as I have been saying all along if you can read.
It is all in the purpose and application of what is required.

I can honestly say that a vast majority of my clients do not require tableless design and I can honestly say I apply CSS as needed for layout control and tables for layout control depending on the situations that come up in design:)

In a perfect world...
You have a Graphics Designer that works well and can communicate well with the Web Designer.(does that happen?)
As a team they work together Optimizing the Design and the Code, give and take until they have something that looks good, usable and easy to update.

Usually that doesn't happen. The Graphic Designer and the "Code Geek" can't get along...and great ideas are lost in translation. When you have a guy doing both you're usually missing out on key things in both areas.

Your a fucking chode. There is absolutely no reason what so ever to use tables for layout, do you understand that? Tables are for tabular data and should NOT be used for presentation. HTML, and XHTML is not for your presentation, it is for markup. Idiots like you have to fuck it up for the rest of us.

Your clients may not require table-less design's but they deserve them. You should want to deliver top quality work instead of some cluttered bullshit your probably overcharging for. If your not going to embrace web-standards and don't want to fuck your clients why don't you have someone that understands xhtml / css well enough to properly slice your designs instead of pumping out garbage that some poor bastard like me is going to have the displeasure of working with down the road.

Lollerskates!!

Ya done any tours lately that are 100&#37; tableless?
Lets see em dorko. Impress us.

OK now shut up, cuz you aint got none...

I'm sorry, what? I'm not the one using one big sliced up image for my sites.

It looks like you just ran out of arguments, went buck wild and now you're throwing out random insults to everyone in this thread.

No, i write more complex code then tours. I'm usually hired for billing systems, affiliate tracking, custom stuff, stuff that you couldn't begin to comprehend all the details and layers of complexity.

I do plenty of table-less pages, i'll be damned if i go posting my mainstream clients sites on gfy of all places. I'm telling you honestly that if you took the time to learn css properly instead of fiddle fucking with your bloated table based crap, you would understand why i'm saying what i'm saying.

Tours of all places should be table-less, There is absolutely no limit to positioning with css, so you even suggesting they should be table based is absurd. If any page should be optimized for search engines and fast loading, containing as little markup as possible while still being as attractive as you want it to be, it should be a tour page.

You make tours based with tables because you can't properly do it with css. That's your fault, not css's, don't go spouting off how tables are better when their not.

Program Owners: Any tour page composed of a bunch of tables should be rejected. Make table-less a base requirement, you will thank me later. It is absolutely no harder to lay one out using tables than it is css, and anyone that tells you otherwise probably shouldn't be hired. You want fast loading, se optimized, pretty tours, demand css and no tables for any data that isn't tabular.

I disagree that tables are better than tableless ... I think the benefits of tableless design outweighs the argument ... that said ... everyone is different and in all honesty, if you design your sites efficiently, I guess tables is ok ...

I'm no expert on judging other designs tho... so I stay out of that part :)

Tableless layouts are more compatible with braile readers.

more replies? LOL

finally some good drama!