Healthcare - A Privilege Or A Right?

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  • JaneB

    #61
    I am surprised that no one has pointed out the doctor shortage the US has. Dotors are threatening to retire or not accept insurance if this passes. Then you would have doctors that want cash only. The quality of care will go down and the wait to see a doctor will be longer. To see a specialist it can already take a couple of months.

    Comment

    • Paul Markham
      Too old to care
      • Jun 2001
      • 52942

      #62
      Originally posted by baddog
      ummm . . . hell no. I am sorry, but I do not feel any responsibility for other people's families. I took care of mine.
      And what happens when you choose to retire, or you lose your job or your family needs more care then a company run for profit decides you're too expensive to keep paying out on?



      Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500.
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      • BFT3K
        Too lazy to set a custom title
        • Dec 2005
        • 10764

        #63
        Originally posted by baddog
        Judging by your followup post, you lied.

        No politically biased bullshit
        Yeah, I already fessed up to that hypocrisy earlier in this very thread.

        Comment

        • 12clicks
          Too lazy to set a custom title
          • Jan 2001
          • 19813

          #64
          Originally posted by BFT3K
          Same as everything else - a fair tax taken out of everyone's paycheck. You pay for healthcare anyway, so why not just cover it like all other security issues - like military spending... how do we pay for that?

          Why do we need to fight insurance companies and pay for this coverage separately?

          If I lose 30% from each paycheck, instead of 25% plus a health insurance payment, I would prefer the simplicity of the slightly higher tax - you pay either way.

          This would actually be more fair for everyone, as everyone would pay into the pool, like for basic education, and for roadwork, and everything else you guys claim to hate, gets paid for now.

          If you are rich, and you want better coverage, I am certain you will be allowed to pay more for it, as the wealthy will always get better services. Doesn't mean the have-nots should be screwed over.

          if that was how it worked, that would solve one small part of it but as with all else, the rich pay for the lion's share. "everyone" will NEVER pay into the pool under obama. THAT is a problem.
          I'm not a dinosaur, I'm a crocodile. I've seen dinosaurs come and go and I'm left unimpressed.

          Comment

          • Robbie
            Leaner, Meaner, Faster
            • Aug 2002
            • 20960

            #65
            How can it be a "privilege" or a "right" lol

            Has the govt. taken so much control of our lives that we can't do anything for ourselves anymore?

            When I was growing up...nobody I knew had "health insurance" That was something for "rich people"

            When we got sick, we went to the doctor. And NO, you didn't have to take out a fucking bank loan to do so.

            There is a reason that "Medical Tourism" is so big now. And that reason is because our govt., the insurance companies, the pharmacies, and the hospital industry have conspired to make prices for medical treatment in the U.S. the most expensive in the world.

            Fucking money grab.

            Take a look at this:
            http://www.indian-medical-tourism.co...-benefits.html
            -Robbie
            ClaudiaMarie.Com

            Comment

            • 12clicks
              Too lazy to set a custom title
              • Jan 2001
              • 19813

              #66
              Originally posted by JaneB
              I am surprised that no one has pointed out the doctor shortage the US has. Dotors are threatening to retire or not accept insurance if this passes. Then you would have doctors that want cash only. The quality of care will go down and the wait to see a doctor will be longer. To see a specialist it can already take a couple of months.
              yup, once the government starts regulating what those evil "rich" doctors make, medical school will no longer be an investment the smart will make.
              I'm not a dinosaur, I'm a crocodile. I've seen dinosaurs come and go and I'm left unimpressed.

              Comment

              • The Demon
                Confirmed User
                • Apr 2003
                • 7336

                #67
                Originally posted by Robbie
                How can it be a "privilege" or a "right" lol

                Has the govt. taken so much control of our lives that we can't do anything for ourselves anymore?

                When I was growing up...nobody I knew had "health insurance" That was something for "rich people"

                When we got sick, we went to the doctor. And NO, you didn't have to take out a fucking bank loan to do so.

                There is a reason that "Medical Tourism" is so big now. And that reason is because our govt., the insurance companies, the pharmacies, and the hospital industry have conspired to make prices for medical treatment in the U.S. the most expensive in the world.

                Fucking money grab.

                Take a look at this:
                http://www.indian-medical-tourism.co...-benefits.html
                Amen to that dude.
                Greed is Good

                Comment

                • Paul Markham
                  Too old to care
                  • Jun 2001
                  • 52942

                  #68
                  Originally posted by JaneB
                  I am surprised that no one has pointed out the doctor shortage the US has. Dotors are threatening to retire or not accept insurance if this passes. Then you would have doctors that want cash only. The quality of care will go down and the wait to see a doctor will be longer. To see a specialist it can already take a couple of months.
                  Both systems suffer with a shortage of doctors, you can never have enough until you get to a one to one ratio.

                  But don't threat they wont all quit or refuse to work, they might lose they're medical cover.



                  Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500.
                  PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

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                  • Paul Markham
                    Too old to care
                    • Jun 2001
                    • 52942

                    #69
                    Reading this thread it's clear how some are misguided about the cost of medical care and how it's paid for.

                    Also some have a "I'm alright Jack so screw those who are not" attitude. Maybe they should think about what happens to them if the tables turned on them.



                    Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500.
                    PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

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                    • Vendzilla
                      Biker Gnome
                      • Mar 2004
                      • 23200

                      #70
                      Originally posted by BFT3K
                      A History Of Reconciliation

                      For 30 years, major changes to health care laws have passed via the budget reconciliation process. Here are a few examples:

                      1982 ? TEFRA: The Tax Equity and Fiscal Responsibility Act first opened Medicare to HMOs

                      1986 ? COBRA: The Consolidated Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act allowed people who were laid off to keep their health coverage, and stopped hospitals from dumping ER patients unable to pay for their care

                      1987 ? OBRA '87: Added nursing home protection rules to Medicare and Medicaid, created no-fault vaccine injury compensation program

                      1989 ? OBRA '89: Overhauled doctor payment system for Medicare, created new federal agency on research and quality of care

                      1990 ? OBRA '90: Added cancer screenings to Medicare, required providers to notify patients about advance directives and living wills, expanded Medicaid to all kids living below poverty level, required drug companies to provide discounts to Medicaid

                      1993 ? OBRA '93: created federal vaccine funding for all children

                      1996 ? Welfare Reform: Separated Medicaid from welfare

                      1997 ? BBA: The Balanced Budget Act created the state-federal childrens' health program called CHIP

                      2005 ? DRA: The Deficit Reduction Act reduced Medicaid spending, allowed parents of disabled children to buy into Medicaid


                      I see some pretty good things in that group
                      It will interesting when the budget comes out today for the bill, it has to reduce the deficit to be able to use the Reconciliation. thats probably why they added the student loan thing.
                      Watching FOX at 3pm pacific for the presidents interveiw with Bret Baier
                      Carbon is not the problem, it makes up 0.041% of our atmosphere , 95% of that is from Volcanos and decomposing plants and stuff. So people in the US are responsible for 13% of the carbon in the atmosphere which 95% is not from Humans, like cars and trucks and stuff and they want to spend trillions to fix it while Solar Panel plants are powered by coal plants
                      think about that

                      Comment

                      • mountainmiester
                        Confirmed User
                        • Oct 2002
                        • 509

                        #71
                        It's not a simple yes or no/right or privilege question until the semantics are clarified.

                        Access to health care and the freedom to choose your health care provider is in deed a right.

                        Having the government provide it is not.

                        Right = No one can stop me from __________
                        Privilege = You can/can't get that treatment or see that doctor

                        Does anyone see how access to health care which is currently a right actually goes to privilege with this plan?
                        Randall Crockett
                        LIMELIGHT NETWORKS
                        [email protected]

                        Comment

                        • smutnut
                          So Fucking Banned
                          • Jul 2007
                          • 5889

                          #72
                          Most Americans don't have health care unless you are talking about people who are victims of violent crimes or unexpected accidents that are visible and require immediate assistance. Check ups are needed to catch illnesses in the womb that not only saves lives but keep down the cost of major health care at the last minute when we are trying to prove how human we are by treating the poor and taking every last dime out of the hands of the middle class for a major illness.

                          It's funny that the people who make minimum wage and have no or minimal coverage are against an overhaul of the system like it matters if they have the latest treatment or technology that they will never have used on them anyway.

                          All judges who can sentence people to prison should do time in jail. All people who can start wars should serve time in the military and in war, and all people against everyone having health care should die slowly of some brutal painful disease!

                          Comment

                          • TheDoc
                            Too lazy to set a custom title
                            • Jul 2001
                            • 13827

                            #73
                            Originally posted by NetHorse
                            Oh is it really? Wow, how many tokes of your bong did you take this morning before you figured I didn't realize that.
                            Sooo, you realized you had a sarcasm fail but posted anyway?
                            ~TheDoc - ICQ7765825
                            It's all disambiguation

                            Comment

                            • Robbie
                              Leaner, Meaner, Faster
                              • Aug 2002
                              • 20960

                              #74
                              Originally posted by smutnut
                              all people against everyone having health care should die slowly of some brutal painful disease!
                              Is anyone in the world "against" everyone having "health care" Of course not.

                              But I'd make an argument that the MAJORITY of people are against being forced to buy health insurance that they shouldn't have to have need of.

                              Bottom line is REAL health care reform would address the insane costs that we are forced to pay in the U.S. for hospital stays, doctor visits, and prescription drugs.

                              The govt and the media are pretty much doing one of the oldest con jobs in the world by distracting people with "insurance" In the end, all that will happen is the insurance companies are going to get 10's of millions of new customers.

                              It won't matter one bit to any of us as far as going to the doctor is concerned. His price will still stay the same or even go higher. My insurance rates will stay the same or probably go higher. My tax rate will go higher. Prescription drugs will still cost 10 times what everybody else in the world pays.

                              I don't see where this is going to make "health care" costs change one bit at all.
                              -Robbie
                              ClaudiaMarie.Com

                              Comment

                              • baddog
                                So Fucking Banned
                                • Apr 2001
                                • 107089

                                #75
                                Originally posted by Paul Markham
                                And what happens when you choose to retire, or you lose your job or your family needs more care then a company run for profit decides you're too expensive to keep paying out on?
                                Rule #1. Don't retire if you can not afford to do so. I have NEVER relied on others, and I can not ever see anything changing that.

                                Originally posted by Paul Markham
                                Both systems suffer with a shortage of doctors, you can never have enough until you get to a one to one ratio.

                                But don't threat they wont all quit or refuse to work, they might lose they're medical cover.
                                I was watching an interview on the Daily Show last night. Some British actor. He was asked what people thought about the health care system in the UK and he mentioned that doctors were not very happy with it because they work long hours for crappy pay.

                                Of course, you Communists don't really care about that I guess.

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