AVN Ads down / gone / broken, WTF?

[Forkbeard]

I use AVN ads / Adbrite on some of my sites, though I did have to turn off the network ads because they got so crappy. But I've been doing good business using them as an ad broker and selling real targeted ads on some of my niche blogs.

So tonight I notice that my "Your ad here" links are all busted. Instead of taking potential advertisers to a sale page for my ads, they are taking them to some sort of fucking generic sales leads generator inviting the potential advertiser to input contact information so a sales rep can be in touch shortly. WTF, that means I'm generating sales leads for AVN but AVN is no longer giving people a way to instantly buy ads on my site!

Worse yet, I can't even log into my account -- they want my email and say they will send "instructions on how to access my account."

They claim it's an upgrade to a version 2.0 of their ad platform, but there was no email announcement, and it feels like they've just been sold off. I want to pull all my links -- why should I give them free sales leads when they aren't offering to sell ads on my sites any more to potential advertisers who click the links? -- but the way their javascript works, that would screw the paid advertisers I've already got.

Anybody from AVN Ads care to comment? They've pulled down the phone numbers from the site so I can't call, and it's not business hours anyway.

At best this is a very badly handled transition!

[Forkbeard]

To amplify:

Instead of being taken to a sales page for my sites, my AVN ads links tell prospective advertisers:

"Are you interested in becoming a new AVN Ads publisher or advertise across our adult advertising marketplace? Tell us who you are and we'll be in touch shortly." And then there's a form to leave your name and phone number. They steal a sales lead, I don't get an opportunity to make an ad sale.

I'm NOT happy.

[CurrentlySober]

sig spot!

[Forkbeard]

Interesting. I have discovered that I can still access my account via the Adbrite interface.

So the backend is all still there -- which I had assumed anyway since the ads were still serving -- but they just decided to steal sales leads during whatever unannounced weird weekend transition / upgrade they are doing.

Still very very tacky.

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by Forkbeard

I use AVN ads / Adbrite on some of my sites, though I did have to turn off the network ads because they got so crappy. But I've been doing good business using them as an ad broker and selling real targeted ads on some of my niche blogs.

So tonight I notice that my "Your ad here" links are all busted. Instead of taking potential advertisers to a sale page for my ads, they are taking them to some sort of fucking generic sales leads generator inviting the potential advertiser to input contact information so a sales rep can be in touch shortly. WTF, that means I'm generating sales leads for AVN but AVN is no longer giving people a way to instantly buy ads on my site!

Worse yet, I can't even log into my account -- they want my email and say they will send "instructions on how to access my account."

They claim it's an upgrade to a version 2.0 of their ad platform, but there was no email announcement, and it feels like they've just been sold off. I want to pull all my links -- why should I give them free sales leads when they aren't offering to sell ads on my sites any more to potential advertisers who click the links? -- but the way their javascript works, that would screw the paid advertisers I've already got.

Anybody from AVN Ads care to comment? They've pulled down the phone numbers from the site so I can't call, and it's not business hours anyway.

At best this is a very badly handled transition!

Yep I have the same here

[MarcWomack]

Well, there are always other options. There are even people who have formed an entire company and service largely in part because of how upset they were with the way they were treated by Adbrite. People like, oh, um ME. We started using Adbrite before the AVNAds private label. Before Adbrite forced anyone adult to move over. Back when AdBrite was giving Publishers 10% referral fee on any business done with customers sent over from the Publisher. Since we were just using them for sales automation, we sent over ALL our customers from our CJTraffic.com site. These customers were buying tons of ads throughout Adbrite's network. Then the private label came. Our referall fee magically vanished. I bitched to the folks ad Adbrite but nothing was done. Folks I'm talking over $5000 a month just gone. Fuck that.

I'm doing the big press releases, announcements, etc next week. But if anyone wants a better solution, we've launched www.madisonavenue.com and it's rocking and rolling.

We've leveraged our experience of running ConsumptionJunction.com, the SickSiteNetwork.com, and CJTraffic.com and developed this new platform. Since 1999 we've made the most money possible off our the traffic from our sites. We've developed MadisonAvenue.com to help us make even more by maximizing the revenue per 1000 impressions (RPM) on all our ads: those sold on a Retail (CPC, CPM, Time-Based) basis AND those run on an affiliate basis (CPA / Rev-Share). We started using the system six months ago and increased our affiliate revenue by 35% and our retail revenue by 45%! Now we're GIVING THIS AWAY! Anyone can use our system.

MadAv is a world-class, web-based, FREE ad rotation solution and revenue maximization tool. One feature of the system is that we can sell their inventor for them. BUT UNLIKE ADBRITE or any other ad network, this is OPTIONAL. You can use the system to sell ads yourself. We're giving you all the functionality we've been using for CJTraffic.com. You can allocate some, all, or none of your ad inventory to Network Campaigns we sell for you.

There's a lot more details on this thread: http://www.gfy.com/showthread.php?p=...6#post12918846.

Bottom line, there's a new option which lets you CONTROL your ad inventory, make more money off your traffic than ever before, is FREE, and will NOT fuck you over.

Anyone that wants more info, I can be reached 24/7 at home: 404.806.0810 or at the office at 678.528.5893.

[Forkbeard]

Sweet, despite being an epic hijack of my thread that's really good news. I'll definitely be checking out your network.

I've always had service issues with Adbrite / AVN, starting with the time they released their interstitial ads product and FUCKING TURNED IT ON BY DEFAULT FOR ALL PUBLISHER ACCOUNTS!

I was not impressed that they began offering an ad format on my pages that I did not choose to offer. Although stealing the sales leads I'm generating for them is a new (lower) low.

[cool1g]

Marc - is Madison Ave only for adult sites or do you do mainstream as well?

[flashfire]

Originally Posted by ConsumptionJunction

Well, there are always other options. There are even people who have formed an entire company and service largely in part because of how upset they were with the way they were treated by Adbrite. People like, oh, um ME. We started using Adbrite before the AVNAds private label. Before Adbrite forced anyone adult to move over. Back when AdBrite was giving Publishers 10% referral fee on any business done with customers sent over from the Publisher. Since we were just using them for sales automation, we sent over ALL our customers from our CJTraffic.com site. These customers were buying tons of ads throughout Adbrite's network. Then the private label came. Our referall fee magically vanished. I bitched to the folks ad Adbrite but nothing was done. Folks I'm talking over $5000 a month just gone. Fuck that.

I'm doing the big press releases, announcements, etc next week. But if anyone wants a better solution, we've launched www.madisonavenue.com and it's rocking and rolling.

We've leveraged our experience of running ConsumptionJunction.com, the SickSiteNetwork.com, and CJTraffic.com and developed this new platform. Since 1999 we've made the most money possible off our the traffic from our sites. We've developed MadisonAvenue.com to help us make even more by maximizing the revenue per 1000 impressions (RPM) on all our ads: those sold on a Retail (CPC, CPM, Time-Based) basis AND those run on an affiliate basis (CPA / Rev-Share). We started using the system six months ago and increased our affiliate revenue by 35% and our retail revenue by 45%! Now we're GIVING THIS AWAY! Anyone can use our system.

MadAv is a world-class, web-based, FREE ad rotation solution and revenue maximization tool. One feature of the system is that we can sell their inventor for them. BUT UNLIKE ADBRITE or any other ad network, this is OPTIONAL. You can use the system to sell ads yourself. We're giving you all the functionality we've been using for CJTraffic.com. You can allocate some, all, or none of your ad inventory to Network Campaigns we sell for you.

There's a lot more details on this thread: http://www.gfy.com/showthread.php?p=...6#post12918846.

Bottom line, there's a new option which lets you CONTROL your ad inventory, make more money off your traffic than ever before, is FREE, and will NOT fuck you over.

Anyone that wants more info, I can be reached 24/7 at home: 404.806.0810 or at the office at 678.528.5893.

nice work

[Mutt]

free? then what's in it for you?

[Pryda]

Another move by AdBrite/AVNAds that makes you think "What the hell are they thinking?".

[halfpint]

Come on AVN sort this out, cant even log in

[ridikuloz]

my clicks are down 30%, bullshit. Could it be because of that?

[WDjay]

Its owned by Adbrite....who is funded by Sequoia Capital (the private equity firm that brought you Yahoo, Google, Youtube, Eharmony...and MANY MORE)
I dont think they are shutting down.

[Forkbeard]

No, but they sure as hell are stealing my traffic right now.

I mean, c'mon, the sales lead capture form doesn't even pretend to ask them what website they were trying to buy traffic on.

[geeknik]

Yeah, instead of fixing their goddamn ad serving problems, they are doing this shit. Fuck 'em.

[cutievids]

yeah this is BS. As an advertiser I have a bunch of expensive "test" campaigns running and I can't edit/delete any of them so this is costing me a small fortune.

[RawAlex]

Originally Posted by cutievids

yeah this is BS. As an advertiser I have a bunch of expensive "test" campaigns running and I can't edit/delete any of them so this is costing me a small fortune.

Can you say "chargeback?" I knew you could.

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by cutievids

yeah this is BS. As an advertiser I have a bunch of expensive "test" campaigns running and I can't edit/delete any of them so this is costing me a small fortune.

You can still get into your dashboard, but you have to go to adbrite and not avn, just use your avn pass and user

[cutievids]

Originally Posted by halfpint

You can still get into your dashboard, but you have to go to adbrite and not avn, just use your avn pass and user

Wow, obviously a note on their site would be too much to ask for. Thanks for the heads up!!

[GooSearch]

try www.GooSearch.com

[aico]

"Epic thread hijack", that made me chuckle... lol

[BSleazy]

Looks like they relaunched.

[avnads]

Yes, it is a re-launch. The official press release can be found at: www[dot]avnads[dot]com/pr_081707.pdf .

All active clients will be receiving additional information shortly. We apologize for the inconvenience during this transition period. However, you can expect great things to come - greater revenue share for publishers, additional payment options, new ad products and enhanced customer service. It's a good thing!

[avnads]

Originally Posted by Forkbeard

No, but they sure as hell are stealing my traffic right now.

I mean, c'mon, the sales lead capture form doesn't even pretend to ask them what website they were trying to buy traffic on.

It's captured in the referring URL; our exchange specialists will contact any potential advertiser and teach them how to buy traffic from your site. AVN Ads is not stealing your traffic. We leverage our advertisers to buy direct and in the network. So, conversely any advertiser that was interested in a bigger site that ends up buying into the network will end up buying traffic from your site. It all evens out in the end.

[ridikuloz]

How long is it going to take for everything to be fully up?

[Forkbeard]

Originally Posted by avnads

It's captured in the referring URL; our exchange specialists will contact any potential advertiser and teach them how to buy traffic from your site. AVN Ads is not stealing your traffic. We leverage our advertisers to buy direct and in the network. So, conversely any advertiser that was interested in a bigger site that ends up buying into the network will end up buying traffic from your site. It all evens out in the end.

That's unacceptable, especially as I have stopped accepting network ads. I use your network to sell ads on my site. Your link no longer offers that option to advertisers. Why should I run that link any longer?

I don't want it to "even out in the end" -- I want to get the service from you that I signed up for. Will you be offering that service in future, or not?

You also need to discuss transitional issues. How can I continue serving the ads I sold without linking to your sales leads theft form?

You ARE stealing my traffic. And I'm not happy about it.

[AsianDivaGirlsWebDude]

The big question is, will AVN Ads be selling ad space to sites that repeatedly and knowingly feature copyright abused content (making themselves a party/enabler to a copyright infringing conspiracy)?

It would seem very strange to me, and a conflict or interest (at the very least), for AVN to sell an ad to a content producer for their various AVN sites/properties, and then turn around as AVN Ads, and sell an ad (for a non-content producing site - such as a dating site or a sex toy site) to a site (such as a torrent site) that publishes links to unauthorized (copyright infringing content) of the very same content producer.

Let's hope AVN Ads can see the writing on the wall, and do the right thing.

ADG

[Forkbeard]

Now, that's a thread hijack that isn't epic, and isn't useful either.

Right now we're talking about AVN ads breaking all publisher's links without warning, stealing sales leads, and then coming here on the boards saying "we're not stealing traffic, we'll sell our network to your leads and you'll get some trickledown that will make it worth your while."

I'm really astonished that they've got the gall to say that, it's deeply unprofessional.

[Forkbeard]

Also, what the hell is up with (from the press release) "Existing AVN Ads publishers ... will need to create a new account on AVNAds.com"? What was this, a hostile takeover? You didn't get a copy of the database from Adbrite in the divorce?

We're your damned customers. We're in your database. We have accounts already, we don't need to waste time creating new ones. If you're changing computers and datacenters, you get a programmer to port the data into the new system. You don't make everybody jump through hoops like a new customer. What the hell?

This is being managed so badly, it really does feel like there's something more going on than an "upgrade". It feels like an unplanned change of ownership or management, something hostile and without the cooperation of the existing managers.

If I'm wrong, fine. So, let's have a better explanation of why this is being mishandled so badly, please.

[AsianDivaGirlsWebDude]

Originally Posted by Forkbeard

Also, what the hell is up with (from the press release) "Existing AVN Ads publishers ... will need to create a new account on AVNAds.com"? What was this, a hostile takeover? You didn't get a copy of the database from Adbrite in the divorce?

We're your damned customers. We're in your database. We have accounts already, we don't need to waste time creating new ones. If you're changing computers and datacenters, you get a programmer to port the data into the new system. You don't make everybody jump through hoops like a new customer. What the hell?

This is being managed so badly, it really does feel like there's something more going on than an "upgrade". It feels like an unplanned change of ownership or management, something hostile and without the cooperation of the existing managers.

If I'm wrong, fine. So, let's have a better explanation of why this is being mishandled so badly, please.

Starting to sound like smoke and mirrors - especially with the lack of response.

I wonder how much money they stand to gain from non-response of the unaware and the apathetic?

ADG

[Voodoo]

On top of that their entire site (each page), loads about 10x slower than GFY!

[Forkbeard]

Yeah. I'm particularly concerned to know whether I'll still get paid for all my recurring ads if I don't sign up for a new account. And, for that matter, whether I'll be provided with javascript that lets me SERVE those recurring ads without advertising this new network -- for free and against my will.

Also, think about this. So far as I can tell, they just changed the backend late on a Friday, without a single advance email to the customers with warnings and reassurances. That doesn't sound like a planned upgrade to me.

The press release so carefully NOT linked upthread is also not linked from the front page of AVN Ads. Why not?

[Forkbeard]

In the cold light of monday morning, I see that the traffic stealing landing pages are still in effect. I still can't access my AVNAds account except through the Adbrite backdoor, and it looks from the .pdf "press release" like I may never be able to. And the oddly hostile "relaunch" hasn't happened.

I guess it's time to log in via adbrite and cancel the recurring ads, so that I can pull all the traffic stealing links once the existing paid advertising periods expire.

[Forkbeard]

I also note that AVNAds had an official announcement thread first thing this morning. Someone pointed to this thread and they said "Got it and responded."

Sorry, but "it all evens out in the end" is not a sufficient response to a traffic hijack to an unapproved destination.

Sales leads are arguably the most valuable thing on the internet. These are mine. I want them back. Right now, I can't take them back without screwing my customers -- a concern AVNAds does not seem to share.

I'm not going to let this drop, honest. It needs to be fixed.

[avnads]

Originally Posted by Forkbeard

I also note that AVNAds had an official announcement thread first thing this morning. Someone pointed to this thread and they said "Got it and responded."

Sorry, but "it all evens out in the end" is not a sufficient response to a traffic hijack to an unapproved destination.

Sales leads are arguably the most valuable thing on the internet. These are mine. I want them back. Right now, I can't take them back without screwing my customers -- a concern AVNAds does not seem to share.

I'm not going to let this drop, honest. It needs to be fixed.

To give you additional visibility, I looked into the number of referrals from your sites:
155.212.155.193 US USA United States MA Massachusetts Framingham
65.43.160.103 US USA United States OH Ohio Cleveland
65.55.210.93 US USA United States NE Nebraska Omaha
75.185.54.201 US USA United States OH Ohio Columbus

Four unique visitors. We ask that you please calm down and not blow this out of proportion. This is temporary. The self-service marketplace will come back online shortly (date TBD). However, if you are uncomfortable maintaining the link, I have detailed the instructions to remove the link in the other thread you are messaging in.

Your ads are being served by AdBrite - they should continue to pay you for that revenue.

Please PM if you have additional questions. Thanks.

[Forkbeard]

Thanks, the response in the other thread has addressed my chief concerns. Drama over, as far as I'm concerned.

Turns out because I'm not a javascript guy that I wasn't aware the ads were served by a separate snippet of javascript from the snippet that used to handle new ad sales. Now that I can control the unwelcome link while still serving my installed ad base, the source of my excitement is gone.

So, now that I'm calm, what have we learned? I'm amused by your attempt to minimize my losses -- how many sales leads have you gotten from former Adbrite customers much higher traffic than me, who didn't notice over the weekend that they aren't selling new ads any more? This isn't so much about me -- my problem is fixed. It's about your apparent failure to understand why the sudden change in link behavior was a problem for your customers.

Now, in the other thread you've acknowledged that this was not merely an upgrade, but rather, the result of an apparently abrupt and ugly divorce from Adbrite. I suspected as much, but you didn't say so. That's the real source of the drama -- you were having a rough time, your options were very limited, and you tried to pretend that nothing was wrong when in fact you had to throw something up and your backend wasn't (isn't) ready.

So, the moral? Next time, be up front about your business problems, so we know to cut you some slack. Your new page was pretending everything was smooth and normal and a great new upgrade, so I got pretty pissed that your great new upgrade was screwing me, even if only in principle. If I had understood from the beginning that you were in the midst of an ugly divorce, if you'd said "please bear with us for a few days until we get everything sorted out", I'd have been far more understanding and willing to cut you some slack.

So, drama over. Next time, try being a bit more open with your customers, eh?

[The Duck]

Originally Posted by avnads

To give you additional visibility, I looked into the number of referrals from your sites:
155.212.155.193 US USA United States MA Massachusetts Framingham
65.43.160.103 US USA United States OH Ohio Cleveland
65.55.210.93 US USA United States NE Nebraska Omaha
75.185.54.201 US USA United States OH Ohio Columbus

Four unique visitors. We ask that you please calm down and not blow this out of proportion. This is temporary. The self-service marketplace will come back online shortly (date TBD). However, if you are uncomfortable maintaining the link, I have detailed the instructions to remove the link in the other thread you are messaging in.

Your ads are being served by AdBrite - they should continue to pay you for that revenue.

Please PM if you have additional questions. Thanks.

Are you stupid? You just delivered a low blow to one of your own customers. Last drop, I am pulling all my AVN ads right now.

[avnads]

Originally Posted by Forkbeard

Thanks, the response in the other thread has addressed my chief concerns. Drama over, as far as I'm concerned.

Turns out because I'm not a javascript guy that I wasn't aware the ads were served by a separate snippet of javascript from the snippet that used to handle new ad sales. Now that I can control the unwelcome link while still serving my installed ad base, the source of my excitement is gone.

So, now that I'm calm, what have we learned? I'm amused by your attempt to minimize my losses -- how many sales leads have you gotten from former Adbrite customers much higher traffic than me, who didn't notice over the weekend that they aren't selling new ads any more? This isn't so much about me -- my problem is fixed. It's about your apparent failure to understand why the sudden change in link behavior was a problem for your customers.

Now, in the other thread you've acknowledged that this was not merely an upgrade, but rather, the result of an apparently abrupt and ugly divorce from Adbrite. I suspected as much, but you didn't say so. That's the real source of the drama -- you were having a rough time, your options were very limited, and you tried to pretend that nothing was wrong when in fact you had to throw something up and your backend wasn't (isn't) ready.

So, the moral? Next time, be up front about your business problems, so we know to cut you some slack. Your new page was pretending everything was smooth and normal and a great new upgrade, so I got pretty pissed that your great new upgrade was screwing me, even if only in principle. If I had understood from the beginning that you were in the midst of an ugly divorce, if you'd said "please bear with us for a few days until we get everything sorted out", I'd have been far more understanding and willing to cut you some slack.

So, drama over. Next time, try being a bit more open with your customers, eh?

Thanks. We, unfortunately, were pressed for time. As the press release stated, the "divorce" was supposed to occur on September 30, 2007. However, the timeline got pushed up when our previous platform partner started to migrate our clients to one of their platforms.

We are sorting things out right now and will have more detail in two hours.

[avnads]

Originally Posted by kandah

Are you stupid? You just delivered a low blow to one of your own customers. Last drop, I am pulling all my AVN ads right now.

Sorry that you see it that way kandah. I wanted to give him visibility so he could have a better idea of how many visitors actually visit the self-service marketplace. Additionally, if you read the other AVN Ads thread, I gave detailed instructions on how to remove the link he was offended by. It worked and Forkbeard is satisfied for the time being.

Really, this was not meant to be a low blow at all. I know this is coming fast and hard at everyone. It was the same for us. Please just take a deep breath and not let it get the best of you.

AVN has a call with our "previous" platform partner in 10 minutes. This call will be on how to make this a smooth transition for all parties involved. Stay tuned.

[MarcWomack]

Originally Posted by Forkbeard

Sweet, despite being an epic hijack of my thread that's really good news. I'll definitely be checking out your network.

I've always had service issues with Adbrite / AVN, starting with the time they released their interstitial ads product and FUCKING TURNED IT ON BY DEFAULT FOR ALL PUBLISHER ACCOUNTS!

I was not impressed that they began offering an ad format on my pages that I did not choose to offer. Although stealing the sales leads I'm generating for them is a new (lower) low.

Heh, realized that was a pretty big hijack so I waited to respond any more until the thread died down. Still, you have my apologies. I just obviously feel REALLY strongly about this.

Also, I want to be clear on something else. My beef is with AdBrite.com, not AVNAds. The crew over there are good people and I think they were just hamstrung by who they were working with.

To answer someone else's question, yes, we handle adult and non-adult. We handle ratings a bit differently than the simple black and white. We break everything down into G-Rated, R-Rated, and X-Rated.

Any other questions please feel free to hit me up directly.

[MarcWomack]

Originally Posted by Mutt

free? then what's in it for you?

Did you read that other thread I linked to? IF Publishers want us to sell their ads, we take a 20% cut. If not, still good for us because we've got another Publisher using the tool and giving us feedback on how to make it better.

[Forkbeard]

No worries Marc, it was structurally a hijack but your heart was pure. ;-)

I'm not too impressed with AVN over this whole thing, they basically tried to mislead the public and pretend there were no issues when in fact they were basically patching one page of html over the fact that they left Adbrite without having a replacement engine ready.

Yeah, I know they felt they had to move fast. But it would have been better if they'd been honest about it from the get-go. I know that traditional marketing droids are taught to imitate the Iraqi foreign minister and pretend nothing is wrong no matter how big the crisis ("American tanks in front of the building? Those are mobile lawn ornaments we bought on Ebay!") but has nobody read The Cluetrain Manifesto?

And I'm pretty pissed right now because currently *nobody* is serving the prepaid ads that people bought on my sites or any of the other adult sites in the Adbrite/AVNAds network. It's been like that for almost 24 hours and there hasn't been a peep out of Adbrite *or* AVN regarding the fact that zillions of paid advertisers are being screwed. Somebody's front page should have a notice or an explanation, at a minimum. And publishers should have gotten emails.

Instead, nothing. It's tacky and suggests that nobody in this mess has the interests of the paying customers at heart.

[Forkbeard]

Upon further investigation, it looks as if Adbrite is serving some ads again. Older javascript with the long encrypted "dk=<verylongnumber>" params was not serving any ads, but if you get new javascript it works.

Of course, there seems to have been no notice to anyone about this change or the need to refresh javascript across all historic zones.

[MarcWomack]

Originally Posted by Forkbeard

"American tanks in front of the building? Those are mobile lawn ornaments we bought on Ebay!"

That's fucking hilarious!!