Foreign Webmasters & 2257
 

Do you think the US will come after foreign webmasters if/when they enter the country for webmaster gatherings, etc.?

I mean technically they will have done business with US citizens, right? So if you're a foreign webmaster and don't comply with 2257, you wouldn't be able to visit the US, or am I way off base here?

Yes your way off base, US laws only effect people in the US. You need to worry about the laws in your own countires not someone else's

As far as I understand it from my solicitor, the way it will effect european webmasters is with giving content to US webmasters. With the European data protection acts, we wont be allowed to give US webmasters details of european girls used on shoots, even if we wanted too, which I dont and wouldnt anyway.

I guess to get round this Ill get content made over there and over here, some US compliant for US webmasters and some European compliant for European webmasters.

of course if you dont comply no sponsor will want your traffic :2 cents:

US laws only affect people on US soil... if the foreign webmaster visits the US, he will be subject to the laws in the US. I was wondering if they could or would take it that far.

Just reminds of the people who got the letter from Germany about their AVS system, and were advised not to travel to Germany if they didn't comply.

dont be silly :helpme

okay cool in that case throw up a site that uses content that breaks the law, say of some child porn images and see how many sponsors want the traffic it generates :2 cents:

Dont be silly

EXACTLY. The foreign webmaster maynot be in trouble but don't you think the sposnor if it's US based will be? US sponsors aren't going to take that risk. Why don't you think that even thought it's legal in some countries for 17 year old to make porn try sending that to a US based sponor. Are you going to get paid? No. Why not it's LEGAL in your own country and US laws don't effect you, right? Hey scat, piss, beastilality and rape porn are legal in some countires try sending that to US based sponsor and see if you get paid.

If you are a foreign webmaster and you sposnors is also non-US based you're in the clear.

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh
too busy liberating iraq, sure they will come after some filthy porn webmasters from germany.

This will have a great effect on non US Webmasters and Sponsors. It will make the US less able to compete, simple as that.

Did you know if these changes go through you can kiss good bye to taking a holiday?

You have to be on hand all the time or am I reading this wrong?

I think Xmas day is probaly not included, unless you log on and check your stats.

well normal business times on the planet earth are from 9am - 5pm so theres one thing they fucked up on right away :1orglaugh

of course well all know these morons live on another planet so im not surprised they fucked up

I don't know if you guys are being deliberately stupid or just trying to create drama.

If today you make galleries that are legal in your country and legal in the US, eg don't have child porn etc, and you are sending that traffic to a US sponsor, today, then tomorrow if the regs change, there will be no difference, the sponsor will still want your completely legal traffic. The difference is if you live in the US you need this extra paperwork, if you don't live in the US you don't.

I guess if you are making CP sites and sending the traffic to sponsors today, they wont want your traffic before the new regs or after the new regs.

A little thought is needed sometimes guys

exactly which part of '2257 compliant' do you not understand :helpme

ARS wont take the traffic for a start..

as found in their tos

You obviously know more than my solicitor, I guess your very clever :thumbsup

If you dont live in the US your site doesnt violate that law, and so you would still be able to send traffic, as I understand it from that small clip youve pulled out, but if in doubt get a solicitor and contact the sponsor

um yes it will :1orglaugh

go speak to a 'proper' lawyer and dont listen to the rest of us fools on gfy

Am glad you find it all so funny, please explain how a a citizen from Spain hosting a legal site in his own country with all the relevant paperwork is infact breaking that law?

You cannot violate a law from another country unless you break that law in that country

So what you say is that an european affiliate, hosted on european server, promoting an US program, are NOT required to have the ID link, on his website. I mean, not that he can be arrested outside US, but that the US sponsor do not have to require the european affiliate to have this link?
This is very essential, since many affiliates of US programs are foreigners, and if they, by law, have to require foreign affiliates too to be compliant, then they gonna loose many foreign affiliates.

What I also wonder about is how US based billing companies, like CCBill will be affected by this? They also do payments to foreign affiliates. Can we expect requirements and holdbacks from the US billing companies if a foreign affiliate/paysite do not comply with the new regulations?

The hole shit is confusing, and most surprising is that we are talking about only a month from now. No info is given from paysites or billing companies. Everyone sit on their back, and wait for the bomb?

Thats a good question, but I doubt it, I cant see how you are violating a law that isnt law in your country, that fact that it isnt law means you cant violate it. So for that reason you are compliant by default becuase it doesnt apply.

To take this a step further, but Im not 100% sure of this, European webmasters wouldnt be allowed to show the models details, because of the data protection act, so by actually complying with a US law you may be breaking the law of your own country. But Im not 100% on that, its something Im getting cleared up

Um doesn't mean an US based affiliate will accept your traffic or pay you. In some country a porno of a chick sucking off a horse is legal. Try getting paid by a US sponsor sending them beastiality traffic.

Thats true.
Man, we are all fucked whatever we do :1orglaugh

Only legal here, if the horse is not underage :1orglaugh

Yes I think your right, but this is where common sense comes into it, its actually not black and white, the laws of your own country must come before the T&C's of a sponsor, or laws of another country. The very fact that in Europe that we have the data protection act means that we may be restricted. But things like beasty and child porn, will often be in a sponsors T&C's on a seperate note.

But getting back to the violation of that law in ARS's T&Cs as posted, I cant see how you are violating that law. If that law isnt law where you are, you cant violate it and so are not in violation of that law and so are still complying with those T&C's

Well if you can't comply with a US based sponors rules then your traffic won't be accept PERIOD. Doesn'tmatter the reason. You can't force sponsor XYZ for example to take your traffic just because 2257 don't apply to YOU, they apply to XYZ and that's all that matters to them.

Some of you are going over board.

This will not effect Non US webmasters, not hosting in the US, legally. Whether the TOS of the sponsor is broken that is down to individual sponsors.

This will effect US webmasters and sponsors big time, it could mean a lot more business for non US webmasters and sponsors. Unless you can comply with the new rules you are tied to FHGs or content so soft it will never be considered sexually explicit, if you are in the US. If you are not it's not a problem.

Using an example like CP or Beastiality to make a point is stretching it.

I don't see anywhere in the act where it says sponsors are responsible for their affiliates 2257 documentation. Maybe someone could point that out for me.

Correct, if you cant comply with there T&C's you wont get paid, I totally agree.

But what Im saying is this: If a sponsor doesnt want you in violation of this rule and the rule doesnt apply to you, then you are not in violation of that rule, and so are not in violation of there T&C's.

So why when you have your own content, on your own server in your own country breaking no laws and rules wouldnt the sponsor want your traffic? Of course they will want it, just like they did yesterday, They are not breaking any laws excepting your traffic, you are not breaking any laws sending it, why wouldnt they want it?

They will, if they dont swap to european sponsors, theres plenty of great ones out there.

Yes the reality of this is they are going to be turning down traffic from people who will be sending it. Even though it's not illegal.

However back in the real world, where these sponsors do as little as they can to track content pirates, stop them and ban them when we catch them for them. Well we think differently. :feels-hot

Exactly! Thats what Ive been trying to say, but you put it nice and simply, thanks

The question is not if affiliates follow sponsors TOS or not. The question is if US based sponsors, are FORCED, to require this from non-us affiliates. By law.
If so, US sponsors will not only loose those not following their TOS, but ALL european affiliates, because those, as mentioned above, will break the data protection law in Europe.

You just don't get it. Ashcfoft made these rules for one purpose to put porn out of busniess. Whether or not a sponsor is legally responsible won't be known until one actually get taken to court. Who is signing up for that duty? FEAR wil cause US sponsors to make it a rule that ALL webmasters must comply. Also any US sponors that has one set of very stringent rules for US webmasters and more liberal ones for foreign webmasters is a sponsor that will lose US webmasters.

You know, I'm almost willing to bet that a certain AG is sitting back at home right now, laughing his off reading these threads... inbetween spanking off to today's Hun listings of course.

What you have to understand is a lot of these guys are running scared and talking it up.

US webmasters and sponsors have had a mountain put in front of them. Non US webmasters will be free to carry on as before.

So will the US sponsors start to refuse traffic becasue it's coming from a non US affiliate? Well the ones that want to go out of business will. The rest will carry on and try to solve their own record keeping problems.

I'm still getting emails requesting 2257 documents for content that included the documentation when it was originally sold, they just deleted it. :helpme

We do get it, and a sponsor cannot be taken to court for something you have on your site, only you can, the very fact that these laws dont apply to you means, if they asked you could say GFY, that would be the end of it. A sponsor isnt liable for what you have on your site, they wasnt yesterday and wont be tommorow.

I will let you into a little secret and I do not want you to go telling everyone else.

THERE'S A WORLD OUTSIDE THE US

Ashc roft cannot put porn out of business. He can only make it harder for those in the US, he's not AG for the world. :1orglaugh

No fukcing shit, try telling that to Ashhahahahaha and Bush.

Exactly. :thumbsup

Exactly

The only difference for a non us sponsor like me is, what about the free content I give away, I wont I dont beleive be able to give documentation by law (data protection act) and so may in the future have to make two sets of content, some US compliant for US wembasters and some European complient for European webmasters.

And trust me US sponsors that have one set of rules for US webmasters and one for foreign webmasters will go out of business as well. You think I'm going to promote sponsor XYZ if I'm put at a competitive disadvantage just because another a webmaster is from the UK or somewhere and can do whatever the fuck he pleases?

I dont think they will have two sets of rules, the rules will be the same, dont violate that law, but if your not in the US you cant violate it, becuase its not law, infact complying could as weve said be actually ilegal where you are, so I dont think there will be two sets of rules, but US webmasters will definatly be at a disadvantage, but that wouldnt be the sponsors fault, thats the laws fault, go change the law, its your country not our :glugglug

God Bless America :thumbsup