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Dialers: The Hun has a strong point but:
Im not an ass kisser, but the hun has a very strong point on his negative opinon on dialers. Some of the surfers may truely be "tricked" into using them, and yes it will more than likely create a distrust by that surfer to never want to pay for porn again..
I have yet to remove the dialers from my site but unlike before I am understaning why so many tgp owners are against them. Ive preached quality quality quality many times here at GFY, and have spoke out against popups, autobookmarkers, and exit consoles more than I can remember. If the surfer truely is tricked into loading this dialer do doubt it is hurting, if not killing potential future buyers of porn... No Doubt.. But I guess Im in self denial right now assuming that the people who use my dialer are more impulsive rather than "tricked" to use my dialer. Im sure that a percentage of my surfers are tricked into using it, but Im trying to find the difference between this form of trickery and the trickery involved in joining a actual "normal" pay site where they are also "tricked" into the recurring monthly billing. Surely most people never intend to be rebilled every month at 39.95 every month after paying only 4.95 for a trial. If one finds using the dialer as wrong or a trick technique that destroys the trust the surfer has for future purchases, how does the dynamics of recurring billing not fall into this catagory? Did American Express have a legitamate complaint, or were they over reacting when they pulled out of the porn site arena saying that porn site's primary function is to "trick" the surfer into a cycle of unwanted monthy billing.. If we really wanted to make things perfect for the surfer, dont just get rid of the dialer get rid of recurring billing. How would you all like that? No more 30.00 per sign-up? It would go down to 5.00 or less. Partnership programs would not exist, or would not be worth the trouble, and the industry would not be nearly as rich as it is now. [This message has been edited by boneprone (edited 07-25-2001).] |
But I also agree that $75.00 for 25 minutes of porn is not good.. Not good at all, and in no way compares to 39.95 per month even if the surfer is tricked into being billed again month after month.
Sure the surfer will be much more pissed off about the dialer bill if he didnt know about it rather than the monthly billing suprise! But they both tend to leave a bitter taste in the surfers mouth.. If a surfer is billed 3 months 39.95 before he realizes he is being billed, he may not be as pissed as the guy getting tricked by the dialer, but I think he is still getting pissed off enough to never buy porn online again. |
Nevertheless, I am not about to remove my pay programs because they do mothly billing to the surfer.
Ive been known to remove pay programs with too many exit popups cause I think they are bad for the industry, yet I still use dialers and stick by them.. I guess we all become hypocrites in this industry one way or another, its just hard to draw a line sometimes and with the $$ coming in. I guess it clouds your thoughts even more when you are making $$ at it. The first natural reaction is to defend it.. But like I said unlike before I am now understanding why so many tgps are against the dialer.. They have a very valid point. A point I usually stand by cause it has to do with quality. |
Like with everything my friend quaility will cost ya http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif
Want a car cheap buy a second hand piece of crap want a decent car? Buy a BMW or Mercedes Want a quality car? Buy a Rolls As you will find out the price climbs equaly with the demand for more quality. Same thing for dialers they offer a lot more then most paysites but cost more http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif Wolfshade ------------------ Wolfshade's Moneymakers Get paid per minute at Dialerclopedia, per run at Nodialercash, or be a sponsor yourself!!! It's the choice of an Adult generation! ICQ#49873955 [email protected] |
I'll stick by the dialer, but to say that they provide quality is really pushing it..
The slow connection speed, and the poor content and the dead links on MOST dialers (except mine) is anything but quality. |
In fact the quality on most dialers (except mine) is pure shit.. I wouldnt view porn with a dialer even if it were free.
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In that case you shuld try mine and be amazed http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif
Wolfshade ------------------ Wolfshade's Moneymakers Get paid per minute at Dialerclopedia, per run at Nodialercash, or be a sponsor yourself!!! It's the choice of an Adult generation! ICQ#49873955 [email protected] |
Let's be honest with what is killing the industry (if anything)... It is all of the FREE stuff that is out there... That is, mainly, the TGP's. They provide more porn than anyone could look at in a year, and its all free. You can't sit there and tell me that TGP's aren't hurting all of us?...
Boneprone, you say: "How would you all like that? No more 30.00 per sign-up? It would go down to 5.00 or less. Partnership programs would not exist, or would not be worth the trouble, and the industry would not be nearly as rich as it is now." in relation to having no recurring billing. I firmly believe that if recurring billing was stopped, it wouldn't lead to lower incomes. People are still going to need to get their porn and if your site is good enough, they will come back, but only on one condition, that all of the free stuff goes. Imagine having free sites with only VERY softcore or censored content (which is what everyone should do anyway to protect minors http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/smile.gif )?... This would mean that people are going to find it MUCH harder to get their rocks off and will more willingly pull out their credit card. Without the free HARDCORE porn that is EVERYWHERE now, conversions would increase and we would ALL make more money, even the TGP owners would make TONS more! I know this will never happen however... It all starts at the TGPs... They are the sites that people go to work and tell their friends about... eg: "Hey I was surfing the net last night and I came across www.thehun.com ! WOW, there was so much porn there - even chicks fucking horses" Pay sites dont have a chance in that situation. Anyway... I will stop ranting now... Does anyone at all agree with me? http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/smile.gif |
I agree partly.
But the problem is not TGP's offering free xxx it's TGP's limiting the advertising on galleries and therefor forcing a lot of webmasters in to mor eaggressive means of advertising. I think it is safe to asume that TGP's are their own worsed enemy http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif Wolfshade ------------------ Wolfshade's Moneymakers Get paid per minute at Dialerclopedia, per run at Nodialercash, or be a sponsor yourself!!! It's the choice of an Adult generation! ICQ#49873955 [email protected] |
Yeah... I agree that they are their own worst enemy (in fact they are net porns worst enemy), but is their any way to buck the trend?
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Yes create a better alternative then posting galleries to TGP's
Right now TGP's generate the most traffic. If you can come up with something doing better then TGP's trafficwise you got it licked. I think toplists are a good bet http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif Wolfshade ------------------ Wolfshade's Moneymakers Get paid per minute at Dialerclopedia, per run at Nodialercash, or be a sponsor yourself!!! It's the choice of an Adult generation! ICQ#49873955 [email protected] |
http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/frown.gif
wow does everyone hate tgp's ? ANYONE WONNA BUY MY TGP ..? "sniff" I list galleries with several banners on it. also somtimes with diallers http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif AND no recip. needed. I will try to keep those rules up because I am also a gallery builder that knows how stupid many of the rules of other TGP's are. http://www.porn-haven.com TGP http://www.porn-haven.com/webmaster.html Webmasters go here |
66 posts http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/frown.gif
not a good number ahh 67 http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/smile.gif better sorry but i really don't like the number 66 or 666 http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif |
why not the 666evil dialer rocks!
It outpeforms the jesusdialer easy http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/biggrin.gif Wolfshade ------------------ Wolfshade's Moneymakers Get paid per minute at Dialerclopedia, per run at Nodialercash, or be a sponsor yourself!!! It's the choice of an Adult generation! ICQ#49873955 [email protected] |
Webmasterbaby
Am alwasy looking for TGPs to post to that do not require an recip. but yours is not in your profile. you can ICQ it if you want 2829770 Jim |
And so we went from dialers to no recip TGP posting *LOL*
Is this board whacked or what? http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/biggrin.gif Wolfshade ------------------ Wolfshade's Moneymakers Get paid per minute at Dialerclopedia, per run at Nodialercash, or be a sponsor yourself!!! It's the choice of an Adult generation! ICQ#49873955 [email protected] |
Wolfshade, I think it's called ADD, hard to keep on topic with it.
And YES, TGPs give away too much porn and limit ads, and they are bad for the industry, but they provide me with a chance to make a buck... ------------------ Phat Sites Need Phat Hosting Get PHAT And Now You can Get even Phatter! TGP Hosting Special! |
Is this board whacked or what?
All you have to do is read some of the post and you can see it's very whacked and wackily fun. Jim |
Hmm you're happy with a buck when you could make a living??????
Does not compute http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/biggrin.gif Wolfshade ------------------ Wolfshade's Moneymakers Get paid per minute at Dialerclopedia, per run at Nodialercash, or be a sponsor yourself!!! It's the choice of an Adult generation! ICQ#49873955 [email protected] |
Wolfshade, you're right, I put in my 17 hours a day to this biz, I make a living out of it, it's not as good as I want it to be *yet* but I'll be there soon, I'm learning my tricks http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/smile.gif
------------------ Phat Sites Need Phat Hosting Get PHAT And Now You can Get even Phatter! TGP Hosting Special! |
Sorry about the subject change before.
and yes boneprone IC your point. The fact of the matter is that most of us have, will, or do trick people just so that we make a buck(living ;-) ) But that's the bizz. I actually have sofar not used any dialler on my sites but was thinking about it. and now all this negativity... what should I do guys?? get one or not? :-) |
Boneprone... 100% right. You have a good view. Making money is no problem, ripping people off is.
Wolfshade: "But the problem is not TGP's offering free xxx it's TGP's limiting the advertising on galleries and therefor forcing a lot of webmasters in to mor eaggressive means of advertising.". Again, history is proving you wrong. These agressive marketing methods are used for a year now, maybe two. A lot of people on this board made a lot of money before excessive ads or agressive marketing. Also, if galleries were costing this industry so much money why do almost all sponsors still have an affiliate program. Just stop those. Nobody will make galleries anymore. No more free porn. So I can go back to how it was the day I started my site: link previews of paysites (ok, I have to admit, along with an index or two). Those paysites will see the results and will start building custom galleries. I HAVE BEEN THERE. This is what happened with my site 6 years ago. And you can ask PK AND UNDOUBTLY she'll tell you the same story. Look at my site. Sure, there's quite a lot of content on there. But is the content even CLOSE to a good paysite?! No. It's not. No movies (no high quality ones anyway), no huge series, no life chat. Just pictures. And a whole lot of 'em. But more than enough oppertunities for paysites to make money. Wolfshade, you're making statements here that are already proven wrong by simple facts. I'm not against dialers. I'm not against advertising. I am against dialers that charge unfair amounts of money. I'm against a paysite that would charge 10 dollars a month when they don't have content... Recurred billing is no problem, if it's clear to people. And if it's easy for them to cancel. Most paysites get their biggest chunk of their income out of recurring customers. And those customers are happy ones. They like what they see, they are not afraid to sign up for another site if they feel it has good content. ANY paysite owner could confirm this. Ads in a paysite work best. Some people spend hundreds of dollars a month on-line on porn. No problem if they KNOW they're are spending that much. I very highly doubt a 75 dollar dialer-call for 25 minutes was what that surfer was looking for though... |
I had a tgp once before.I didn't care what sponsor you used.You are out there to make money and I wasn't going to restrict gallery submitters due to their sponsors.
I do see The Hun's point.I know what he is saying and I agree with the old saying.."once bitten..twice shy".But I know that money has to be made somehow. I have never used dialer sponsors and cannot give an opinion on them. Who knows what's hurting the biz.No one can say for sure.Just because the surfer gets his ass stung by a dialer doesn't mean he won't click another banner.It does, however, make him less likely to. If you want to submit to The Hun,you have to follow his rules obviously.He can give more traffic in one hour than most tgps can give in a week. The Hun has been around for a long time and probably knows what he's talking about. ------------------ Your tattooed messiah |
Nice change of heart Boneprone...you going to start giving away teddybears now too?
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I'm not sure I agree with the point that diallers will stop people using signups or clicking. Popup hell will pull banner clicks down - but a dialler (IMHO obviously http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif ) would only succeed in stopping the person who used it from using another dialler. The two types of program are totally different beasts.
Regarding the free porn point I certainly agree to an extent with the point about the amount of free porn being a problem. However there are a few points here that haven't really been raised - Firstly, it's easy to say it should stop and we're fools for keep submitting etc, however it's still very much true that if you don't then some other bugger will. It may be a shitty way to make money but you can't afford to ignore it as a tool as long as it's there and as long as you use it it will be there. It's a catch 22 situation with no real way out. The only alternative is to find other ways but it is tough to beat the lure of free porn to get the punters in. OK, it's harder to get signups. However I believe this has a much to do with the amount of people now trying to sell porn rather than the amount of free stuff about. Let's be honest about this - on the whole free porn is crap. At best it's usually a couple of dozen (often 'grainy') pics of the same couple in almost the same pose. A pay site can still offer far more and for anyone into porn in a serious way is the only option. Free porn may be a pain but is with us for the duration. ------------------ Sleep is something that happens to other people |
Hun,
You are provng yourself wrong my friend! As Sandman correctly stated in this other thread here: Quote:
I saw those ads too now(10 minutes ago) it is true. Again double standard I'm affraid Also if what you just stated is true: Quote:
You think that creates happy surfers???? You being of the opinion that surfers don't have to read disclaimers and need your protection because of that can't possibly agree to that type of advertising????? http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/tongue.gif And last but certainly not least when I asked you about a free exe file and if it was ok to post galleries with that on it you turned me down for the added bookmarks, while that is explained before installing(hell you quoted the terms yourself) so when somebody does come up with a free tool with the potential like a dialer for webmasters you turn that down too. Popular sponsors like ARS get blacklisted because you don't like the exit etc..... What is left then Hun? answer me that. I can remember the time when you listed complete indexes and though that's not a nice thing to do to a Bandwidth paying webmaster you were a lot more reasonable back then. It is since you started condeming certain sponsors and dialers or dialer like programs your traffic makes less and less for webmasters, while they pay the HUGE bandwidth bills, supply the content(again pay for it) and the webspace. I don't know about the rest here but I think you just could be a little more appreciative of the webmasters providing your content, as you once correctly stated on your own site without them there would be no Yellow Pages. So far all I have seen is you repeating yoru opinion which is fine, but I now showed you a lot of facts please explain those I would be most interested http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif Wolfshade ------------------ Wolfshade's Moneymakers Get paid per minute at Dialerclopedia, per run at Nodialercash, or be a sponsor yourself!!! It's the choice of an Adult generation! ICQ#49873955 [email protected] |
I love it when people come here and blow their mouth off about how tgps kill the fucking industry..
Ive explained the dynamic of tgp in this industry sooo many fucking times, Im not gunna do it any more. So many people really dont think before they pop off. |
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Am slow after all am a 5th grade drop out. Jim |
Bone it's the otherway around actually
It's not the free stuff from TGP's destroying the bizz it's dialers and other tools Changing the biz and the way it is changing starts to threathen those big TGP's. Even Worldsex that once was a very easy going TGP gets it. They never cared about what's advertised on galleries as long as the gallery was good and clean. Now they prohibit the use of dialers. Like I explained in the thread I started TGPs won't last forever and they know it wether they wanna admit it or not. Hun for that matter you can not tell me that the clicks on your banners has not decreased over time. I simply don't buy that http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif Wolfshade ------------------ Wolfshade's Moneymakers Get paid per minute at Dialerclopedia, per run at Nodialercash, or be a sponsor yourself!!! It's the choice of an Adult generation! ICQ#49873955 [email protected] |
Wolfshade, i dont usually agree with ya but you are 100% right.
1 out of 10 times aint bad! ha ha! |
Hold on, hold on... you're trying to proove points I didn't make Wolfshade... in this post it says I'm NOT against dialers. I'm against programs that rip people off! I'm against 75 USD for 25 minutes of access... That's what I'm against. Please don't try to find dirt on me in favor of the dialer. That's not what this discussion is about. Again, I am not against dialers, I am against the high prices some of 'em charge.
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I think it will all work it's self out just fine with time. It is becoming fast, a game where creativity, originality, and hard work will be what makes it in this industry.
The overwhelming hype on how much a select few were making a few years back has sucked thousands of people into the game all at once. Alot of people who shouldn't be here, and those that should, are all going after the same piece of pie in a room that is way to small for everyone. Many give up everyday... but even more are sucked in by the dream of fast money. Why not though? Affiliate programs are selling themselves so easily to webmasters and webnewbies alike. When many of them don't realize they are competing against thousands of others to sell the same shit, then they get frustrated and bitch about it when they aren't converting. Everyone is scratching each other?s back though... Content providers selling to big sites and galley owners alike... Free hosts for gallery owners and site owners, TGP's, toplists, and linklists sending everyone traffic... Now it's your job to figure out the formula or crack the code on how to make all of it work for you. I think time will tell who's really dedicated and in it to win it. Oh yeah and about dialers http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/smile.gif LOL I think they are pretty shady, but do serve a purpose for some surfers out there. No CC, or don't trust the net with their CC, from a different country...etc. As for paysites reoccurring... I really can't believe people don't see it when they sign up. Most that bitch about are just pissed at themselves that they forgot about it, or the wife is asking what the fuck is up with this charge. I've also done in house customer service and believe me they come up with the funniest shit. I wish you all luck on your quest for world domination. http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ |
Wolf: "It's not the free stuff from TGP's destroying the bizz it's dialers and other tools Changing the biz and the way it is changing starts to threathen those big TGP's.".
Dialers are in no way, shape or form even the smallest thread for any link-site out there... If I'd allow the use of rip-off advertising and console loops people would be afraid to click on banners and soon stop clicking 'em. And that's not only a threat to me, that's a threat to everybody in this whole industry... Dialers are not threatening anything. How are link-sites threatened by ANY of this? I don't get that. Wolfshade, for that matter, I never made more money than last month. And the month before that it was the same, and the month before that too. I can ASSURE you I have not noticed any drop of income. If you don't buy that then that's you're problem. These are FACTS I'm stating. Link-sites will not disappear. Simple as that. People need directories. If someone finds out something new someone else will create a directory of services on that new invention. It's been like that for ever. Phonebooks. the "real" yellow Pages, white pages, you name 'em. But also search-engines, portals, stuff to help people find what they're looking for. Trust me wolf, those won't disappear. Ever. Lets get one thing straight. The way this industry goes (and the way ANY industry goes) lays in where the consumer wants to go. There will be a time when the consumer gets smart and knows what's going on. A consumer is not blind. They only will be ripped of for so long. And right now unfortunately there's enough 'newbies' to make a living prospering on lack of knowlegde. And then the consumer again decides where things are going. If the consumer wants movies, money can be made there. if they want to chat, they spend their money on chatrooms. That's how any business goes. You can create a market. But especially with the enormous amount of competition that's active these days it's impossible to tell people what they want. When competition is fierce everything people want is there. So they decide where to go. Sites to find what you're looking for (search-engines, linksites) are a very good tool for people. THAT's why I take so good care of my visitors. Or try to anyway |
What's this? http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/biggrin.gif
The Hun World's Most Popular Adult Web Page Has this guy got pull or what. http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/wink.gif I really think alot of you thehun, you stick up for what you believe in and it will take alot more than what anyone on this board can say am sure to change it. Jim |
yeah it seems like some people here didnt fully read my post either, I wasnt anti dialer in tone either. I was questioning it, but I was also questioning and comparing it to any other paysite technique.
I was trying to make the reader think how is a dialer "tricking" the surfer anymore than the tricking that goes on with any "normal" paysite and its monthly recurring monthly billing technique. Seems like a lot of people dont read the entire post before they pop off. Bitches. |
Dialers are becoming more friendly now. I on a daily basis program dialers to go to the webmasters own content etc. where it offers a great alternative to using a CC on their site.
Dialers are changing with the times...they are offering more & more...& most of them are at a somewhat reasonable rate. The plain fact of the matter is....if the people dont want it & the webmasters wont use it....it will go away. But as it stands...dialers are making alot of progress by offering more & more unique content/idea's. It used to be you got a dialer..& it would go to the "Mega Content Site" & charge you 11bucks a minute.... But now...many many webmasters are pointing them to their own site's & using them as a viable alternative to CC billing. Thus there is no point in tricking the surfer...they know what they are paying for & how much it is. So...I agree with you guys on alot of points..but thats why the dialer industry needs to make some changes..& keep innovating http://bbs.gofuckyourself.com/board/tongue.gif ------------------
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------------------ MyProfilZ!!! The Scarab TGP Fuckit - why am I in here and not working? |
ya know what? we're fucking SALESMEN, plain and simple.
I think the "free" element of porn will always exist. A good salesman gives out samples. I do believe the explicitness of our samples will decline because like any good salesman, once we got em hooked...we raise the price and give the illusion away. Dialers. Well, hmmm. If the surfer is specifically made to understand what they were getting and how much it would cost, would they still download the software? I believe yes. Look at those TV telephone psychic lines. You get charged $3.50 a minute. When they and the phone sex lines first came out, there was a backlash but they are still with us. I agree with the Hun that every interest needs a portal. I think Mr. Hun, you will jump on the softcore bandwagon with the rest of us. As I said, we are salesmen. I have found the best way to sell a product is to first, find one you like. Second, just decribe to the customer EXACTLY what they are getting for their money. If your product is a good one, the description does the selling for you. Then again, we are salesmen. We all have tricks and buzzwords. To say some methods are less ethical than others is true. But to say that we don't all dance and dazzle to push our products would not be true. Honorable methods will determine the future. So will creativity, convenience, quality service and an ability to adapt to change. ------------------ tit, A revolution in adult content: EROTICOPY [This message has been edited by titmowse (edited 07-25-2001).] |
once again this post is not about dialers, but about the billing techniques of the indusry as a whole including monthly billing techniques and comparing them to the difference in dialer techniques.
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and once again my nuts itch.
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