Up to half in U.S. have pre-existing conditions
 

And the GOP wants to repeal Obama's health care bill?!

Yeah, good luck with that!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41132734...h-health_care/

I know lots of people that are getting creamed right now with premium increases. This isn't a simple case of "close to 50% of the population have pre-existing conditions so we must keep going." When people see their rates getting jacked, which they are, they are going to be questioning all of the new policies even more than they already have been.

found some article yesterday about a 10 day old baby being denied coverage cause of 'pre-existing'.. ins company had no problem insuring the rest of the kids however

That's true. They will question why the changes did not go FURTHER.

People don't realize that insurance is a business, not a charity. Most of the conditions and rules are in place to ensure the continuity of the business, if you want true universal healthcare you'll have to take huge tax increases as the government controls and pays for healthcare, and nobody really wants that.

This pre-existing shit has gone too far. One thing is making money off selling you porn that peopel can live by without, another thing is throlling with medicine. Even if i accept its capitalism that should some how align medical pricing for majority to be able to pay for it. If the medical services are so expensive how come this market is still alive and prices are sky high?

Insurers have 2 jobs:

- signing up new clients
- denying claims from existing ones

:2 cents:

What have you done to help these people?

Since joining Kaiser I have paid about:

$6768
$7680
$8880
$10404
$11028
$13800
---------
$58560

In that amount of time I have used approximately $12,000 of the money.

That leaves $46,000 to be spent on my pre-existing conditions should any come up right? Wrong...

They bank the $46,000 for future problems right? Wrong...

That $46,000 is called profit and they give it to the investors like any other company does.

The current system is complete bullshit. That money should be used like life insurance. It sits there collecting interest to pay for my heart attack or stroke in the future.

There should be a sliding scale. I can elect to allow $2500 a year to go to the company so it can keep more doctors/nurses on call. Expedited service. If it all goes I get to the front of the line and don't have to sit in a fucking waiting room picking up germs from mongrels.

I bet you also pay for home insurance? They day you figure out the whole program was built for profit you will soon have more money then the company you pay for the repairs you need...simple math, 101. For the record I have no insurance except for state minimal auto, only because the law makes me. The whole scam has built empires on others interest :2 cents:
Wait until they make it law to have health insurance, and I leave this greed fucked country!

The new healthcare law is a joke. CNN was posting polls throughout the day and it seems the majority want it repealed. All I want is the restrictions on pre existing conditions reduced.

HA you people think healthcare is a RIGHT, but it's not. Unless you vote for it to become a RIGHT and then watch taxes blow through the roof. Creating legislation to make private companies play by your rules will only force them into bankruptcy.
This is coming from someone with a pre-existing condition and large healthcare costs.

only stupid liberals think its a right.

They made way more than that. By nature, premiums are just funds that they then invest to make more money.

I don't know how things work these days but in the past claims usually cost more than premium income but investment returns made up the difference.

Insurance is not a savings account. Insurance is the spreading of risk. Some life insurance has a savings feature in addition to the death benefit protection. Compare term to (cash value) whole life in their purest forms. Health insurance more like term life. How about the guy who paid the same in but had a $500,000 claim? The $46,000 is not profit...it goes into the pool. Yes, profits are paid out to the stockholders after claims and administrative costs are covered.

As well as any rightwinger on Medicaid or Medicare and there are TONS. It is always funny to watch them try to explain how others are not entitled to the same entitlements they are.

It should be a right and anybody who argues that it shouldn't be is a piece of shit human being. How that medical care gets paid for and what type of treatment and care is extended to every citizen is up for fair debate.

Great logic! Anyone who doesn't agree with you is a stupid piece of shit human being. Lets try using your logic. Anyone who agrees it should be a right is just a lazy piece of shit and a burden on society.

Should health care or health insurance be a right? That is the key to the debate. Virtually everyone will agree that health care should be a right.

In many cases, if you can invest the difference it will greatly work out for you - but that doesn't work for everyone. I've had a show truck stolen and a rental totaled - I haven't paid enough to insurance over my life yet to pay for those cars.

With that... the new health care insurance doesn't "make" you pay. You simply wont get a tax credit otherwise, which you don't get now anyway. So live on how you like....

Well right now under current laws a insurance company cannot turn you down for pre existing condition and they have to cover those conditions, but they can charge up to 150% of the normal rate for pre existing conditions. But yeah rates have went thru the fucking roof. I'm paying over $600 a month for me and 1 granddaughter. And neither one of us has pre existing conditions. And a $500 per year deductable on us both. I think I have like 80% coverage after the yearly copay. It's fucking insane. Even if I go to the doctor every time I get a pimple on my ass, the insurance company still makes major bank as they have so many conditions in their contracts with the doctors the insurance companies rarely lose money on a insured person.

Choker you should look into a high deductible insurance plan with a health savings account (HSA) on the side. Roughly 20% of the insureds generate 80% of the claims. Insurance companies lose money on lots of individuals and even entire large groups. This where pooling comes in to spread the risk...

These rate increases have gone on for YEARS and which is why we have these new policies. These rates icnreases HAVE NOTHING to do with the new policies since most don't even take effect for 3 fucking years.

Free Enterprise at its worst ...

Oh you're so right. I mean as soon as the bill was passed, the next 6 months people's rates have gone up substantially and that apparently happens all the time, according to you.. Moron..:winkwink:

$450K/year pre existing condition here.

Insurance is just group sharing of risk and any insurance company taking me on would immediately wipe out the income from a huge number of other customers. It's only like refusing car insurance to someone that drives like a complete spaz ans has smashed up their last 4 cars because you pretty much know for certain that they will total their next car too and quite likely take someone else out too.

Even if what you said was true, perception is completely different.

Politicians said the new laws would change things. People see their bills continuing to rise. What are these people going to think? They're going to think that they were lied to, once again, and the new laws did absolutely nothing. And at the end of all that... they are still stuck paying more.

So Joe Blow thinks he was lied to, is paying more money, and is receiving less care.

A business is about profits.

What health care costs depends on level of care provided, not the system of collecting the money to pay for it. A private run health care system has the added burden of producing profits for the companies. A Government run National Health has the burden of providing care for those unable to pay, or like me retired.

Mismanagement or over inflated administrations are subject to both systems.

Neither system is perfect.

But if forced to choose between a system that will care for me come what may and a system that will try to dump me to guard profits. It's not a hard choice. AND that's the real difference between the 2 systems.

Thank you, somebody finally understands how insurance REALLY works, as opposed to a lot of angry rants.

Exactly.

National Health takes you on come what may. Private Insurance .................

I like the idea of heavy smokers, drinkers, very obese, etc. Paying more National Health Insurance. And that's what they do when they buy cigarettes, booze, but not food. Unless they insist on eating MacDees every day. :)

But it's got it's draw backs.

You would be covered under a National Health scheme and would of paid for it all your life and some who never really get sick would of helped pay for it as well.

Cause the government is super good at managing funds and not wasting money on administrative costs... how's SS doing now? haha
Actually my real fear is universal healthcare will let any joe blow utilize an already stressed system = longer wait times, higher costs, lower quality of care. Just ask canadians that need any specialized help, they can't get it!

QFT... Aside from the ridiculous sense of entitlement, of course..

You are correct that rates have been increasing annually since the inception of health insurance however further adjustments are being made now in anticipation of the new laws. Think about it...you throw a bunch of pre-existing conditions into the pool that were not covered before. Theoretically they say more people will be covered to help spread that risk but it won't be enough. It is kind of like mandatory car insurance...hmm wonder why you need uninsured motorist then.

It seems to me that they realize "mandatory health insurance" is not going to exist, which will eliminate a huge pool of paying people that they claimed to anticipate getting. It really can't. What's the punishment going to be for not having health insurance? Fines? Jail time? Yeh, right.

That sounds like a great campaign slogan. "Don't pay for health insurance? Go directly to jail!"

Lets not forget that insurance is supposed to insure against a risk that could happen in the future... If you have pre-existing conditions and are trying to get insurance, you are trying to game the system... not really any different than crashing a car, and then trying to buy car insurance...

Think about this folks... If health insurance is guaranteed issue so the insurance company cannot deny you and if they cannot restrict coverage for pre-existing conditions then why in the world would anyone buy insurance until they are sick?

I think we tried to make the same point simultaneously.

I must be in the healthy half. No pre-existing conditions here

You brought up slightly different point I think, that if you force insurance companies to take on people with pre-existing conditions, then it makes sense why you would have to force people to get insurance as well... otherwise it wouldn't make sense, only an idiot would buy insurance without pre-existing conditions....

or in car insurance terms: what would the point be of buying car insurance, if car insurance were forced to insure cars that have already crashed?

medical/healthcare wouldn't cost as much if the companies who made the equipment/etc weren't greedy and setting high prices on equipment....

So you are in the UK, and paying $450,000 p/year for insurance?

Right. I'm sure it's all the medical device companies...

Two or three years ago I needed a new wheelchair. I got in contact with this "recommended vendor." So I'm working with the guy, figuring out all the details, and I tell him "I can't pay more than $2500 for this, that's the absolute most." "No problem, no problem." So he comes to deliver my chair about a month later with a bill. He hands me a bill, it's $3500. Then he looks at it and says "oh wait, that's the bill if you are on Medicare, here is the correct one."

Bill still came out to $2800. Was not happy about that.

Anyway, the point of my story is... it's every company/person along the long chain wanting a piece of the pie and each one trying to figure out how to screw over the next person in line.

Great point. On the flip side (and I can't believe I'm going there), people get specific insurance because of pre-existing conditions.

seems like half is now a majority ....

ANYTHING you have is a pre-existing condition. my guess is probably 70% or more have some type of condition, but won't say anything when getting new insurance because of the fear of paying more.

stupid IMO

couple of years ago I changed heath insurance companies but there was a lag in coverage because Atena took their sweet ass time getting their shit together. However, about 4 months later I had some slight pain in my lower right side and thought I had a kidney infection.

I went to the doctor, they took some blood tests and found it was fine and not sure what was causing the problem. However, Atena refused to pay because they claimed it was a "pre-existing condition" and I would not have any coverage on that going forward.

WTF? this is why America is fucked. Private insurance companies getting to do and say what they want.

No, America is fucked because private insurance companies get to do what they want, then the government responds by shutting them down and doing what THEY want..

up here everyone 'has' health insurance, basic anyway. what happens is we all have to pay a certain amount, with low income being able to get 'premium assistance' etc

if one doesn't pay, it floats till you file taxes and they take it from that, or could lead to further legal action

Does the term "Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" mean anything to you? If a person dies because they cannot afford medical treatment that is available to others are they not denied their unalienable right to life? Keep fighting for a corporate ran government you clueless uneducated imbecile.

I was going to stay out of this, but you have to be the moron on the day with that statement.
Life=NO emergency room can turn you down, the illegal aliens know this and USE this
Liberty= Like the liberty to choose not to get insurance?
The pursuit of happiness= If you can afford it after ObamaCare takes full effect

The lawyers want to control the doctors you idiot

knock knock


who's there?


Death.....


Death who?


Death mother fucker, you have been denied coverage in the name of profits...so you can die...now pay up for your death tax as well