Why is it hard to take down illegal tube sites? - GoFuckYourself.com

The Duck · 10-17-2008, 07:36 PM

Are they all on rogue hosts? If not it should be as simple as sending a few well articulated lawyer written emails to the host and domain registrar right? I dont know.

Sin_Vraal · 10-17-2008, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kandah

Are they all on rogue hosts? If not it should be as simple as sending a few well articulated lawyer written emails to the host and domain registrar right? I dont know.

I would guess that while the particular content is in violation, the site as a whole is not. you would basically have to have a number of people writing these letters, otherwise its not gonna get any more traction that taking down the offending video.

Tubes are basically the free hosts of old, thats why I find this shit hilarious. its the same old shit with a new shine to it.

KillerK · 10-17-2008, 11:16 PM

I would guess because they are bro's with the big programs. They send shitloads of traffic to dating and cam offers.

SomeCreep · 10-17-2008, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kandah

Why is it hard to take down illegal tube sites?

Because The Force is strong with them.

d-null · 10-17-2008, 11:21 PM

notice that some big sponsors' content is rarely found on the tubes

it is like they know where they might face a legal problem they don't want to deal with, but they gladly rip off the rest

Jens Van Assterdam · 10-17-2008, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillerK

I would guess because they are bro's with the big programs. They send shitloads of traffic to dating and cam offers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by d-null

notice that some big sponsors' content is rarely found on the tubes

it is like they know where they might face a legal problem they don't want to deal with, but they gladly rip off the rest

wootpr0n · 10-18-2008, 12:37 AM

A) Big web host is making lots of money selling the tube site bandwidth and servers

B) If they took it down, word will spread that this web host has no backbone to stand up to bullies, and their policy is to take the side of the complainer

C) Practically no liability. The Tube site already has a DMCA policy to take down the videos, and unless they refuse to comply with a valid takedown request, the webhost can't get involved. A Tube site is a separate "service" in the context of the law.

D) It's not their problem, and their legal department knows that you, a porn producer are never going to sue the tube site (let alone the web host), and even if you were stupid enough to sue them, you would lose.

The only time you can take down a tube site is if your attorney, who works for a medium to large sized law firm, writes a long letter to the General Counsel of the web host, demanding that you take down the site. Then if that tube site is only using one server at that web host, and a small amount of bandwidth, and the web host already has a bad reputation and couldn't care if it got worse, will the tube site be taken down.

Rorschach · 10-18-2008, 12:47 AM

Tube sites are protected from copyright liability by the DMCA safe harbour clause, which indemnifies them from prosecution for user uploaded content. The DMCA single handedly allows the content theft tube model to flourish and prosper. Here's a summary:

http://www.keytlaw.com/Copyrights/dmca.htm

aico · 10-18-2008, 01:02 AM

Trust no one...

Paul Markham · 10-18-2008, 01:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rorschach

Tube sites are protected from copyright liability by the DMCA safe harbour clause, which indemnifies them from prosecution for user uploaded content. The DMCA single handedly allows the content theft tube model to flourish and prosper. Here's a summary:

http://www.keytlaw.com/Copyrights/dmca.htm

True. The laws governing the Internet were set up before the Internet became what it is today.

tiger · 10-18-2008, 01:33 AM

Combination of DMCA protection and money.

Mr. Billy · 10-18-2008, 01:38 AM

Now we know why the RIAA and MPAA decided to go after the folks who uploaded and downloaded the content.

Might be time to do that.

Got rid of Napster didn't it?

Don't worry about driving customers away. They will still come back to pull out their credit cards for porn.

Mr.Right - Banned For Life · 10-18-2008, 01:44 AM

Find a way to take away their domains.

Write well formulated letters to the ICANN.

d-null · 10-18-2008, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Billy

Now we know why the RIAA and MPAA decided to go after the folks who uploaded and downloaded the content.

Might be time to do that.

Got rid of Napster didn't it?

Don't worry about driving customers away. They will still come back to pull out their credit cards for porn.

that works great for torrents and p2p, because anyone downloading is also uploading, so if there were some lawsuits of some average dudes at home downloading porn and the publicity that surrounds it, it would strike fear in a big hurry....

as far as the tubes go, instead of simple dmca take down requests, it would be nice to see uploader ip's be subpoenad and held accountable.... if stolen content is being uploaded by someone involved in the tubesite management, then they should be sued to bankruptcy and beyond

DamageX · 10-18-2008, 02:19 AM

Because they're not actually illegal. Yet.

Mr. Billy · 10-18-2008, 03:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d-null

that works great for torrents and p2p, because anyone downloading is also uploading, so if there were some lawsuits of some average dudes at home downloading porn and the publicity that surrounds it, it would strike fear in a big hurry....

as far as the tubes go, instead of simple dmca take down requests, it would be nice to see uploader ip's be subpoenad and held accountable.... if stolen content is being uploaded by someone involved in the tubesite management, then they should be sued to bankruptcy and beyond

I think you have it right.

I originally did not like the idea of going after the user, but if the tube sites claim immunity, then they must identify users who are "misusing" their service by uploading copyrited content that they are not entitled to distribute.

Immunity cannot apply to both the tube site operator and the uploader of material covered by copyrite. One of them is responsible. The tube site owners must decide between paying the penalties or allowing the users to be punished.

Tube site owners, how do u want it. Do you want to become responsible members of the community, or do you want to cause your members to be trashed in the legal system.

You may be immune to the copyrite angle of this argument, but you must be quaking in your boots when you realize that you might be required by law to hand over the identities of your members for prosecution. I think tube sites in any country might be obligated to respond to such a subpoena or face legal consequences.

This may be what ultimately proves to be the downfall of tube sites.

I wonder how many surfers are going to want to upload to tube sites now? Hmmmmmmm.....

selena · 10-18-2008, 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d-null

that works great for torrents and p2p, because anyone downloading is also uploading, so if there were some lawsuits of some average dudes at home downloading porn and the publicity that surrounds it, it would strike fear in a big hurry....

as far as the tubes go, instead of simple dmca take down requests, it would be nice to see uploader ip's be subpoenad and held accountable.... if stolen content is being uploaded by someone involved in the tubesite management, then they should be sued to bankruptcy and beyond

I love this idea.

seeandsee · 10-18-2008, 07:20 AM

evil tubes are strong!

camgirlshide · 10-18-2008, 07:23 AM

google has had to argue they spend millions of dollars in filtering technology to filter out illegal content on youtube. Therefore, they are taking every reasonable effort possible to keep illegal content off their site. Even with this, they face enormous legal battles.

The illegal tube sites, on the other hand, don't seem to spend any money on chasing down illegal content (assuming for a second they didn't post said content themselves knowing it was illegal). So, to me at least, it seems google's argument doesn't hold up to the illegal tube sites.

Now, I still say the answer is my plan to simply go after the wallets of any affiliate program that willingly pays money to a tube site or attempts to gain traffic by placing a few of their short legally offered clips among the thousands of longer stollen clips. Therefore, I urge you to remove all mentions of affiliate programs from your sites participating in either of these two activities.

brassmonkey · 10-18-2008, 07:31 AM

dont hate the playa hate the game

count of monte cristo · 10-18-2008, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamageX

Because they're not actually illegal. Yet.

well, if a host has a client that a repeat infringer, they have an obligation to turn them off, otherwise, they could be liable for contributory infringement.

you will find the largest tube sites are connected to the largest low priced host for a few reasons.

they need to be connected to a very friendly host in order to not be taken down
they need extremely low prices in order to maintain the profitability of their biz model
in return they contribute a ton of bw, whose volume helps lower the hosts overall bw costs

therefore, tubes that dont have a tight relationship with a host are at a competitive disadvantage, symbiosis at its finest

crockett · 10-18-2008, 07:48 AM

I think you guys are going after them with the wrong angle. Screw going after the hosts, go after the domains via icann.

The Duck · 10-18-2008, 08:11 AM

What about rogue techniques like dos and infinite requests to dl content? I know its not legal but what the fuck are we going to do.

I once had a world of warcraft site offering cheats and exploit info, the wow community went apeshit and launched all kinds of attacks and I soon had to take my site down.

fuzebox · 10-18-2008, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rorschach

Tube sites are protected from copyright liability by the DMCA safe harbour clause, which indemnifies them from prosecution for user uploaded content.

But tube sites don't take user uploaded content, every video I upload gets rejected

DamageX · 10-18-2008, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kandah

What about rogue techniques like dos and infinite requests to dl content? I know its not legal but what the fuck are we going to do.

I once had a world of warcraft site offering cheats and exploit info, the wow community went apeshit and launched all kinds of attacks and I soon had to take my site down.

That's because you were a two-bit loser geek kid who took pleasure in offering cheats and whatnot. These tube sites actually make enough to hire lawyers. In fact, some of them hire lawyers so good that if I were you I'd expect a lawsuit just for suggesting illegal methods of dealing with them.

Kudles · 10-18-2008, 09:12 AM

Because people are stupid

10-17-2008, 07:36 PM	#1
The Duck Adult Content Provider Industry Role: Join Date: May 2005 Location: Europe Posts: 18,243	Why is it hard to take down illegal tube sites? Are they all on rogue hosts? If not it should be as simple as sending a few well articulated lawyer written emails to the host and domain registrar right? I dont know. __________________ Skype Horusmaia ICQ 41555245 Email [email protected]

10-17-2008, 11:21 PM	#5
d-null . . . Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: NY Posts: 13,724	notice that some big sponsors' content is rarely found on the tubes it is like they know where they might face a legal problem they don't want to deal with, but they gladly rip off the rest __________________ __________________ Looking for a custom TUBE SCRIPT that supports massive traffic, load balancing, billing support, and h264 encoding? Hit up Konrad! Looking for designs for your websites or custom tubesite design? Hit up Zuzana Designs Check out the #1 WordPress SEO Plugin: CyberSEO Suite

10-18-2008, 12:37 AM	#7
wootpr0n Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 250	A) Big web host is making lots of money selling the tube site bandwidth and servers B) If they took it down, word will spread that this web host has no backbone to stand up to bullies, and their policy is to take the side of the complainer C) Practically no liability. The Tube site already has a DMCA policy to take down the videos, and unless they refuse to comply with a valid takedown request, the webhost can't get involved. A Tube site is a separate "service" in the context of the law. D) It's not their problem, and their legal department knows that you, a porn producer are never going to sue the tube site (let alone the web host), and even if you were stupid enough to sue them, you would lose. The only time you can take down a tube site is if your attorney, who works for a medium to large sized law firm, writes a long letter to the General Counsel of the web host, demanding that you take down the site. Then if that tube site is only using one server at that web host, and a small amount of bandwidth, and the web host already has a bad reputation and couldn't care if it got worse, will the tube site be taken down. __________________ Sig too big http://www.gofuckyourself.com/gfy_faqs.html Want to use a large banner in your sig??? Contact Eric about getting on as an advertiser - eric AT adult.com

10-18-2008, 01:33 AM	#11
tiger Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 6,986	Combination of DMCA protection and money. __________________

10-18-2008, 02:19 AM	#15
DamageX Marketing & Strategy Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Former nomad Posts: 14,293	Because they're not actually illegal. Yet. __________________ Whitehat is for chumps If you don't do it, somebody else will - true story!

10-17-2008, 11:16 PM	#3
KillerK Confirmed User Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 3,406	I would guess because they are bro's with the big programs. They send shitloads of traffic to dating and cam offers.

10-18-2008, 12:47 AM	#8
Rorschach So Fucking Banned Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 5,579	Tube sites are protected from copyright liability by the DMCA safe harbour clause, which indemnifies them from prosecution for user uploaded content. The DMCA single handedly allows the content theft tube model to flourish and prosper. Here's a summary: http://www.keytlaw.com/Copyrights/dmca.htm

10-18-2008, 01:02 AM	#9
aico Moo Moo Cow Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Washington State Posts: 14,748	Trust no one...

10-18-2008, 01:38 AM	#12
Mr. Billy Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 467	Now we know why the RIAA and MPAA decided to go after the folks who uploaded and downloaded the content. Might be time to do that. Got rid of Napster didn't it? Don't worry about driving customers away. They will still come back to pull out their credit cards for porn.

10-18-2008, 01:44 AM	#13
Mr.Right - Banned For Life I guarantee it Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 18,314	Find a way to take away their domains. Write well formulated letters to the ICANN.

10-18-2008, 07:20 AM	#18
seeandsee Check SIG! Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Europe (Skype: gojkoas) Posts: 50,945	evil tubes are strong! __________________ BUY MY SIG - 50$/Year Contact here

10-18-2008, 07:23 AM	#19
camgirlshide Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,558	google has had to argue they spend millions of dollars in filtering technology to filter out illegal content on youtube. Therefore, they are taking every reasonable effort possible to keep illegal content off their site. Even with this, they face enormous legal battles. The illegal tube sites, on the other hand, don't seem to spend any money on chasing down illegal content (assuming for a second they didn't post said content themselves knowing it was illegal). So, to me at least, it seems google's argument doesn't hold up to the illegal tube sites. Now, I still say the answer is my plan to simply go after the wallets of any affiliate program that willingly pays money to a tube site or attempts to gain traffic by placing a few of their short legally offered clips among the thousands of longer stollen clips. Therefore, I urge you to remove all mentions of affiliate programs from your sites participating in either of these two activities. __________________ Useful adult webmaster links - Alphabetical list of solo models with webcam Stats on my best converting affiliate programs - camgirlshide webmaster blog complete list of affiliate programs I use.

10-18-2008, 07:31 AM	#20
brassmonkey Pay It Forward Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Yo Mama House Posts: 77,237	dont hate the playa hate the game __________________ TRUMP 2025 KEKAW!!! - The Laken Riley Act Is Law! DACA ENDED - SUPPORT AZ HCR 2060 52R - email: brassballz-at-techie.com

10-18-2008, 07:48 AM	#22
crockett in a van by the river Industry Role: Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 76,806	I think you guys are going after them with the wrong angle. Screw going after the hosts, go after the domains via icann. __________________ In November, you can vote for America's next president or its first dictator.

10-18-2008, 08:11 AM	#23
The Duck Adult Content Provider Industry Role: Join Date: May 2005 Location: Europe Posts: 18,243	What about rogue techniques like dos and infinite requests to dl content? I know its not legal but what the fuck are we going to do. I once had a world of warcraft site offering cheats and exploit info, the wow community went apeshit and launched all kinds of attacks and I soon had to take my site down. __________________ Skype Horusmaia ICQ 41555245 Email [email protected]

10-18-2008, 09:12 AM	#26
Kudles Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Here There and Everywhere Posts: 5,477	Because people are stupid __________________ Free to Play MMOs and MMORPGs