Don't get upset. I'm totally objective here. I have no problem admitting that thanks to USA I'm not speaking Russian language here.
Thanks to USA this world probably, indeed, is a better place.

That does not mean that one couldn't criticize.

I was pointing out that there are MANY countries in the world with the atrocities that you mentioned, yet no western country takes action. And I was including EU to those western countries, by the way.

lol yes right,he hates america, execute him......

The point is... bullies like this don't want you to criticize.

Look what happened here....because I proclaimed a distaste for murdering people, these fellas branded me a "Commie".

Typical bully behaviour. Can't discuss things in a normal manner...incapable of delivering a message without resorting to petty insults.

I think someone had it right when they suggested this topic was beyond the cerebral potential of this forum.

No, but it is the very freedom that we base our society on that <i>allows</i> people like Chumpsky to say what they want to, good or bad....or idiotic as the case may be.


Think about it.... if he was shouting, preaching and rambling on so loudly AGAINST marxism and against the communistic platforms, how long do you think he'd be safe in those countries? Fact is he'd have had his fucking head cut off long ago. See the difference? Please, this chumpsky argument is really quite lame. Rose has this one nailed for once.

Perhaps we should just do nothing. Let him take his free shot at one of our allies most likely Israel, but he could reach Europe. Then when we have 100,000 dead people then we can do something. But yea we should wait untill he acts first.

And I'm not a Somalia expert - no way, but from what I've read, UN/USA didn't even finish the job there.

The country is still ruled by warlords, and numerous clans kill and oppress Somalian people.

Rwanda
Liberia
Papua New Guinea

No one's doing anything...

LOL....

If you are putting forth and glorifying the preachings of people like Chomsky, then you have branded yourself a commie.


How many people has the dick-tater Saddam murdered, or had murdered? Hmm? If left to continue to operate within his little world unsupervised, how many more will he cause to die?

Millions.

But they at least tried, which is more than you can say for other countries.

All the points you mention are valid. Notice the WAR HAWKS can't seem to refute any of it??!?

Here is typical response....

"well...uh...you know it was the USA that gave you your freedom and if we've got the bomb we should use it to stop others from keeping our oil. bomb them. your so stupid dont you know why dont you try living in (insert war-torn name here) and then see how the fuck you like it you stupid motherfucker."

Why to execute him. He is totally harmless lunatic.

All I'm asking is that you think before you criticize.


THINK.


If you're just criticizing but not offering any viable alternatives, then your opinion is useless. Doing nothing is often the worst thing one can do in these situations. GW is at least a guy who takes action, I'll give him that much. Thankfully most American presidents have been doers rather than wimps.

who's Chumpsky? His name is Noam Chomsky, he is American, more American than many of people here and professor of linguistics at MIT. You see his latest attempt to show to people the propaganda of media had the impact you see now. I would recommend that we should not judge people who's work is not familiar to us.

anyway,i'm not going to change anyones mind,i have better things to do. You can believe whatever you want, but when you reffer to events you should give the facts too.

That is correct.

Hell, you really cannot say a word these days about US politics without getting flamed. Is it such a sore point to Americans? I'm sorry if it is.

Well you should get your government to assemble your military and go help them out!

Or should the US do it so you have something to complain about later when a few innocent people get killed?

Yes mr Soul rebel,
but again I remind you to......

"Think about it.... if he was shouting, preaching and rambling on so loudly AGAINST marxism and against the communistic platforms, how long do you think he'd be safe in those countries? Fact is he'd have had his fucking head cut off long ago. See the difference? Please, this chumpsky argument is really quite lame. Rose has this one nailed for once."

Chomsky is allowed to speak his opinions and his doctrine freely here. He is allowed to criticize the USA freely, because in the USA and Canada you are free to do so. Is my point so hard to grasp? Once you see it you'll soon see the irony of it all.

Mika..... I am Canadian.

I simply see things as they are, not through the slants and twists of those that want to place a negative light on everything good than anyone or any country does.

mika,
I could careless what you or anyone else says about Americans, or our government.
The arguement is weather we should remove Saddam nothing more. You can say what you like. I just read it and pass on by. No harm, no foul. We all respect your freedom of thought, and speach. My fellow Americans complain about the government, I can take it. lol

At least I'm interested in US politics, which, REMEMBER, is FOREIGN politics to me. I wonder how many Americans are interested in European politics. Can you honestly say you're following EU politics?

If you wish, I can just shut the fuck up, but then again it would be just Americans talking to each other after a while ;))

Take it ez ;)

No no i don't disagree with you on this. Anyway, I try to avoid political discussions in this board. :-) Even someone is bullshiter he has the right to talk and the rest can judge ;-)

Communist-Chomsky is a great defender of Cuba, which has not been bombed and has not suffered a war, but is poorer today than it was more than forty years ago when Castro took power. In 1959, Cuba was the second richest country in Latin America. Now it is the second poorest just before Haiti. Naturally, Chomskyites will claim that the U.S. economic boycott is responsible. But the whole rest of the world trades with Cuba. Cuba not only trades with all of Latin America and Europe, but receives aid from the latter. Moreover, in the 70s and 80s, the Soviet Union gave Cuba the equivalent of three Marshall Plans in economic subsidies and assistance -- tens of billions of dollars. Cuba is a fertile island with a tropical climate. It is poor because it has followed Chomsky?s examples, and not America?s. It is poor because it is socialist, Marxist and Communist. It is poor because it is run by a lunatic and sadist. It is poor because in Cuba, America lost the Cold War. The poverty of Cuba is what Chomsky?s vision and political commitments would create for the entire world.

Jesus F Christ man....

Do you think maybe a few million Americans "took an interest" during WW II when they (along with Canadians, Brits, etc etc) came over there, fought and in many cases died? Do you think we "took an interest" when we sent forces and aid over to Kosovo? What about WW I??? How many Canadians & Americans died fighting for principles in EU then??

Jeez louise, I just got through asking you people to THINK.

I'm nearly shitting my pants this is so funny....

From the same guy who said.... "If you are putting forth and glorifying the preachings of people like Chomsky, then you have branded yourself a commie. "

Are you at some point going to follow through with any of your claims?!?

Once again, I am posting the COMPLETE CHOMSKY ARCHIVE and I am waiting for you to follow through with your knowledgable statements. Shoe me some information that points to him being a "commie" Are you actually aware what a communist is? Man, this isn't a game and it isn't funny anymore. I am embarassed I lowered myself into a pissing match with you.

At first I though you were seriously interested in debating points of merit...obviously I was wrong to assume such grand vision could eminate from someone within a province whose chief export is now the West Nile virus.

mika,
As a matter of fact I try to watch SkyNews, and the BBC whenever I can. I am quit interested in all points of view concerning wold polotics. For the record I don't want to see the US rush into anything without it being thought out completely. Which I think they are doing.

So please by all means post your thoughts. I am interested, even if I don't agree with every thing you think or say.

Chris

Also, why is it that people from EU think that we only get one news channel in the US? There's dozens of news channels. Not to mention CSPAN, which is our government in session.

Cd why don't you calm down a little? I agree with most things you have said. I'm not into pissing match here, especially not with a man who only seems to separate the "criticism" out of my posts.

Well, start shitting your pants then, because you have now shown yourself to be a buffoon to boot. Why? Because it WAS YOU that accused me first of labelling you as a commie, which I didn't by the way. I suspected it, but never came out and said it.

So, YOU say that I branded you a commie, and then I went ahead and pointed out that you showed <i>yourself</i> to be one, not I.

And it's not secret that chumpsky is a huge supporter of communistic platforms and principles and politik. Da! Politik!

So be ashamed all you want. In every debate/argument there is a winner and a loser.

I am debating you, and on a message board at that, so continually asking me to calm down is, well.... dumb. I'm about the calmest person I know, very easy going guy. Do you see me asking anyone to "calm down"?? No? That's because I take it as it comes, and if someone wants to flip their lid here, I say let em.


And yes, I pick out the parts of your posts that speak to me of being inaccurate or out to lunch, and so far there's plenty for me to pick out.

As I said I am not gonna waste my time searching the net.
I know enough about him. I red enough of his "work"

Chomsky is a hypocritical moron

He is a medicocre social scientist who has managed to build quite a little empire by finding a wellspring of pathetic people who like being told that the moon is made of green cheese.

Finding out that this unrepentant socialist is actually quite the lover of capitalist luxury is no surprise to those who understand Chomksy's type. BTW he loves his yachts and Audis.


And yes Chomsky does make you think. In my case, after reading a Chomsky piece, I usually think something like, "What a fucking hypocritical moron."

Let me tell you something, capitalism exists near everywhere. Some people still believe that USA is an equation of the capitalistic system. Crap, wrong. Travel abroad and you'll see that capitalism is EVERYWHERE.

I don't say people in Cuba are in good condition. No they are not. But I can easily say the same for million Americans. Million americans live under bad conditions and wars every day due to a stupid president doesn't help them. If you are one time capitalist in mind, i'm 100 times. Believe me, but this doesnt make me blind. I'm glad I live in a country that although the average income is way below the american, the canadian etc I know for fact very few (near none) people are homeless and they starve. And yes we have capitalism here too.

anyway,that's enough for today. :)

Ok I guess I acted exactly the same way.
To be honest, I agree to a large extent with you.
I only PICKED UP the part where you said that US goes out to help people in other countries. If you insist, that it is the main reason of US actions, then you're not realistic IMO.

Asking you to calm down, was like suggesting, take it ez, we don't have a debate here because we only slightly disagree.


As far as the original topic of the thread is concerned, I voted "never". I could be totally wrong. Who knows?
I think that if Iraq gets some kind of deal going with UN, it will be a political suicide for USA to go on offensive. Thus my vote "never".

:glugglug

AGAIN....these pants are getting soiled as the laughs continue to come...

"Noam Chomsky is one of America's most prominent political dissidents. A renowned professor of linguistics at MIT, he has authored over 30 political books dissecting such issues as U.S. interventionism in the developing world, the political economy of human rights and the propaganda role of corporate media. "

Most MIT professors are pretty medicore. What institution do you teach at?

Again.... like you said, there is a winner and a loser to every argument and I just won. You couldn't refute one fact, err or statement you made.

That my friend, is a verdict not even a judge from the lowly Manitoba Supreme Court could fuck up.

Exactly!

It baffles me whenever I see this argument being tossed around here. In Canada we not only get ALL the US newscasts (ABC, NBC, CBS etc), but we get our own excellent newshours as well, like Global, CBC, CTV and many others, plus international newscasts too.


It's just a stupid useless side criticizm that is usually thrown at us when they know they can't win the argument. Accent on stupid.

STOPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP


the Americans stopped discussing on this topic and only Canadians and Europeans left doing it..We are crazy. Im outttttt

No it's the fact that Europeans are far more civilized and actually watch other programs on TV than football, Baywatch and CNN ;)

My friend I think you are confused and not just about your clown chomsky. I am not from Manitoba.

Yup. now i believe both of you.. The moon is made of green cheese AND This war isn't about oil.

Sheeeeeiiiit. I blew that line. Well ya got me. I was a little confused...hey I still have my sense of humor.